Team3S: 3000GT & Stealth Tuesday, October 23
2001 Volume 01 : Number
653
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date:
Mon, 22 Oct 2001 10:21:26 -0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: RE: Left foot braking
You missed my question:
How do you
left foot brake and downshift at the same time?
Rich
> I
wonder
>how
>Flash manages to brake and clutch with his left
foot.
>Let's see, the heel of his left foot is on the brake, and he
depresses
>the
>clutch with the toe...or is it the other way around?
Maybe he doesn't
>use
>the clutch at all to
downshift?
>
>I give up. Flash, how DO you downshift when you are
hard on the brakes
>with
>your left foot?
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 11:32:30
-0400
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Re: Ceramic brakes?
Thanks god I have the cover everything
warranty so when I do break the
car I can chalk it up to a bad
part.
Don't wreck the Spyder. They are too nice. Agree on all
else.
- -----Original Message-----
From:
owner-team3s@team3s.com
[mailto:owner-team3s@team3s.com] On Behalf
Of Jannusch, Matt
Sent: Monday,
October 22, 2001 11:13
To: 'Team3S'
Subject: RE: Team3S: Re: Ceramic
brakes?
> I sit corrected. You have a highly-modded car.
Just try it
> in a stock engine/suspension car on a road track or maybe
we
> can meet halfway (Chicago?) and run some tests.
Nah, my car
is too rare to toss it off a corner at 140 MPH - which I'm
sure
I'd manage
to accomplish before the day was over. They won't let me
roadrace up
here in it anyway since I don't have a solid roof or a
rollcage
(and I'm
not installing one since I'd rarely race it anyways).
I'm
already
illegal for drag racing as well, but they haven't stopped me
yet (I
don't
think those guys realize the car is a convertible).
If
LF-braking works for you then that's cool... There are downsides
to
it
though (hard on motor, hard on clutch, hard on tranny, and
more
obviously
(as you are well aware) hard on brakes). But hey, any
racing is harder
on a
car than driving on the street. :-)
-
-Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 11:37:20
-0400
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Re: Ceramic brakes?
Yup. That's why I wanted the Wilwood
brake recirculation setup Geoff
was talking so much about. The fluid is
coming out clear so it is still
good it just needs recirculated.
And I
am only over-driving the brakes because that is the only thing
left I can do
with a mostly-stock car right now. I went TO the Big Reds
thinking they
would handle track events. They do but they are
definitely not serious
brakes by any means. They do take quite a lot of
abuse.
I read
the "Going Faster" book and learned a ton from it. What I did
have a
good laugh at though was the Chapter on All-Wheel Drive cars.
Here is their
entire chapter (one sentence) in summary, "We will not go
into detail on how
to drive an all-wheel drive car in this book simply
because the techniques
employed are too difficult to teach and nobody
uses them anyway." I
paraphrase but that was their mentality. Luckily
our cars act like FWD
most of the time until modded then they lean
toward RWD things.
-
--Flash!
- -----Original Message-----
From: Jim Berry
[mailto:fastmax@home.com]
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2001 11:18
It's
simple --- you're overdriving your brakes --- In the book Going
Faster
one
of the showroom stock guys explained his mindset --- he drives
with
about
50% of the brake capacity, if he doesn't, he gets to go home
early. He
trail
brakes to get his speed down as much as possible using
limited braking
and
accelerates later so he can maintain more speed
before the apex --- he
keeps
it at the limits of traction at all times
before the apex rather than
accelerating
to the apex.
Left foot
braking is fine for AutoX because of the limited track time
but you
better
plan on having a $5000 setup for our 4000# car in a road track
situation [
you need --- 6 pot AP's, water,blowers and brake fluid
recirculation
]
Brake management is just as important as traction management ---- if it
were a race it doesn't do any good to go faster than hell for three
laps
and
then take two laps off too cool your brakes.
>
> Heartland Park (where it was hot and might have helped matters) I
had
> good brakes the first two or three sessions. By the fourth I
had
fading
> brakes (pedal would hit the floor but I was not slowing
down
That's a fluid issue and there is no rotor or pad combination that
will
cure
that problem. Water, forced air, fluid recirculation on the
caliper or a
modified driving style is required --- see
above.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 11:25:59
-0500
From: "Willis, Charles E." <
cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Re: Ceramic brakes?
Flash,
I don't disagree that left
foot braking is a good trick for keeping the rpms
up while slowing down
enough to turn in - I just don't believe it is
necessary or helpful for every
turn. I think you are just grinding the pads
down most places on the
track.
Another thing, just because somebody (me) is an instructor doesn't
mean they
are fast, or driving up to the car's potential - it means they can
get
around the track safely and have some ability (or training) to
communicate
that skill to a student.
Remember - my son was 2 seconds
faster per lap at Heartland Park, he hadn't
been on a track in a year, and he
wasn't doing any left foot braking.
My best friend (an Advanced
Instructor) and I did a "follow-the-leader" last
weekend at TWS. He had
a NA Porsche 911. The only places he could gain on
me were places that
required hard braking - I had to slow down more to get
my heavier car rotated
safely than he did. Then he would loose ground on
exits because of my
horsepower advantage. He has driven my car and thinks
it is very
difficult to drive on the track. He has ridden with me many
times, and
believes I am doing what is necessary because of my
car's
characteristics. He said flatly that the only thing he could see
me doing
to improve my lap times on the track was to improve the braking
power of the
car.
Chuck
> -----Original Message-----
>
From: Darren Schilberg [SMTP:dschilberg@pobox.com]
> Sent: Monday, October
22, 2001 9:31 AM
> To: 'Team3S'
> Subject: RE: Team3S: Re: Ceramic
brakes?
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 11:55:51
-0500
From: "Willis, Charles E." <
cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
Subject:
FW: 3S-Racers: FW: FW: Team3S: Carbotech Panther Pad Group Purch
ase
Update with pricing and product code for Porsche Big Red pads in
Panther
Plus compound.
Chuck Willis
> -----Original
Message-----
> From:
anaimi@apple.com
[SMTP:anaimi@apple.com]
> Sent: Monday, October 22, 2001 10:57 AM
>
To: Willis, Charles E.
> Subject: Re: 3S-Racers: FW: FW: Team3S: Carbotech
Panther Pad Group
> Purchase
>
> Hi chuck,
>
>
so far i have the order for you and Richard Garriott. Please let me
> know who else is interested, because I need to put the order in
together.
> Big Red CT-594 in Panther Plus is $179.00 minus the discount +
shipping.
>
> Many thanks and let me know if there are anyone else
interested in this
> order.
>
> Ali
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 13:11:03
-0400
From: Michael Reid <
mreid@magma.ca>
Subject: Team3S: CAPs VIN
Databases
Shane/Team3s:
>I see this is a "Stealth" thread, but
is someone trying to track down ALL
>the 3000/Strealth VINs?
As
Jeff Lucius pointed out, it's been done already. (Mostly anyway, there
are
about 3578 missing VINs in 1991, 553 missing Stealth Turbo's in 1995,
and
about 561 missing 3000GT's in 1997 model year).
If anyone can email me
scans of brochures or options lists from Mitsu and
Dodge, that would be very
helpful in analysing some of the data I have.
I have a few brochure scans,
but not enough. I'm particularly interested
in knowing what the various
exterior colors were called each year.
It would also be helpful if people
could email me their VINs and a list
of all the options their car was
equipped with from the factory. I need
this to cross-reference the option
codes with the actual options. I haven't
found yet that CAPS knows anything
about the actual options on a car. Anyone
ever see different, other than date
of manufacture related ?
I extracted data for 151,454 Stealth and
3000GT VINs from the CAPS database.
I sent out some 10 copies of the data but
don't think anyone's put it on
the internet anywhere for download
yet.
This data is for US and Canadian cars only. Reading the archives I
see that
someone has access to the Japan and Europe versions of CAPS, so I'm
thinking
that the same can be done for those 3000GT's also.
I should
be able to generate a bunch of web pages with the statistics
I've found one
of these days... This includes info on tranmsissions,
emissions, country,
exterior and interior paint color and most if not
all factory
options.
Mike.
94 TT.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 10:17:54
-0700
From: "ek2mfg" <
ek2mfg@foxinternet.com>
Subject:
Team3S: manual info
could somebody who has a service manual for a 99
front end send me
the pic that shows the front end and how it goes together?
I am doing
a 99 conversion and dont really want to buy the manual just for
this.
