Team3S: 3000GT & Stealth Monday, February 9
2004 Volume 02 : Number 367
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 22:08:57 -0500
From: "Joseph Spainhour" <
spainhou@bellsouth.net>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Know of any good xmission shops in the Research Triangle area?
Which dealership did you take it to? By the way, I am in Cary and am more
than happy to help you with any of the work. I have never done a transmission
before, but from what I understand it is doable and should save you a ton of
money. I think a new transmission is like $3K and the clutch can be had for
$450.
Joseph
93 3KGT VR-4
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2004 21:55:13 -0600
From: "xwing" <
xwing@wi.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Know of any good xmission shops in the Research Triangle area?
John:
I have had some problems with trans/rebuilds lately...so I would
recommend TRE in Michigan. It will cost some amount of money to rebuild the
tranny no matter who you go to, so at this point my best suggestion, and who I
just got a tranny rebuilt by, is called TRE (Team Rip Engineering), in
Michigan. Here is their website; they are well known for DSM trannies that
WORK including for use/abuse...
http://www.teamrip.com/ TRE rebuilding mine
cost a little over $1100 including parts; shipping is shipping no matter who
does it. TRE doesn't just give you some random tranny with a couple of the
WORST (cheap synchro rings) replaced, then box it back up and ask $1800...they
are more like craftsman, making YOUR tranny good again; they totally disassemble
it, hot tank/clean all parts, and they LIST what parts they needed to
change. They are less expensive than any other 3S rebuilder I've heard of,
and you know you get a proper trans back, IMHO... I think the time and shipping
cost will PALE in comparison to the quotes you are getting so far, and you will
have a better trans. Tell TRE you heard it from me :) it probably won't cost you
any more! Jack Tertadian
------------------------------
Kormex in California sells a rebuilt tranmission for $1700 plus $250
shipping (both ways) plus a refundable core charge for your old tranny.
http://www.kormextrans.com They ship you a
trans, you get it installed, ship your old trans back to them, and you get your
core charge back.
When all the shouting is over, the trans and shipping will
cost you about $2,000.
Like Jack T says, they ain't perfect. Mine leaked, so we had to take it
back out and put a new output shaft seal in it.
I would recommend a
different shop if I knew one. But I don't know anybody who will ship you a trans
like that.
Any experienced trans shop can replace the trans and clutch in one day, so
labor should be 8 hr x whatever they charge in Atlanta ($75/hr? If so, that
would be $600) plus the inevitable screw-you factor ("we ran into
a
problem...") plus parts, so budget $750-1,000 for parts and labor at a
trans shop. It will actually take them longer than one day, because they need to
get the flywheel refaced if they are putting in a new clutch, and they probably
have to send that out to a machine shop.
Still, that's about half the price the dealer wants.
The last thing you want to do is buy a Mitsubishi rebuilt trans and have
the dealer install it. Dealers will screw you, do a crummy job, and not stand
behind their work. Besides, I hear that Mitsubishi trannies actually come from
Kormex anyway, so why pay them an extra markup?
One other possibility is to have Mike the Mechanic (
mwillis92@msn.com) drive or fly to Atlanta
from Des Moines and do it for you in your garage. If Mike does it, the job would
be done right.
Rich/slow old poop
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:53:14 -0000
From: "Alex Judd" <
ajudd@enpocket.com>
Subject: Team3S:
Vacuum tube replacement
Hello again list.
1. The OEM boost controller wasn't connected.
2. There was an open T junction in one of the other pipes
Guessing there was some third party equipment here I replaced it with a new
straight tube.
3. Replaced tube to SBOV
So.. as far as I can tell all vacuum pipes are now either reconnected or
replaced so I should be fine. Here's the end result of day 1 - look OK?
Thanks again
Alex
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 15:32:15 -0000
From: "Jeff Lucius" <
jlucius@stealth316.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Vacuum tube replacement
>> 1. The OEM boost controller wasn't connected.
