Team3S: 3000GT & Stealth Monday, March 11
2002 Volume 01 : Number
779
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date:
Mon, 11 Mar 2002 14:14:27 -0500
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: 300-320 Hp 1993 to 1994
Seeing that a change of 4 psi or so of
boost (and other small changes
noted in the thread) resulted in about a 20 hp
increase. Is there some
general guideline to what horsepower gain
people are seeing with an
electronic or manual boost controller on their
car? Like 320 stock
(with second gen assumed 12 psi boost) and then add
a boost controller
maintaining 15 psi. Another increase of 3 psi.
Is that going to be
another 20 horsepower, only 5 horsepower, or 40
horsepower?
Is this something that is read easier from a graph (I imagine
the higher
horsepower you get the more boost (and fuel, air, etc.) you need
so it
is a curve that gets steeper (more boost needed) the more horsepower
you
get)?
- --Flash!
- -----Original Message-----
From:
Chris Winkley
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 13:10
Are you guys
sure about that (a boost control solenoid change adding
20hp)? I would swear
there was a camshaft profile change in 1994 (along
with 4 bolt main bearings,
6 speed, etc.).
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 11:37:07
-0800 (PST)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Brake'er, Brake'er, Gtech Competition
Sweet..been wondering
what 6pot 14" calipers on a 3200lb car would rear
anyway.
On Mon, 11
Mar 2002, Zobel, Kurt wrote:
> Zero it like a qtr mile, then just hit
the brakes anytime over 60mph.
> Once stopped the Gtech will alternate
display; 0-60 secs acceleration and
> 60-0 feet to stop.
>
>
Kurt
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Geoff Mohler
[mailto:gemohler@www.speedtoys.com]
> Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 8:12
PM
> To: Zobel, Kurt
> Cc:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Brake'er, Brake'er, Gtech Competition
>
>
> Cool..how do you set it up for that?
>
> On Fri, 8 Mar
2002, Zobel, Kurt wrote:
>
> > OK Guys,
> > Let's see
some Gtech braking info. Then we can bitch about those too.
> >
> > Let's try to get some numbers for different brake setups, and see
what
> > works.
> > Include tire and suspension mods, as they
will factor in too.
> >
> > Kurt
> >
> >
-----Original Message-----
> > From: Jon Bohlke
[mailto:bohlke_mobile@yahoo.com]
> > Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 9:28
AM
> > To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st> >
Subject: Re: Team3S: Gtech Competition
> >
> >
> >
My friend and I have wondered about the accuracy and precision of the
>
> Gtech pro. Since there has been a bit of dicussion about it here
I
> > thought I would share the results of his test. He took the
Gtech with
> > him to the dragstrip at Maple Grove. He ran 4-5
times that day and said
> > that the G-Tech was accurate on the ET but
was optimistic on the speed.
> > I think he said that the Gtech was
within .1s of the ET reported on the
> > timeslip in each run. He
drives a C5 but I don't hold that against him
> > :) , though I am not
sure that it makes a difference what type of car
> > you use to test
the Gtech.
> >
> > Jon
> > 98 Pearl White
VR4
> >
http://3000gt.websnout.com-
---
Geoff Mohler
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 11:37:18
-0800 (PST)
From: Jeff Lucius <
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: 300-320 Hp 1993 to 1994
The factory-stated "supercharging
pressure" for 1st gen is 8.7 psi
and for 2nd gen is 10 psi, with rated bhp
going from 300 to 320.
Using that as a model, the following simple, linear
predictions might
be implied.
boost bhp
8.7
300
10.0 320
11.3 340
12.6 360
13.9
380
15.2 400
16.5 420
17.8 440
Unless of
course you are using the dyno at AAM, then 18 psi boost
nets you a 600 HP
engine! :)
But seriously, the above predictions *might* apply to a stock
motor.
Once VE is improved, *less* boost nets you *more* power (compared
to
stock).
Jeff Lucius,
http://www.stealth316.com/- -----
Original Message -----
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
To:
"'Team3S'" <
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Monday, March 11, 2002 12:14 PM
Subject: RE: Team3S: 300-320 Hp 1993 to
1994
Seeing that a change of 4 psi or so of boost (and other small
changes
noted in the thread) resulted in about a 20 hp increase. Is
there
some general guideline to what horsepower gain people are seeing
with
an electronic or manual boost controller on their car? Like
320
stock
(with second gen assumed 12 psi boost) and then add a
boost
controller
maintaining 15 psi. Another increase of 3
psi. Is that going to be
another 20 horsepower, only 5 horsepower, or
40 horsepower?
Is this something that is read easier from a graph (I
imagine the
higher horsepower you get the more boost (and fuel, air, etc.)
you
need so it is a curve that gets steeper (more boost needed) the
more
horsepower you get)?
- --Flash!
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 14:40:45
-0500
From: "Furman, Russell" <
RFurman2@MassMutual.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: 300-320 Hp 1993 to 1994
Jeff, as I am sure you are very well
aware it is not just the boost PSI that
nets the power but also the CFM of
air at that particular PSI that makes the
horsepower. And just look at
the size of the monsters bolted to that motor
and look at the
lag......... Great for a track car but on a daily driven
car takes too
long to really get going.
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
Jeff Lucius [SMTP:stealthman92@yahoo.com]
> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002
2:37 PM
> To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Subject: Re: Team3S: 300-320 Hp 1993 to 1994
>
> The factory-stated
"supercharging pressure" for 1st gen is 8.7 psi
> and for 2nd gen is 10
psi, with rated bhp going from 300 to 320.
> Using that as a model, the
following simple, linear predictions might
> be implied.
>
>
boost bhp
> 8.7 300
> 10.0 320
> 11.3
340
> 12.6 360
> 13.9 380
> 15.2 400
>
16.5 420
> 17.8 440
>
> Unless of course you are
using the dyno at AAM, then 18 psi boost
> nets you a 600 HP engine! :)
>
> But seriously, the above predictions *might* apply to a stock
motor.
> Once VE is improved, *less* boost nets you *more* power (compared
to
> stock).
>
> Jeff Lucius,
http://www.stealth316.com/>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
> To:
"'Team3S'" <
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
>
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 12:14 PM
> Subject: RE: Team3S: 300-320 Hp
1993 to 1994
>
> Seeing that a change of 4 psi or so of boost (and
other small changes
> noted in the thread) resulted in about a 20 hp
increase. Is there
> some general guideline to what horsepower gain
people are seeing with
> an electronic or manual boost controller on their
car? Like 320
> stock
> (with second gen assumed 12 psi boost)
and then add a boost
> controller
> maintaining 15 psi.
Another increase of 3 psi. Is that going to be
> another 20
horsepower, only 5 horsepower, or 40 horsepower?
>
> Is this
something that is read easier from a graph (I imagine the
> higher
horsepower you get the more boost (and fuel, air, etc.) you
> need so it
is a curve that gets steeper (more boost needed) the more
> horsepower you
get)?
>
> --Flash!
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 14:47:59
-0500
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: 300-320 Hp 1993 to 1994
Jeff,
Thanks for the
numbers but just like the max top speed in a gear
graph this is totally
inaccurate I bet. The graph on your page shows
that 6th gear can go
well over 200 mph. I don't think anyone has ever
had a 3/S over that
speed and thought that 5th speed was the highest
speed gear.
So boost is not the only thing and air, fuel, spark, etc.
needs
increased. I had a manual boost controller on stock 9B turbos
and
second gen car. I dialed it the wrong way one time and under WOT in
3rd
gear saw 21 psi. Oops. I doubt that meant I had 500 hp going
since I
believe it is impossible to get 500 hp from stock turbos,
stock
injectors, K&N, stock fuel pump, etc. Maybe not. I
don't think anyone
has done it.
But the boost was definitely
that high but I bet most of it was
leaking out the BOV or the boost
controller vent hole or something.
Maybe I should donate that controller to
AAM since it yielded 500 hp (an
increase of 180 hp) for only $35.
=)
Thoughts?
- --Flash!
- -----Original
Message-----
From: Jeff Lucius
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002
14:37
The factory-stated "supercharging pressure" for 1st gen is
8.7 psi
and for 2nd gen is 10 psi, with rated bhp going from 300 to
320.