I have a 93 manual and could let you know how they used to do
it....:)
I know is not a bolt up conversion so please hold the bantering to
a
minimum..........thanks in advance....mainly looking for
illistrations
with part numbers and how the details go
together....went to stealth316 and
downloaded his info (very
helpfull) but I need one more set of
pics.........the pic in the 93
manual looks to have greater detail and I am
wondering that the 99
manual has the same
bob K. -----used to be
rakoch.bmd on this board if that helps
*** Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 10:36:35
-0700
From: Rich <
rleroy@pacifier.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Speed Bleeder Discount For Team3S Members
All:
Team3S
members are being offered a 10% discount on Speed Bleeder
products.
When ordering, mention that you are a member of Team3S
for the
discount. Whitney is the customer service rep, and
she's
great!
http://www.speedbleeder.comRich
For
the Admins
*** Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 13:34:19
-0400
From: Michael Reid <
mreid@magma.ca>
Subject: Team3S: 95 &
96 Stealth TT comparison
AFAIK, in the US and Canada:
the
following are the only models with AWS:
91-94 Stealth R/T Turbo
91-99
3000GT VR-4
the following are the only models with ECS:
91-94
Stealth R/T Turbo
94 Stealth R/T Luxury
91-95 3000GT
VR-4
95-96 3000GT VR-4 Spyder ???
Except for the 94 R/T Luxury, I
think all cars with ECS also had Active
Exhaust.
The R/T Luxury was a
model only made in 94, but in many ways it can be
considered an R/T with a
fancy option package. The regular 94 R/T was more
like a 91-93 ES and the
VINS used support that.
The 96 3000GT Spyders were pretty much like the
95's AFAIK, and I think that's
one reason why the regular 96 VR-4 didn't have
ECS, but the 96 VR-4 Spyder
did.
I've no idea if the Spyder SL's had
ECS... Anyone ? It might make sense.
Corrections or additions
appreciated...
Japan and Euro cars could be quite different. I think
Japan may have had a
non-turbo with AWD and AWS, as well as a turbo FWD with
automatic.
I also think there were two 94 Stealth turbo's with auto
trannies built for
the US.
VINS: JB3AN74K6RY000028 and JB3AN74K8RY000029 .
Carfax has nothing on them,
but it
also has nothing on my Canadian 94 TT.
Anyone know anywhere else these VINs
could
be checked
?
Mike.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 10:46:24
-0700
From: "Maupin, Justin" <
Justin.Maupin@kla-tencor.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Braking
All,
So much talking about brakes I have a
question myself... though this is more
attuned to the ABS system... I noticed
the other night when I did a e-brake
powerslide to get my ass end around a 45
degree corner that the ABS kicked
back at me in that nasty POW-POW-POW way
that it does, like when you pop
your fusable link and your ABS is dead... it
resumed normal as soon as I let
the e-brake off(I enjoy doing that entirely
too much). So anyway I figure
this is a function of the ABS, and the
system in general doesn't like me
doing it... However I was wondering if
there is a way known herein to either
make the ABS more tolerant or design a
switchable system that will allow me
to bypass the ABS temporarily without
getting the POW-POW-POW kick back.
Thanks,
Justin
Maupin
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 14:03:04
-0400
From: "Jeff VanOrsdal" <
jeffv@1nce.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: VIN
and option research **WAS 95 & 96 Stealth TT comparison**
We really
need to get ahold of the Asian and Euro CAPS databases. I know
the
Asian cars especially had many options we didn't. For instance,
there
was a "lightweight" GTO MR, the AWD non-turbo automatic GTO SR,
various
Recaro seat packages, optional 6 pot AP brakes, and several
others. To the
best of my knowledge, North America is the only locale
that got FWD models.
I believe it was Oleg that had all three databases
(Asian, European, and
North America) If he has broadband access and
would be so generous as to
upload the multiple CD images, I can provide some
temporary FTP space so
that we can start getting the databases into wider
distribution.
Jeff VanOrsdal
1991 Stealth ESX Twin Turbo
jeffv@1nce.com- -----Original
Message-----
From:
owner-team3s@team3s.com
[mailto:owner-team3s@team3s.com]On Behalf
Of Michael Reid
Sent: Monday,
October 22, 2001 1:34 PM
To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
Team3S: 95 & 96 Stealth TT comparison
AFAIK, in the US and
Canada:
the following are the only models with AWS:
91-94 Stealth
R/T Turbo
91-99 3000GT VR-4
the following are the only models with
ECS:
91-94 Stealth R/T Turbo
94 Stealth R/T
Luxury
91-95 3000GT VR-4
95-96 3000GT VR-4 Spyder ???
Except for
the 94 R/T Luxury, I think all cars with ECS also had
Active
Exhaust.
The R/T Luxury was a model only made in 94, but in
many ways it can be
considered an R/T with a fancy option package. The
regular 94 R/T was more
like a 91-93 ES and the VINS used support
that.
The 96 3000GT Spyders were pretty much like the 95's AFAIK, and I
think
that's
one reason why the regular 96 VR-4 didn't have ECS, but the
96 VR-4 Spyder
did.
I've no idea if the Spyder SL's had ECS... Anyone ? It
might make sense.
Corrections or additions appreciated...
Japan
and Euro cars could be quite different. I think Japan may have had
a
non-turbo with AWD and AWS, as well as a turbo FWD with automatic.
I
also think there were two 94 Stealth turbo's with auto trannies built for
the
US.
VINS: JB3AN74K6RY000028 and JB3AN74K8RY000029 . Carfax has nothing on
them,
but it
also has nothing on my Canadian 94 TT. Anyone know anywhere
else these VINs
could
be checked ?
Mike.
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 11:35:55
-0700
From: "Bob Forrest" <
bf@bobforrest.com>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: VIN and option research **WAS 95 & 96 Stealth TT
comparison**
- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff VanOrsdal"
<
jeffv@1nce.com>
> We really
need to get ahold of the Asian and Euro CAPS databases.
- ---snip---
>
I believe it was Oleg that had all three databases (Asian, European, and
>
North America) If he has broadband access and would be so generous as
to
> upload the multiple CD images, I can provide some temporary FTP space
so
> that we can start getting the databases into wider distribution.
-
-------------------->
Vinny Singh said he'll soon be updating our
US-spec CAPS database that's
already on our Team3S server.
www.Team3S.com/FAQ-CAPS.htm
It probably
makes sense to put the Asian and Euro CAPS here as well -
permanently. I
think Jeff Mohler is down to our last 500 GIGabytes of
storage on the Team3S
server, so he can handle it... :-) Knowing
Jeff, he's probably already
shopping for a multi Terabyte raid array that
will fill the rest of the
"server room"...
<chuckle>
Best,
Forrest
*** Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: 22 Oct 2001 11:41:52
-0700
From: John Monnin <
jkmonnin@altavista.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Brake hoses and VIN check digits
I saw 2 posts recently that are
stright out of DOT Federal regulations. Working for the final manufacture
of a vehicle built in 2 stages I have to know which of these regulaltions effect
my company.
QUESTION 1: Brake lines are for Off road use only, is
this normal?
Aftermarket brake lines are probably superior to stock
but the manufacture was unwilling to do expensive testing to prove
it.
Brake lines are federally regulated for new vehicle
manufacturers: Note most DOT regualtions specifically say for original
equipment manufactures. Aftermarket parts and performance parts are a very
grey area. Brake lines are regulated by:
U.S. DOT Federal Motor
Vehicle Safety Standards
Title 49, part 571, Standard 106 brake
hoses.
The purpose of this standard is to reduce deaths and injuries
occurring as a result of brake system failure from pressure or vacuum loss due
to hose or hose assembly rupture
This spec gives requirements for burst
strength, allowable expansion, and cracking. It is a fairly involved test
procedure that is not cheap to do. OEM hose meets these requirements but
it is not too difficult to exceed these requirements using steel braided
hose. My guess is that the after market companies don’t want to go throw
the expense of proving it. Another issue is that after market parts are
not held to the same standard as OEM parts.
QUESTION 2: What
is correct way to calculate VIN number check digit?
The check digit is a
great way to check if someone has faked a VIN number to make their car look like
something it is not. You can easily make a basic program that will
calculate VIN check digits (the 9th digit of the VIN number.)
VIN check
number decoding is a calculation straight out of the Federal regulations too so
every vehicle sold in America must meet this requirment.
