team3s            Thursday, April 19 2001            Volume 01 : Number 469




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 18 Apr 2001 08:53:32 -0700
From: John Monnin <jkmonnin@altavista.com>
Subject: Team3S: FIPK alternative

Has anyone tried this  K&N cone filter adapter being sold on E-bay on a regular basis for $18-$20.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=580297094

It is obiously not CARB certified but It looks like a Stillen air intake w/o the air cleaner.


John Monnin
jkmonnin@altavista.com
1991 VR4

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 14:09:22 -0400
From: "Mihai Raicu" <aa2345@wayne.edu>
Subject: Team3S: RE: SUPER HIGH EGT Temperatures!!!

Barry,

Can you ellaborate more on this TIMING MONITOR.  My brother, John (with the
94 TT), knows computer programming, so if you have a game plan, maybe you
can send me the details and we'll see what he can do.

I just want a way to monitor as much of this car as possible (ie. knock,
temps, timing...).  What you are suggesting is progress towards that.  Maybe
my brother can work on the software aspect and someone else on the interface
to the engine.

- -MIKE-
95 Red VR4

John
94 Pearl Yellow TT
- ---------------------------------
>From: "Barry E. King" <beking@home.com>
>Subject: RE: Team3S: SUPER HIGH EGT Temperatures!!!
>
>We need a display that shows actual timing and knock at all times, in
>additon to the stuff we already have.  I have a design for the timing
>monitor if someone wants to try and build it, although I retain the rights.
><grin>  All you need is some signal conditioning for the crank trigger and
a
>fast enough PIC, a few hundred lines of code or so and a way to display the
>results.
>
>Barry

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 13:19:43 -0500
From: "Jannusch, Matt" <mjannusch@marketwatch.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: RE: SUPER HIGH EGT Temperatures!!!

>We need a display that shows actual timing and knock at all times, in
>additon to the stuff we already have.  I have a design for the timing
>monitor if someone wants to try and build it, although I retain the rights.
><grin>  All you need is some signal conditioning for the crank trigger and
>a fast enough PIC, a few hundred lines of code or so and a way to
>display the results.

I'm trying to build a general-purpose datalogger for our cars using PIC and
stuff...  If you want, send me the info and I'll see if I can incorporate it
into what I'm making.  Progress is real slow though, but now with summer
here and the car working I should be able to make quicker progress.

- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 14:10:22 -0500
From: "Walton C. Gibson" <kalla@tripoint.org>
Subject: Re: Team3S: wierd steering behavior

>     Does this always happen at the same speed/rpm?  Does it happen if you
> accelerate slowly through the gear and dont boost up?

I took the car out again last night and drove it on the highway for
about 20 minutes.
It seemed to occur in the higher gears only when I got on the boost
(under full power),
not when coasting at a set speed or at a set RPM. The effect was slight,
I noticed that
I tend to hold the steering wheel in such a way that it makes it more
noticeable. My car
is fairly modified (@ probably 400 bhp) so might this be a small amount
of torque steer?


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 14:23:21 -0500
From: Merritt <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject: Team3S: Is H&R dead?

I ordered a set of wheel spacers from www.nascarplace.com, which places the
order with H&R Spacers in Carson City. That was three weeks ago. I got an
immediate confirmation of the order.
I started calling, e-mailing and faxing this week, and can't seem to get
through to anybody at either place.

Anybody have any experience with these folks?
Are they still in business?

I hate it when a company doesn't post a phone number, or if they do post
one, it's answered by a machine.
Is everybody working a second business at night out of their basements?

Rich/94 Mitsubishi 3000GT VR4

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 14:47:58 -0500
From: "Mark Wendlandt" <stealth_tt@hotmail.com>
Subject: Team3S: Delphi Injectors

Can anyone tell me if the injectors for "American Iron"..i.e. 92 Camaro, are
the same dimensionally as our injectors.  Will they fit in our fuel rail and
manifolds?

Delphi makes some top feed, low impedance injectors and they are of the
"Bosch style".  These are available in sizes up to 85lb/hr(890cc/min) and
the availability is much greater(i.e. lower price).

http://www.delphiauto.com/pdf/eandepdfs/mpfi_tf.pdf

Mark Wendlandt
'91RT/TT

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 15:49:50 -0700
From: "Nickolaos M. Sgouros" <atenag@coqui.net>
Subject: Team3S: A/C Compressor on/off. Help needed!

I tried that and the problem continued. There is a  "Belt Control" circuit
that controls the clutch, reading various sensors. Did someone knows where
is located?

Nikos the Greek
92' RT TT
Puerto Rico

- -----Original Message-----
From: owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st
[mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On Behalf Of Wayne
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2001 12:50 PM
To: Team3s
Subject: Re: Team3S: A/C Compressor on/off. Help needed!