Using that as a model, the following simple, linear predictions
might
be implied.
boost bhp
8.7 300
10.0
320
11.3 340
12.6 360
13.9 380
15.2
400
16.5 420
17.8 440
Unless of course you are using
the dyno at AAM, then 18 psi boost
nets you a 600 HP engine! :)
But
seriously, the above predictions *might* apply to a stock motor.
Once VE is
improved, *less* boost nets you *more* power (compared
to
stock).
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 14:02:14
-0600
From: "Christopher Deutsch" <
christopher0@attbi.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Possible product
Definitely interested! If you need
software written for data logging let me
know.
Are you planning on
using a Wideband O2 sensor, like the one from that
environmental Honda that
they use on the EFI DIY page?
Christopher
> -----Original
Message-----
> From:
owner-team3s@team3s.com
[mailto:owner-team3s@team3s.com]On Behalf
> Of Jannusch, Matt
>
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 1:00 PM
> To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Subject: Team3S: Possible product
>
>
> Anyone interested in
an LCD display that would do the following:
>
> During cruise (based
on throttle position) display two bargraphs of O2
> voltage (one for each
bank of cylinders), display RPM and display boost
>
pressure/vacuum.
>
> During TPS > 60% display exact O2 voltage
for both O2 sensors accurate to
> .001 volt, plus RPM, plus boost
pressure.
>
> The display would be small enough that it would fit
easily on top of the
> steering wheel shroud. It could also maybe
have warning LED's on it that
> would light up at something like less than
a certain voltage of O2 above a
> certain boost pressure or something like
that.
>
> I'm building one for myself, just wondering if anyone else
would be
> interested. I don't have the costs worked out yet, but it
should be under
> $200.
>
> There might be a possibility of
datalogging those parameters as well, but
> I'd be working on the more
basic version first. It could also be
> built with
> a
vacuum-florescent display at higher cost also. It might be a
two-piece
> unit where the display would just be cabled to the master
unit
> with a piece
> of RJ-11 phone cable so you could position it
anywhere and it
> would take up
> very little space.
>
>
Interest? Comments?
>
> -Matt
> '95 3000GT Spyder
VR4
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 12:05:14
-0800
From: "ek2mfg" <
ek2mfg@foxinternet.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Front Strut Bar
I have a 93 R/T with sunroof and I have to
modify the metal brackets
under the plastic trim to let the round style cusco
fit...maybe a
diff between stealth and 3000 but it must be done no matter how
it
will fit in the rear...I have tried several options...If I want
the
metal bracket that keeps the sunroom mounted solid to the frame
then
it is a must......just a very small notch but a MUST none the
less.
bobk.
- ---- Original Message ----
From:
erik.gross@intel.comTo:
Jim_Floyd@maxtor.com,
dschilberg@pobox.com,
>Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
Subject: RE: Team3S: Front Strut
Bar
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 09:52:37 -0800
>> I have no idea why
anyone would design a strut tower bar with
>> anything less than the
maximum support between the strut
>> towers. Maybe for a lower selling
price ?
>
>How about adjustability?
>
>BTW, in response
to Flash's question, yes, the (round) Cusco rear
>strut
>tower
brace will allow storing the removable glass sunroof in the
>stock
>location with the brace installed.
>
>Note:
some of the pictures are of my base model 3000GT (white), but
>there
>are also some pictures of my VR-4
(black).
>http://www.team3s.com/~egross/3000GT/RearStrutBar/RearStrutBar.html
>
>--Erik
>'95
VR-4
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 14:13:45
-0600
From: "Jannusch, Matt" <
mjannusch@marketwatch.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: 300-320 Hp 1993 to 1994
> Thanks for the
numbers but just like the max top speed in
> a gear graph this is totally
inaccurate I bet. The graph on
> your page shows that 6th gear can
go well over 200 mph. I
> don't think anyone has ever had a 3/S
over that speed and
> thought that 5th speed was the highest speed
gear.
If you had enough horsepower, you could go over 200 mph. It
isn't that the
graph is inaccurate, its just that nobody has the power to
pull it in 6th
gear.
> So boost is not the only
thing and air, fuel, spark, etc.
> needs increased. I had a manual
boost controller on stock 9B
> turbos and second gen car. I dialed
it the wrong way one
> time and under WOT in 3rd gear saw 21 psi.
Oops. I doubt
> that meant I had 500 hp going since I believe it is
> impossible to get 500 hp from stock turbos, stock injectors,
>
K&N, stock fuel pump, etc. Maybe not. I don't think anyone
> has done it.
You can't sustain that boost pressure high enough
in the rev range to get
500 HP out of it, but you probably had really good
torque in the midrange
for that one pull if timing didn't get pulled out
right away.
- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 14:17:14
-0600
From: "Jannusch, Matt" <
mjannusch@marketwatch.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Possible product
> Definitely interested! If you
need software written for data
> logging let me know.
I figured
that I'd just provide an RS-232 interface to dump the raw data to
a laptop
running some sort of terminal software and then you could look at
it later in
Excel.
> Are you planning on using a Wideband O2 sensor, like the one
> from that environmental Honda that they use on the EFI DIY
page?
Just the stock O2 sensors. Wideband is expen$ive, $250 a
piece for the
Honda one you mentioned. They also require that you share
your designs with
them if you use their information/design. Not sure
that's what I'm looking
for.
Just trying to make something simple to
solve the problem of having gauges
strewn all over the interior of my
car. :-)
If you were to build one of their DIY-widebands, my gauge
design could be
able to display the voltages it is outputting with high
accuracy (within
.004v on a zero to 5V range). I'll be using 10-bit A/D
converters for the
voltage measurements and could maybe make it
software-selectable for either
0-1V range or 0-5V range.
-
-Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 15:17:39
-0500
From:
romachka21@netscape.net
(Roman)
Subject: Team3S: Boost drop to 5psi
I have only posted once
before when I was building my 94 VR-4 800hp project car. I had an engine rebuild
by AAM with rods, pistons, valves, head work, polishing, boring, balancing and
etc....
Basicly the block is bullet proof.
Before I was braking the
motor in and now the block has about 600 miles on it. I only boosted up to 3500
rpm.
What it would do is boost to 15psi and drop to about 10 psi and it will
hold it.
After about 500 miles on a new block I noticed a problem that when
the car gets warm or ran for about 5 min I would not be able to have the turbos
boost past 6 psi. The problem is still there and I NEED HELP....
When the car
is cool it will boost up to 15 psi and drop to 10 psi. After it gets warm it
will not boost pass 6 psi. I have an aftermarket gauge.
I get no oil leaks...
and I am not sure why it would boost fine when cold and not when
worm.
Any help will be appreciated. I want to dyno the car with the stock
setting to see what the head work did to the HP. But not when it boost to 6
psi.
The only mods to the car is the Block with the Heads... Gutted both
precats. No Boost controller. I have Boost gauge and air/fuel
gauge.
Thank you guy for all the help.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 12:20:17
-0800
From: "Geddes, Brian J" <
brian.j.geddes@intel.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Possible product
I'm definitely interested as well.
As
for the wideband O2, I've been looking into the DIY WB O2 sensor lately,
and
I see a couple of difficulties using one in this application.
First,
the milage on these sensors is pretty low - I've heard that the
sensors
typically have a lifespan of about 10k miles before they go
south. It's a
GREAT tuning tool, but not something you'd run on your
car every day.
Secondly, the electronics needed to control the heating and
other functions
of the sensor are somewhat complex and would certainly add a
chunk of change
to the cost of the unit. IMHO, the WB O2 would be
better off as a separate
unit.
For anyone interested in the
Wideband 02 sensor, this page sells PCBs and
parts kits to make your own
sensor controller, or will send you a
pre-assembled/tested unit.
They're also working on nicely packaged
controller unit with display, all
you'd need to add is the WB 02 sensor,
which you can get from NAPA online for
around $125. All told their setup
runs 1/3-1/4 the cost of every other
WB 02 setup I've seen. They're even
working on software to do
logging!
http://www.techedge.com.au/vehicle/wbo2/default.htmI've
got no interest in this company, and in fact haven't even ordered one
yet
(although I plan to, with my S-AFC on the way!) Just sharing
info.
- - Brian
- -----Original Message-----
From: Christopher
Deutsch [mailto:christopher0@attbi.com]
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 12:02
PM
To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
RE: Team3S: Possible product
Definitely interested! If you need
software written for data logging let me
know.
Are you planning on
using a Wideband O2 sensor, like the one from that
environmental Honda that
they use on the EFI DIY page?