Title 49, part
565.6 , VEHICLE IDENTIFICATION NUMBER REQUIREMENTS
A copy of this
section is below
c) The third section shall consist of one character,
which occupies position nine (9) in the VIN. This section shall be the check
digit whose purpose is to provide a means for verifying the accuracy of any VIN
transcription. After all other characters in VIN have been determined by the
manufacturer, the check digit shall be calculated by carrying out the
mathematical computation specified in paragraphs (c) (1) through (4) of this
section.
(1) Assign to each number in the VIN its actual mathematical value
and assign to each letter the value specified for it in Table III, as follows:
Table III
Assigned Values
A = 1 J = 1 T = 3
B = 2 K = 2 U = 4
C
= 3 L = 3 V = 5
D = 4 M = 4 W = 6
E = 5 N = 5 X = 7
F = 6 P = 7 Y =
8
G = 7 R = 9 Z = 9
H = 8 S = 2
(2) Multiply the assigned value for
each character in the VIN by the position weight factor specified in Table IV,
as follows:
Table IV
VIN Position and Weight Factor
1st
................8 10th .................. 9
2d .................7
11th....................8
3d..................6 12th....................7
4th ................5 13th....................6
5th ................4
14th....................5
6th ................3 15th....................4
7th ................2 16th....................3
8th................10
17th....................2
9th (check digit) .......0
(3) Add the
resulting products and divide the total by 11.
(4) The numerical remainder
is the check digit. If the remainder is 10 the letter "X" shall be used to
designate the check digit. The correct numeric remainder, zero through nine
(0-9) or the letter "X," shall appear in VIN position nine (9).
(5) A sample
check digit calculation is shown in Table V as follows:
Table
V
Calculation of a Check Digit
VIN Position 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13
14 15 16 17
Sample VIN 1 G 4 A H 5 9 H ... 5 G 1 1 8 3 4 1
Assigned
Value 1 7 4 1 8 5 9 8 ... 5 7 1 1 8 3 4 1
Weight Factor 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 10 0 9
8 7 6 5 4 3 2
Multiply Assigned value times weight factor 8 49 24 5 32 15 18
80 0 45 56 7 6 40 12 12 2
Add products:
8+49+24+5+32+15+18+80+0+45+56+7+6+40+12+12+2 = 411
Divide by 11: 411/11 = 37
4/11
The remainder is 4; this is the check digit to be inserted in position
nine (9) of the VIN
John Monnin
jkmonnin@altavista.com1991 VR-4,
4-bolt main conversion
*** Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 18:36:55
From: "Kevin Umbreit" <
unclesam099@hotmail.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: 95 & 96 Stealth TT comparison
Mike,
great work!!
one correction that i can offer to you is the '91-'93 R/T non
turbos had
ECS. the '94+ stealth dropped the ES name and went to the R/T
(pretty
much an ES) and the R/T luxury.
keep up the good work with the CAPS
program!!
- --Kevin
Blue '91 R/T (produced June 1990)
owner of one
of the missing VINs
>AFAIK, in the US and Canada:
>
>the
following are the only models with AWS:
>
>91-94 Stealth R/T
Turbo
>91-99 3000GT VR-4
>
>
>the following are the only
models with ECS:
>
>91-94 Stealth R/T
Turbo
>94 Stealth R/T Luxury
>91-95 3000GT
VR-4
>95-96 3000GT VR-4 Spyder ???
>
>
>Except for the
94 R/T Luxury, I think all cars with ECS also had
Active
>Exhaust.
>
>The R/T Luxury was a model only made in
94, but in many ways it can be
>considered an R/T with a fancy option
package. The regular 94 R/T was more
>like a 91-93 ES and the VINS used
support that.
>
>The 96 3000GT Spyders were pretty much like the
95's AFAIK, and I think
>that's
>one reason why the regular 96 VR-4
didn't have ECS, but the 96 VR-4 Spyder
>did.
>I've no idea if the
Spyder SL's had ECS... Anyone ? It might make sense.
>
>Corrections
or additions appreciated...
>
>Japan and Euro cars could be quite
different. I think Japan may have had a
>non-turbo with AWD and AWS, as
well as a turbo FWD with automatic.
>
>I also think there were two
94 Stealth turbo's with auto trannies built for
>the US.
>VINS:
JB3AN74K6RY000028 and JB3AN74K8RY000029 . Carfax has nothing on them,
>but
it
>also has nothing on my Canadian 94 TT. Anyone know anywhere else these
VINs
>could
>be checked ?
>
>Mike.
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 12:06:54
-0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Lucius <
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: manual info
Hi Bob,
I just purchased a '99 3000GT
manual off of ebay this weekend. I'll
be happy to scan and email you the
pages you need. Drop me an email
in two weeks if you haven't heard from me
and still need this info. I
don't remember seeing part numbers in the other
manuals I have.
In the mean time, see if the pictures in the Mitchell
Guide I have at
my web site help any. Look at pages 972 and 973. It does have
part
numbers. I also have a Mitchell Guide there for
Stealths.
Mitchell 3000GT:
http://www.geocities.com/lutransys/blucius/b-2-mitchell.htmMitchell
Stealth:
http://www.geocities.com/lutransys/blucius/b-2-mitchell-s.htmJeff
Lucius,
www.stealth316.com-
----- Original Message -----
From: "ek2mfg" <
ek2mfg@foxinternet.com>
To:
<
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Monday, October 22, 2001 11:17 AM
Subject: Team3S: manual info
could
somebody who has a service manual for a 99 ...<snip>
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 12:27:19
-0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Lucius <
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: VIN and option research
Oleg has sent me copies of these. I
am sure there are others that he
sent them too. Maybe one the Team3S admins
has copies? There are 6
CDs I think. Maybe a little much for most people to
ftp around. :)
Yep, the Mitsu site lists only AWD models for
Japan.
http://www.mitsubishi-motors.co.jp/docs8/productss/gto99/index.htmlNote
on the spec page how the gear ratios are different. Anybody have
access to
Japan trannies?
Jeff Lucius,
www.stealth316.com- ----- Original
Message -----
From: "Jeff VanOrsdal" <
jeffv@1nce.com>
To: "Team3s Tech List"
<
team3s@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Monday, October 22, 2001 12:03 PM
Subject: RE: Team3S: VIN and option
research **WAS 95 & 96 Stealth TT
comparison**
We really need to
get ahold of the Asian and Euro CAPS databases. I
know the Asian cars
especially had many options we didn't. For
instance, there was a
"lightweight" GTO MR, the AWD non-turbo
automatic GTO SR, various Recaro seat
packages, optional 6 pot AP
brakes, and several others. To the best of
my knowledge, North
America is the only locale that got FWD models.
I
believe it was Oleg that had all three databases (Asian, European,
and North
America) If he has broadband access and would be so
generous as to
upload the multiple CD images, I can provide some
temporary FTP space so that
we can start getting the databases into
wider distribution.
Jeff
VanOrsdal
1991 Stealth ESX Twin Turbo
jeffv@1nce.com*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 14:32:53
-0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Braking
>So much talking about brakes I have a question
myself... though this is more
>attuned to the ABS system... I noticed the
other night when I did a e-brake
>powerslide to get my ass end around a 45
degree corner
You want to try that again? A 45 deg corner is a slight
turn:
The only corner where you could possibly want to make a handbrake
turn
would be a 180 deg hairpin. Even so, the faster way through a hairpin
is
with full power and all four tires spinning. Anytime you lock the rear
end
up in a turn, you are going s..l..o..w. Maybe the ABS is trying to tell
you
something about your cornering style.
>back at me in that nasty
POW-POW-POW way that it does, like when you pop
>your fusable link and
your ABS is dead... it resumed normal as soon as I let
>the e-brake off(I
enjoy doing that entirely too much).
Yer right, though, it's a lot
of fun. I used a handbrake turn back in my
rally days, when we'd spin
the car around in its length doing a bootlegger
turn on a one-lane gravel
road. (My navigator would yell, "You dummy! You
missed the turn! Go back!").
What you do is slam on the brakes and then, as
the car gets down to about 15
mph, grab the handbrake and snap it around on
gravel. If you have any kind of
shoulder or ditch to work with, it's better
to spin the rear wheels under
power and snap it around that way, cuz you
have more control, and the car
"launches" out of the turn because the rear
wheels are already spinning in
the right direction when the car comes around.