Hello,
The most common reason for this seems to be a faulty pressure switch. It is
located on the dryer. Unplug the connector and jumper the two terminals (on
the harness side) with a paper clip. If the compressor stops cutting
on/off, you need to verify you have a full charge. If you do, you need to
replace the switch, which cannot be ordered by itself. It comes as part of
the dryer.

Wayne


At 03:35 PM 4/16/01 , Nickolaos M. Sgouros wrote:


>Dear friends Hi!
>Here I need some help if someone has some experience at the A/C system of
>the RT TT 92'. My compressor after 2-3 minutes of operation starts going
>on/off. Even if I set the control to the lower point (should keep the
>compressor on for a while) the same symptom happens. On/off every 5-10
>seconds.  I check the gas; is ok. I know that our cars have 2-3 sensors
that
>they can cut the compressor. Please give some feedback.
>
>Nikos the Greek
>92' RT TT
>Puerto Rico

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 12:49:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: George Kuo <amkreadgto@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Is H&R dead? (Wheel Spacers)

I found a place that can custom quality wheel
spacers/adapters for a VERY VERY reasonable price...

http://www.wheelspacers.com/

Good Luck,
George
- --- Merritt <merritt@cedar-rapids.net> wrote:
> I ordered a set of wheel spacers from
> www.nascarplace.com, which places the
> order with H&R Spacers in Carson City. That was
> three weeks ago. I got an
> immediate confirmation of the order.
> I started calling, e-mailing and faxing this week,
> and can't seem to get
> through to anybody at either place.
>
> Anybody have any experience with these folks?
> Are they still in business?
>
> I hate it when a company doesn't post a phone
> number, or if they do post
> one, it's answered by a machine.
> Is everybody working a second business at night out
> of their basements?
>
> Rich/94 Mitsubishi 3000GT VR4
***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 14:52:43 -0500
From: "Mark Wendlandt" <stealth_tt@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: A/C Compressor on/off. Help needed!

It is located under the glove box.  There is a panel above the pass.
feet..it is attached to that(you need to remove the panel to get to it.)

Mark Wendlandt
'91RT/TT


>I tried that and the problem continued. There is a  "Belt Control" circuit
>that controls the clutch, reading various sensors. Did someone knows where
>is located?
>
>Nikos the Greek
>92' RT TT
>Puerto Rico

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 22:09:39 +0200
From: "Roger Gerl \(RTEC\)" <roger.gerl@bluewin.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Delphi Injectors

I don't have time to look into the manual but at least the fuel pressure is
not great. 4 bars is about 58 psi what represents 15 psi of boost.... not
enough for high power application !

Roger
93'3000GT TT
www.rtec.ch


> Delphi makes some top feed, low impedance injectors and they are of the
> "Bosch style".  These are available in sizes up to 85lb/hr(890cc/min) and
> the availability is much greater(i.e. lower price).



***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 22:13:32 +0200
From: "Roger Gerl \(RTEC\)" <roger.gerl@bluewin.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: RE: SUPER HIGH EGT Temperatures!!!

> I'm trying to build a general-purpose datalogger for our cars using PIC
and
> stuff...  If you want, send me the info and I'll see if I can incorporate
it
> into what I'm making.  Progress is real slow though, but now with summer
> here and the car working I should be able to make quicker progress.

Well, how many summers do you want to work on ? Many already tried but
reading the knock sensor is not easy at all ! And reading the advance timing
against the base ? The ECU knows what to try but that's it :(( Good luck !

Roger
93'3000GT TT
www.rtec.ch

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 15:38:06 -0500
From: "Mark Wendlandt" <stealth_tt@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Delphi Injectors

Interesting...that is something that I didn't consider.  Not too many turbo
Camaros out there that would need that kind of fuel pressure.

From what I understand www.dsm-performance.com is selling them.  They are
Holley injectors and they "modify" them to work in DSM and our cars.  What
this Mod is, I dont know.  They did say however that Bob Fontana was using
them(85lb/hr) in his 17G setup(Bob are you out there.)

These Holley injectors(85lb/hr) can be purchased from Summit for <
$80/injector.  If indeed they are limited to 4bar how are they getting by
this limitation?  Bob?