Christopher
> -----Original
Message-----
> From:
owner-team3s@team3s.com
[mailto:owner-team3s@team3s.com]On Behalf
> Of Jannusch, Matt
>
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 1:00 PM
> To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Subject: Team3S: Possible product
>
> Anyone interested in an LCD
display that would do the following:
>
> During cruise (based on
throttle position) display two bargraphs of O2
> voltage (one for each
bank of cylinders), display RPM and display boost
>
pressure/vacuum.
>
> During TPS > 60% display exact O2 voltage
for both O2 sensors accurate to
> .001 volt, plus RPM, plus boost
pressure.
>
> The display would be small enough that it would fit
easily on top of the
> steering wheel shroud. It could also maybe
have warning LED's on it that
> would light up at something like less than
a certain voltage of O2 above a
> certain boost pressure or something like
that.
>
> I'm building one for myself, just wondering if anyone else
would be
> interested. I don't have the costs worked out yet, but it
should be under
> $200.
>
> There might be a possibility of
datalogging those parameters as well, but
> I'd be working on the more
basic version first. It could also be
> built with
> a
vacuum-florescent display at higher cost also. It might be a
two-piece
> unit where the display would just be cabled to the master
unit
> with a piece
> of RJ-11 phone cable so you could position it
anywhere and it
> would take up
> very little space.
>
>
Interest? Comments?
>
> -Matt
> '95 3000GT Spyder
VR4
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 14:24:18
-0600
From: "Jannusch, Matt" <
mjannusch@marketwatch.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Boost drop to 5psi
> Basicly the block is bullet proof.
> Before I was braking the motor in and now the block has about
>
600 miles on it. I only boosted up to 3500 rpm. What it would
> do is
boost to 15psi and drop to about 10 psi and it will
> hold it. After
about 500 miles on a new block I noticed a
> problem that when the car
gets warm or ran for about 5 min I
> would not be able to have the turbos
boost past 6 psi. The
> problem is still there and I NEED HELP.... When
the car is
> cool it will boost up to 15 psi and drop to 10 psi. After it
> gets warm it will not boost pass 6 psi. I have an aftermarket
>
gauge. I get no oil leaks... and I am not sure why it would
> boost fine
when cold and not when worm.
If you are running the stock boost control
setup, then 6 psi is what happens
if you get excessive knock. Do your
pistons rattle in the bores? How much
cylinder wall clearance are you
running? If the block was bored too loose
for your pistons they can
rattle and trigger the knock sensor, causing the
ECU to close the boost
solenoid and result in the meager 6 psi of boost.
Which pistons did you
get? If you told them to build it for 800 HP, then
they probably bored
a little extra clearance to allow for piston expansion
under the heat of
making that much power. The tradeoff is that they rattle
at lower
temps.
Also make sure the signal line to the BOV is connected to manifold
pressure.
If it isn't, the stock BOV will leak like a sieve resulting in
similar
behavior.
- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 13:24:53
-0700
From: "Floyd, Jim" <
Jim_Floyd@maxtor.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Boost drop to 5psi
What has AAM done about the problem
??
- -----Original Message-----
From:
romachka21@netscape.net
[mailto:romachka21@netscape.net]
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 1:18 PM
To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
Team3S: Boost drop to 5psi
I have only posted once before when I was
building my 94 VR-4 800hp project
car. I had an engine rebuild by AAM with
rods, pistons, valves, head work,
polishing, boring, balancing and
etc....
Basicly the block is bullet proof.
Before I was braking the
motor in and now the block has about 600 miles on
it. I only boosted up to
3500 rpm.
What it would do is boost to 15psi and drop to about 10 psi and it
will hold
it.
After about 500 miles on a new block I noticed a problem
that when the car
gets warm or ran for about 5 min I would not be able to
have the turbos
boost past 6 psi. The problem is still there and I NEED
HELP....
When the car is cool it will boost up to 15 psi and drop to 10 psi.
After it
gets warm it will not boost pass 6 psi. I have an aftermarket
gauge.
I get no oil leaks... and I am not sure why it would boost fine when
cold
and not when worm.
Any help will be appreciated. I want to dyno
the car with the stock setting
to see what the head work did to the HP. But
not when it boost to 6 psi.
The only mods to the car is the Block with
the Heads... Gutted both precats.
No Boost controller. I have Boost gauge and
air/fuel gauge.
Thank you guy for all the help.
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 12:23:55
-0800
From: "fastmax" <
fastmax@cox.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Front Strut Bar
I actually had to remove the brackets for the sun roof to
get my Roadrace
Engineering bar installed --- If I seriously modified it I
could probably
reinstall it. Having a hole in my roof seems like a dumb idea
anyway so
I won't miss the
brackets.
Jim Berry
PS
--- Darren: apparently Roadrace Eng no longer makes the strut bar. They
are a
DSM house so I guess they decided not to screw around with them.
PPS ---
Darren: I don't have my ABS disconnected, even at the track. I've
removed
the fuse occasionally to test the effectiveness and operation of
the
ABS.
===========================================================
From:
"ek2mfg" <
ek2mfg@foxinternet.com>
>
I have a 93 R/T with sunroof and I have to modify the metal brackets
>
under the plastic trim to let the round style cusco fit...maybe a
> diff
between stealth and 3000 but it must be done no matter how it
> will fit
in the rear...I have tried several options...If I want the
> metal bracket
that keeps the sunroom mounted solid to the frame then
> it is a
must......just a very small notch but a MUST none the less.
>
>
bobk.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 12:32:41
-0800 (PST)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Boost drop to 5psi
Ya..dont ask us, ask them. Thats the
respectable first thing to do.
On Mon, 11 Mar 2002, Floyd, Jim
wrote:
>
> What has AAM done about the problem ??
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
romachka21@netscape.net
[mailto:romachka21@netscape.net]
> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 1:18
PM
> To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Subject: Team3S: Boost drop to 5psi
>
> I have only posted once
before when I was building my 94 VR-4 800hp project
> car. I had an engine
rebuild by AAM with rods, pistons, valves, head work,
> polishing, boring,
balancing and etc....
>
> Basicly the block is bullet proof.
> Before I was braking the motor in and now the block has about 600 miles
on
> it. I only boosted up to 3500 rpm.
> What it would do is boost
to 15psi and drop to about 10 psi and it will hold
> it.
> After
about 500 miles on a new block I noticed a problem that when the car
>
gets warm or ran for about 5 min I would not be able to have the turbos
>
boost past 6 psi. The problem is still there and I NEED HELP....
> When
the car is cool it will boost up to 15 psi and drop to 10 psi. After it
>
gets warm it will not boost pass 6 psi. I have an aftermarket gauge.
> I
get no oil leaks... and I am not sure why it would boost fine when cold
>
and not when worm.
>
> Any help will be appreciated. I want to dyno
the car with the stock setting
> to see what the head work did to the HP.
But not when it boost to 6 psi.
>
> The only mods to the car is the
Block with the Heads... Gutted both precats.
> No Boost controller. I have
Boost gauge and air/fuel gauge.
>
> Thank you guy for all the
help.
- ---
Geoff Mohler
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 15:32:08
-0500
From:
pvg1@daimlerchrysler.comSubject:
Re: Team3S: 5mm spacers
Are they wheel spacers? How would 7-mm spacers
change suspension geometry:
camber, caster, toe, steering angles? I'd like to
see what considerations
are behind the 7-mm spacers.
The biggest 3S
suspension flaw is the MacPhearson design with a poor
geometry. The front
outside wheel in turns leans towards the outside WAY
too much. It is so bad
that it is impossible to improve it significantly by
changing camber or
caster angles. I do not understand what a 7-mm wheel
spacer would
change.
Philip
-
--------------------------------------------------------
Henri Le Hir <
hlehir@lucent.com> wrote:
On my 1st
Gen Stealth RT/TT, I found that the handling was
"understeering
by
design".
So I had a serious look at the front
suspension, made some tests with my
accelerometers (dry / wet / ice / snow),
did some math, and found out that
I'd theoritically have to put 7mm spacers
on the front (both sides).
Unfortunately, I could only find HR 5mm
spacers for the Stealth / VR4, so
it's what I have.
Right now, the car
is definitively more responsive (from the steering point
of view), and maybe
just a little (as in very little ) bit still
understeering.
