Team3S: 3000GT & Stealth Sunday, April 20
2003 Volume 02 : Number 134
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Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 09:23:49 -0500
From: "xwing" <
xwing@wi.rr.com>
Subject: Team3S:
Re: Running with Z06es
Anything below 3 minutes at Road America is going pretty good for a
street
car, and something to be proud of IMHO. 2:31 is very fast
for a street
car. If you and Phil were in the 2:40's you were cooking
pretty good, and with your brakes are on the edge of cooking them :)
likely...
This year I did no Hotlap timing since I was tuning the motor mostly,
chasing leaks and limited to 120mph by the AEM computer glitch (a patch solution
is now in place for THAT!) Last year with what turns out to be 12 slightly bent
intakes causing a chronic miss, as well as Web cams causing problems (including
finding a rockerarm entirely OFF after the event on checking stuff over) and
sneaking up on my then-new Brembo brakes to be sure not to cook them, I did a
Hotlap Time'd 2:41before parking it when the miss got so bad I was afraid it
would break. I'm pretty confident it can manage a 2:30something once all
tuned up and ready to go. I'd be overjoyed to get a 2:31, but with those
speeds will come adjustments in techniques and lines, so will take time to get
the car and myself down there.
Alot of time can be had from the exit of the Carousel, all the way to turn
12. The faster you come out of the Carousel, and the more your skill,
bravery and car allow you to stay ON the throttle up to and through the Kink,
the more speed you carry through that long section up to turn 12. Once you are
over 100mph entering the Kink it does take guts and concentration; that is the
most critical turn on the course in that if you mess up your entrance by
sleeping at HIGH speed, you very well could crash and burn. At the very
high speeds which can be involved even after the Kink, with the car getting
maybe a little floaty, yet it IS a curve/turn so more intimidating than the pure
straight from 14 to 1, how brave, skillful or stupid you are impacts your
laptimes there as much there as anywhere else, at least with cars capable of
"Ludicrous Speed".
As yet I'm not taking advantage of the new turbos I have, and the lag is
more than my relatively instant-spool TD04-13/15/17G's. Over time, a
better tuneup, maintaining some spool and earlier on gas will help that lag
loss. I would like to fit some wider rubber on the car for more surface
area/less heat buildup; with the car weight/hp and heavy braking/turning, the
front tires do tend toward overheating when pushed to the max, and the usual
Kumho "greasy" feeling can progress to falling off the slip-angle curve. I
just got a nice Longacre digital memory probe-type tire pyrometer to start
collecting data on tire temps, eventually hoping to find better pressures and
camber settings.
The scuttlebutt on tires has been that Hoosiers are probably the fastest
tires, but wear faster and are not as thick/durable as other brands. I
have the same Kumho Ecsta V700's that I used at LAST year's Road America F-Body
meet for now. I like Vettes; they have a lower center of gravity than our cars,
and do weigh less; and theoretically and likely in practice their
double-wishbone suspensions can be superior to our MacPherson struts. The
massively wide tires they can easily fit cause me to be envious.
I enjoyed driving my buddy's 2002 Ford SVT Lightning pickup passing a
lowered/racy Acura Integra and riding an AC Cobra-type car who was rude enough
not to let us by before the session ended :)
Jack T.
94VR4; Ground Control springs 550/375lbs (no camber plates yet);
Kumho Ecsta V700 tires 265-35-18; Brembo 14" front brakes, stock rears with
Porterfield R4 pads; MOMO seats, carbon hood, no rear seats; engine stuff
done. Stock: shocks/swaybars/interior ahead of rear seats/AC/radio, no
strutbars yet. This is an absolute street car which I drive all the time :)
especially now that it runs better...
From:
merritt@cedar-rapids.netI suspect
some of you have seen the Z06 videos from Road America by now. If not, they are
at
http://www.speedseekers.com/picsandvids.htmlPhil
and I were running lap times in the 2:40s and 2:50s, depending on the condition
of our brakes at the time, but that Z06 was running 2:31 -- a full 15 to 20
seconds a lap faster.