I also used to make a
handbrake turn approaching my driveway in my 74 Vega
in snow and ice. I'd
come down a hill to a cul-de-sac. As I approached my
driveway (straight
ahead), I'd grab the handbrake, turn the car completely
around, grab reverse,
and back up my driveway. I got so good at it, the car
never stopped -- it'd
just spin and continue backwards. The key was to put
the automatic in
neutral, then grab the handbrake, then slap it into
reverse as it was
sliding, instead of waiting until it stopped. Stunt
drivers in the movies do
that kind of stuff all the time.
Rich/old poop
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 13:10:29
-0700
From: "Gross, Erik" <
erik.gross@intel.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Handbrake turns
I've occasionally contemplated using the hand
brake in a turn-around on an
AutoX course, but I've never done it in my VR-4
because I'm nervous about
locking up the rear wheels in an AWD car. On
my old 3000GT (FWD), I did
e-brake 180s no problem (although doing it without
stopping or smoking the
front wheels was a challenge).
So what
happens if your going along at 20-30mph and you turn in and jam on
the
e-brake in an AWD car? Obviously it would shock the driveline,
but
would it cause the front to lock up as well?
Not that I
ever plan to do this in my VR-4, just curious...
-
--Erik
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 15:24:43
-0500
From: "Jannusch, Matt" <
mjannusch@marketwatch.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Handbrake turns
> So what happens if your going along at
20-30mph and you turn
> in and jam on the e-brake in an AWD car?
Obviously it would
> shock the driveline, but would it cause the front to
lock up
> as well?
...if you stay on the e-brake long
enough to cause the viscous coupling to
lock up then yes, it'll lock the
front wheels too. I doubt the e-brake has
enough stopping power to do
that though.
I'd list e-brake turns under the "not recommended" category
for AWD cars.
The Mitsu Lancer EVO VII has an electronically controlled
center
differential which disconnects the rear driveline if you pull the
e-brake
(making it FWD), which would be the preferable way to do it on an AWD
car.
- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 16:33:11
-0400
From: "Furman, Russell" <
RFurman2@MassMutual.com>
Subject:
FW: Team3S: was handbrake turns NOW EVO VII
What is the lists opinion on
my statement below....
> > Just as an interesting piece of Info we
may see a 230 HP
> > detuned version of the EVO VII around October
2002 :) Can
> > you say daily driver till 2004 when the
warranty expires.
> > Then out comes the wrenches and airtools
plus that lovely
> > sucking sound [money coming out of my
wallet :( ]
> >
> > > The Mitsu Lancer EVO VII
has an electronically controlled center
> > > differential which
disconnects the rear driveline if you pull the
> > > e-brake
(making it FWD), which would be the preferable way
> > to do it on
> > > an AWD car.
> > >
> > >
-Matt
> > > '95 3000GT Spyder VR4
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 14:03:29
-0700
From: "Gross, Erik" <
erik.gross@intel.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: BOV Dump Straight to Atmosphere (and GReddy Type S Re
port)
First, my experience:
My VR-4 had an HKS Sequential BOV
(vents to atmosphere) installed when I
bought it and I drove the car with it
installed for about 5000 miles. I
played with the adjustment screw a
little during this time to see how it
affects operation.
Observations(with HKS BOV):
* Loud, but not completely obnoxious
whoosh sound
* No gaggle of geese under my hood with K&N installed
*
No stalling when adjustment screw was anything but
all the way loose
*
Occasional oily/fuel smell when BOV vents
* 1-2mpg lower gas mileage than
with stock
BOV (friend's data)
* Definitely ran rich for a second or two
after BOV
activation (reports from people following car)
* If BOV
activated during a shift (clutch in), there
was a little engine
vibration/rocking (from missing?)
if you REALLY paid attention
* If BOV
activated from partial throttle with clutch
engaged (i.e. lightly
accelerating in 4th at 65mph
and then quickly back off the throttle), the
engine
would buck once (miss from being too rich?) and cause
a noticeable
jerk and shock to the driveline
A month or so ago, I replaced my HKS BOV
with a GReddy Type S BPV (vents
back to intake). I'm very happy with
it.
Observations:
* Almost as loud as the HKS BOV, but it is
somewhat
quieter
* No gaggle of geese under my hood with K&N
installed
* No stalling when whatsoever
* No oily/fuel smell when BPV
vents
* Seems to get better gas mileage, but all the gas
stations recently
switched to oxygenated gas for the
winter, so I'm not absolutely sure -
stupid
tree-huggers :-)
* Doesn't seem to run rich when BPV activates
*
NO engine vibration when BPV activates during shift
* Occasionally I get a
very slight buck when BPV
activates under partial throttle conditions,
though
it is much less severe than with the HKS BOV and
occurs far less
frequently (maybe 1/20th as much
as with the HKS)
* Turbo spool-up
IS noticeably quicker in-between shifts
(provided you shift
quickly)
Second, Responses to some previous posts:
> Has anyone
noticed any strange effects when venting your
> stock BOV strait to the
atmosphere?
Not to sound like a jerk, but why on earth would you want to
do that? Just
the sound? There's a reason the stock valve vents
to the intake in a Karman
Vortex MAS system...
> I vented [my stock
BPV to atmosphere] to see what it was
> like. Got a cool *whoosh*
sound when shifting gears, lost
> metered air, did not stall, did not run
rich.
It did run rich (no way around that), but apparently not rich
enough that it
caused effects that were immediately visible to you...
It HAS to run rich
if you vent metered air with the stock ECU and
MAS.
> There is nothing wrong with dumping to atmosphere though
> other than you lose metered air [...] You only lose a little
>
performance since your engine needs to suck in that much
> more
air.
[Kyle's Broflovski's mom from South Park] whatWhatWHAT?!? But
losing
metered air causes the engine to run rich, robbing you of power and
not
giving your turbo the spool-up help that a BPV offers. Not to
mention the
shock on the engine/driveline from bucking/missing when it runs
rich...
> > I have heard 2 theories on how this effects performance
> > though: 1) the loss of boost pressure to the atmosphere
>
> keep the turbos from staying well spooled
>
> The *exhaust
gas* spools the turbo. The BOV has no affect
> on this EXCEPT when it does
not function correctly and
> allows high pressure to build in the intake
track, which
> tries to slow the compressor wheel, possibly to the
point
> of damaging the turbo.
But what about where the vented air
(FROM the BPV) goes? It goes to the
*inlet* side of the turbo,
effectively increasing the pressure before the
compressor wheel relative to
the pressure after the wheel. This would cause
a larger pressure
differential in the compressor side of the turbo, thereby
decreasing spool-up
time. Next time you have the (non-pressurized side)
intake piping off,
look at the "T" pipe directly after the MAS housing,
which is where the stock
BPV vents. Look at the outlets for the BPV
discharge - they're routed
so that the air coming out of the BPV is divided
between the two hoses to the
turbos. Further, the air is directed in a
spiral motion as it enters
the turbo inlet hoses, which, I assume, is the
same direction that the
compressor wheel turns.
- --Erik
'95 VR-4 with GReddy Type S
BPV
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 14:22:34
-0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Handbrake turns
Thats the old-skool way of a 180 turn in
AutoX.
Its really quicker to enter really wide and late apex it.
Learnt that at
Mckammey school
On Mon, 22 Oct 2001, Gross, Erik
wrote:
>
> I've occasionally contemplated using the hand brake
in a turn-around on an
> AutoX course, but I've never done it in my VR-4
because I'm nervous about
> locking up the rear wheels in an AWD
car. On my old 3000GT (FWD), I did
> e-brake 180s no problem
(although doing it without stopping or smoking the
> front wheels was a
challenge).
>
> So what happens if your going along at
20-30mph and you turn in and jam on
> the e-brake in an AWD car?
Obviously it would shock the driveline, but
> would it cause the front to
lock up as well?
>
> Not that I ever plan to do this in my
VR-4, just curious...
>
> --Erik
Geoff
Mohler
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 14:10:18
-0700
From: "Gross, Erik" <
erik.gross@intel.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Handbrake turns
> Thats the old-skool way of a 180 turn in
AutoX.
>
> Its really quicker to enter really wide and late apex
it.
> Learnt that at Mckammey school
Yeah, the way I
currently approach the 180s is to brake deep, turn-in fairly
sharply, and
then have a nice, wide arc toward the apex cone where I kiss
the "back" side
of the apex cone. Seems to work pretty well - I travel a
little farther
than the line directly to the apex, but my exit speed is
MUCH
better.
- --Erik
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 14:30:37
-0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Handbrake turns
If you go in realllly wiiiide, you end up
with:
1) Much more distance to brake into.
