Team3S: 3000GT & Stealth    Monday, March 17 2003    Volume 02 : Number 106
 
----------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 18:14 -0500
From: "Dennis R. Ninneman" <dninneman@comcast.net>
Subject: Team3S: Re: Boost/Boost controller question
 
Have been running fine lately on my conservative mods: Borla, K&N, ATR
w/high flow cat, BOV.  I have a Blitz DSBC set at a ratio of 45% & gain of
12.  Would like to hear from those more experienced than I if this gives me
at least factory boost on my '97(still need to get a boost gauge).  Any
examples of others running this controller?  Thanks.
 
Dennis -==- Philly
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 19:47:31 -0600
From: "cody" <overclck@satx.rr.com>
 
Just buy a boost gauge, they are like $50 max...  It's cheaper than a new motor...
 
- -Cody 
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 21:49:40 -0500
From: "Alex Pedenko" <alex@kolosy.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Re: Boost/Boost controller question
 
I have the sbc-id (I think the settings work the same). On warm days
(60+) a setting of ratio 56 gain 12 puts me right under 15 psi (14.7-14.9). On colder days that is _way_ too much - when it gets to 30 or below, I run a ratio of 48 and that is usually enough for the same boost levels. So I'd say you're running a little over stock. Stock equivalent is ratio 35 gain 10-12
 
Alex.
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 22:39:16 -0500
From: bob atkins <ratkins@cfl.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Re: Boost/Boost controller question
 
On the line of this subject - I lost the link and can't remember source name for the small digital boost gauge posted here not to long ago.  I was not successful in an archive search - so . . .
 
1)  Could someone please REPOST the source for the digital boost gauge - It looked the perfect size for Steering column mount with no obstruction of other instrumentation?
 
2)  Anyone want to weigh in on opinions of digital vs. traditional round analog?
 
Thanks
Badbob
 
on 3/16/03 9:49 PM, Alex Pedenko at alex@kolosy.com wrote:
 
> I have the sbc-id (I think the settings work the same). On warm days
> (60+) a setting of ratio 56 gain 12 puts me right under 15 psi
> (14.7-14.9). On colder days that is _way_ too much - when it gets to
> 30 or below, I run a ratio of 48 and that is usually enough for the
> same boost levels. So I'd say you're running a little over stock.
> Stock equivalent is ratio 35 gain 10-12
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 23:20:52 EST
From: GMightymoose@aol.com
Subject: Team3S: Just got my tranny rebuilt
 
Hey guys I just got my 92 VR4's tranny rebuilt, it shifts great, except for 3rd gear-wants to grind a little.  I believe my problem is a "friction" issue.  I used the right grade tranny fluid, but I was wondering if there is some sort of additive I could add to my transmission, that would help me out a little.  Thanks in advance
 
James G
99 & 92 VR4
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 22:59:16 -0600
From: "Dan Hyde" <danielhyde@attbi.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Re: Boost/Boost controller question
 
I can't comment specifically about the link source you are looking for. However, below are a couple digital gauge suppliers that might be of interest.
 
http://www.dakotadigital.com/Detail.cfm?Category=01&PartNumber=ODYR-09-1
 
http://www.pptracing.com/
 
Dan
97 VR4
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 23:06:54 -0600
From: "cody" <overclck@satx.rr.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Re: Boost/Boost controller question
 
Personally, I love my a-pillar mounted gauges in my Talon... out of the way, easy to see, etc...  It's only $25 extra for the pod too
 
- -Cody
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 00:10:29 -0700
From: "Donald Ashby" <dashbyiii@earthlink.net>
Subject: Team3S: Wheel Fitment Question
 
Fondmetal Type 9A
Silver powder coat with a glossy finish
*****************
*17X9 5-114.3 25S*
*****************
 
Will it fit on my vr4 without shaving my calipers or rubbing anything etc.? Or is 25mm too big of an offset? Donald Ashby '93 3000GT VR-4 "Don't drink and park, accidents cause people!"
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 06:38:22 -0600
From: "cody" <overclck@satx.rr.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Wheel Fitment Question
 
They will stick out of the fenderwell, but they will probably fit over the caliper...
 