I ran a whole bunch of linked, consistent 2:50-2:51 laps on stock boost,
then added 5 gal of 110 octane and cranked the boost to 14 psi, but didn't time
laps after that. I am guessing that my best laps on big boost and with good
brakes were in the mid 2:40s. I know, for example, that the TT Porsche has run
2:45 and I passed him, so I must be in the mid 2:40s somewhere. In case you were
timing, during the last session (where Phil broke the wheel), I was running
2:50s on no brakes (metal to metal).
>From what I can tell from watching the Z06, I run the exact same
lines
within a few feet or so on turn in, so it's not a matter of improving
lines or learning the track. At least, I don't think so. I studied those videos
for a long time, trying to see if I was missing anything, but there was nothing
new there. Just that the Z06 was much faster.
More track time would definitely help, but more power would help more. If I
had Phil's horsepower I could cut another 5 seconds off my lap times by picking
up a second or so on each straight. That's about how much Phil was reeling me in
on the video. Therefore, bigger turbos, bigger injectors, AFC, etc. for me and
better brakes for Phil should get us both down to 2:40 flat. Where's the rest of
the 9 seconds?
Is it the Z06's Hoosiers?
Is it the power-to-weight (380hp @ 3200 lb for
the Z06 v 400+hp @ 4000 lb for the VR4?) Is it the sheer weight of Battleship
VR4 that makes it unable to stick like a Z06? Is it better brakes? Combinations
thereof? Or is it just that a well-driven, well-prepared Z06 is out of our
class? I want to run with that crowd in Class A next time, and with those two
Vettes (the black and silver ones that were dueling in "Grip v Horsepower").
I've beaten other Z06es in the past, but not like those two guys. What do I
gotta do to run with the big boys? Current mods listed below. 1994 3000GT VR4
with: Ground Control suspension Eibach springs camber plates GAB front struts
front and rear sway bars Porsche Big Red calipers Speed bleeders SS lines Motul
fluid cryogenically treated stock rotors brake cooling fans water injection to
brakes Alamo intercoolers Stillen downpipe custom cat back single side exhaust
(loud!) Blitz DSBC Supra fuel pump aftermarket boost gauge Blitz BOV K&N
Milli Miglia wheels w/Michelin Pilot street tires Stock chromies with Kuhmo V700
race tires Probably 400+ hp. 13.1 @ 105 mph
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 13:45:06 -0400
From: "Philip V. Glazatov" <
gphilip@umich.edu>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Rollbars
At 02:15 PM 4/18/2003, Matt Jannusch wrote:
>I know Autopower makes
some sort of rollbar, but I'm curious what it
>looks like, and whether or
not it would fit in my Spyder. It wouldn't
>be able to extend
further back than the rear seats. Any ideas or
>suggestions?
I don't think anyone has ever done this in a Spyder yet.
Flash has one. He has some pics of it somewhere on his website. Show them
to us, Flash.
I saw it in his car. He installed it in there especially for the purpose of
showing it to me, so I suppose the installation does not take too long. It
is bolted to the floor behind the front seats and to the rear wheel wells
through the speaker holes. The speakers must be removed. It does not extend
farther back than the speaker holes.
Philip
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 14:30:18 -0400
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Rollbars
I already sent an email to Matt privately and asked for any questions he
may have. The pictures are on the Team3S FAQ page, Philip,
www.team3s.com/FAQrollbar.htm.
I can answer specific questions if anyone has them.
I didn't install it in the car specifically for showing you - the rollbar
has two parts: the hoop and the crossbraces. I had removed the crossbraces
during the winter (non-track season so wasn't using the 5-point harnesses) but
installed the crossbraces and harnesses to show you - the hoop was still in the
car, but yes, I installed it so you could see and experience what it is
like.
This AutoPower Race Rollbar (the name of it) was purchased from I/O Port
Racing (
www.ioportracing.com) and Ken
Myers there was a tremendous help so I gladly endorse them for the help.
The installation means removing the rear speakers and interior rear quarter
panels, drilling some holes, installing the rollbar, and tightening it all up -
I'd guess 4-6 hours for someone and a friend not that you have a set of
instructions (I need to make better ones). I had nothing (no pictures,
drawings, instructions, etc.) so it took a little longer.
