Team3S: 3000GT & Stealth   Monday, December 22 2003   Volume 02 : Number 327




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 02:23:42 -0800
From: "Tyson Varosyan" <tigran@tigran.com>
Subject: Team3S: Where do the numbers in my pocketlogger come from?

When I am looking at numbers like coolant temp, O2, air intake etc. Are
those what the sensors are reading, or what the ECU is seeing? For instance,
if a wire from the coolant temp sensor was damaged right on the ECU plug,
would I see it on my pocketlogger? I am still banging my head on a number of
issues with my car and I cannot seem to figure them out. Sensor readings I
am seeing on the pocketlogger are within spec. I just want to make sure that
what I am seeing on the pocketlogger is EXACTLY what the ECU is seeing.

Thanks,

Tyson Varosyan
Technical Manager, Uptime Technical Solutions LLC.
tyson@up-times.com
www.up-times.com
206-715-TECH (8324)

UpTime/OnTime/AnyTime


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 03:38:54 -0700
From: "Donald Ashby" <dashbyiii@mho.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Where do the numbers in my pocketlogger come from?

They are coming from the ECU, not the direct sensor voltage, so if the sensor doesn't make it to the
ECU you won't see anything, even if the sensor is still functioning properly.
Donald Ashby
'93 3000GT VR-4 (RIP)
'92 3000GT VR-4 (Vroom!)
"Don't drink and park, accidents cause people!"
- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Tyson Varosyan" <tigran@tigran.com>
To: "Team3S" <Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2003 3:23 AM
Subject: Team3S: Where do the numbers in my pocketlogger come from?



When I am looking at numbers like coolant temp, O2, air intake etc. Are
those what the sensors are reading, or what the ECU is seeing? For instance,
if a wire from the coolant temp sensor was damaged right on the ECU plug,
would I see it on my pocketlogger? I am still banging my head on a number of
issues with my car and I cannot seem to figure them out. Sensor readings I
am seeing on the pocketlogger are within spec. I just want to make sure that
what I am seeing on the pocketlogger is EXACTLY what the ECU is seeing.



***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 09:55:28 -0500
From: Darren Schilberg <dschilberg@spamcop.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Rim Recall

As promised, I'm following up on what I found when I demounted my leaking winter
tire-to-97 SL wheel.  The two tires that were not leaking were the ones I previously
treated with silicone on the bead so that solution definitely works.  The two wheels
that were slowly leaking did not have silicone on the beads as I had forgotten I wanted
to do a head-to-head test of treated and untreated wheels.

So I took some extra time and not only took off the flaking chrome from the bead area of
the wheel but ALL the chrome covering on the bead area of the wheel so now it is just
the bare metal.  Then I added silicone to the bead and remounted the tire.  Two days
later that tire has lost 0 psi since filling it up - aha - success.

However, over the last three weeks the two previously-treated tires that lost 0 psi over
3 weeks suddenly hit a flaw and one was flat yesterday when I left for work.  Strange -
it had been just fine the night before.  I'm not sure why but I'll have to keep tabs on
that one also.

So, although we know the rims have some flaws with the chrome at the tire bead section
it can be overcome, corrected, treated, and cured although I'm not sure if there is
anything we can get in return for our troubles.  Good luck and keep us posted.

- -Flash!

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 12:35:13 -0600
From: Matt Costanza <mcostanza@austin.rr.com>
Subject: Team3S: Replacement speakers for 97 SL

My left front door speaker is rattling bad. I am going to need to
replace the speaker and I'm interested in learning of my options. I
would like to keep the Bose head unit and just replace speakers. The
first story that I have been told (by the dealer no less) is the Bose
system is very proprietary for speakers. In order to get proper sound
balance from the Bose head unit, I need to replace the speakers with the
  stock speakers. These speakers have the cross-over unit mounted on the
rear of each speaker and have a unique cross over range.

So, I'm interested in learning if I do have options in after-market
speakers or should I just order the stock speakers from the dealer?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

Regards,
- --
Matt Costanza
Austin, Tx USA


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 15:33:40 -0700
From: "Jim Floyd" <jim_floyd7@earthlink.net>
Subject: Team3S: Timeline comparisons

> Some people are complaining on how long the war on terrorism is
taking,
> but consider this:
>
> It took less time to take Iraq than it took Janet Reno to take the
Branch
> Davidian compound. That was a 51-day operation.
>
> It took less time to find Saddam's sons in Iraq than it took Hillary
> Clinton to find the Rose Law Firm billing \ records.
>
> It took less time for the 3rd Infantry Division and the Marines to
destroy
> the Medina Republican Guard than it took Teddy Kennedy to call the
police
> after his Oldsmobile sunk at Chappaquiddick.
>
> It took less time to take Iraq than it took to count the votes in
Florida!
>
> Damn our military is GREAT !.