Mark


>From: "Roger Gerl \(RTEC\)" <roger.gerl@bluewin.ch>
>To: <Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
>Subject: Re: Team3S: Delphi Injectors
>Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 22:09:39 +0200
>
>I don't have time to look into the manual but at least the fuel pressure is
>not great. 4 bars is about 58 psi what represents 15 psi of boost.... not
>enough for high power application !
>
>Roger
>93'3000GT TT
>www.rtec.ch
>
>
> > Delphi makes some top feed, low impedance injectors and they are of the
> > "Bosch style".  These are available in sizes up to 85lb/hr(890cc/min)
>and
> > the availability is much greater(i.e. lower price).
>

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 17:00:06 -0700
From: Richard <radanc@home.com>
Subject: Team3S: Lowering Springs

I am going to finally lower my car, but was wondering how some of you
guys who have done this deal with speed bumps, etc. I have only about 4
inches of clearance from the ground to the ATR downpipe - lowest part of
car. Lowering another 1.3 inches or so seems like navigating over these
may be difficult at best. Any comments?

Rich
92 Stealth TT

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 20:04:56 -0400
From: "Michael Bulaon" <profilevr4@3000gtvr4.net>
Subject: Team3S: Has anyone changed their steering wheel?

Just wondering if anyone here has ever changed their steering wheel. I was
looking into either a Sparco steering wheel or a Momo steering wheel for my
VR-4 and noticed that none of the two companies makes a hub or adapter to
fit an aftermarket steering wheel on our car.

If anyone knows where to get one, or has a workaround let me know.


Thanks,
Michael Bulaon


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 21:04:01 -0400
From: "Dan Mecier" <dan@3sxperts.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Lowering Springs

Rich,

I have the RSR drop springs on my 94 VR-4. They lowered the car about 1.5"
all the way around. I also have the ATR downpipe (and complete ATR exhaust)
and haven't had any issues with speed bumps, curbs, etc. I think my front
active-aero air dam scrapes before anything else.

Dan Mecier
3SX Automotive Technologies
www.3Sxperts.com

PS - We are having a group buy on Intrax and Eibach springs through the end
of this week. Price for your car - Eibach $250, Intrax $215. Prices do not
include shipping.

- -----Original Message-----
From: owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st
[mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On Behalf Of Richard
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 8:00 PM
Cc: Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
Subject: Team3S: Lowering Springs


I am going to finally lower my car, but was wondering how some of you
guys who have done this deal with speed bumps, etc. I have only about 4
inches of clearance from the ground to the ATR downpipe - lowest part of
car. Lowering another 1.3 inches or so seems like navigating over these
may be difficult at best. Any comments?

Rich
92 Stealth TT

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 20:58:45 -0400
From: GREG RUSH <rush@siscom.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S: All the hubbub RE: BOV?

I used a BOV from a saab 9000. Works great and is a 90 degree design. Its smaller
inlet and outlet but is easy to adapt. I was told it will hold 18psi easily. Its
also prety loud. Cost me $40 from Saab dealer.

Richard wrote:

> I agree. I saw leakage when only upgrade was high flow intake. I think
> it is worth the $200-350 for a good BOV that will serve you well as you
> upgrade over time.
>
> Rich
> 92 Stealth TT
>
> Curt Gendron wrote:
> >
> > On a completely stock 3/S, the stock BOV is fine, but even cranking the
> > boost up to 15psi, may cause the stock BOV to leak.  You'll denfinatly want
> > to upgrade the BOV if going any higher than 15psi.  My stock BOV started
> > leaking around 14-15psi.
> >
> > I'm working on manufacturing the adapter for the 1g DSM BOV, so you can use
> > it on a 3/S.  Price will be around $30 plus shipping.  I'll know for sure in
> > about a week.
> >
> > later,
> > Curt
> > http://www.mn3s.org
> >
> > >From: Merlin916@aol.com
> > >To: team3s@stealth-3000gt.st
> > >Subject: RE: Team3S: All the hubbub RE: BOV?
> > >Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 16:15:11 EDT
> > >
> > >n a message dated 4/16/01 4:08:29 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> > >mjannusch@marketwatch.com writes:
> > >
> > ><< No, I am hitting my boost limit quicker because of the BOV.  It isn't
> > >  leaking pressurized air back into the intake, making the boost climb more
> > >  rapidly.
> > >   >>
> > >
> > >
> > >     Youre stock BOV will not leak air with the stock boost controller
> > >unless
> > >its defective.  When I had a 94 Toyota MR2 Turbo, I tested it on a dyno
> > >stock
> > >and with just a BOV and the power curves were exactly the same.  Changing
> > >the
> > >BOV with no other modifications will do nothing for you power/boost
> > >level/rate of boost increase/anything else except maybe sound cool.
> > >
> > >Joe
> > >93 RT/TT
> > >

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 13:48:12 +1200
From: Kevin Clark <Kevin.Clark@hnz.co.nz>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Has anyone changed their steering wheel?

> Just wondering if anyone here has ever changed their
> steering wheel. I was looking into either a Sparco
> steering wheel or a Momo steering wheel for my VR-4
> and noticed that none of the two companies makes a hub
> or adapter to fit an aftermarket steering wheel on our
> car.