- -Cody
 
- -----Original Message-----
From: Donald Ashby
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 1:10 AM
 
Fondmetal Type 9A
Silver powder coat with a glossy finish
*****************
*17X9 5-114.3 25S*
*****************
 
Will it fit on my vr4 without shaving my calipers or rubbing anything etc.? Or is 25mm too big of an offset? Donald Ashby '93 3000GT VR-4 "Don't drink and park, accidents cause people!"
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:14:58 -0500
From: "Starkey, Jr., Joseph" <starkeyje@bipc.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: General question
 
Several reasons, with weight being one of them.  They are quieter, cheaper, you don't have to lube them, they can simplify many otherwise complex engine designs and can be used to drive multiple components. 
 
- -----Original Message-----
From: Joseph Spainhour
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 2:06 PM
 
Hello All,
 
  Does anyone know why Mitsubishi used a standard belt instead of a metal chain type timing belt? It would seem that since the belt is so important to engine life, they would have used one that you would not have to replace or at least not as often.
 
Joseph
93 VR-4
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:17:58 -0600
From: "Willis, Charles E." <cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Basic Performance Modifications
 
April 2003 Turbo magazine has a nice review of Boost Controllers including some EBC's and MBCs.
 
Chuck Willis
 
- -----Original Message-----
From: Donald Ashby [mailto:dashbyiii@earthlink.net]
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 2:37 AM
 
My friend with a 2g Talon has a avc-r, he says it was the biggest waste of money ever spent, we unplugged it and put in my $5 bleeder valve, after about 15 minutes we had it set to the same boost, it took half an hour to set on the avc-r. I've never put a EBC on my car, always ran with my MBC, and according to my boost gauge it runs pretty solid boost, fairly easy to change to, pop hood, unscrew/screw in/out hop back in drive off. Donald Ashby '93 3000GT VR-4
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 11:23:35 -0500
From: "Furman, Russell" <RFurman2@MassMutual.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: General question
 
Actually a timing belt was a sound design choice, leaving the motor as an
interference design was NOT...   Damn shoemaker engineering
 
I mean how hard would it have been to raise the focking deck height 2MM???????
 
Russ "had a bad weekend with the toy" F
CT
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 11:33:29 -0500
From: "Furman, Russell" <RFurman2@MassMutual.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Valve to Piston clearance?
 
While I am thinking about it (see thread below) does anyone know if the adjustable lifters sold by DR and 3SX are solid core or if they have oiling ports built into them like the stockers?
 
Reason I ask over this weekend I discovered even with the large valve relief's in my pistons, if my belt skips more than 3 teeth  I am guaranteed
piston to valve contact.......   @#$%^&*!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Of note I was forced to deck my heads 1MM due to my incompetence in removing them and managed to nick the head to block mating surface.....
 
Also what kind of penalty am I going to be paying by reducing valve lift?
 
Russ F
CT
 
- -----Original Message-----
From: Furman, Russell
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 11:24 AM
 
Actually a timing belt was a sound design choice, leaving the motor as an
interference design was NOT...   Damn shoemaker engineering
 
I mean how hard would it have been to raise the focking deck height 2MM???????
 
Russ "had a bad weekend with the toy" F
CT
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 08:40:48 -0800 (PST)
From: Casey Spivey <spiv99@yahoo.com>
Subject: Team3S: Popping noise while turning
 
Whenever I turn to the left and bring the wheel back it seems to catch at a certain point. It seems that the whole spring assembly is catching at the top. Would this be the upper strut mount? Does it even have one ('91 Vr-4, Front Left)?  It's not the CV shaft or the tie rod end. What else could it be? Thanks, Casey
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:44:29 -0600
From: "Willis, Charles E." <cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Popping noise while turning
 
very likely.  The upper strut mount has a bearing and is prone to wearing out.  This is nicely described at Jeff Lucius site concerning GC installation.  If I was going to replace one, I would go ahead and replace the other, too.
 