Well from your first pic, the red circle is not around the factory boost
control solenoid, at least it does not look like the factory BC solenoid on my
car ('92 TT USA-spec). The BC sol. looks like it is still in the factory
location which is the one (of normally four solenoids) closest to the driver's
seat. And in your last pic it looks like the BC sol still has a nipple that does
not have a hose on it (in fact it is the lower nipple that usually connects to
the "H" and from there to the Y-Pipe).
The service manual has some pretty good pics in it identifying the
solenoids, though the one you have circled does not look like any on my car. The
BC solenoid has two nipples on one end (opposite the electrical connector) and
both are at 90º to the centerline (long axis) of the solenoid. Normally the
electrical connector is on the bottom as installed.
Again, the BOV needs a dedicated hose connecting it to the plenum.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 16:46:19 +0100
From: Roger Gerl <
roger.gerl@bluewin.ch>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Vacuum tube replacement
Lots of weird stuff going on there ... for sure you do have a manual at
hand don't you ??
The OEM boost solenoid is usually located on the most right side of the
plate. There is still a valve hanging... where is it connected to ? Here's
like it lokks stock :
http://www.rtec.ch/sol_valve1.jpg
The Boost solenoid shown in the pics is NOT OEM ! It is something else - so
you have an EBC installed in that car or what is it ?? Where does the
second outlet lead to ? This thing is really wrong !! Also remove the
y-pipe connection to this solenoid. Or remove the FPR connections as it
doesn' belong there. It just looks like one wanted to increase fuel
pressure.
The FPR line must be connected to a solenoid valve outlet (the blue hose
you installed now correctly). The inlet goes to the metal tubes and after
the TB to the plneum. This is usually the line where a T is fitrted to
measure boost.
The Boost line must be connected to the y-pipe ellbow. It leads to a 4-way
connector close to the rear turbo outlet :
http://www.rtec.ch/sol_valve3.jpg.
From there one tube goes to the rear
actuator and the other to a metal pipe
that leads to the front wastegate
actuator. The last one goes up to the
boost solenoid valve
http://www.rtec.ch/sol_valve2.jpg.
Note that on my valve the lower port is
capped as the solenoid must be out
of the loop for an EBC. Otherwise it
would lead to the rubber inlet infront
of the rear turbo.
This is ok now. Usually you can read boost at those T's. Therefore a meter
or boost sensor was connected to them. The BOV T is not blocked, it has
been converted to a straight pipe because one had no one at hand.
Yes, this is ok as the line goes straight to the Sequential SBOV from
HKS.
No, not ok. Cross out 2 and 3, they are fine now. On the rear there is at
least one valve missing, either some has been relocated or the EGR or EVAP
valve is missing. So the best thing to do is to locate the 4-way connector
or check out where the rear wastegate actuator hose is comming from. For
this you should know what the actuator is ! Report back and describe where
all the stuff leads to when you have located the source of the tube to this
actuator.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 17:10:48 -0000
From: "Alex Judd" <
ajudd@enpocket.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Vacuum tube replacement
|Lots of weird stuff going on there ... for sure you do have a manual at
|hand don't you ??
Roger/Jeff (and Andi) - thanks for the replies - yes lots wrong. That's
what's making it tough. Please excuse - I'm still learning
[JL] Well from your first pic, the red circle is not around the factory
boost control solenoid, at least it does not look like the factory BC solenoid
on my car ('92 TT USA-spec). The BC sol. looks like it is still in the factory
location which is the one (of normally four solenoids) closest to the driver's
seat. And in your last pic it looks like the BC sol still has a nipple that does
not have a hose on it (in fact it is the lower nipple that usually connects to
the "H" and from there to the Y-Pipe).
[RG] The OEM boost solenoid is usually located on the most right side of
the plate. There is still a valve hanging... where is it connected to ? Here's
like it looks stock :
http://www.rtec.ch/sol_valve1.jpg
[AJ] Boost Solenoid = Wastegate control solenoid. Yes, going by the stock
diagram the plate should hold a Fuel Pressure Sensor, then an EGR solenoid and
then the Turbocharger waste gate solenoid. As far as I can see there is only
what looks like the fuel pressure sensor (well that's the space it's sitting in)
and maybe the waste gate solenoid. I'll follow the connections to see if that
really is it.