***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 16:41:28 -0700
From: "Erik Petterson" <erik@microworks.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Replacement speakers for 97 SL

On the 1st and 2nd gen's the stock head units are made by Infinity, not Bose
(pretty sure it's the same on the 3rd gen's too).  Vehicles like a 300zx had
stock bose systems with each speaker having it's own crossovers, and some
had individual amps on the backs of each speaker(extremely proprietary
systems = $$$), but our 3/S stock systems should be totally different.  Any
crossovers for the door/dash are taken care of by the amp under your
passenger seat - if you have the premium system.

I have compiled a link/FAQ page for our stereo systems here:
http://members.cox.net/erikpetterson/3SAudioFAQ/FAQ.html
(look under "How to Install Front & Rear Speakers")

There are still a lot of links I have to add, but I think the stock system
is covered well enough for you to figure out what to replace it with.  A
common replacement (with the 3si.org bunch) is the Infinity Reference
series, get the 6 3/4 size as it will mount easier.

ALSO - This is definitely something you can do yourself with little to no
previous knowledge.  No need to pay dealer fees.  The step by step picture
instructions provided on Jeff's site should be more than enough to get you
through it.

- -Erik
'94 R/T


- ----- Original Message -----
> So, I'm interested in learning if I do have options in after-market
speakers


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 17:44:21 -0800 (PST)
From: WILLIAM POTTER <wpotter@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Team3S: RE:Smoke when idling for a minute

One other possibility.....excessive crankcase
pressure.   This could be from a bad PCV valve or
worse....blow-by in one of the cylinders.  I had the
same problem.  Smoke off idle or when I coasted and
got back in the throttle.  My case (91 VR4)was a
cracked piston between the first and second
compression rings.  The blow-by pressurized the crank
case causing a small amount of oil to be forced out
the breather tube...which is connected to the air
intake, so it just sucked the oil back into the engine
causing the smoke.  This happened to me twice within
the first year I owned the car (60k on the car at the
time).  I found the problem with a normal compression
test.  Sometimes a leak down is needed though....

The other suggestions that were posted are also
possibilities.  My case is the worst case scenario,
but wanted to throw it out there.

- -Bill
91 VR4



<snip>
Ok guys I'm in stop and go traffic and if I sit still
for any length of time
then accelerate my 94 3k sl puffs a cloud of smoke
out.  Going down the road
it is fine, no smoke.

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 20:19:53 -0600
From: "Jesse Rink" <jrink@w3si.org>
Subject: Team3S: driveshaft woes continued...

I'm pretty pissed off with this whole ordeal and have no idea what else to
do or try. I'm getting so frustrated I'm starting to think about just
selling the car.

I got rid of my stock driveshaft back in September because it was causing
false engine knock due to bad carrier bearings. I ordered a PST 1 piece
CFDS. After installing it, I had mad vibration above 80 mph that I couldn't
get rid of. I returned the PST 1 piece CFDS and ordered up a PST 2 piece
CFDS. I've had nothing but problems with the 2 piece unit. I get a constant
whirring wobble noise anytime the car is moving, foward or reverse, which
seems to be coming from underneath the car (even going as slow as <5mph). I
have tried taking the driveshaft off and putting it back on again to no
avail using different combinations of spacers and insulators on the carrier
mount assembly.  I've NO IDEA what to try. The car isn't even driveable
right now. The whirring wobble noise just screams "somethings wrong - dont
drive me anymore".

I didn't have THIS problem with the 1 piece CFDS, however I had vibration
problems which posed a problem for me taking it on the road course this
April. With the 2 piece unit, road courses aren't even on the horizon
because I can't even take it on the street.

I could send the 2 piece unit back, IF they'll even refund my $ for it. But
then I'm still without a driveshaft. I could TRY to go back to a 1 piece
CFDS, but that didn't work for me before. I can't go back to the stock
driveshaft as I no longer have it (sold it), and there's no way in hell I'm
buying a new DS from Mitsu for $1,600.

Does anyone have any idea what can be causing this problem or have any
recommendations?

Infuriated,
Jesse Rink
Eagle, WI


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 19:47:56 -0800
From: "Riyan Mynuddin" <riyan@hotpop.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: driveshaft woes continued...

Jesse-

A whirring sound seems to me like bad driveshaft bearings.  Will PST take
the shaft back and put new bearings in for you?  I don't see why they
wouldn't if you complained long enough and forwarded this entire Team3S
thread to them.  Did you ever try spraying parts of the driveline with a
thin lubricating oil such as WD40 and see if the sound changes?  This may
help you isolate the problem if you haven't tried it yet.