Chuck Willis
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 16:53:52 +0000
From: mjannusch@attbi.com
Subject: RE: Team3S: Valve to Piston clearance?
 
> Of note I was forced to deck my heads 1MM due
> to my incompetence in removing them and
> managed to nick the head to block mating
> surface.....
 
Ouch.
 
> Also what kind of penalty am I going to be
> paying by reducing valve lift?
 
You aren't reducing valve lift by shaving down the head.  You are making it
more likely for the pistons to contact the valves if something goes wrong with
the timing, since they will now be 1mm lower in the chamber if you shave 1mm
off the head.  The static compression ratio will also be bumped up as there
will be less volume in the chamber at TDC.
 
- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 11:57:41 -0500
From: "Furman, Russell" <RFurman2@MassMutual.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Valve to Piston clearance?
 
Matt I am aware decking the heads dropped the valves deeper into the cylinder I was more curious if getting adjustable lifters and reducing the lift of the oversize valves by 1MM would significantly hamper the cars performance?  Particularly over 5K....
 
Your thoughts since you have already dug around the insides???????
 
Russ F
CT
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 11:04:03 -0600
From: "merritt@cedar-rapids.net" <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject: Team3S: Head gasket Qs
 
1. I saw a metal head gasket today up at the speed shop. Trent (my tuner) sez he found it in a old crappy motor, and is going to look for a source.
 
Anybody know where we can buy metal head gaskets for a 3000GT VR4? Is this a good thing or a bad thing for our motors?
 
2. I have coolant pumping out of the overflow tank. I've seen the coolant light on every now and again this winter, but the overflow tank was always full, so I figgered it musta been the WW tank icon. Guess not. For the first time, though, I saw coolant on the floor this morning.
 
Trent my tuner says it might be too low a pressure on the radiator cap (which I'll change today) causing it to lose fluid or -- gasp!! -- it might be a head gasket. Shudder. There's no indication of a water pump leak. No steam out the exhaust.
 
We put a pressure gauge on the rad, pumped it up, and it is slowly leaking. It could be leaking down because of the crappy fitting at the gauge or it could be leaking through the head gasket. In any case, it leaks down very slowly.
 
Trent says the only way to know for sure is to do a compression test. Izzat right?
 
As you may or may not recall, I have always had severe overheating problems on track, and pegged the temp gauge on a number of occasions. I fear the chickens may have come home to roost.
 
3.  Assuming we have to replace head gaskets, what else should be do whilst in there?
New spark plug wires?
I have a set of 560 injectors -- can I put them in without an AFC? Anything else? If we have to go in, might as well do other stuff.
The motor (94 VR4) has 80,000 miles.
 
Rich/slow old poop/steaming hot
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 09:43:45 -0800
From: "James Mutton" <james@playstream.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Oil filters and plug gap
 
Technically you've already tried the Pennzoil.  They are OEM'd Fram filters (Painted yellow of course).  Fram happens to be the largest piece of junk ever.  I wouldn't even touch the box of a Fram unless I was trying to destroy the car.  I'm exaggerating but you get the point, Junk.  Run away.
 
I Can't say much about Bosch Platinum plugs in our cars.  In general I found (while working in the industry that it was hit or miss with the Bosch Platinum's.  Some cars loved them others absolutely hated the plugs and refused to perform until they were changed out.  I've never run them in our cars so I can't say how they'd react on a 3S.
 
- -James
95 Green VR-4
 
- -----Original Message-----
From: Desert Fox [mailto:bigfoot@simmgene.com]
Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 8:25 PM
 
So I've tried the following oil filters on my 95 VR-4
 
Fram 3593 ($3.79)
Fram TG3593A Tough Guard ($5.79)
Fram X2 version of size 3593 ($11.99)
K&N HP-1004 ($10.99)
Amsoil (around $8.00)
Mitsu stock ($5.49)
Honda stock (around $6.50) my wife's 98 Accord V6 uses the same filters as the 3000GT!
 