2) Much more distance to
accellerate out from.
On Mon, 22 Oct 2001, Gross, Erik wrote:
>
> Thats the old-skool way of a 180 turn in AutoX.
> >
> >
Its really quicker to enter really wide and late apex it.
> >
Learnt that at Mckammey school
>
> Yeah, the way I currently
approach the 180s is to brake deep, turn-in fairly
> sharply, and then
have a nice, wide arc toward the apex cone where I kiss
> the "back" side
of the apex cone. Seems to work pretty well - I travel a
> little
farther than the line directly to the apex, but my exit speed is MUCH
>
better.
>
> --Erik
Geoff Mohler
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 14:20:30
-0700
From: "Jim Berry" <
fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Handbrake turns
Using the E brake to stop the rear wheels should cause
the ABS to release
pressure on all four wheels until they are all moving
again. We have a BS
two channel ABS system [ Hell the NA cars have a 3
channel system and
real cars have 4 channel ]. The wheels work in diagonal
pairs so that if a
front locks, it releases pressure on the locked front and
its diagonal partner
in the rear --- it also uses an oddball hydraulic
circuit called select low, which
releases pressure on the other rear
wheel so that one rear does not lock up
and cause loss of control. Locking up
both rears ought to confuse the hell
out of the ABS --- no matter how much it
releases the pressure it can't get
the rears to start turning. It probably
keeps releasing pressure until the E
brake can't keep the rears from turning
which the ABS interprets as the
restoration of grip so it lets the pressure
build which locks the wheels again.
I can see no good coming from this
exercise.
Jim
Berry
=======================================================
- -----
Original Message -----
From: Gross, Erik <
erik.gross@intel.com>
To: Team3S
List (E-mail) <
team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
>
I've occasionally contemplated using the hand brake in a turn-around on
an
> AutoX course, but I've never done it in my VR-4 because I'm nervous
about
> locking up the rear wheels in an AWD car. On my old 3000GT
(FWD), I did
> e-brake 180s no problem (although doing it without stopping
or smoking the
> front wheels was a challenge).
>
> So
what happens if your going along at 20-30mph and you turn in and jam on
>
the e-brake in an AWD car? Obviously it would shock the driveline,
but
> would it cause the front to lock up as well?
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 14:41:13
-0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
Team3S: CAPS downloading Notes
Everyone:
If you would like to DL
the CAPS database, thats just dandy, but please
only download what your pipe
can support -1- file at a time.
Ive had to block out two dialup providers
in my router in the last week,
who feel that downloading -all- the fiels at
once is ok.
Look..if you have a 56K modem, youre not getting 56k * 20 if
you download
20 files at once.
If you have mega-DSL, and you are
annoyed at only getting T1 speeds from
the server, opening 20 more
connections aint gonna help either.
:^)
Bob, can you add a polite
note about DL'ing the CAPS stuff?
I Have a Toyota parts database that ive
had to restrict to only 1 of the
two files online at a time, and rotate every
week or so..for the same
reason. Just Id rather not do that with all
the CAPS stuff.
- ---
Geoff Mohler
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 14:34:28
-0700
From: "Maupin, Justin" <
Justin.Maupin@kla-tencor.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Handbrake turns
For all those concerned about e-brake turn in
the VR4... rest assured that I
only did it on the wet road... The road goes
90 degrees ( I said 45 didn't
I) but turning into my driveway as I did would
have made it a 180... Guess I
didn't think carefully enough about what I was
saying... It has been a long
couple of weeks... My question still goes
unanswered though... can we in
some way temporarily disable the
ABS?
Justin
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 18:19:58
-0700
From: "Darc" <
wce@telus.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Speed
Bleeder Discount For Team3S Members
An FYI addendum this
subject.... The Stealth 1st Gen TT's do not take the
size 7 on the rears as
reported in previous threads. The size 7 is for the
Mitsu 1st gen rears only.
This information is reflected accurately at the
Speed Bleeder site where 10's
are noted for Stealth rears, and 7's for Mitsu
rears. So, do note this
difference in the cars, and do not go by previous
threads here (as I
did) if you have a Stealth. Mitsu and Stealth rears,
are
different.
Best
Darc
Re:
> All:
> Team3S
members are being offered a 10% discount on Speed Bleeder
>
products. When ordering, mention that you are a member of Team3S
>
for the discount. Whitney is the customer service rep, and she's
>
great!
>
http://www.speedbleeder.com>
>
Rich
> For the Admins
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 19:02:13
-0700
From: "Jim Berry" <
fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Speed Bleeder Discount For Team3S Members
Darc --- sorry to burst your
bubble, but, I have a 93 stealth and it requires
the 7mm speed bleeders. I am
currently installing my front calipers on the
rear of my car and I cannot use
the speed bleeders that were on my
rear brakes because they are 7 mm not the
10 mm required on the fronts.
Jim Berry
====================================================
- -----
Original Message -----
From: Darc <
wce@telus.net>
To: <
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Monday, October 22, 2001 6:19 PM
Subject: Re: Team3S: Speed Bleeder Discount
For Team3S Members
> An FYI addendum this subject.... The
Stealth 1st Gen TT's do not take the
> size 7 on the rears as reported in
previous threads. The size 7 is for the
> Mitsu 1st gen rears only. This
information is reflected accurately at the
> Speed Bleeder site where 10's
are noted for Stealth rears, and 7's for Mitsu
> rears. So, do note this
difference in the cars, and do not go by previous
> threads here (as
I did) if you have a Stealth. Mitsu and Stealth rears,
> are
different.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 19:06:30
-0700
From: "Jim Berry" <
fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Handbrake turns
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Maupin, Justin
<
Justin.Maupin@kla-tencor.com>
My
question still goes unanswered though... can we in
> some way temporarily
disable the ABS?
>
> Justin
It should be fairly easy --- if
you remove the 10 amp fuse it
disables the ABS so it should be fairly easy to
put a switch
in the line to disable the power to the ABS [ I think
].
Jim Berry
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 21:24:19
-0500
From: "Alex Pedenko" <
apedenko@home.com>
Subject: OT: Re:
Team3S: CAPS downloading Notes
Just as a side note, and not to p*ss
anybody off -
Certain ISPs impose a
per-connection bandwidth limit - I know this from
experience, my cable
modem at home can support up to 10Mb (1megabit/s =
100k/s, so 1
megabyte/s) but not on one connection. It can only do about
10%
on
one TCP connection. In that case, if your ISP does that, opening
another
connection infact _will_ make things go
faster.
As a software developer, I understand
you not wanting to allow multiple
connections from the same person, but
there are also ways to make sure of
that - there are ways of limiting
the number of connections from the
same
IP.
But in any case, if ur a 56K
user, stick to Geoff's advice - 5.6 KBps
won't become 100 KBps if you
have 20 connections going.
Alex.
> -----
Original Message -----
> From: "Geoff Mohler" <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
>
To: <
team3s@team3s.com>
> Cc:
<
3sracers@speedtoys.com>
>
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2001 4:41 PM
> Subject: Team3S: CAPS downloading
Notes
>
> > Everyone:
> >
> > If you would like
to DL the CAPS database, thats just dandy, but please
> > only download
what your pipe can support -1- file at a time.
> >
> > Ive had
to block out two dialup providers in my router in the last week,
> >
who feel that downloading -all- the fiels at once is ok.
> >
>
> Look..if you have a 56K modem, youre not getting 56k * 20 if
you
download
> > 20 files at once.
> >
> > If you
have mega-DSL, and you are annoyed at only getting T1 speeds from
> >
the server, opening 20 more connections aint gonna help either.
>
>
> > :^)
> >
> > Bob, can you add a polite note
about DL'ing the CAPS stuff?
> >
> > I Have a Toyota parts
database that ive had to restrict to only 1 of the
> > two files online
at a time, and rotate every week or so..for the same
> > reason.
Just Id rather not do that with all the CAPS stuff.
> > ---
>
> Geoff Mohler
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 20:11:29
-0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Re: Ceramic brakes?
> If you come out of the corner in a
gear that puts you around 4000-4500 RPM
> then the turbo lag should be
short enough to not matter - especially on
> stock turbos. If the
lag is too long, then you should start accelerating
> earlier so it is
already pulling when you come out of the corner and take
> better
advantage of the AWD.
- ---
Stock pea shooters at 4000+ aint worth it,
shoot for more like 3K to get a
decent turque curve out of your power
band.