But it's
definitively a lot more neutral than it used to be.
I'll keep it this
way
Best
Henri
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 12:35:59
-0800
From: "fastmax" <
fastmax@cox.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Boost drop to 5psi
6# is about what you get if the line to the waste
gates are closed
and the waste gate solenoid is not doing anything --- eg. if
the
control line is disconected from the
solenoid.
Jim
berry
===============================================
- ----- Original
Message -----
From: "Roman" <
romachka21@netscape.net>
To:
<
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Monday, March 11, 2002 12:17 PM
Subject: Team3S: Boost drop to
5psi
> I have only posted once before when I was building my 94 VR-4
800hp project car. I had an engine rebuild by AAM with rods,
pistons, valves,
head work, polishing, boring, balancing and etc....
>
> Basicly the
block is bullet proof.
> Before I was braking the motor in and now the
block has about 600 miles on it. I only boosted up to 3500 rpm.
> What it
would do is boost to 15psi and drop to about 10 psi and it will hold it.
>
After about 500 miles on a new block I noticed a problem that when the car gets
warm or ran for about 5 min I would not be able to
have the turbos boost past
6 psi. The problem is still there and I NEED HELP....
> When the car is
cool it will boost up to 15 psi and drop to 10 psi. After it gets warm it will
not boost pass 6 psi. I have an
aftermarket gauge.
> I get no oil
leaks... and I am not sure why it would boost fine when cold and not when
worm.
>
> Any help will be appreciated. I want to dyno the car with
the stock setting to see what the head work did to the HP. But not when
it
boost to 6 psi.
>
> The only mods to the car is the Block with the
Heads... Gutted both precats. No Boost controller. I have Boost gauge and
air/fuel
gauge.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 12:50:00
-0800 (PST)
From: Casey Spivey <
spiv99@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
turbos going bad? anyone?
I have an Autometer boost guage, this is where
I am getting the 15lbs
from. I haven't noticed any oil loss, but I just
changed it last
week so I can keep better track of it. Wouldn't some
oil be getting
in the pipes and down to the intercooler? Was there any
special
trick, like a dye test, that the dealer did to tell that yours
was
cracked or am I going to have to take it all apart to save some
time
and money? Later
I was the exact same. I didn't smell any
oil burn or spot a single
drop
of oil, that's when the mechanic told me it
was likely all burning
up.
As well, my factory turbo gauge, showed full
turbo pressure, but the
mechanic said it wasn't reading
accurately.
What's the deal with PCV valve change? Just change it
to a new
factory
valve, what is this supposed to
do?
Later,
Shannon
Casey Spivey wrote:
> I
thought for sure it was the rear turbo as well. I used a little
> mirror
to check around the back turbo and I couldn't see any oil
> around. It's
possible that it is still coming out but being burn up
> from the heat.
There was no oil in the intercooler either. It was
> recommended to change
the PCV valve which I will do here in the
next
> couple days. Unless my
manual boost controller is really off I
don't
> understand how I can
get 15lbs with a cracked turbo. Plus the oil
is
> throwing me
off.
>
> I am not a mechanic by any means, but I have a 92 Stealth
TT and
had
> a
> similar thing happen to me recently. I
don't have manual boost
but,
> experienced the "air escaping" sound
near the rear, by the
firewall.
> I
> have never smelt oil, but
experienced loss of oil over time. As
> well, I
> noticed that
often around 4,000 RPM the car seemed to hesitate and
> run
>
rough
>
> After taking it in for a check-up, it was revealed that my
rear
turbo
> is
> cracked. Not what I wanted to hear, and I
am sure not what you
want
> to
> hear. It explains the air
escaping, the lack of boost and the oil
> loss. It is rare that I
have the opportunity to drive the car the
> way
> it should be so I
didn't notice this as a big problem for a few
> weeks,
> the car
seemed fine, except when you wind it out. Thus, when the
>
rear
> turbo kicked in it blew air out of the turbo, as well as burnt
oil
> being
> sent through the turbo.
>
> I was just
about to sell it, now I might have to keep it seeing I'm
> going to soak a
good buck into it. I hope you have better luck
with
>
yours.
>
> Later,
>
> Shannon
>
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 16:12:29
-0500
From:
pvg1@daimlerchrysler.comSubject:
RE: Team3S: Possible product
>> Definitely interested! If you
need software written for data
>> logging let me know.
>I
figured that I'd just provide an RS-232 interface to dump the raw
data
to
>a laptop running some sort of terminal software and then you
could look at
>it later in Excel.
I'd pay $200 right now for
anything that would let me dump some key, high
sampling rate data into Excel!
A laptop PCMCIA data acquisition card is all
I need, but those were $700+
last time I checked. Anyone knows of a better
deal?
Alerts are very
useful too. I do not expect myself to catch a spike in some
reading when I am
testing my car in the street watching out for cops, cats,
pedestrians, and
other cars ;-)
A display with some sort of data logging, replay, or X-Y
plots (boost-O2,
boost-RPM, RPM-O2, or RPM-knock sensor voltage!) would also
be very cool.
Philip
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 13:41:01
-0500
From: "Zobel, Kurt" <
KURT.ZOBEL@ca.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Brake'er, Brake'er, Gtech Competition
Zero it like a qtr mile,
then just hit the brakes anytime over 60mph.
Once stopped the Gtech will
alternate display; 0-60 secs acceleration and
60-0 feet to stop.
Kurt
- -----Original Message-----
From: Geoff Mohler
[mailto:gemohler@www.speedtoys.com]
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 8:12
PM
To: Zobel, Kurt
Cc:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
RE: Team3S: Brake'er, Brake'er, Gtech Competition
Cool..how do you set it
up for that?
On Fri, 8 Mar 2002, Zobel, Kurt wrote:
> OK Guys,
> Let's see some Gtech braking info. Then we can bitch about those
too.
>
> Let's try to get some numbers for different brake setups,
and see what
> works.
> Include tire and suspension mods, as they
will factor in too.
>
> Kurt
>
> -----Original
Message-----
> From: Jon Bohlke [mailto:bohlke_mobile@yahoo.com]
>
Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 9:28 AM
> To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Gtech Competition
>
> My friend and I have
wondered about the accuracy and precision of the
> Gtech pro. Since
there has been a bit of dicussion about it here I
> thought I would share
the results of his test. He took the Gtech with
> him to the
dragstrip at Maple Grove. He ran 4-5 times that day and said
> that
the G-Tech was accurate on the ET but was optimistic on the speed.
> I
think he said that the Gtech was within .1s of the ET reported on the
>
timeslip in each run. He drives a C5 but I don't hold that against
him
> :) , though I am not sure that it makes a difference what type of
car
> you use to test the Gtech.
>
> Jon
> 98 Pearl
White VR4
>
http://3000gt.websnout.com-
---
Geoff Mohler
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 14:19:39
-0500
From: "Zobel, Kurt" <
KURT.ZOBEL@ca.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Trunk mounted battery
..and don't forget the Optima two year
replacement warranty.
I may still get a Dynabatt, for track only, but
only at about $100 or less.
Been looking for any discounts or group buys.
Kurt
- -----Original Message-----
From: Chris Winkley
[mailto:cwinkley@plaza.ds.adp.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 10:13
AM
To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
Team3S: Trunk mounted battery
Folks...
I've had it with dry cell
batteries. This is the third one I've had, with
each failing to hold a charge
over the winter sitting in the garage (even
with a 2 amp automatic charger on
it). At $225 a piece, this is NOT a good
investment.
:-(
Sooooo, I bought a Optima Red Top this last
weekend...900 amps and only
$115.00!!!
Now the dilemma. I thought it
would be a great idea to go all the way so I
bought a NHRA rated Moroso
polyethylene airtight box and battery kill
switch. BUT, I cannot locate a
space anywhere in the trunk where I can
install the box. I can squeeze the
battery itself into the right rear
corner, and can drill one hole to the
outside of the frame and one to the
inside (over the gas tank) for the steel
strap but can't come up with a
solution for the box as it's approximately two
inches larger all the way
around. Has anyone successfully installed a sealed
box? If so, where? I'm
thinking I may resort to having a stainless steel tray
fabricated, screw it
to the floor pan, and use the strap with two strap bolts
to hold it in the
tray should I decide to try driving upside down.
Suggestions???