I have a Momo on the car.  You will loose the airbag,
stereo, and cruise controls when you replace the factory
wheel.  I am not sure in your country but you may also
need to completely remove the SRS system in order to
keep the car "safe" (you don't want the car attempting
to deploy a non-existant airbag).

> If anyone knows where to get one, or has a workaround
> let me know.

Mine was in the car when I purchased it, I have heard
that the Momo Mitsubishi Eclipse adapter fits our cars.

Cheers,
Kevin Clark
'91 GTO-VR4

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 01:47:50
From: "Kevin Umbreit" <unclesam099@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Lowering Springs

Rich,
I have the eibach lowering springs that lower the car 1.3" front/1.5" rear. 
My borla TT exhaust hangs down very low at the rear suspension.  i scrape
more on my front end than the rear.  however, i do catch the exhaust pipe
every once in a while.  i think that eibach makes springs with a 1.2" drop
all around.  you might want to check up on that.  go to carparts.com and see
what they have.  also, you could use coupons from curt gendron at
http://www.mn3s.org/car-parts.html

>>big thanks to curt for getting us these coupons!!

- --Kevin Umbreit
'91 R/T


>
>I am going to finally lower my car, but was wondering how some of you
>guys who have done this deal with speed bumps, etc. I have only about 4
>inches of clearance from the ground to the ATR downpipe - lowest part of
>car. Lowering another 1.3 inches or so seems like navigating over these
>may be difficult at best. Any comments?
>
>Rich
>92 Stealth TT

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 19:12:13 -0700
From: "Jim Berry" <fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Has anyone changed their steering wheel?

I installed a Momo wheel ---- I have some pictures of the install, and the
modifications I made to the Momo hub [ they do offer one ]. I didn't like
the way it fit and I extended the length to better fit my 6'3" height.

        Jim berry
==========================================

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Bulaon <profilevr4@3000gtvr4.net>
To: <team3s@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 5:04 PM
Subject: Team3S: Has anyone changed their steering wheel?


> Just wondering if anyone here has ever changed their steering wheel. I was
> looking into either a Sparco steering wheel or a Momo steering wheel for my
> VR-4 and noticed that none of the two companies makes a hub or adapter to
> fit an aftermarket steering wheel on our car.
>
> If anyone knows where to get one, or has a workaround let me know.
>
> Thanks,
> Michael Bulaon

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 19:18:43 -0700
From: "Jim Berry" <fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Has anyone changed their steering wheel?

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Kevin Clark <Kevin.Clark@hnz.co.nz>
To: <team3s@stealth-3000gt.st>
>
> I have a Momo on the car.  You will loose the airbag,
> stereo, and cruise controls when you replace the factory
> wheel.  I am not sure in your country but you may also
> need to completely remove the SRS system in order to
> keep the car "safe" (you don't want the car attempting
> to deploy a non-existant airbag).


I have the factory cruise control adapted and could do the radio
if I get ambitious. You will loose the  SRS but no need to worry
about it going off inadvertently.

        Jim Berry


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 20:06:21 -0700
From: Sharyn Ivey <awoll1@pacbell.net>
Subject: Team3S: Rotors are really on there

I got the wheel off. No Problem.
I got the brake off. No problem.
I read the archive, and I think I read Jeff Lucius' page on changing rotors.
It says you really have to pound in order get the rotors off. Well, I have
pounded -- and pounded. For an hour. And the rotor is getting the last
laught.
I notice that both rotors have two little holes about 1/4 inch diam. One of
these is threaded. Does anyone know the size of the bolt that will go into
this little hole. Maybe putting a bolt in the hole and using it to give
leverage against the hub will force it to break loose. Any suggestions would
be much appreciated.

Andy Woll


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 22:23:02 -0500
From: "Brad Bedell" <bbedell@austin.rr.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Rotors are really on there

Put a bolt in the hole and thread it off.  The hole is on there for that
reason.

*IF* these are rear rotors, make sure the rear parking brake is unset.


Brad
Check out my home page: http://home.austin.rr.com/overboost/
E-Mail: bbedell@austin.rr.com ICQ#  3612682


- -----Original Message-----
From: owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st
[mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On Behalf Of Sharyn Ivey
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 10:06 PM
To: Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
Subject: Team3S: Rotors are really on there

I got the wheel off. No Problem.
I got the brake off. No problem.
I read the archive, and I think I read Jeff Lucius' page on changing rotors.
It says you really have to pound in order get the rotors off. Well, I have
pounded -- and pounded. For an hour. And the rotor is getting the last
laught.
I notice that both rotors have two little holes about 1/4 inch diam. One of
these is threaded. Does anyone know the size of the bolt that will go into
this little hole. Maybe putting a bolt in the hole and using it to give
leverage against the hub will force it to break loose. Any suggestions would
be much appreciated.