> Left foot braking has got to be hard on the tranny and
transfer case, which
> are already weak components on these cars. A
stock clutch will be toast in
> no time as well.
>
>
-Matt
> '95 3000GT Spyder VR4
Geoff Mohler
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 20:13:39
-0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Re: Ceramic brakes?
Good work!
Pinch the output ends
of the vents to get as much air as -possible- into
the hub..to force air thru
the vents of the rotors.
On Mon, 22 Oct 2001, Darren Schilberg
wrote:
> Here are the pictures. I think these work better than
any brake cooling
> ducts I have seen for our cars. The duct ends up
about one inch from
> the 12 o'clock position on the rotor. I did
not add the gutter
> downspout to this picture but this will work on a car
that has been
> lowered to the max also. Attaches near the axle
instead of the front of
> the car which ounces up and down to much for
those stiff cars.
>
>
http://www.speedtoys.com/~dschilberg/cars/brakes/Brake_ducts/index.htm>
> --Flash!
> 1995 VR-4
Geoff Mohler
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 19:59:11
-0700
From: "Darc" <
wce@telus.net>
Subject: Team3S:
Porterfield SS Lines
Team;
As with the Speed Bleeders, there may
be differences in our cars with the
rear brake lines. Insure what
lengths you have on these lines (measure them)
and what ends
(male/female--female/female--male/male) are required when
placing your orders
with Porterfield for SS replacements. IMHO it appears
there may be
differences, particulalry in 1st Gen Stealth as versus 1st Gen
Mitsu. With
more feedback to the manufacturer, as with Speed Bleeder, the
problem will
become moot.
Best
Darc
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 20:05:33
-0700
From: "Darc" <
wce@telus.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Speed
Bleeder Discount For Team3S Members
Okie Dokie...ammend the information
to read, 1992 Canadian Production (Dog
Sled modle) RT/TT's require #10
(mm) Speed Bleeders in the rear, not 7's
as reported. Perhaps the 1993
is the only year that takes 7's??????? It
would stand to reason that Jim
would have to have the different one ;-))
Darc
- ----- Original
Message -----
From: "Jim Berry" <
fastmax@home.com>
To: "Darc" <
wce@telus.net>; <
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Monday, October 22, 2001 7:02 PM
Subject: Re: Team3S: Speed Bleeder Discount
For Team3S Members
> Darc --- sorry to burst your bubble, but, I have
a 93 stealth and it
requires
> the 7mm speed bleeders. I am currently
installing my front calipers on the
> rear of my car and I cannot use the
speed bleeders that were on my
> rear brakes because they are 7 mm not the
10 mm required on the
fronts.
>
> Jim
Berry
> ====================================================
> -----
Original Message -----
> From: Darc <
wce@telus.net>
> To: <
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
>
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2001 6:19 PM
> Subject: Re: Team3S: Speed
Bleeder Discount For Team3S Members
>
>
> > An FYI
addendum this subject.... The Stealth 1st Gen TT's do not
take
the
> > size 7 on the rears as reported in previous threads.
The size 7 is for
the
> > Mitsu 1st gen rears only. This information
is reflected accurately at
the
> > Speed Bleeder site where 10's are
noted for Stealth rears, and 7's for
Mitsu
> > rears. So, do note
this difference in the cars, and do not go by
previous
> > threads
here (as I did) if you have a Stealth. Mitsu and
Stealth
rears,
> > are different.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 20:24:34
-0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Re: Ceramic brakes?
> If you're going to use the brakes
like that, you're going to have to have
> some active method for cooling
them, like ducts or Rich's water spray.
- ---
ok..thats it..im gonna
quote. *laugh*
"Brake Evaporative Cooling"
This approach uses
small quantities of atmomized water that are
injected into the inlet of the
brake cooling duct. Idealy, the water
evaporates before reaching the
brake disc, creating the maximum
temperature drop before the air reaches the
caliper and disc (essentially
the same priniciple that road racers experience
in the rain, when cool
water vapor is ingested into the brake ducts bit in a
more controllable
and consistent manner). The object is to cool the
incoming air intake
charge, not to spray water directly onto the disc and
cakuoer surfaces.
If water is sprayed directly into the center of the disc
area, this
creates steam, which acts as an insulator. If that happens,
you wont
achieve the full benefit of the water chare."
- -end
quote-
Also, AP caliper CP4910 is an example of a caliper with
water jacketing so
you can circulate cooling water in
it..heh..cool!
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 20:25:32
-0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
Team3S: RE: Ceramic brakes?
It wont fade..never EVER, but it just -wont-
stop at all when cold in a
reasonable distance.
On Mon, 22 Oct 2001,
Mihai Raicu wrote:
> Geoff,
>
> Thanks Geoff for the
reply. Keep us posted on how they work on the
> Supras please.
However, "ugly and nasty" does not sound good for the
> fade free
streetability I'm interested in.
>
> -MIHAI RAICU-
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> > From: Geoff Mohler
[mailto:gemohler@www.speedtoys.com]
> >
> > The MK4 supra is
the first car to get the kit, and I'll be able to get
> our
> >
cars as well once those are complete.
> >
> > Race only..swap
pads/rotors at the track. Street use will be ugly
> > nasty...not
recommended at all.
Geoff Mohler
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 23:35:56
-0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Team3S: RE:squirting water
That's it? This is what we've been waiting
three weeks for? The big hairy
anti-squirting argument?
If there was a
teeny bit of truth to this, the Trans Am cars would use it.
Instead, they
squirt raw water directly into the rotor and CREATE STEAM for
cooling.
I will buy this argument for cooling an intercooler or a radiator,
because
a 10 degree drop in the ambient air WOULD make a difference. But I
still
maintain that 10 F cooler air in the cooling duct won't make a diddly
damn
bit of difference to a rotor at 1400 F.
As for cooling brakes in
the rain, I think that proves my point more than
yours, because water is
splashing up on the rotors. It has nothing to do
with cooler ambient air,
because I can fry brakes in November at 35F
ambient just as easily as I can
in the summer at 100 F ambient.
Rich
Geoff
said:
>ok..thats it..im gonna quote. *laugh*
>"Brake
Evaporative Cooling"
> This approach uses small quantities of atmomized
water that are
>injected into the inlet of the brake cooling duct.
Idealy, the water
>evaporates before reaching the brake disc, creating the
maximum
>temperature drop before the air reaches the caliper and disc
(essentially
>the same priniciple that road racers experience in the rain,
when cool
>water vapor is ingested into the brake ducts bit in a more
controllable
>and consistent manner). The object is to cool the
incoming air intake
>charge, not to spray water directly onto the disc and
cakuoer surfaces.
>If water is sprayed directly into the center of the
disc area, this
>creates steam, which acts as an insulator. If that
happens, you wont
>achieve the full benefit of the water
chare."
>
>-end quote-
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 22:04:42
-0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
Team3S: RE:squirting water
No offense, but I'll take my brake advice from
a book about it first...and
ask nay-sayers for proof or results to dispute
it.
Thats all.
:^)
On Mon, 22 Oct 2001, Merritt
wrote:
> That's it? This is what we've been waiting three weeks for?
The big hairy
> anti-squirting argument?
> If there was a teeny bit
of truth to this, the Trans Am cars would use it.
> Instead, they squirt
raw water directly into the rotor and CREATE STEAM for
> cooling.
>
> I will buy this argument for cooling an intercooler or a radiator,
because
> a 10 degree drop in the ambient air WOULD make a difference. But
I still
> maintain that 10 F cooler air in the cooling duct won't make a
diddly damn
> bit of difference to a rotor at 1400 F.
>
> As
for cooling brakes in the rain, I think that proves my point more than
>
yours, because water is splashing up on the rotors. It has nothing to do
>
with cooler ambient air, because I can fry brakes in November at 35F
>
ambient just as easily as I can in the summer at 100 F ambient.
>
> Rich
>
> Geoff said:
>
> >ok..thats it..im
gonna quote. *laugh*
> >"Brake Evaporative Cooling"
> >
This approach uses small quantities of atmomized water that are
>
>injected into the inlet of the brake cooling duct. Idealy, the
water
> >evaporates before reaching the brake disc, creating the
maximum
> >temperature drop before the air reaches the caliper and disc
(essentially
> >the same priniciple that road racers experience in the
rain, when cool
> >water vapor is ingested into the brake ducts bit in
a more controllable
> >and consistent manner). The object is to
cool the incoming air intake
> >charge, not to spray water directly
onto the disc and cakuoer surfaces.