[RG] The Boost solenoid shown in the pics is NOT OEM ! It is something else
- so you have an EBC installed in that car or what is it ?? Where does the
second outlet lead to ?
[AJ] I don't know - to be honest from the clarity of my pictures it's hard
to see what it is - would a non-stock item still look similar (or will it be
relocated somewhere?)
[RG] This thing is really wrong !! Also remove the y-pipe connection to
this solenoid. Or remove the FPR connections as it doesn' belong there. It just
looks like one wanted to increase fuel pressure.
[AJ] The pipe going out of the right hand side (as you look at the front of
the car) of the Fuel Pressure Solenoid? That's the one that was hanging around
that I said I reconnected above [obviously wrongly]. If that pipe comes straight
out of/into the engine as shown in
http://ajudd.kgbinternet.com/gto/VacuumPipes/BoostWithReconnectedTubeAnnotated.gif
this should go where - Andi suggested that should go to the top turbo waste gate
actuator
[RG] The FPR line must be connected to a solenoid valve outlet (the blue
hose you installed now correctly). The inlet goes to the metal tubes and after
the TB to the plneum. This is usually the line where a T is fitrted to measure
boost.
[AJ] Yes - that's where I've just replaced with a straight tube to the
HKS
[RG] The Boost line must be connected to the y-pipe ellbow. It leads to a
4-way
connector close to the rear turbo outlet :
http://www.rtec.ch/sol_valve3.jpg.
From there one tube goes to the rear actuator and the other to a metal pipe that
leads to the front wastegate actuator. The last one goes up to the boost
solenoid valve
http://www.rtec.ch/sol_valve2.jpg.
Note that on my valve the lower port is capped as the solenoid must be out of
the loop for an EBC. Otherwise it would lead to the rubber inlet infront of the
rear turbo.
[AJ] Yes. Still can't see the Y-Pipe but I can follow that. However as the
stock parts don't seem to be there anymore on mine I definitely need a
replacement boost solenoid of some type (EBC I guess). There is no EBC inside
the car so I'm guessing that was removed before it was auctioned.
[RG] No, not ok. Cross out 2 and 3, they are fine now.
OK.
[RG] On the rear there is at least one valve missing, either some has been
relocated or the EGR or EVAP
valve is missing. So the best thing to do is to
locate the 4-way connector or check out where the rear wastegate actuator hose
is comming from. For this you should know what the actuator is ! Report back and
describe where all the stuff leads to when you have located the source of the
tube to this actuator.
[AJ] More detective work needed. As you say I need to follow the pipes to
find out where they go and thus what (if anything) is doing the job of these two
components.
Alex
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 09:36:28 -0800
From: "Bob Forrest" <
bf@bobforrest.com>
Subject: Team3S:
OT: Sears Point (Infineon) Track Report, Feb 7-8. 2004
NASA Pro Racing HPDE (and road races), Feb 7-8, 2004:
It was an outstanding weekend - all of us had a ball! Our usual
'base' crew of Bay Area 'regulars' showed up - Geoff & Nissa, Bob & ET,
and Bill Ashurst. Michael Gerhard didn't bring his '91 VR-4 (which is just out
of major surgery), but he came by on Saturday to help out with prepping our
cars. Mike shared Chef's duties with me at the NASA Saturday Night BBQ
(and provided passenger ballast for Bill and I during our runs...). Nissa
left the Z-06 in the parking lot and decided to don a yellow suit and play
Safety Official all weekend.