I have seen the Pennzoil but haven't tried it. I refuse to use the Fram that is impregnated with Teflon for the obvious reasons...
 
Are there any that I have missed or should try? I have grown partial to the K&N simply because of its 1" socket on the end that makes removal a snap with a socket instead of using a filter wrench. But I kinda like the price of the Mitsu...
 
On another note, why do I see spark plug gap listed as .44 for our cars? That seems much wider than most people are running. Anyone running that wide a gap?
 
Anyone out there happy with Bosch platinum plugs?
 
Yet another note: Will running a test pipe in place of your main cat increase fuel mileage?
 
- --
Paul/.
95 black 3000GT VR-4
98 VFR800F, TBR aluminum hi exit
formerly reasonable and prudent
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 12:48:35 -0500
From: pvg1@daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: RE: Team3S: Valve to Piston clearance?
 
Yikes!
 
You compression ratio is now up from 8 : 1 to 8.94 : 1, which means that you will not be able to run high boost.
 
Your valve timing is now retarded by about 2 degrees, which means that your valves are more likely to contact the pistons.
 
You are screwed, but there is hope. Get low-compression pistons. Check to make sure there is adequate clearance.
 
You could get adjustable cam gears. You need only two just for the intake (I think). You can save half the price of the full set.
 
Solid lifters will do nothing. They could be adjusted, but that does not mean that they could be adjusted any way you want. They must be adjusted to maintain the specified gap between the rockers and the valve stems, so they are not really adjustable. IMHO they are not worth buying unless you are running aggressive lift cams, which bleed down the stock lifters as they operate.
 
If you do all that your engine will be better that before you, barbarian, messed up your heads! ;-)
 
Philip
 
- -----------------------------------------
 
Of note I was forced to deck my heads 1MM due to my incompetence in removing them and managed to nick the head to block mating surface.....
 
Also what kind of penalty am I going to be paying by reducing valve lift?
 
Russ F
CT
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 17:54:26 +0000
From: mjannusch@attbi.com
Subject: RE: Team3S: Valve to Piston clearance?
 
> Matt I am aware decking the heads dropped
> the valves deeper into the cylinder I was
> more curious if getting adjustable lifters
> and reducing the lift of the oversize valves
> by 1MM would significantly hamper the cars
> performance?  Particularly over 5K....
 
Adjustable lifters won't really let you reduce the valve lift.  You'd need to
grind down your cams to modify lift.  If you loosen the lifters, they
won't be in spec and will wear faster and clatter like crazy.  They are really
only adjustable to set the lifter to rocker clearance to spec.
 
I guess I'm not seeing the point of reducing lift at the sacrifice of flow.
 
- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 12:58:25 -0500
From: "Furman, Russell" <RFurman2@MassMutual.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Valve to Piston clearance?
 
Thanks Phil :p  but I am not pulling my motor apart AGAIN ( I am  running wiseco's .039 overbore {long saga on why I am running those instead of
J.E.'s})
 
Oh I can run high boost it is called ELF 124 race gas =) =) =)
 
Although I called the guy that did my head work and it was actually a little more than 1/4 MM he decked them (hey I am retarded what do you want)
 
And he said that I am banned from using tools in his presence =(
 
Any rate so I am using stock 93 VR-4 intake cams and if I can find them I am going to swap in stock SL exhaust cams.
 
As soon as my tax return gets deposited I am ordering UR cam gears, then it is just getting the rest of the pennies together for the remaining stuff......
 
Russ F
CT
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 12:58:18 -0500
From: pvg1@daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: Re: Team3S: Head gasket Qs
 
Rich,
 
Your gasket is good.
 
Your coolant cap is bad. It could also be the seat where that cap seals. Inspect the seat for pitting and corrosion and get a new coolant cap.
 
To test the cap, pump up the cooling system through the radiator drain plug. It should hold 0.9 atm or 0.9 bar.
 
FYI, The best head gasket for a stock motor is a stock gasket.
 
Philip
 
- ----------------------------------------------------------
 
1. I saw a metal head gasket today up at the speed shop. Trent (my tuner) sez he found it in a old crappy motor, and is going to look for a source.
 