Did the "different combinations of spacers and washers" seem to change
anything? [make it louder, softer, change the pitch?] Also, you shouldn't
rule out a driveline problem besides your driveshaft [like the
tranny/transfer case/rear differential/wheel bearings/axle bearings/brake
system].  I know it may seem like a stretch since it would be an odd
coincidence to happen at the time that you're changing shafts, but it's
possible.

For example, I replaced my stock driveshaft with the 1-piece PST CFDS due to
excessive driveline play.  The play ended up coming from my rear
differential, so I'm out $1000 just because of my hunch.  Sure I have near
30 more hp now and I saved on total weight too, but no one likes throwing
away hard-earned money just for unintended benefits.

IMO, you should start the long search for a junkyard stock driveshaft that's
in good condition.  It would be a valuable tool to you because then you
could test and make sure it's the driveshaft causing the problem, and you
wouldn't be out of luck in the meantime. Either way, it can't hurt to put to
a "want-to-buy" ad on 3Si and keep your eyes peeled.

I personally have my old stock driveshaft and at least some of the hardware
lying around here still.  But I get the annoying and unsettling vibration on
the highway with it so I'd like to hold on to it just in case I go for a
track day or something.  However, you know what they say.  For the right
price, anything is for sale.  Feel free to make me an offer, but realize
that you'll also have to pay shipping on a very heavy piece of metal from
Sunnyvale, CA 94087.

Good luck,
Riyan
93 stealth rt tt



***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 22:55:15 EST
From: M3000GTSL84@aol.com
Subject: Re: Team3S: Replacement speakers for 97 SL

Matt-

Of COURSE the dealer will say that, but it is, after all, a satin dealer.

The stock cones are made out of paper,  have small magnets to power the
sound,  and will go bad on you, as you no doubt have noticed.

I installed a pair of Infinity kappa's 6 1/2's in my 97 SL doors, and the
sound is on a much different level. Installation is simple-jeff lucas has a how
to, which came in handy. I liked the sound so much that all my speakers have
been replaced with kappas.

I believe I payed around 140 for my new pair, which im willing to bet is the
same price or cheaper then replacement stock ones. They sound better, will
never go bad like the stock ones do, and are easy to install.  If you need more
advise please ask- I have gone through this problem.

Our headunits are Infinity-Nissan cars deal with Bose.

Mike-
97 SL

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 23:00:03 EST
From: M3000GTSL84@aol.com
Subject: Re: Team3S: Rim Recall

Flash-

My SL has had many problems. . .this is just the latest. Instead of putting
yet more money and elbow grease into a car that keeps breaking, I believe I
will look for a turbo.  It is kind of heart breaking. I fix one thing, then
another breaks. Instead of putting money into making it faster and better overall,
I must concentrate on just keeping it running.

By the way, do those big shiny 18' chrome wheels on the VR-4 have this
problem?

Mike
97 SL

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 23:55:06 EST
From: M3000GTSL84@aol.com
Subject: Team3S: Mitsu service website

Hey guys-

While browsing the Mitsu website, I came across a Mitsu offical service site.

http://www.mitsubishitechinfo.com/epacarb/

Subscription for a day is 20 dollars. Listed on the site are service manuals,
recalls, and other good stuff for all 3000GT years.

mike
97 SL

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2003 23:55:17 -0600 (CST)
From: Geoff Mohler <gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Rim Recall

Its called "your car is getting old".

Concentrate on the level of budget you think is acceptable..and buy within
that range.

I dunno if buying a turbo car is any cheaper than maintaining an SL.

On Sun, 21 Dec 2003 M3000GTSL84@aol.com wrote:

> Flash-
>
> My SL has had many problems. . .this is just the latest. Instead of putting
> yet more money and elbow grease into a car that keeps breaking, I believe I
> will look for a turbo.  It is kind of heart breaking. I fix one thing, then
> another breaks. Instead of putting money into making it faster and better overall,
> I must concentrate on just keeping it running.
>
> By the way, do those big shiny 18' chrome wheels on the VR-4 have this
> problem?
>
> Mike
> 97 SL
>
> ***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
>

- ---
www.SpeedToys.com: Geoff Mohler orders@speedtoys.com

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2003 15:44:29 -0800
From: "MM2 Phillips, J" <phillipsj@duluth.navy.mil>
Subject: Team3S: Probably Burnt ECU

Saturday, I wad driving home from wendys ( about 80 in 4th gear ) when the
car ( 91 VR-4 ) died.  I got white smoke from the center dash, car would not
restart.... had to have a friend pull me the last 3/4 of a mile up a hill to
my house.

I'm guessing it is the ECU. does that sound about right...?

where can i get another one at a decent price ( used / remanufactured / new
)...?
and is the AEM EMS really worth the $1400 these places want for it...?

money isn't super tight, but i also am not looking to break the bank.  what
would you guys recommend...?

thanks for your time...
- -ryan-

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

End of Team3S: 3000GT & Stealth V2 #327
***************************************