Bill and I were the only ones running 3S's. ET was racing, so she
left the Stealth at home and ran her Spec Miata racecar. The SM just
barely had the paint dry from the final body repairs done this past week - the
result of multiple damages from the 25-hour Enduro in December. The car
got new pads and brake fluid, but she ran on the same Proxes RA-1's race tires
that they ran in the Enduro(!?!). We started to change to fresh Proxes,
but she broke a stud and Bill and Geoff had to help put in a new one just before
she went out for qualifying, starting at the back of the pack. It wasn't
the best way to start the racing season, but she was lucky to get the car back
in time at ALL. She qualified, which was all that was important. She
placed well on Saturday, and took 4th Place on Sunday. Geoff's first runs
in his new Pro-7 racecar (RX-7, spec) had him turning amazing 2:05's and 2:06's
- he even passed me
*once* when I blew a pass and got stuck behind a pig-slow
orange 'Bullitt' Mustang. :-) Geoff ran his first race in the car on
Sunday and had an
*outstanding* 3rd Place finish! Congrats Geoff and
ET!.
On Friday we saw "New York style" rain here on the Best Coast, but by
Saturday AM it was clearing and the weekend looked promising. ET and I got
to the track late, and Bill was already leaving for his first Group 3 session.
Throughout the weekend, Bill "opened it up" more and more - actually screeching
the tires coming through the hairpin at Turn 11. Bill has
been
(properly) cautious throughout his time in the NASA HPDE program, and
has only run a few Group 3 events last year. It was great to see him
finally bang the throttle and turn in some vastly improved lap times. Go
Bill!
Sears Point has a new, slower track surface from last year (and safer, they
say), and they got rid of the annoying bumps at the end of the main straight
approaching Turn 1 and at the bottom of the hill heading up to Turn 2. The
track was cold, and slippery on Saturday morning, after all the rain on Friday,
so a few cars going off-road brought grass and mud on to the track in many
places. It was kind of greasy, but if you were careful, it was a really
fast track. NASA has been listening to the feedback from students and
racers, and has upped the times for each of the 4 daily HPDE sessions from 20
minutes to 25 minutes. NASA has gotten better with scheduling, too, and
now they offer a full 2-hour unlimited HPDE "Open Track" session at the end of
the day on Sunday. 3 rules: open passing everywhere, no car contact
allowed, and no "Banzai dive passes" are tolerated. If any Group 1 or 2
drivers want to brave the faster HPDE groups and racers on the track, they are
allowed to run... But if they are too scared to be passed in the turns, all they
need to do is put a big "N" on the back of their car. The advanced drivers
honor that.
My weekend was terrific. I ran my '91 VR-4 in NASA HPDE Group 4 (and
the parallel, NASA "Time Trials" program). I'm running in the same Class B
(against Porsche, M3, Viper, Ferrari, SVT, Lambo, etc), of the NASA Time Trials
(in which I took First Place for 2003 - Yay, ME!). I really feel like I've
got Sears Point *down*, with consistent, low-2:04's lap times - that has me in
First Place again (so far) for 2004. When the track was still cool and
fast on Saturday, I turned a 2:03 flat..., *with* Michael in the car - an extra
200+ lbs that didn't help my time. The track slows as it warms up, so even
without Mike, I couldn't match that time on Sunday, doing only 2:03:665. There
are some really fast cars out there this year, so I just don't know if I can
repeat last year's win. I have no problem at all with the Lotuses, stock
Z-06's, Ferrari, Maserati, Diablos, modded Camaros, etc., but it's still a
stretch to stay ahead of the Vipers and the 700+ HP SVTs, which weigh next to
nothing and blow by me on the straights. Luckily, many of them are heavily
modded, which places them in the (unlimited) Class A group, so my only
competition in Class B so far this year is a single, killer-fast '03 SVT.
I'm a better driver, so I took him easily this weekend, but if he improves, I'll
have my hands full. They allowed another group to join Group 4 this past
weekend - a bunch of CMC drivers (Camaro-Mustang Challenge) who were all going
for their competition licenses. They were a welcome addition-- their cars
were fast and they were highly skilled (almost) racers, so they didn't slow us
down.