Anybody know where we can buy metal head gaskets for a 3000GT VR4? Is this a good thing or a bad thing for our motors?
 
2. I have coolant pumping out of the overflow tank. I've seen the coolant light on every now and again this winter, but the overflow tank was always full, so I figgered it musta been the WW tank icon. Guess not. For the first time, though, I saw coolant on the floor this morning.
 
Trent my tuner says it might be too low a pressure on the radiator cap (which I'll change today) causing it to lose fluid or -- gasp!! -- it might be a head gasket. Shudder. There's no indication of a water pump leak. No steam out the exhaust.
 
We put a pressure gauge on the rad, pumped it up, and it is slowly leaking. It could be leaking down because of the crappy fitting at the gauge or it could be leaking through the head gasket. In any case, it leaks down very slowly.
 
Trent says the only way to know for sure is to do a compression test. Izzat right?
 
As you may or may not recall, I have always had severe overheating problems on track, and pegged the temp gauge on a number of occasions. I fear the chickens may have come home to roost.
 
3.  Assuming we have to replace head gaskets, what else should be do whilst in there? New spark plug wires? I have a set of 560 injectors -- can I put them in without an AFC? Anything else? If we have to go in, might as well do other stuff. The motor (94 VR4) has 80,000 miles.
 
Rich/slow old poop/steaming hot
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 13:01:39 -0500
From: "Furman, Russell" <RFurman2@MassMutual.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Valve to Piston clearance?
 
See I didn't understand that changing lift is more complicated than just changing lifters now I do....
 
Guess I am up that creak with out a paddle and better just keep an eye on the timing belt and the rest of that mess.....
 
Ya know this car is going to drive me back to the bottle if work doesn't...
 
Russ F
CT
 
- -----Original Message-----
From: mjannusch@attbi.com [mailto:mjannusch@attbi.com]
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 12:54 PM
 
> Matt I am aware decking the heads dropped
> the valves deeper into the cylinder I was
> more curious if getting adjustable lifters
> and reducing the lift of the oversize valves
> by 1MM would significantly hamper the cars
> performance?  Particularly over 5K....
 
Adjustable lifters won't really let you reduce the valve lift.  You'd need to
grind down your cams to modify lift.  If you loosen the lifters, they
won't be in spec and will wear faster and clatter like crazy.  They are really
only adjustable to set the lifter to rocker clearance to spec.
 
I guess I'm not seeing the point of reducing lift at the sacrifice of flow.
 
- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 18:02:50 +0000
From: mjannusch@attbi.com
Subject: Re: Team3S: Head gasket Qs
 
> Anybody know where we can buy metal head
> gaskets for a 3000GT VR4? Is this a
> good thing or a bad thing for our motors?
 
The stock gaskets are metallic.
 
> 3.  Assuming we have to replace head gaskets,
> what else should be do whilst in there?
> New spark plug wires?
 
Great time to do it, if you need 'em.  Generally replace them every 60,000
miles or so for good measure.
 
> I have a set of 560 injectors -- can I
> put them in without an AFC?
 
Nope, need fuel control for most anything over stock size.
 
> Anything else? If we have to go in,
> might as well do other stuff. The motor
> (94 VR4) has 80,000 miles.
 
Water pump, if it wasn't done at the 60,000 mile maintenance.  Could also
install adjustable cam sprockets.  If you get any oil or antifreeze on any of
the belts, replace those too.
 
- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 13:10:39 -0500
From: pvg1@daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: RE: Team3S: Valve to Piston clearance?
 
Geees, I was going to bash you and your builder for removing 1 mm from the heads, but I decided not to make you feel bad since the damage was already done. Those 0.25 mm is nothing to worry about. OEM's often rework heads that they scratch right at the plant and they stay within the print specs. But check your valve clearance anyway. If it is a little too small then you could always Dremel the pistons a little.
 
Your gears are more likely to cause valve damage than these 0.25 mm. You need to test your valve clearance with those gears set at different angles, so that you know your limits.
 