Andy Woll

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 20:45:23 -0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <gemohler@speedracer.speedtoys.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Rotors are really on there

Yes, thats exactly what those threaded holes are for.

Im suprised they are NOT in the FAQ on rotor removal.

Its a pretty standard threadsize for a Jap car...although I dont know it
offhand.

On Wed, 18 Apr 2001, Sharyn Ivey wrote:

> I got the wheel off. No Problem.
> I got the brake off. No problem.
> I read the archive, and I think I read Jeff Lucius' page on changing rotors.
> It says you really have to pound in order get the rotors off. Well, I have
> pounded -- and pounded. For an hour. And the rotor is getting the last
> laught.
> I notice that both rotors have two little holes about 1/4 inch diam. One of
> these is threaded. Does anyone know the size of the bolt that will go into
> this little hole. Maybe putting a bolt in the hole and using it to give
> leverage against the hub will force it to break loose. Any suggestions would
> be much appreciated.
>
> Andy Woll
- ---
Geoff Mohler <gemohler@speedtoys.com
California, USA


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 22:35:18 -0500
From: Merritt <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject: Team3S: Bad Vendor

After waiting three weeks, I finally got www.nascarplace to respond to my
query, "Where's my order?"

Here's what they said:

"Autobahn North America has stop carrying the H&R product line.  Please
contact H&R and they will direct you to a dealer."

So, Autobahn North America and www.nascarplace are the same entity. They
have no phone number, mailing address or fax number, and you must deal with
them via e-mail. Inquiries are handled by an automated response service.
They did not respond until I added this to my message: "The 500+ people on
opentracking.com and the 650 people on the 3000GT mailing list are all
anxiously awaiting the answer to this question."

In other words, if I hadn't been so insistent, mean and pushy, I would be
sitting here waiting for my wheel spacers until Jeff Lacina's cows came home!

OK folks, you see how they respond to customer queries. I will never deal
with Autobahn North America and www.nascarplace again. I suggest that all
of you do likewise. We don't need vendors like this in our world.

So, are there any other vendors who want to sell me a set of H&R wheel
spacers (or something similar) for a 3000GT VR4 AWD?? I can't deal with H&R
directly because they don't sell to the public. If you are a vendor, please
contact me off-list at merritt@cedar-rapids.net

Rich/94 3000GT VR4 twin turbo AWD

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 20:37:24 -0700
From: Sharyn Ivey <awoll1@pacbell.net>
Subject: Team3S: Rotors are not coming off

Thanks for the feedback guys. The calipers are just hanging (actually wired
up so as to save the hoses), but the damn things are not breaking loose.

Is there a bolt on the car I can remove and use in the little hole on the
rotor? I do not have many metric small bolts lying around.

Andy Woll


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 20:57:50 -0700
From: "Ken Middaugh" <kmiddaugh@ixpres.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Rotors are really on there

It is a standard metric bolt.  I don't recall the size.  However last time I
removed my rotors, I used one of the bolts on the front caliper, I think it
was one of the bolts that hold the two halves together.  It was the correct
size.  Just thread it into the rotor and it will loosen it.  Just don't
forget to torque it correctly when you replace it back in the caliper.

Good luck,
Ken

> I got the wheel off. No Problem.
> I got the brake off. No problem.
> I read the archive, and I think I read Jeff Lucius' page on changing
rotors.
> It says you really have to pound in order get the rotors off. Well, I have
> pounded -- and pounded. For an hour. And the rotor is getting the last
> laught.
> I notice that both rotors have two little holes about 1/4 inch diam. One
of
> these is threaded. Does anyone know the size of the bolt that will go into
> this little hole. Maybe putting a bolt in the hole and using it to give
> leverage against the hub will force it to break loose. Any suggestions
would
> be much appreciated.



***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 22:03:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <gemohler@speedracer.speedtoys.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Rotors are really on there

Dont break the caliper apart..the fluid channels are internal..and best
left undisturbed.