Also, any suggestions on the best run for the cables? I
bought 20 feet of
Moroso 2 gauge cable with plenty of beefy ring
terminations. My plan is to
connect the two ground connections that are in
the engine compartment (motor
and chassis) to each other, then run a ground
to the body in the trunk. This
will leave only one cable to run (the
positive) back up to the engine
compartment. It seems like there's plenty of
clearance if I attach it to the
body pan on the passenger side, but I could
get fancier and tuck it up along
the tunnel where the driveline and tranny
is. Again, suggestions?
Looking forward...Chris
1995 Glacier Pearl
White VR4 (w/custom K&N intake, bored and polished
throttle body, TEC 15G
turbos, RC 560cc injectors, HKS fuel pump, ARC2/MAF
fuel controller, Split
Second A/F meter, GReddy PRofec A boost controller,
Apex EGT & boost
gauges, GReddy turbo timer, HKS SBOV, custom intercoolers,
Odyssey dry cell
battery, Magnecore 8.5mm wires, NGK double platinum plugs
gapped at .032",
ACT 2800 lb pressure plate, Broward six puck racing disc,
Centerforce
throwout bearing, ATR downpipe and test pipe, GReddy catback
exhaust, Stillen
cross-drilled rotors, Porterfield R4 race pads, SS brake
lines, Eibach 1"
drop progressive springs, Michelin SX MXX3 Pilots)
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 17:58:29
EST
From:
DonBrando36@aol.comSubject: Team3S:
VR4 block
does anyone know if the 1993 VR4 engine
could fit into a 1993 N/A engine
compartment. Could i use N/A
transmition with the VR4 or do i need to buy a
VR4 tranny? could the
new engine be jsut front wheel drive or just rear
wheel
drive?
this is the way i am going to go, if it is
possible
brandon
93 3000GT Dohc
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 15:06:45
-0800
From: "Gross, Erik" <
erik.gross@intel.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Front Strut Bar
> Erik - Can you re-install the rubber tops to
the rear
> shock towers with the Cusco rear strut tower bar in
>
place? I believe Chris' allows this.
Actually the Cusco bar allows
you to replace the rubber tops for the rear
shock towers after the bar is in
place, not that it really matters all that
much.
You can see this very
clearly on my webpage:
http://www.team3s.com/~egross/3000GT/RearStrutBar/ReinstallWithSunroof.jpg>
I don't know about the RoadRace one but Jim B. said they are
> not
selling them now? Is that right? Jim, can you replace
> the
rubber tops to the shock towers?
What's the big deal with the rubber
covers for the shock towers? Helps keep
dust out and "looks
better," but I don't see its presence or absense as
much of an issue... but
that's just me - maybe it has some critical function
that I don't know
about.
> Remember that many of the big name shops are in this for the
money and
> profit. Few companies actually make the product for what
it was
> intended for or if they do then we can't afford it for our
cars.
C'mon, now... while that is true in some specific cases, it's
not fair to
make that a blanket statement. Bigger companies should be
able to sink more
into R&D than smaller shops and big, established
companies also have
experience in their corner. I'm not in any way
saying that all smaller
shops (or individuals) lack this experience or
R&D budget, but looking at
the big picture and statistics...
I'd
be the first to tell anyone that Chris (TEC) makes a well-built front
brace
that is a complete solution (battery bracket, all hardware,
powder
coated). It made a rather large difference in my VR-4's
handling, mainly in
the areas of steering precision/feel and front tire
traction in cornering,
especially in transitions (like slaloms).
Is
his bar the only one we have available to us? Not any more. Is it
the
best-performing bar? I'm not qualified to answer that, but I'm
happy with
mine. Is it the cheapest bar? No, it's pretty expensive
compared to the
others. Would I buy it again, now that there are others
available? Maybe,
but I'd have to do some more research to figure out
which option is the best
value for me.
- --Erik
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 15:36:38
-0800 (PST)
From: menalteed <
menalteed@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Team3S: excessive battery corrosion
My 92 Stealth has had a major problen
with corrosion
at the positive battery terminal. Now with all the IC
pipes
out I have checked the cable and followed the
main negitive cable back to the
block just under the
front Turbo. It was very loose, and looks like it
has
been that way from the factory. In any case I will
need to replace the
positive cable to the starter from
the battery as over time cuting it down to
get rid of
bad corroded cable has made it now to short for
further use. I
have been going through my books on the
92 Stealth but can't find any
reference to the
positive battery cable or if it can be replaced, or is
it
part of a harness system as it looks like and I
would need to buy the harness
with the negitive and
positive cable
and the other starter circuit wires
as a unit. I
wonder if someone has a caps book that wouldn't mind
doing a
quick check to I can place a order for a new
cable.
I also want to thank
all the people here for so much
qreat information, and informative
discussion, and for
sure without this great place to ask questions I
would
never have made this far with my turbo upgrade and all
the other
stuff to get my ten year old Stealth back to
a fresh as new condition. I'm
trying to take care of
all the little things that need to be done to get
this
back on the road. I'm replaceing rusted parts. oil
lines and
electrical where it needs it like the
positive battery cable.
Peter
92 Stealth TT
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 17:43:01
-0600
From: RJM <
rjmsmail@swbell.net>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Suspension light blinking on 94 3000gt
Thanks Chuck for the
advice, I apologize that I am just getting to check the
car out
now. Basics please: I have the voltmeter(s), manual and am
looking
under the front end now, didn't take rear tires off/inspect rear
shocks yet
other
than looking around car with tires on (guess that's still
"bogus" but right now
I
have the front up and want to do the computer
test, I have new tires and don't
want to ruin them)
1.) What is 1st and
2nd generation?
2.) What is MFI (these two questions would be good to put in
the acronyms/FAQ,
I didn't see them there)?
3.) Where in the manual is the
ECU (computer) showing pin locations and I am
assuming I put the voltmeter on
DC volts and if I get the generations wrong and
use the wrong pin it won't
damage the ECU (for a 1994 3000gt SL)?
4.) Related to 3.): is there a place
in the archives/website guys that shows how
to
do the computer check with
the voltmeter, I'm sure there is, sorry I can't find
it,
I'll keep
searching in the interim.
5.) If it is a speed sensor causing the problem, am
I left to find which one? I
am
assuming "yes".
Thanks MUCH.
I've already put another 2,000 since we talked last.
Bob
"Willis,
Charles E." wrote:
> When the ECS fails to get through its self-test,
it remains in SPORT-HARD
> mode and the light blinks. Your message
didn't say anything about
> inspecting the REAR two shocks and their
wiring harness connections.
>
> If the dash light is flashing, then
a fault code is being sent telling you
> which strut has the
problem. 9 times out of 10 it is a poor connection, but
> can be a
rotated shaft on the shock itself and can be a wiring harness
> spooled
around the top of the strut. "It looks okay" is bogus.
>
>
Check it yourself -
>
> These are instuctions I gave someone else
with voltmeter:
>
> 1. Find the datalink connector under the
dash in the driver's
side.
> A. 1ST
GENERATION - connect + to pin 3, - to pin 12. Pin 3 is the
> third
down on the left side, before the double space. Pin 12 is the lower
>
right corner.
> B.
2ND GENERATION - connect + to pin 3, - to pin 4 or 5. Pin 3 is
> the
third from the top left side of the connector ( on the log side of the
>
trapezoid), pin 4 and 5 are next to the right.
>
> 2. Turn the
ignition on.
>
> 3. Look at the voltmeter. The code is
repeated many times. Seven (7)
> short deflections is code =0, and
means everything is wonderful.
>
> 4. Other codes are: 1
long, 1 short = 11, G sensor
bad.
>
2 long, 1 short=21, steering angular velocity sensor
open
>
2 long, 4 short=24, speed sensor open
>
> These codes don't
disappear until ingnition switch is off, even if you fix
> the
problem.
>
> 5. These codes disappear when you correct the
problem:
> 6 long, 1
short=61, Front Right
shock
> 6 long, 2
short=62, Front left
shock
> 6 long, 3
short=63, Rear right
shock
> 6 long, 4
short=64, Rear Left shock
>
> MFI trouble codes are read in a
similar manner, but different pins.
>
> FIRST GENERATION - connect +
to pin 1, - to pin 12.
> SECOND GENERATION - Connect pin 1 to GROUND and
watch the CHECK ENGINE light
> flashes for same sort of patterns - long
flashes (1.5 sec) are tens digit,
> short (0.5 sec) flashes are ones
digit. That gets you the same codes you
> would read on the Scan
Tool.