Philip
 

Thanks Phil :p  but I am not pulling my motor apart AGAIN ( I am  running wiseco's .039 overbore {long saga on why I am running those instead of
J.E.'s})
 
Oh I can run high boost it is called ELF 124 race gas =) =) =)
 
Although I called the guy that did my head work and it was actually a little more than 1/4 MM he decked them (hey I am retarded what do you want)
 
And he said that I am banned from using tools in his presence =(
 
Any rate so I am using stock 93 VR-4 intake cams and if I can find them I am going to swap in stock SL exhaust cams.
 
As soon as my tax return gets deposited I am ordering UR cam gears, then it is just getting the rest of the pennies together for the remaining stuff......
 
Russ F
CT
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 13:25:58 -0500
From: "Furman, Russell" <RFurman2@MassMutual.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Valve to Piston clearance?
 
Once I have my cam gears in house I will set the cams the way they are going to run (+1 intake -3 exhaust)
 
Actually I am doing most of the assembly myself, I just handed him my stock heads with new valves, springs, retainers, and retainer clips.  He warned me about the nicks but through his thick polish accent I thought he said 1MM when I picked them up....  When I called him a little while ago one of his guys clarified that it was actually 1/4MM (he said maybe a tiny bit more)
 
And no I did not do the short block assembly (I suck at plastigauging) a local shop did the work for me and I explained to them very clearly about maintaining damn tight tolerances in the bottom end to reduce the likelihood of spun bearings.  I also requested they use a torque plate (but I am not sure if they did or not)
 
We shall see if I break this little bish or not after the NG and YES it looks like I will be there barring any issues/surprises between now and 06/01
 
- -----Original Message-----
From: pvg1@daimlerchrysler.com [mailto:pvg1@daimlerchrysler.com]
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 1:11 PM
 
Geees, I was going to bash you and your builder for removing 1 mm from the heads, but I decided not to make you feel bad since the damage was already done. Those 0.25 mm is nothing to worry about. OEM's often rework heads that they scratch right at the plant and they stay within the print specs. But check your valve clearance anyway. If it is a little too small then you could always Dremel the pistons a little.
 
Your gears are more likely to cause valve damage than these 0.25 mm. You need to test your valve clearance with those gears set at different angles, so that you know your limits.
 
Philip
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 12:33:43 -0700
From: Desert Fox <bigfoot@simmgene.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: General question
 
OK, so they should have made it non-interfering with gear driven cams - if for nothing else, the sweet sound...
 
- --
Paul/.
95 black 3000GT VR-4
98 VFR800F, TBR aluminum hi exit
formerly reasonable and prudent
 
on 3/17/03 9:23, Furman, Russell at RFurman2@MassMutual.com scribbled:
 
> Actually a timing belt was a sound design choice, leaving the motor as an
> interference design was NOT...   Damn shoemaker engineering
>
> I mean how hard would it have been to raise the focking deck height
> 2MM???????
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 14:41:54 -0600
From: "merritt@cedar-rapids.net" <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Head gasket Qs
 
>Your gasket is good.
 
Lordy, I hope so.
 
>Your coolant cap is bad. It could also be the seat where that cap
>seals. Inspect the seat for pitting and corrosion and get a new coolant
>cap.
 
I did that today. I got a 16 psi unit. The one that was on there was a new one I put on last year.
 
Rich
 
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Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 13:50:09 -0700
From: Desert Fox <bigfoot@simmgene.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Oil filters and plug gap
 
That's kinda what I thought. I have had several Fram (not on my VR-4 but on
others) crush when trying to remove them, creating a real problem for removal.
 
How about the .044 gap? Any thought on that? Too wide?
 