On Wed, 18 Apr 2001, Ken Middaugh wrote:

> It is a standard metric bolt.  I don't recall the size.  However last time I
> removed my rotors, I used one of the bolts on the front caliper, I think it
> was one of the bolts that hold the two halves together.  It was the correct
> size.  Just thread it into the rotor and it will loosen it.  Just don't
> forget to torque it correctly when you replace it back in the caliper.
>
> Good luck,
> Ken
>
> > I got the wheel off. No Problem.
> > I got the brake off. No problem.
> > I read the archive, and I think I read Jeff Lucius' page on changing
> rotors.
> > It says you really have to pound in order get the rotors off. Well, I have
> > pounded -- and pounded. For an hour. And the rotor is getting the last
> > laught.
> > I notice that both rotors have two little holes about 1/4 inch diam. One
> of
> > these is threaded. Does anyone know the size of the bolt that will go into
> > this little hole. Maybe putting a bolt in the hole and using it to give
> > leverage against the hub will force it to break loose. Any suggestions
> would
> > be much appreciated.
>
- ---
Geoff Mohler <gemohler@speedtoys.com
California, USA


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 00:15:09 -0500
From: "cody" <overclck@starband.net>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Rotors are really on there

I had a hard time trying to use the bolt method once FINALLY finding the right size bolt to fit in there.  I honestly had better luck POUNDING THE CRAP out of my rotors.  All four were pretty damn hard.  The rears were a bit easier than the fronts though.  I SOAKED mine in penetrating oil like all day long before even attempting ~either~ method of removing them.  Finally, when the little bolt attempt failed, I just found a REAL BIG rubber mallet, and beat on the stupid rotor, two nice hard hits, then rotate 90 degrees, then repeat.  they finally came off, after about two whole revolutions...  I used ALOT of force.

- -Cody

#> It is a standard metric bolt.  I don't recall the size.  However
#last time I
#> removed my rotors, I used one of the bolts on the front caliper,
#I think it
#> was one of the bolts that hold the two halves together.  It was
#the correct
#> size.  Just thread it into the rotor and it will loosen it.  Just don't
#> forget to torque it correctly when you replace it back in the caliper.
#>
#> Good luck,
#> Ken
#>
#> > I got the wheel off. No Problem.
#> > I got the brake off. No problem.
#> > I read the archive, and I think I read Jeff Lucius' page on changing
#> rotors.
#> > It says you really have to pound in order get the rotors off.
#Well, I have
#> > pounded -- and pounded. For an hour. And the rotor is getting the last
#> > laught.
#> > I notice that both rotors have two little holes about 1/4 inch
#diam. One
#> of
#> > these is threaded. Does anyone know the size of the bolt that
#will go into
#> > this little hole. Maybe putting a bolt in the hole and using it to give
#> > leverage against the hub will force it to break loose. Any suggestions
#> would
#> > be much appreciated.


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 03:51:46 -0500
From: Merritt <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject: Team3S: Bad Vendor II

I recently informed you of my problems dealing with Autobahn North America
/ www.nascarplace. Essentially, after an ordeal of trying to get them to
answer queries, I finally found that they don't carry H&R wheel spacers any
more. I have no idea when they were planning to tell me that. If I hadn't
gotten rude and pushy, I'd still be waiting for parts that would never come.

Here is yet another reason to not do business with these people: They are
vastly overpriced.

I went to www.carparts.com and purchased the same H&R spacers for $84
(after discounts). Autobahn wanted $132.15 for the exact same parts (both
prices include shipping).

If this message makes all 1100 of you on two lists think twice about
dealing with these guys, they will be getting what they deserve from
treating customers badly.

I hope this isn't too far off topic.

Rich/3000GT VR4 twin turbo AWD

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 07:54:12 -0400
From: "Schilberg, Darren" <DSchilberg@freemarkets.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Rotors are really on there

Sorry to hear all the troubles.  Mine came off like a breeze.  Maybe put the
wheel back on and have the local Brakes place use air wrenches to loosen the
rotor for you.  Usually they will do this for free or just a few bucks of
time.

Oh, and if you have changed rotors (Supra, Porsche, Porterfield, non-stock,
etc.) you might need to find a different-sized bolt to thread in there.

However, once it IS off then invest in some much-needed anti-seize compound
(that gray goopy paste stuff that stains everything it touches) and that
will prevent the rotor from sticking again.  Then go ahead and coat the
threads of the studs where the rotor goes over so your lug nuts will never
get stuck.  A little goes a long way.  I applied a small dab over 6 months
ago and I have removed the wheels, calipers, and rotors probably over 30
times already with no problem (thanks, JCZoom).

- --Flash!
dschilberg@pobox.com

3Si #577
1995 Black VR-4 w/ Big Reds, Autopower rollbar, Sparco Evo race seat,
Simpson 5-point harnesses, and a custom spark plug plate
http://www.team3s.com/FAQrollbar.htm

- -----Original Message-----
From: cody [mailto:overclck@starband.net]
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 1:15 AM
To: Team3S
Subject: RE: Team3S: Rotors are really on there

I had a hard time trying to use the bolt method once FINALLY finding the
right size bolt to fit in there.  I honestly had better luck POUNDING THE
CRAP out of my rotors.  All four were pretty damn hard.  The rears were a
bit easier than the fronts though.  I SOAKED mine in penetrating oil like
all day long before even attempting ~either~ method of removing them.
Finally, when the little bolt attempt failed, I just found a REAL BIG rubber
mallet, and beat on the stupid rotor, two nice hard hits, then rotate 90
degrees, then repeat.  they finally came off, after about two whole
revolutions...  I used ALOT of force.