Passing the supercars in the tight turns and getting a good jump on them
down the straights is no problem for me, but at this low boost, they almost
always pass me before the end of the straights. I know I'll be able to
easily break 2 minutes and stay with them once I'm able to turn up the
boost. This is the third time in a row that there was no 96 or 100 octane
unleaded at Sears Point, and I just can't chance running at high boost with pump
gas - I'm stuck at 8psi until I start carrying octane booster. It appears
that many people bring gas cans and empty the pumps of the good stuff at the
beginning of the weekend. I NEED more boost to get my times in the
1:57-1:58 range to stay ahead. By way of comparison to the Class A cars,
one of the Porsches logged a blazing 1:53 this weekend (gulp!). I NEED
MORE BOOST! ;-)
Fortunately, this year, I don't have to hold back like I did last year,
since I was only running (inadequate) R4-S street pads on my 1st gen
brakes. Just before the last HPDE in 2003, I installed Porterfield R4-E
(endurance) pads, and Porterfield Cryo-ed rotors - NOT slotted, and NOT
drilled. I ran most of last year on 2 sets of street pads out of laziness,
lack of money, and a few quirks of the Porterfield delivery system... I'm
still using the same Toyo Proxes RA-1's I got in June of last year
(255-40ZR17). They might make it through to summertime, I hope. The
only problem on my car right now is that I have a vibration in the right front
when braking at any speed over 110. Bill and I talked about it yesterday,
and it might be sticky calipers, and perhaps it's time for a rebuild. I
didn't get the new rotors turned when I put them on, so it might be an uneven
surface..., or maybe I bent a wheel somehow. I've never warped rotors before,
but I guess that's a possibility, too.
Gotta prep and do some quick biz today..., and then I'm outta here to head
off to a one-day NASA HPDE at Laguna Seca. ET is on her way back up to
Nevada to run the racing school, so unless Bill gets an urge to join me in the
warm weather of Monterey, I guess I'll be the only 3S there. Over and
out...,
- ---Forrest
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 10:49:01 -0700
From: norman <
normanross@shaw.ca>
Subject: Team3S:
HELP
Hi my name is Norm dose any one know how nos works on the stealth R/T na i
am thinking of get NOS so dose any one with is best for are cars .All so is
thare a pro cramer out for the Stealth its a 91 Thanks Norm
------------------------------
I am the sixth 3000GT/Stealth to sign up for the Speedseekers event in
April at Road America.
That's the most of our cars I have ever seen at a
HPDE. Well, except for last year's gathering, of course.
I don't see Jack T on there yet, or the owner of Road America -- who is
running One Lap in a 3000GT -- but, when they do sign up, that will make eight
of us
A bunch of local Wisconsin dudes are planning to host a
mini-gathering, so we might have a couple dozen of our cars there, running,
helping, or socializing.
The field is filling up fast, so get your registration in if you want to
drive your beast on the finest road course in the world.
Go to
www.speedseekers.com
Rich/slow old poop.94 3000GT VR4
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 14:54:18 -0600 (CST)
From: <
jawieman@iastate.edu>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Speedseekers is filling up
I will be going as well. Does anyone on this list want to split the
weekend? I prefer to
run on Sunday, but will do either day (assuming I get the VR4 back together
again in
time)! If not I will just wait the inevitable and buy
someones spot when they break down.
> I am the sixth 3000GT/Stealth to sign up for the Speedseekers event in
> April at Road America.
> Go to
www.speedseekers.com
Make it eight
J.A. Wieman
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 16:20:04 -0500
From: Ted pangrace <
tpan@adelphia.net>
Subject: Team3S:
Factory Radio Problem
I have a 93 Stealth ES. The stereo in the car makes sound but it
looks
bad (beat up) and sounds worse. I have bought a factory
Infinity Q402
part # MR141227 serial # 56229005 A
said to be out of a 96 3000GT.