- --
Paul/.
95 black 3000GT VR-4
98 VFR800F, TBR aluminum hi exit
formerly reasonable and prudent
 
on 3/17/03 10:43, James Mutton at james@playstream.com scribbled:
 
> Technically you've already tried the Pennzoil.  They are OEM'd Fram
> filters (Painted yellow of course).  Fram happens to be the largest
> piece of junk ever.  I wouldn't even touch the box of a Fram unless I
> was trying to destroy the car.  I'm exaggerating but you get the
> point, Junk.  Run away.
>
> I Can't say much about Bosch Platinum plugs in our cars.  In general I
> found (while working in the industry that it was hit or miss with the
> Bosch Platinum's.  Some cars loved them others absolutely hated the
> plugs and refused to perform until they were changed out.  I've never
> run them in our cars so I can't say how they'd react on a 3S.
 
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Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 15:52:48 -0500
From: "Furman, Russell" <RFurman2@MassMutual.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Head gasket Qs
 
Hey Rich when you change your oil again check and see if their is any coolant in it also check you cooling system (when cold obviously) at the radiator drain plug and look to see if it has any oil in it.
 
When a head gasket cracks it is not always a case of billowing clouds of white smoke out of the tail pipes.  My daily beaters (same car different years, same damn engine and automatic) have done me both the cloud smoke and coolant in the oil system.....
 
Russ F
CT
 
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Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 15:55:24 -0500
From: "Furman, Russell" <RFurman2@MassMutual.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Oil filters and plug gap
 
Paul for a stock car that gap is fine, if you are going to be modding the car I would recommend gapping down to .030-.034 (what ever gap that doesn't produce spark blowout at higher than stock boost pressures)
 
As for oil filters I have no idea I just use the factory Mitsu filter....
 
Russ F
CT
 
- -----Original Message-----
From: Desert Fox [mailto:bigfoot@simmgene.com]
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 3:50 PM
 
That's kinda what I thought. I have had several Fram (not on my VR-4 but on
others) crush when trying to remove them, creating a real problem for removal.
 
How about the .044 gap? Any thought on that? Too wide?
 
- --
Paul/.
95 black 3000GT VR-4
98 VFR800F, TBR aluminum hi exit
formerly reasonable and prudent
 
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
 
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Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 14:57:27 -0600
From: "merritt@cedar-rapids.net" <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Head gasket Qs
 
At 03:52 PM 3/17/03 -0500, Furman, Russell wrote:
>Hey Rich when you change your oil again check and see if their is any
>coolant in it
 
I know how to do that...
 
also check you cooling system (when cold obviously) at the
>radiator drain plug and look to see if it has any oil in it.
 
...but how do you see oil in the coolant? Let it form a pool, and look for the rainbow?
 
>When a head gasket cracks it is not always a case of billowing clouds
>of white smoke out of the tail pipes.  My daily beaters (same car
>different years, same damn engine and automatic) have done me both the
>cloud smoke and coolant in the oil system.....
 
I have less trouble with my winter rat/beater Talon TSi AWD turbo than with the VR4, and I run the Talon a whole lot harder. Just yesterday I had it airborne over some RR tracks, and up to 100 mph on gravel.
 
Maybe I'm trying to race the wrong car. Say, didn't we have a discussion about this a few months ago? Maybe all those guys were right after all.
>
Rich
94 VR4
92 Talon AWD turbo
 
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Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 16:06:18 -0500 (EST)
From: Philip V Glazatov <gphilip@umich.edu>
Subject: Team3S: Re: 3S-Racers: Head gasket Qs
 
Hmm. That is a good thing to check. I did not think of this one <smacking himself on the head>.
 
I had a similar issue when I installed a low-pressure cap. That cap is recommended when you install the NPG+ coolant that I have. The NPG guys actually recommend a "zero-pressure" cap. But a zero-pressure cap or a cap without a rubber seal seeps all the coolant through into the overflow reservoir. So, I had to install the seal back and use a lighter cap spring instead. It now holds only about 4-5 psi.
 
While experiencing all these problems I also became suspicious that I had a leaky head gasket. But after I fixed the cap I think the problems stopped. I guess the key would be to remove the cap after the car was sitting overnight and see the radiator still filled completely. If there is lots of air in the engine/radiator and the cap is new, then I would suspect a leaky head gasket.
 