>
> You clear codes by disconnecting the battery for 10
seconds, reconnecting
> and idling the car for 15 min to make sure the
codes don't return.
>
> Chuck Willis
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 15:54:44
-0800
From: Rick Pierce <
piercera@pacbell.net>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: excessive battery corrosion
Peter,
When I did my JSpec
swap, I replaced the positive cable on my 92 VR-4 - it's
part
number:
MB629313
and I got it from
Conicelli Mitsu for $59.04
You might want to check with some of the
dealers on the Team3S vendor page
to find the best price
This should work
for you it's purely a plug and play to the harness.
Best, Rick
- -----
Original Message -----
From: "menalteed" <
menalteed@yahoo.com>
To: "Team3S"
<
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Monday, March 11, 2002 3:36 PM
Subject: Team3S: excessive battery
corrosion
> My 92 Stealth has had a major problen with
corrosion
> at the positive battery terminal. Now with all the IC
>
pipes out I have checked the cable and followed the
> main negitive cable
back to the block just under the
> front Turbo. It was very loose, and
looks like it has
> been that way from the factory. In any case I
will
> need to replace the positive cable to the starter from
> the
battery as over time cuting it down to get rid of
> bad corroded cable has
made it now to short for
> further use. I have been going through my books
on the
> 92 Stealth but can't find any reference to the
> positive
battery cable or if it can be replaced, or is
> it part of a harness
system as it looks like and I
> would need to buy the harness with the
negitive and
> positive cable
> and the other starter circuit wires
as a unit. I
> wonder if someone has a caps book that wouldn't
mind
> doing a quick check to I can place a order for a new
>
cable.
> I also want to thank all the people here for so much
>
qreat information, and informative discussion, and for
> sure without this
great place to ask questions I would
> never have made this far with my
turbo upgrade and all
> the other stuff to get my ten year old Stealth
back to
> a fresh as new condition. I'm trying to take care of
> all
the little things that need to be done to get this
> back on the road. I'm
replaceing rusted parts. oil
> lines and electrical where it needs it like
the
> positive battery cable.
>
> Peter 92 Stealth
TT
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 19:22:53
-0500
From: "Aamer" <
aamer@thepentagon.com>
Subject:
Team3S: strange sound when car starts (link to a sound file
enclosed)
Hello list members:
This week, my car started to make a
strange "screeching" noise when it
starts. The sound only occurs for a couple
of seconds when I first start the
car -- and it usually won't make the sound
if the car has been started
within the last couple of hours. I typically hear
it in the mornings when I
start the car after it has been not been started
for over 12 hours.
I've tried revving the car up to redline and I don't
hear the sound when I
rev it. In fact, as I've said, I only hear it when the
car starts up after
being at rest for a while. I also got someone to start my
car while I
listened under the hood. It appears that the noise is being
produced near
the back end of the engine -- by that I mean the side that the
flywheel is
on (I want to say it's coming from near cylinder #5, but I'm
fairly sure
that's not what's making the noise).
My gut instinct is
telling me that the problem might be coming from the
starter solenoid, but
I'm not sure. I recorded a sound file of the car
starting up ... you will be
able to hear the screeching if you listen to
this sound.
The sound is
posted on the internet at the following address:
http://home.nc.rr.com/aamer/car/car.wavAny
feedback would be appreciated. Thanks!
Aamer Abbas
'94 3000GT (DOHC --
Naturally Aspirated)
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 16:29:10
-0800
From: "Geddes, Brian J" <
brian.j.geddes@intel.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: strange sound when car starts (link to a sound file e
nclosed)
Sounds like a bad starter to me. I had one once, so I'm
pretty familiar
with the sound. :) It's caused by the starter not
disengaging quickly
enough from the ring gear/flywheel, making the two grind
together once the
engine is running on its own. If it is the starter,
put in a new one and
you should be okay. You might want to check for
damage to the ring gear.
- - Brian
- -----Original
Message-----
From: Aamer [mailto:aamer@thepentagon.com]
Sent: Monday,
March 11, 2002 4:23 PM
To: Team3S
Subject: Team3S: strange sound when car
starts (link to a sound file
enclosed)
Hello list members:
This
week, my car started to make a strange "screeching" noise when it
starts. The
sound only occurs for a couple of seconds when I first start the
car -- and
it usually won't make the sound if the car has been started
within the last
couple of hours. I typically hear it in the mornings when I
start the car
after it has been not been started for over 12 hours.
I've tried revving
the car up to redline and I don't hear the sound when I
rev it. In fact, as
I've said, I only hear it when the car starts up after
being at rest for a
while. I also got someone to start my car while I
listened under the hood. It
appears that the noise is being produced near
the back end of the engine --
by that I mean the side that the flywheel is
on (I want to say it's coming
from near cylinder #5, but I'm fairly sure
that's not what's making the
noise).
My gut instinct is telling me that the problem might be coming
from the
starter solenoid, but I'm not sure. I recorded a sound file of the
car
starting up ... you will be able to hear the screeching if you listen
to
this sound.
The sound is posted on the internet at the following
address:
http://home.nc.rr.com/aamer/car/car.wavAny
feedback would be appreciated. Thanks!
Aamer Abbas
'94 3000GT (DOHC --
Naturally Aspirated)
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 18:26:54
-0600
From: RJM <
rjmsmail@swbell.net>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: strange sound when car starts (link to a sound file enclosed)
Did
you do any work on the belts? Are you sure a belt doesn't need
adjusting
(sounds
like MAYBE a pulley/loose belt)?
Bob
Aamer
wrote:
> Hello list members:
>
> This week, my car started
to make a strange "screeching" noise when it
> starts. The sound only
occurs for a couple of seconds when I first start the
> car -- and it
usually won't make the sound if the car has been started
> within the last
couple of hours. I typically hear it in the mornings when I
> start the
car after it has been not been started for over 12 hours.
>
> I've
tried revving the car up to redline and I don't hear the sound when I
>
rev it. In fact, as I've said, I only hear it when the car starts up
after
> being at rest for a while. I also got someone to start my car
while I
> listened under the hood. It appears that the noise is being
produced near
> the back end of the engine -- by that I mean the side that
the flywheel is
> on (I want to say it's coming from near cylinder #5, but
I'm fairly sure
> that's not what's making the noise).
>
> My
gut instinct is telling me that the problem might be coming from the
>
starter solenoid, but I'm not sure. I recorded a sound file of the car
>
starting up ... you will be able to hear the screeching if you listen to
>
this sound.
>
> The sound is posted on the internet at the following
address:
>
http://home.nc.rr.com/aamer/car/car.wav>
>
Any feedback would be appreciated. Thanks!
>
> Aamer Abbas
>
'94 3000GT (DOHC -- Naturally Aspirated)
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 19:55:54
-0500
From:
romachka21@netscape.net
(Roman)
Subject: RE: RE: Team3S: Boost drop to 5psi
"Jannusch, Matt"
<
mjannusch@marketwatch.com>
wrote:
>> Basicly the block is bullet proof.
>> Before I
was braking the motor in and now the block has about
>> 600 miles on
it. I only boosted up to 3500 rpm. What it would
>> do is boost to
15psi and drop to about 10 psi and it will
>> hold it. After about 500
miles on a new block I noticed a
>> problem that when the car gets
warm or ran for about 5 min I
>> would not be able to have the turbos
boost past 6 psi. The
>> problem is still there and I NEED HELP....
When the car is
>> cool it will boost up to 15 psi and drop to 10 psi.
After it
>> gets warm it will not boost pass 6 psi. I have an
aftermarket
>> gauge. I get no oil leaks... and I am not sure why it
would
>> boost fine when cold and not when worm.
>
>If you
are running the stock boost control setup, then 6 psi is what happens
>if
you get excessive knock. Do your pistons rattle in the bores? How
much
>cylinder wall clearance are you running? If the block was
bored too loose
>for your pistons they can rattle and trigger the knock
sensor, causing the
>ECU to close the boost solenoid and result in the
meager 6 psi of boost.
>
>Which pistons did you get? If you
told them to build it for 800 HP, then
>they probably bored a little extra
clearance to allow for piston expansion
>under the heat of making that
much power. The tradeoff is that they rattle
>at lower
temps.
>
>Also make sure the signal line to the BOV is connected to
manifold pressure.