The guy at the junk yard said it was a "plug
and play". Well.... it
plugged but don't play. All appears
OK. Lights, tuning, tape transport
all look like there doing something
but not a peep. There is one 14 pin
plug in my car. Not to be
foiled, I researched on the net the pin
protocol of the plug. Maybe
93's and 96's are different. I got an
adapter and proceeded to twist
together all used wires (not fun). When
firing it up again the results
were the same. Not a peep. Maybe this
unit needs an
external amp? Maybe the internal amp is fried? (It
only
uses a 5 amp fuse). I grow tired of this. Anybody have any
ideas?
Ted
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 16:56:13 -0500
From: "Starkey, Jr., Joseph" <
starkeyje@bipc.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Factory Radio Problem
If this is the "premium" stereo with the in-deck cassette and external CD,
it needs an external amp.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 23:28:58 +0100
From: "Roger Gerl" <
roger.gerl@bluewin.ch>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Vacuum tube replacement
Just follow the diagram Jeff provided to ensure the right
connections.
[RG] The FPR line must be connected to a solenoid valve outlet (the
blue
hose you installed now correctly). The inlet goes to the metal tubes
and
after the TB to the plneum. This is usually the line where a T is fitrted
to
measure boost.
[AJ] Yes - that's where I've just replaced with a straight tube to the
HKS
You only fixed one side !
[RG] The Boost line must be connected to the y-pipe ellbow. It leads to
a
4-way
connector close to the rear turbo outlet :
http://www.rtec.ch/sol_valve3.jpg.
From there one tube goes to the rear
actuator and the other to a metal pipe
that leads to the front wastegate
actuator. The last one goes up to the boost
solenoid valve
http://www.rtec.ch/sol_valve2.jpg.
Note that on my valve the lower port is
capped as the solenoid must be out of
the loop for an EBC. Otherwise it
would lead to the rubber inlet infront of
the rear turbo.
[AJ] Yes. Still can't see the Y-Pipe but I can follow that. However as
the
stock parts don't seem to be there anymore on mine I definitely need
a
replacement boost solenoid of some type (EBC I guess). There is no
EBC
inside the car so I'm guessing that was removed before it was
auctioned.
The Y-pipe ?? Look at the black plastic thing ... ;-)
Since you don't know yet what the parts are and you can't follow the
diagram
on Jeff's pages, I highly recommend you to find someone in your area
that
can help you for a minute. It does work much better that way and making
an
error is less possible. Obviously there is something missing and not
well
installed so be very careful. I'd rip iout just everything of the tubing
an
reisntall from the green field with the diagrams.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 20:40:22 -0500
From: "Danno" <
palermod@msu.edu>
Subject: Team3S:
Brake Disaster
Folks,
Had the two front calipers/pads replaced by someone I generally trust
18
months ago. My son comes in tonight to tell me the brakes are making
a
funny noise. I go out to drive the car and the grinding is intense
from the
left, front wheel.
I pull the wheel and notice the inboard pad half out of the caliper:
no
"pad" left on the shoe at all - rivets! The outboard side of the
rotor
looks fine, but I can imagine the inboard side of the rotor is
shot.
In 27 years of working on cars I've never seen this happen (a pad come
out
of a caliper, regardless of how worn the shoe is), and I'm wondering
whether
the brake job I paid almost $900 for (included rear calipers and
rotors) was
done improperly. I mean, 18 months from a set of
street-driven pads???
The car is at the mechanic's now, and I'd like to know whether I
should
needle him to make this right. I'm looking for informed
opinions; What say
ye??
Thanks (again!)
- - Dan
'95 VR4
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2004 22:35:57 -0600
From: "William J. Crabtree" <
wjcrabtree@earthlink.net>
Subject:
Team3S: Factory Head unit to aftermarket stereo
TED, pay close attention here.
Who took my write up (on building the harness to connect a
factory
premium head unit and connect it to a amp) and posted it to
their
website? Anybody got that link for Ted?
-Jeff Crabtree
'91 Stealth R/T TT (3SI
#0499)
2K Jeep TJ Sport
St. Louis, MO
------------------------------
End of Team3S: 3000GT & Stealth V2
#367
***************************************