Philip
 
On Mon, 17 Mar 2003, merritt@cedar-rapids.net wrote:
> >--Key can be if you see BUBBLES coming out of overflow; but that
> >might only happen at high boost.  If you have water overflowing the
> >tank, AND have to add water to the RADIATOR CAP by the manifold like
> >it is low in the engine, air may well have forced extra water out
> >into overflow; and that same air disallows the vacuum that is
> >supposed to suck the fluid back INTO the motor, when it cools down
> >after shut off.
>
> This sounds like when I overheated it last year, and it took hours to
> fill the motor up again with water. WHAT is the secret to filling the
> motor and radiator with water and getting rid of the air bubble?  Turn
> it upside down? Belch it over yer shoulder?
>
> Rich
 
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Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 16:10:49 -0500 (EST)
From: Philip V Glazatov <gphilip@umich.edu>
Subject: Team3S: Re: 3S-Racers: Head gasket Qs
 
On Mon, 17 Mar 2003, merritt@cedar-rap
> WHAT is the secret to filling the motor and radiator with water and
> getting rid of the air bubble?  Turn it upside down? Belch it over yer
> shoulder?
 
You can keep filling the radiator while the car is running. This is how I do it. Opening a hot radiator is dangerous, but topping it off is safe.
 
Philip
 
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Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 15:12:41 -0600
From: "merritt@cedar-rapids.net" <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject: Team3S: Filling the rad
 
>> WHAT is the secret to filling the motor and radiator with water and
>> getting rid of the air bubble?
>
>You can keep filling the radiator while the car is running. This is how
>I do it.
 
But I did that, and it took HOURS. It said it was full -- overflowing and all -- but five minutes later, it took more. I kept doing that, over and over, until it finally had enough. There's gotta be a better way.
 
Rich
 
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Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 15:26:46 -0600
From: "Willis, Charles E." <cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
Subject: Team3S: RE: 3S-Racers: Filling the rad
 
Rich,
 
I got a Prestone kit from O'Reilly's several years ago that included a plastic reservoir jug and some plastic tubing with a hose clamp.  You disconnect the top radiator hose from the radiator and clamp the tubing on that hose and feed it into the reservoir jug. You let the car run until it reaches operating temperature and the thermostat opens (water starts flowing through the top radiator hose).  Then you add water into the radiator until the fluid coming out is clear.  Then you add 1 gallon of antifreeze to the radiator and then turn the engine off.  Reconnect the top hose and top off with water.  Fill the overflow tank to the full line.  You are done.
 
You can do this without the nifty tubing and reservoir, it's just a little messy and not real enviro-friendly (keep cats away from the stream).
 
Chuck Willis
 
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------------------------------
 
Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 14:40:40 -0700
From: Desert Fox <bigfoot@simmgene.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Oil filters and plug gap
 
That is what I thought. How come all the reference materials for our cars list the stock gap at .044?
 
I need to regap as I am getting spark blowout under WOT between 4500 and 5000rpm with stock boost.
 
- --
Paul/.
95 black 3000GT VR-4
98 VFR800F, TBR aluminum hi exit
formerly reasonable and prudent
 
on 3/17/03 14:14, Willis, Charles E. at cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org
scribbled:
 
> 0.034 much better for 15 psi boost=no spark blowout
> 0.044 seems way too wide.
 
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Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 16:36:54 -0800
From: Andrew Woll <awoll1@pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S: General question
 
Yeah - and for the average guy in 3s car they costs 1000 to change when my BMW costs zero and my Subaru costs 200.  Its design technology like this that makes simple things expensive. I can really feel the weight difference. Yep - about a pound for the belt. and, Yep - about 2 pounds for the chain. Wow, that ought to make a big difference. Sorry for the sarcasm. I just plain hate timing belts.
 
Andy
- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Starkey, Jr., Joseph" <starkeyje@bipc.com>
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 7:14 AM
 
> Several reasons, with weight being one of them.  They are quieter,
> cheaper, you don't have to lube them, they can simplify many otherwise
> complex engine designs and can be used to drive multiple components.
 
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End of Team3S: 3000GT & Stealth V2 #106
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