- -Cody


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 07:12:38 -0500
From: "xwing" <xwing@wi.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Rotors are really on there

I used the bolt-hole to try to remove stock rotors from my 93 once, and
instead of loosening the rotor off, it started to crack and buckle away just
a small portion of the rotor around that bolt hole only.  Seeing it cracking
and STILL not coming off, car went to dealer where it became their problem
:)
Jack T.

From: "Geoff Mohler"
Subject: Re: Team3S: Rotors are really on there
> Yes, thats exactly what those threaded holes are for.
> Im suprised they are NOT in the FAQ on rotor removal.
> Its a pretty standard threadsize for a Jap car...although I dont know it
offhand.

> On Wed, 18 Apr 2001, Sharyn Ivey wrote: changing rotors.
> > you really have to pound in order get the rotors off. Well, I have
pounded For an hour.
> > both rotors have two holes 1/4 inch diam.
> > Maybe putting a bolt in the hole and using it to give
> > leverage against the hub will force it to break loose.
> > Andy Woll


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 08:08:43 -0500
From: "Willis, Charles E." <cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Rotors are really on there

That is exactly what those little holes are for.  I don't recall whether
they are coarse or fine thread, but they are real cheap.  I think they were
10mmx24 bolts.  You should be able to thread them in by hand.  If not, you
have the wrong thread.  Then you tighten each a little until the rotor lets
loose from the hub.  Clean as much corrosion as you can from the hub and
rotor before reinstalling and apply anti-seize compound to save trouble next
time.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sharyn Ivey [SMTP:awoll1@pacbell.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 10:06 PM
> To: Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
> Subject: Team3S: Rotors are really on there
>
> I got the wheel off. No Problem.
> I got the brake off. No problem.
> I read the archive, and I think I read Jeff Lucius' page on changing
> rotors.
> It says you really have to pound in order get the rotors off. Well, I have
> pounded -- and pounded. For an hour. And the rotor is getting the last
> laught.
> I notice that both rotors have two little holes about 1/4 inch diam. One
> of
> these is threaded. Does anyone know the size of the bolt that will go into
> this little hole. Maybe putting a bolt in the hole and using it to give
> leverage against the hub will force it to break loose. Any suggestions
> would
> be much appreciated.
>
> Andy Woll

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 08:15:50 -0500
From: "Willis, Charles E." <cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Rotors are really on there

sometimes that happens - the bolt cracks away a little of the surrounding
rotor surface.  I've had this happen, but the rotor comes off.  That part of
the rotor is not important for function.  Mine still work.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: xwing [SMTP:xwing@wi.rr.com]
> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 7:13 AM
> To: team3s@stealth-3000gt.st
> Subject: Re: Team3S: Rotors are really on there
>
> I used the bolt-hole to try to remove stock rotors from my 93 once, and
> instead of loosening the rotor off, it started to crack and buckle away
> just
> a small portion of the rotor around that bolt hole only.  Seeing it
> cracking
> and STILL not coming off, car went to dealer where it became their problem
> :)
> Jack T.
>
> From: "Geoff Mohler"
> Subject: Re: Team3S: Rotors are really on there
> > Yes, thats exactly what those threaded holes are for.
> > Im suprised they are NOT in the FAQ on rotor removal.
> > Its a pretty standard threadsize for a Jap car...although I dont know it
> offhand.
>
> > On Wed, 18 Apr 2001, Sharyn Ivey wrote: changing rotors.
> > > you really have to pound in order get the rotors off. Well, I have
> pounded For an hour.
> > > both rotors have two holes 1/4 inch diam.
> > > Maybe putting a bolt in the hole and using it to give
> > > leverage against the hub will force it to break loose.
> > > Andy Woll

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 08:31:45 -0500
From: "Willis, Charles E." <cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
Subject: Team3S: learn from my mistake

I think somebody posted a similar warning a couple of months back.  When was
the last time you checked the air pressure in your temporary spare tire?

I hit a pothole at about 10 mph yesterday in my '93 VR4 and deflated a tire.
When I went to change to the temporary spare, I checked the pressure:  10
psi instead of 60 psi!  Then as I was filling it up, I started wondering
what the pressure was in the temporary spare in my '94 VR4:  10psi!  I was
in town close to a filling station and had a spare car and cell phone.  I
wonder how high my blood pressure would have gone if this had happened out
in the boondocks somewhere?