>If it isn't, the stock BOV will leak like a sieve
resulting in similar
>behavior.
>
>-Matt
>'95 3000GT
Spyder VR4
>
Thank you matt for the info.
AAM put in JE pistons
with Crow Rods and I am not sure what clearance they have. Would you be so kind
to let me know what questions should I be asking them to see if they did
something wrong.
It sounds exactly how you described it. That the pistons
are rataling. And are fulling the knock sensor. Nothing else seemed to make
sence.
It seems to lose boost when ever it wants to and go to full boost
once in a while. I have no patern.
I will appreciate for the questions
that I need to ask AAM.
By the way this is my daily driver now.
Thank
you everybody for contributing...
- --
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 19:55:21
-0600
From: RJM <
rjmsmail@swbell.net>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Suspension light blinking on 94 3000gt
Well,
I managed to
answer all but 4.) and 5.) below: I have a 2nd gen. car by the shape
of
the trapezoid (I didn't notice Chuck's details below) and determined a code
61.
But the right front shock looks OK except the black "cap" (under the
hood) is a bit
loose, but it has been loose for some time and wasn't all the
way off. Connection
looks good. Guess the shock is
failing???? I don't understand because the TOUR
ride seemed good, it is
the left driver's side shock that looks like it may be
leaking
slightly. I wonder if I will eventually ruin these new tires, the
only
difference in the ride, now always in SPORT mode, is probably that the
bottoming
out" sound I sometimes here is more frequent. ANY IDEAS MUCH
APPRECIATED. 103,000
miles on original struts (no
shocks?). Thanks again. Bob
RJM wrote:
> Thanks
Chuck for the advice, I apologize that I am just getting to check
the
> car out now. Basics please: I have the voltmeter(s),
manual and am looking
> under the front end now, didn't take rear tires
off/inspect rear shocks yet
> other
> than looking around car with
tires on (guess that's still "bogus" but right now
> I
> have the
front up and want to do the computer test, I have new tires and don't
>
want to ruin them)
> 1.) What is 1st and 2nd generation?
> 2.) What
is MFI (these two questions would be good to put in the acronyms/FAQ,
> I
didn't see them there)?
> 3.) Where in the manual is the ECU (computer)
showing pin locations and I am
> assuming I put the voltmeter on DC volts
and if I get the generations wrong and
> use the wrong pin it won't damage
the ECU (for a 1994 3000gt SL)?
> 4.) Related to 3.): is there a place in
the archives/website guys that shows how
> to
> do the computer
check with the voltmeter, I'm sure there is, sorry I can't find
>
it,
> I'll keep searching in the interim.
> 5.) If it is a speed
sensor causing the problem, am I left to find which one? I
>
am
> assuming "yes".
>
> Thanks MUCH. I've already put another
2,000 since we talked last.
> Bob
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 20:19:58
-0600
From: "Jannusch, Matt" <
mjannusch@marketwatch.com>
Subject:
RE: RE: Team3S: Boost drop to 5psi
> Thank you matt for the
info.
> AAM put in JE pistons with Crow Rods and I am not sure what
> clearance they have. Would you be so kind to let me know what
>
questions should I be asking them to see if they did something wrong.
I'd
just ask for the specs that they bored it to, and the specs of
the
pistons. Check with JE that that clearance is correct for the power
you
told AAM you wanted to make. I'd guess that it is probably done to
the spec
you asked for (800 HP) so the pistons are pretty loose.
>
I will appreciate for the questions that I need to ask AAM.
> By the way
this is my daily driver now.
I'd work with AAM, since they built it for
you they should know all the
specs and should be able to deliver on whatever
they promised you.
Sounds to me like you asked for an all-out race motor
and that's what you
got, for better or worse.
- -Matt
'95 3000GT
Spyder VR4
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 18:26:02
-0800 (PST)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
RE: RE: Team3S: Boost drop to 5psi
> I'd just ask for the specs that
they bored it to, and the specs of the
> pistons. Check with JE that
that clearance is correct for the power you
> told AAM you wanted to
make. I'd guess that it is probably done to the spec
> you asked for
(800 HP) so the pistons are pretty loose.
- ---
No doubt..mine certainly
are. You can tell a hint of piston slap even
warmed up at low/lug RPMs
leaving a light. But man..20-22psi feels damn
good when its
reliable.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 21:50:49
-0500
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Front Strut Bar
Bob -- Chris' bar accounts for the shelf for the
sunroof to sit on and
no modification is necessary. It also allows the
rubber top to the
shock tower to be put in place.
Erik -- Some people
like the stock look of things in their car so they
replace parts when they
can. When I didn't put the rubber tops back on
I could hear the shocks
"hissing" as they compensated with the stuff
inside after going over
bumps. I thought it was neat but some people
probably don't want to
hear those noises.
Thanks for the pic of the Cusco allowing the rubber
tops back on. I
only looked at the smaller thumbnails
initially.
Agreed that the blanket statement doesn't apply to everyone
but these
cars have been out since 1991 and so far I only see one aftermarket
shop
with rear strut tower bars? Maybe a few more but certainly not as
many
as springs or wheels or seats or turbos. I'm sure the Subaru,
Toyota,
BMW, Audi, etc. lines have more than Cusco to choose from for a rear
bar
and front bar.
Like I said, Chris' bar might be over-Engineered
but I think it will
always outperform the car. Some other bars (not
naming names) but let's
say someone makes their own out of a piece that goes
across, bolts to a
vertical piece, and then bolts to the part around the
tower. That will
be so flimsy that it is scary to think they trust it
on their car.
His bar is not the only one available and bigger is not
always better
but I think his bar deserves at least equal billing as the
big-name
aftermarket ones. I don't have the money to buy all three or
four
available and test them but anyone with a G-Tech can do this (we
know
those numbers might be bogus but the same G-Tech on the same car
with
the same driver is the best we can do). I still think his bars
will
outperform others. I'm open to being wrong but will hold out
judgment
until someone tests them head-to-head or we get more feedback on
these
bars. Chris' bars have been proven on cars and they DO work but
we just
need more people to realize their potential and believe in
them.
- --Flash!
- -----Original Message-----
From:
Gross, Erik [mailto:erik.gross@intel.com]
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002
18:07
Actually the Cusco bar allows you to replace the rubber tops for
the
rear
shock towers after the bar is in place, not that it really
matters all
that
much.
You can see this very clearly on my
webpage:
http://www.team3s.com/~egross/3000GT/RearStrutBar/ReinstallWithSunroof.jpg
C'mon,
now... while that is true in some specific cases, it's not
fair
to
make that a blanket statement. Bigger companies should be
able to sink
more
into R&D than smaller shops and big, established
companies also have
experience in their corner. I'm not in any way
saying that all smaller
shops (or individuals) lack this experience or
R&D budget, but looking
at
the big picture and
statistics...
I'd be the first to tell anyone that Chris (TEC) makes a
well-built
front
brace that is a complete solution (battery bracket, all
hardware, powder
coated). It made a rather large difference in my
VR-4's handling,
mainly in
the areas of steering precision/feel and front
tire traction in
cornering,
especially in transitions (like
slaloms).
Is his bar the only one we have available to us? Not any
more. Is it
the
best-performing bar? I'm not qualified to
answer that, but I'm happy
with
mine. Is it the cheapest bar? No,
it's pretty expensive compared to the
others. Would I buy it again, now
that there are others available?
Maybe,
but I'd have to do some more
research to figure out which option is the
best value for me.
-
--Erik
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 21:55:31
-0500
From: "Jerry B." <
scorpman@optonline.net>
Subject:
Team3S: Weekend Blues!!!
Ok,,
Here is my delima,, I
live in New Jersey.. Still new to the area and am
looking for places to hang
out with my machine. You know were all the people
go to show off thier cars,,
most of the time it is a parking lot or
something.
Now my question
is,, is ther any stealth/mitsu3000 owners out there in the
NJ area that hangs
out on Fridays or whatever and know of good areas to just
relax?? If you
might know and or do this sort of thing please drop a line
back and let me
know.
Thanks
Jerry B
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 22:08:14
-0500
From: "Darren Schilberg" <
dschilberg@pobox.com>
Subject: RE:
RE: Team3S: Boost drop to 5psi
Even if it is a full race motor (in a
daily driver no less ... DAMN) how
would you get the pistons warmed up in a
race motor when you only have
one warm-up lap behind a pace car (race
scenario)? I imagine they need
to get pretty warm to be
expanding. If you have the engine tuned to
produce zero knock then can
you unplug the knock sensor or have it
monitored another way?