> >If water is sprayed directly
into the center of the disc area, this
> >creates steam, which acts as
an insulator. If that happens, you wont
> >achieve the full
benefit of the water chare."
> >-end quote-
Geoff
Mohler
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 00:05:35
-0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Team3S: RE:squirting water
At 10:04 PM 10/22/01 -0700, Geoff Mohler
wrote:
>No offense, but I'll take my brake advice from a book about it
first...and
>ask nay-sayers for proof or results to dispute it.
My
only proof is that I KNOW my system works.
Without water injection, I
lose my brake effectiveness after four hard laps
at Road America. As soon as
the brakes start to go away, I start
a'squirtin', and they come back. Then,
when the water's gone from the
reservoir, so are the brakes. Time to come in
for a refill. Izzat enuf
results for you?
Would that I had the
wherewithall and the knowledge to rig up a fiber optic
infrared temperature
sensor to track rotor temps pre and post
squirt.
Rich
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 22:29:46
-0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
Team3S: RE:squirting water
> My only proof is that I KNOW my system
works.
>
> Without water injection, I lose my brake effectiveness
after four hard laps
> at Road America. As soon as the brakes start to go
away, I start
> a'squirtin', and they come back. Then, when the water's
gone from the
> reservoir, so are the brakes. Time to come in for a
refill. Izzat enuf
> results for you?
- ---
No, thats only showing
it works, but not that its superior to whats listed
and accepted as 'best
practice' by most everyone ive met that wasnt racing
delivery trucks on the
beach in Denmark (ever watch that stuff?? WILD!)
> Would that I
had the wherewithall and the knowledge to rig up a fiber optic
> infrared
temperature sensor to track rotor temps pre and post
squirt.
>
>
> Rich
Geoff Mohler
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 00:33:05
-0500
From: "cody" <
overclck@starband.net>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: RE:squirting water
Now now children...
I think the
real answer may lay in between your arguments. This means I
AM RIGHT,
and both of you are only HALF RIGHT!!!! :-P
From my brief
knowledge of thermodynamics, I know that the most heat is
transferred during
a phase change. Such as liquid to gas / gas to
liquid / solid to
liquid, etc. You get my point. Well, how hot does
it have
to be for water to vaporize even when sprayed in a fine mist in
a 3" x oh say
30" long tube (ducted to your brakes).
I think the answer to this
argument is this. You don't spray a direct
stream of water on your
brakes like you were washing a rotor wish a
hose. That's gonna take up
a lot of water, not to mention possibility
of cooling things too quickly,
resulting in warpage.
The optimum water sprayage (that's not
a word), is to spray a lot of
water, but in the intake tract to the brakes
where it is actually
traveling as little "droplets" These droplets hit
the rotor along with
the cool air, and you get 1. Steam if the rotors are hot
enough 2.
Cooler brakes The steam shows that a lot of heat is
being transferred.
This is normal if you are spraying enough water.
But... the water that
is sprayed actually hits the rotor and vaporizes
immediately.
So - Rich - you are right about the steam forming and the
amount of
water, but the optimum is to spray a constant spray of water but in
a
manner that spreads out the water as much as possible (not in a
direct
stream), and Geoff - you are right too, but the water does not
vaporize
before it hits the rotor, it vaporizes as it hits the rotor
(producing
steam, and producing enough steam to notice if you are using
enough
water)
An examples: The water spray you want in the
tubing is like a
conventional shower head - spread out and not directly on
the rotor (you
want it off the rotor so it has a chance to mix with incoming
air giving
it more "swirl", you don't want water spray that mimics a
"massage"
shower head pointing directly on the rotor. This could cause
warpage,
and is not quite as efficient (should still work, but not
as
efficiently).
Think about watering your lawn with a hand held
sprayer - to get the
most effective coverage, you are going to use the
largest, most spread
out spray pattern because it will cover more evenly than
trying the
"pressure sprayer" and trying to cover every inch of grass (or
rotor).
So, there is my theory, taken from all the sources I could find
on the
net relating to it, and a little bit of common sense... If I
misread
what anyone had said before, I apologize, as I only half followed
the
thread before...
- -Cody
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 05:53:15
-0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Lucius <
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Speed Bleeder Discount For Team3S Members
As I and others
have mentioned in past related posts, it is very easy
to tell if you have 7
mm or 10 mm threaded bleeders in back (all
fronts are 10 mm as is the clutch
bleeder, AFAIK). Just see what size
wrench fits the hexagonal used to loosen
and tighten the bleeder. An
8 mm wrench fits our 7 mm threaded bleeders and a
10 mm wrench fits
10 mm threads. As far I and others can tell only the
following 3S
cars (US models only?) have 7 mm threaded bleeders in back:
3/92-5/93
production dates (some '92s and probably all '93s). My '92 Stealth
TT
with a production date of 92.03.02 has 7 mm bleeders in back.
Jeff
Lucius,
www.stealth316.com-
----- Original Message -----
From: "Darc" <
wce@telus.net>
To: "Jim Berry" <
fastmax@home.com>; <
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Monday, October 22, 2001 9:05 PM
Subject: Re: Team3S: Speed Bleeder Discount
For Team3S Members
Okie Dokie...ammend the information to read, 1992
Canadian Production
(Dog Sled modle) RT/TT's require #10 (mm)
Speed Bleeders in the
rear, not 7's as reported. Perhaps the 1993 is the only
year that
takes 7's??????? It would stand to reason that Jim would have to
have
the different one ;-))
Darc
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 08:22:06
-0500
From: "Willis, Charles E." <
cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Speed Bleeder Discount For Team3S Members
Wow! If the
bleed screws are different are the rear calipers
different too? Or
still just the old single piston floating caliper?
> -----Original
Message-----
> From: Darc [SMTP:wce@telus.net]
> Sent: Monday,
October 22, 2001 8:20 PM
> To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Speed Bleeder Discount For Team3S Members
>
>
An FYI addendum this subject.... The Stealth 1st Gen TT's do not
take
> the
> size 7 on the rears as reported in previous threads.
The size 7 is for the
> Mitsu 1st gen rears only. This information is
reflected accurately at the
> Speed Bleeder site where 10's are noted for
Stealth rears, and 7's for
> Mitsu
> rears. So, do note this
difference in the cars, and do not go by previous
> threads here (as
I did) if you have a Stealth. Mitsu and Stealth rears,
> are
different.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 08:24:59
-0500
From: "Willis, Charles E." <
cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Re: Ceramic brakes?
Could somebody post/or link a graphic
representation of the torque curve for
1st and 2nd gen VR4's with stock
turbos?
> Stock pea shooters at 4000+ aint worth it, shoot for more
like 3K to get a
> decent turque curve out of your power
band.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 10:40:04
-0400
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: RE:squirting water
And I shouldn't comment how at Kansas Rich was
doing his water spraying
magic and not going 5 seconds faster than us ...
should I? I think he
was the fastest because there was human timing and
only clocked him at
most 0.5 second faster in the 7 sessions we
timed.
Just trying to add some substance. I know Heartland Park is
not Road
Atlanta. And I know Rich was following Chuck's line to learn
it more so
I don't know if we ever saw Rich break out and have a best lap
since he
was doing more learning.
Rich? How much faster you
think you coulda gone without someone in
front to slow you down?
Also
... Rich, Chuck, and Chuck's son were in A Group and were
speedbumps for the
full race-prepped cars. I was in C Group and only
got passed by 2 cars
and passed all the others (some twice in one
session). I'll bet that
has something to do with it also since I was
not held up as much by sticking
my arm out the window.
- --Flash!
- -----Original
Message-----
From: cody
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2001
01:33
From my brief knowledge of thermodynamics, I know that the
most heat is
transferred during a phase change. Such as liquid to gas /
gas to
liquid / solid to liquid, etc. You get my point.
Well, how hot does
it have to be for water to vaporize even when sprayed in a
fine mist in
a 3" x oh say 30" long tube (ducted to your brakes).
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 10:43:37
-0400
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Re: Ceramic brakes?
I agree that LFB is not needed in every turn
but Kansas offered such
great places. It is the flattest course I ever
ran. Mid-Ohio is not
hilly by any means but has more higher speed
corners than Kansas and
Watkins Glen is my most favorite of all so far
(haven't hit the other
big tracks yet, though).
I was also doing what
*I* needed to keep up with the group and push
myself.
-
--Flash!