But this is the standard rollbar design for anything and meets all the
specs of the SCCA and NASA, PCA, etc. It weighs about 60 pounds. It
has a harness bar option (preferred obviously since you'll want to use harnesses
with it). It fits like a glove. The only drawback is for someone
with a manual crank sunroof - the crank might be rendered useless. I have
a power sunroof so just a button is all I need for sunroof action. I
assume that a Spyder car will have no issues making this fit inside the
roof. I see now that I/O Port Racing has changed their webpage and now
offer a dropdown menu for our car when choosing the rollbar - you can choose a
solid roof or a convertible so maybe they are aware of a convertible
3000GT. So, if you want, you can race with the top down (just follow the
guidelines for any open cockpit car like using arm restraints and stuff) but
wouldn't it be cool to run down a dragstrip with the top down and clear all of
the rules?
Philip, here is the page of what I did for you to see (installed the middle
"guts" of the rollbar),
www.team3s.com/~dschilberg/cars/rollbar/.
With the rollbar I attach a set of 5-point harnesses onto the harness bar.
I also add a fire extinguisher and a video camera mount. This rollbar has
come in handy for lots of handy features.
Let me know what questions folks have and I'll augment the FAQ page.
- --Flash!
1995-1/2 VR-4 with AutoPower Race Rollbar
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 16:30:32 -0400
From: "Alex Pedenko" <
alex@kolosy.com>
Subject: Team3S: tire
wear
Hey gang,
I've had my yoko es100 installed for ~1000 miles now (probably a
little less) and I'm getting a little worried about the wear upfront...
those lines you see going around the circumference of the tire are all but
gone on the fronts and are still there in the back.
Do I need an alignment asap or is this normal wear?
Thanks,
Alex
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 16:45:49 -0400
From: "Steven Chen" <
fourchens@earthlink.net>
Subject:
Team3S: 1993 Mitsu 3000 gt vr4, 108,000 miles Wheels
To: Team 3si
From: Steven Chen
Date: 4/19/03
I am shopping for new wheels (stock wheels, 17 x 8.5, are chewed-up).
The service manual says the wheel offset is 46mm (1.8"). I went to the
Enkei web site and the RPF1 appeared to be the closest fit compared to
stock. I talked with someone from tires.com/aka discount tire direct &
he said that the o/s of the Enkei (40mm) was too much & that I needed a
wheel with an o/s of 25-35mm. He also said the RPF1 would fit the
non-vr4's because of the smaller caliper/disk. My questions: 1. My service
manual doesn't differentiate between vr4 & non-vr4 wheels. Is the discount
tire direct guy mistaken? 2. The oem wheels are marked L and R. Does
this mean that I will have problems with after market wheels? 3. What are
the actual oem wheel backspace(s) & offset(s)?
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 17:32:30 -0500
From: "cody" <
overclck@satx.rr.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: tire wear
Your rear tires don't do any steering... The fronts scrub or roll
over under turning... that's perfectly normal wear for those tires.
However, you could prolly lower tire pressure in the rear to use more of the
effective contact patch when cornering...
And of course, make sure you rotate every other oil change to ensure the
fronts (this is on any tire) don't scrub too much and wear them out
prematurely...
- -Cody
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Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 17:36:56 -0500
From: "cody" <
overclck@satx.rr.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: 1993 Mitsu 3000 gt vr4, 108,000 miles Wheels
He's right, BUT...
A correctly designed wheel will fit a VR4 with the correct (40-ish) offset,
so long as it is designed to clear the brakes.
Without the properly designed wheel, you would have to have a lower offset
wheel to clear them. Problem being the thickness of the spokes of the
wheel...
For all intents and purposes, in wheel geometry, there is no difference
between vr4's and other models, but the wheel must clear the brake. Any
wheel will clear the brake on the non-turbo cars...
- -Cody
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Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 18:37:51 -0400
From: "Philip V. Glazatov" <
gphilip@umich.edu>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: tire wear
The front looks okay, assuming that you are also getting the same wear on
the inside part of that tire. The rear looks like it has too much negative
camber. You could eyeball your camber with a simple weight (like nut) on a
string. The manual says zero camber, IIRC.
If you are not planning to change your camber too often to change your
handling, I would by a "lifetime alignment" from one of the car shops. Who
offers those? PepBoys??