-
--Flash!
- -----Original Message-----
From: Jannusch, Matt
Sent:
Monday, March 11, 2002 21:20
I'd just ask for the specs that they
bored it to, and the specs of the
pistons. Check with JE that that
clearance is correct for the power you
told AAM you wanted to make. I'd
guess that it is probably done to the
spec
you asked for (800 HP) so the
pistons are pretty loose.
Sounds to me like you asked for an all-out race
motor and that's what
you
got, for better or worse.
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 21:17:22
-0600
From: "Jannusch, Matt" <
mjannusch@marketwatch.com>
Subject:
RE: RE: Team3S: Boost drop to 5psi
> Even if it is a full race motor
(in a daily driver no less
> ... DAMN) how would you get the pistons
warmed up in a race
> motor when you only have one warm-up lap behind a
pace car
> (race scenario)? I imagine they need to get pretty warm
to
> be expanding. If you have the engine tuned to produce zero
> knock then can you unplug the knock sensor or have it
>
monitored another way?
You'd probably want to use a standalone ECU that
doesn't use a knock sensor
so you can program static timing values that you
feel are "safe", and would
dial it in on a dyno to verify.
The pistons
will warm up and expand pretty quick once you get on it.
More
work/effort/money than I'd want to do... But if you want 800 HP
then
that's what you'll be facing, I'm afraid. I'll settle for my
little 650 HP
prepped motor. ;-)
- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder
VR4
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 19:57:55
-0800
From: "fastmax" <
fastmax@cox.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
strange sound when car starts (link to a sound file enclosed)
It sounds
like the starter not disengaging from the flywheel --- It hangs up for
a
second or so. I cleared mine up with a little WD-40 when I had the starter
out for trans work.
Jim
Berry
=====================================================
- -----
Original Message -----
From: "Aamer" <
aamer@thepentagon.com>
To:
"Team3S" <
team3s@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Monday, March 11, 2002 4:22 PM
Subject: Team3S: strange sound when car starts
(link to a sound file enclosed)
> Hello list members:
>
>
This week, my car started to make a strange "screeching" noise when it
>
starts. The sound only occurs for a couple of seconds when I first start
the
> car -- and it usually won't make the sound if the car has been
started
> within the last couple of hours. I typically hear it in the
mornings when I
> start the car after it has been not been started for
over 12 hours.
>
> I've tried revving the car up to redline and I
don't hear the sound when I
> rev it. In fact, as I've said, I only hear
it when the car starts up after
> being at rest for a while. I also got
someone to start my car while I
> listened under the hood. It appears that
the noise is being produced near
> the back end of the engine -- by that I
mean the side that the flywheel is
> on (I want to say it's coming from
near cylinder #5, but I'm fairly sure
> that's not what's making the
noise).
>
> My gut instinct is telling me that the problem might be
coming from the
> starter solenoid, but I'm not sure. I recorded a sound
file of the car
> starting up ... you will be able to hear the screeching
if you listen to
> this sound.
>
> The sound is posted on the
internet at the following address:
>
http://home.nc.rr.com/aamer/car/car.wav>
> Any feedback would be appreciated. Thanks!
>
> Aamer
Abbas
> '94 3000GT (DOHC -- Naturally Aspirated)
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 20:01:05
-0800
From: "fastmax" <
fastmax@cox.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Possible product
I'd like to see a cheap alternative to the PCMCIA cards
but I don't know
how you're going to do the analog to digital conversion and
buffering
without a bunch of
hardware.
Jim
Berry
===================================================
- ----- Original
Message -----
From: <
pvg1@daimlerchrysler.com>
To:
<
team3s@team3s.com>
Sent:
Monday, March 11, 2002 1:12 PM
Subject: RE: Team3S: Possible
product
> >> Definitely interested! If you need software
written for data
> >> logging let me know.
>
> >I
figured that I'd just provide an RS-232 interface to dump the raw data
>
to
> >a laptop running some sort of terminal software and then you
could look at
> >it later in Excel.
>
> I'd pay $200 right
now for anything that would let me dump some key, high
> sampling rate
data into Excel! A laptop PCMCIA data acquisition card is all
> I need,
but those were $700+ last time I checked. Anyone knows of a better
>
deal?
>
> Alerts are very useful too. I do not expect myself to
catch a spike in some
> reading when I am testing my car in the street
watching out for cops, cats,
> pedestrians, and other cars ;-)
>
> A display with some sort of data logging, replay, or X-Y plots
(boost-O2,
> boost-RPM, RPM-O2, or RPM-knock sensor voltage!) would also
be very cool.
>
> Philip
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 22:09:51
-0600
From: "Jannusch, Matt" <
mjannusch@marketwatch.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Possible product
> I'd like to see a cheap alternative to
the PCMCIA cards but I
> don't know how you're going to do the analog to
digital
> conversion and buffering without a bunch of
hardware.
PIC microcontrollers. All the technology needed is
onboard or easily
interfaced to the chip. No problem. Cost of
about $4 per chip, and I
already own the programmer and compilers for other
projects I played around
with to learn the technology.
It is very
do-able.
- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 20:09:16
-0800
From: "fastmax" <
fastmax@cox.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
5mm spacers
I don't see how you could get positive camber on the outside
front with
6º of caster. If the fronts are turned into the corner the caster
should
increase the negative camber on the outside front ?!?!?! what am
I
missing here.
Jim
Berry
=================================================
- ----- Original
Message -----
From: <
pvg1@daimlerchrysler.com>
>
The biggest 3S suspension flaw is the MacPhearson design with a poor
>
geometry. The front outside wheel in turns leans towards the outside WAY
>
too much. It is so bad that it is impossible to improve it significantly
by
> changing camber or caster angles. I do not understand what a 7-mm
wheel
> spacer would change.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 23:41:52
EST
From:
Luckyslug@aol.comSubject: Team3S: My
Tour-Sport repair
I have heard all about how its probably the wires when
the ECS does not work.
In some cases, yes. But not in all. In my case, the
wires were perfect. It
started as most....first it would blink on and off
from time to time, but for
the most part it still worked ok. Then, after
about a 6 month period, it got
worst and worse until it just didnt work at
all. No lights, no control, no
nothing. (except horrible handling) The
capacitors(mostly) and resisters tend
to fail after many years in the ECU.
After reading that, I took the ECS
controller apart and found leaking
capacitors (the 3 small ones) and two
resistors that "looked" bad. After
changing the capacitors....it still didnt
work. But after also changing the
resistors that "looked" bad, everything
works perfect again. So if yours
does not even show any signs of life like
mine did, you might wanna take a
look at the controller. By the way, im lazy
and found it hard to soder the
new parts on to the top,(hardly any room to
work with) so i just put them on
the bottom side. Either way, make sure you
hook the + and - up right. I got
my parts from radio shack. The capacitors
match but they dont sell the small
ass resistors that mitsubishi used so just
use the smallest they have.
Worked for me.
Steven 91 SL
Nashville,TN
***
Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2002 00:31:22
-0500
From: "Philip V. Glazatov" <
gphilip@umich.edu>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: 5mm spacers
The caster is okay, but there is another angle (if it
has a name - I do not
know it) that measured the deviation of the wheel's
steering axis from the
vertical in the plane perpendicular to the car.
Kind of like caster but in
the vertical plane perpendicular to the car. If
this angle is too large,
and it is apparently very large on the 3S, the
outside wheel will have a
lot of positive camber. Go outside and turn your
front wheels.
Philip
At 11:09 PM 3/11/2002, fastmax
wrote:
>I don't see how you could get positive camber on the outside front
with
>6º of caster. If the fronts are turned into the corner the caster
should
>increase the negative camber on the outside front ?!?!?! what am
I
>missing
here.
>
> Jim
Berry
>=================================================
>-----
Original Message -----
>From: <
pvg1@daimlerchrysler.com>
>
> The biggest 3S suspension flaw is the MacPhearson design with a
poor
> > geometry. The front outside wheel in turns leans towards the
outside WAY
> > too much. It is so bad that it is impossible to improve
it significantly by
> > changing camber or caster angles. I do not
understand what a 7-mm wheel
> > spacer would change.