- -----Original Message-----
From: Willis, Charles
E.
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2001 12:26
I don't disagree that
left foot braking is a good trick for keeping the
rpms
up while slowing
down enough to turn in - I just don't believe it is
necessary or helpful for
every turn. I think you are just grinding the
pads
down most places
on the track.
Another thing, just because somebody (me) is an instructor
doesn't mean
they
are fast, or driving up to the car's potential - it
means they can get
around the track safely and have some ability (or
training) to
communicate
that skill to a student.
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 10:50:46
-0400
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Re: Ceramic brakes?
I missed what you mean here?
Were you
saying to pinch the rotor end to speed up airflow? Direct it
toward the
inside of the rotor so it slings out through the vanes? Keep
it pointed
at the rotor after the caliper? Before the caliper?
I had to pinch
the front (although it maintains the same cross-sectional
area) to avoid the
speedbumps and daily driving. I did remove the
gutter downspout funnel
that leads to the intake. This is a 2"x8"
rectangle that funnels into a
3" diameter hole. This setup stayed on
all week until I went for an
alignment. This was also the first setup
of this design. Total
cost ... around $10 for both sides.
I was able to get it right up near
the rotor and it was not pinched by
the tires when at full lock. I hope
they bend the same way when on the
track but I never got to test them.
I had them on for 20 miles of road
driving (the one in the picture) but not
one on the driver's side. When
I pulled over I put the back of my
fingers near the cooled rotor and
then near the un-cooled rotor. I
couldn't tell a difference. I needed
a pyrometer.
All I know is
that with the stock plastic covering under the front of
the car and without
punching holes in the wheelwell splashguard area
this is the only way to get
a duct to the brakes. Merritt has his
under-the-car-splashguard removed
so he can afford to put up to a 4"
tube I believe. I don't have that
luxury.
- --Flash!
- -----Original Message-----
From: Geoff
Mohler
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2001 23:14
Good
work!
Pinch the output ends of the vents to get as much air as -possible-
into
the hub..to force air thru the vents of the rotors.
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 08:52:31
-0600
From: "Floyd, Jim" <
Jim_Floyd@Maxtor.com>
Subject:
Team3S: NOS injection effect on compression ratio and combustion chamber
volume.
I had a local mustang owner with NOS tell me
this:
1) Injecting NOS into your engine increases the compression
ratio of
the combustion chamber while injecting NOS.
2) Injecting NOS
increases the volume of gasoline in the combustion
chamber while injecting
NOS.
Because you have to increase gas volume during NOS
injection.
Is this true ?
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 10:56:03
-0400
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Handbrake turns
I've done it on an AutoX course once.
Didn't work and took my
concentration from where it was needed. I think
it just slowed the car
down more than I wanted since the car is so
heavy.
Another old AutoX trick is to pump the rear tires up to at least 5
psi
higher than the front (if not 10 psi). This will allow them to not
grip
as well since they have too much air in them. Boy howdy can you
pivot
around corners then. However, slalom sections get real
interesting.
Just remember that our cars generally are not good at
AutoX. I
routinely get beat by a New Beetle, FWD Talon, Integra (NON
Type R),
etc. Just aggravating (and as Merritt says) not worth the
effort that 3
45-second runs for $15 gives you when an open track day is $100
and I
get 6 hours of track time.
- --Flash!
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 11:05:55
-0400
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
Subject: RE:
Re: Team3S: CAPS downloading Notes
Not car tech but DSL tech that many
(most) home connections are ADSL
(asynchronous DSL) and not SDSL (synchronous
DSL) which means it is
faster downloading than uploading. One site that
I like to test the
current Internet connection on is
www.2wire.com/services/bwm.html
where
you can test the bandwidth. Biased I am sure but it is a
rule-of-thumb.
But your connection is only governed by the weakest
link. If you plug a
cable into Geoff's server than you get 100
Mbps. If you dialup then you
get 43.3 kbps. DSL ain't T1 and even
T1 ain't T3 and both of those
don't see T1 speed since it is going through
some slower connection on
the way through. And if Geoff's server is
only dishing things out from
a 500 Mhz chip then your new whiz-bang machine
is still going to see
slow connections.
Then you get into some
people's webpages that have a restriction on how
much is passed through the
bandwidth in a month. Etc. In case people
were not aware of how
some connections work.
Maybe there is a need for mirror sites in Germany,
Sweden, Ireland, etc.
where other 3/S owners are. :) Besides, I
wanna race head-to-head with
someone over an Internet connection from 3/S
sometime ... like Gran
Turismo where they have cars close to what we
have? <grin>
- --Flash!
- -----Original
Message-----
From: Alex Pedenko
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2001
22:24
Certain ISPs impose a per-connection
bandwidth limit - I know this
from
experience, my cable modem at
home can support up to 10Mb (1megabit/s =
100k/s, so 1 megabyte/s) but
not on one connection. It can only do
about
10%
on one TCP
connection. In that case, if your ISP does that,
opening
another
connection infact _will_ make things go
faster.
As a software developer, I understand
you not wanting to allow
multiple
connections from the same person,
but there are also ways to make sure
of
that - there are ways of
limiting the number of connections from
the
same
IP.
But in any case, if ur
a 56K user, stick to Geoff's advice - 5.6
KBps
won't become 100 KBps
if you have 20 connections going.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 11:08:25
-0400
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Porterfield SS Lines
I believe I have some pictures of my SS
lines on my 1995 VR-4 if it is
worth people to see or see the difference (if
any) from their car to
mine.
For some initial pictures look at my Big
Red install page. I know I
have more pictures of the rear SS lines as
well.
www.speedtoys.com/~dschilberg/cars/brakes/BigReds_install.html-
--Flash!
- -----Original Message-----
From: Darc
Sent: Monday,
October 22, 2001 22:59
As with the Speed Bleeders, there may
be differences in our cars with
the
rear brake lines. Insure
what lengths you have on these lines (measure
them)
and what ends
(male/female--female/female--male/male) are required when
placing your orders
with Porterfield for SS replacements. IMHO it
appears
there may be
differences, particulalry in 1st Gen Stealth as versus 1st
Gen
Mitsu. With
more feedback to the manufacturer, as with Speed Bleeder,
the
problem will
become moot.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 10:01:08
-0500
From: "cody" <
overclck@starband.net>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: NOS injection effect on compression ratio and combustion chamber
volume.
Kinda... Its not really compression ratio you are changing,
but you are
compressing a lot more volume of air, because the N20 breaks down
into
oxygen and nitrogen and this added volume creates higher
cylinder
pressures. Compression ratio does not change without
mechanical
changes.
When NOS is injected, fuel is also
injected. Nitrous is only a
catalyst. You have to have air in
order for fuel to combust. You can
add fuel all day long and not gain
one single HP. You can add air all
day long (or NOS) and not gain a
single HP (and prolly run lean and burn
a piston), but when you add the two
together, you get from a little to a
lot of extra HP, depending on how much
NOS and fuel you additionally
inject.
Think of it the same way
you do a turbo, except with an on/off switch.
Extra air from the turbo means
extra fuel is needed.
- -Cody
- -----Original
Message-----
From:
owner-team3s@team3s.com
[mailto:owner-team3s@team3s.com] On Behalf
Of Floyd, Jim
Sent: Tuesday,
October 23, 2001 9:53 AM
To: 'Team 3S'
Subject: Team3S: NOS injection
effect on compression ratio and
combustion chamber volume.
I
had a local mustang owner with NOS tell me this:
1) Injecting NOS
into your engine increases the compression
ratio of
the combustion chamber
while injecting NOS.
2) Injecting NOS increases the volume of gasoline in
the
combustion
chamber while injecting NOS.
Because
you have to increase gas volume during NOS
injection.
Is this true ?
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 10:18:18
-0500
From: "Jannusch, Matt" <
mjannusch@marketwatch.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Handbrake turns
> Just remember that our cars generally
are not good at AutoX.
I beg to differ. ;-) My times
are very close to the modified Porsches in
my class (A-Prepared) with my car
on stock suspension and street tires where
they are on full-out race rubber
and have completely redone suspension and
the whole works. 3/S cars can
be competitive just as any other car can
be... AutoX is 90%
driver.
...and my friend took the season trophy in the entire Stock
Street Tire
class with his completely bone-stock 1991 3000GT VR4 against all
sorts of
Integras, Probes, VW's, Neons, etc.
Go figure.
-
-Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
End of Team3S: 3000GT &
Stealth V1
#653
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