Philip
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 18:37:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: Bret Duvall <
teeminus@yahoo.com>
Subject: Team3S:
Neutral Wire
Does anybody know if there is a neutral wire in a '93
VR4 that senses
when the car is in neutral? I am
hooking up a remote start and my
installer would be
happy if we could find this wire!
- -Bret
- -'93 VR4
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 21:53:48 -0400
From:
Rod2414738@aol.comSubject: Re: Team3S:
Neutral Wire
I would be very surprised if you find a wire that tells the ECU when the
car is not in gear. With an automatic, sure, but not the manual.
What you could do is use an infrared LED and photo transistor setup aimed
across the middle of the shift gate. The IR LED would be on one side and
the photo transistor on the opposite side. Sense off of the emitter of the
photo transistor to get a low signal when the car is not in gear or off of the
collector if you need a high signal. To be really safe though, you would
also want a red filter on the photo transistor and a lens beside the IR LED to
provide a tight beam of IR that the shift rod can easily block when the car is
not in gear. I am sure you could also use micro switches to do the trick,
but I am more familiar with electronics than mechanics.
- -Rod
'93 Stealth R/T TT
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 00:12:45 -0400
From: "Philip V. Glazatov" <
gphilip@umich.edu>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Neutral Wire
Once had to install a remote starter on a manual car I used a magnetic
switch. You could pick up one of those from electronics catalogs for $10. I
think that was more robust and simpler to use too. It was just a switch
that does not require any other electronics to make it work. I also used a
parking brake switch as a backup.
Do not procrastinate installing that stuff. I did that on my first car. I
thought: "I will install it later and be very careful in the meantime".
Sure enough, the car ran away from me on a parking lot and only a light
pole stopped it. All right side was scraped, $900 worth of damage,
LOL!
Philip
At 09:53 PM 4/19/2003,
Rod2414738@aol.com wrote:
>What you
could do is use an infrared LED and photo transistor setup
>aimed across
the middle of the shift gate. The IR LED would be on one
>side and
the photo transistor on the opposite side. Sense off of the
>emitter
of the photo transistor to get a low signal when the
>car is not in gear
or off of the collector if you need
>a high signal. To be really
safe though, you would also
>want a red filter on the photo transistor and
a lens beside
>the IR LED to provide a tight beam of IR that the shift
rod can easily
>block when the car is not in gear. I am sure you
could also use micro
>switches to do the trick, but I am more familiar
with electronics than
>mechanics.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 09:43:13 +0100
From: "Ivan Gore" <
i.d.gore@talk21.com>
Subject:
Team3S: I've got a question
I have a problem with my 92 VR4, the "Active Aero", "Cruise Control",
"Electronic Suspension" and "FWS" do not operate. The dash lights all come on to
suggest they are active but they don't actually work and after doing my homework
they all need a vehicle speed signal. I suspect it is the "Vehicle speed sensor"
but the Speedo works fine therefore it is a break in the wiring somewhere. One
other point, there is a km/h to mph converter fitted which I can't find
anywhere; I reckon this may be where the break occurs. My local Mitsubishi
dealer has no information about my car and claim there is no way I can get a
workshop manual for it, they are trying to get a wiring diagram from their head
office but it may take a few weeks!! Has anyone got a wiring diagram they can
scan for me so I can trace the VSS signal from the sensor to the other
components and find the break in the circuit? I have only had the car for a week
and the fault was there when I bought it so I have no history of when and where
the fault started. I look forward to some help.
Ivan Torquay, Devon UK
92 GTO Twin Turbo (Japanese import)
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 12:38:53 -0500
From: "Steve" <
denon11@insightbb.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: I've got a question
HI, Ivan
I would check the # 11, 15 amp Fuse.
The power to this fuse
is power up by the
start pos of the ignition switch.
This fuse
controls,
Active aero control unit,
cruise control ,main and relay,
Etacs
unit,
power ant,
combination meter,
Speed Sensor,
SRS Unit,
Turn
Signal and flasher unit.
If this does not help, let me know and I will
email you off list the
detailed wiring layout.
Steve Truskosky
Pear white 95 3000GT SL
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End of Team3S: 3000GT & Stealth V2
#134
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