As many times as a adjust air pressure in my tires, it could have taken
about 30 seconds to check either of these spares, but somehow, it never
occurred to me as being important.

Ignore this message at your own risk.

Chuck

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 09:39:02 EDT
From: Phillystreetracn@aol.com
Subject: Re: Team3S: Rotors are really on there

i have a set of 2nd gen rotor hanging on the wall (for my talon... ha) and
the thread seems to be a 10x1.50 metric.. good luck.
                                                                             
            ~pete~
                                                                          
www.randskustumz.com

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 06:49:49 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Lucius <stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Delphi Injectors

My hat's off to anyone who can actual **USE** 720 cc/min injectors at
their limit let alone 890s (without nitrous of course).

Running 720 cc/min injectors at a healthy 90% IDC is injecting about
3888 cc/min (or about 370 lb/hr) of fuel. A person would need about
4400-4600 lb/hr of air to go with that, or 1050-1100+ CFM of air. A
density ratio of 3:1 at 7000 RPM and 95% VE would be required in our
2.972-L engine. That means **at least** 29 psi of boost, which also
happens to be about the pressurizing limit for turbos that are sized
for our cars.

Now Mark, you are just joking about needing 890 cc/min injectors,
right?

Jeff Lucius, www.stealth316.com

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Wendlandt" <stealth_tt@hotmail.com>
To: <Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 1:47 PM
Subject: Team3S: Delphi Injectors

Can anyone tell me if the injectors for "American Iron"..i.e. 92
Camaro, are the same dimensionally as our injectors.  Will they fit
in our fuel rail and manifolds?

Delphi makes some top feed, low impedance injectors and they are of
the "Bosch style".  These are available in sizes up to
85lb/hr(890cc/min) and the availability is much greater(i.e. lower
price).

http://www.delphiauto.com/pdf/eandepdfs/mpfi_tf.pdf

Mark Wendlandt
'91RT/TT

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 10:12:27 -0400
From: "Schilberg, Darren" <DSchilberg@freemarkets.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: learn from my mistake

I also learned a similar lesson and that is to ALWAYS carry at least two
cans of Fix-a-Flat or similar product.  This will fill every hole I've ever
had in a tire long enough to get to a service station.  They claim 50 miles
but it can be taken much MUCH farther in an emergency.

This will not repair a hole in the sidewall of a tire so be careful as
sometimes only those large plugs will do the trick.  Fortunately, the stock
245/40/18 tires have a fairly small sidewall so most punctures will occur in
the tread.

I do keep my spare tire aired up and have had a full-size spare for several
months since I do not use the trunk.  This is great peace of mind since I
would not be limited to the 45 mph recommended speed that the spare is.

Oh yeah ... some Fix-a-flat cans say that they are NOT recommended for
Z-rated or performance tire applications.  Read the label.

- --Flash!
dschilberg@pobox.com

3Si #577
1995 Black VR-4 w/ Big Reds, Autopower rollbar, Sparco Evo race seat,
Simpson 5-point harnesses, and a custom spark plug plate
http://www.team3s.com/FAQrollbar.htm

- -----Original Message-----
From: Willis, Charles E. [mailto:cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org]
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2001 9:32 AM
To: Team3S
Subject: Team3S: learn from my mistake

I think somebody posted a similar warning a couple of months back.  When was
the last time you checked the air pressure in your temporary spare tire?

I hit a pothole at about 10 mph yesterday in my '93 VR4 and deflated a tire.
When I went to change to the temporary spare, I checked the pressure:  10
psi instead of 60 psi!  Then as I was filling it up, I started wondering
what the pressure was in the temporary spare in my '94 VR4:  10psi!  I was
in town close to a filling station and had a spare car and cell phone.  I
wonder how high my blood pressure would have gone if this had happened out
in the boondocks somewhere?

As many times as a adjust air pressure in my tires, it could have taken
about 30 seconds to check either of these spares, but somehow, it never
occurred to me as being important.

Ignore this message at your own risk.

Chuck


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 07:32:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Lucius <stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Wheel Offsets and Effect on geometry?

I measured (crudely) the offset on my stock 17" 1992 Stealth TT
wheel. Placing the "outside" rim on the garage floor I put a straight
edge across the "inside" rim. The distance to the mounting surface
was about 6-9/16". The width of the wheel was about 9-9/16". The
mounting surface is about 45.24 mm from the center of the wheel
[(9.5625/2)-6.5625 inches]. Given that I was using a simple
retractable measuring tape and rounded to the closest 1/16", I would
say that the factory service manual quoted 46-mm offset is correct.

Do the non-US models really have 42-mm offset wheels?

Jeff Lucius, www.stealth316.com

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Lucius" <stealthman92@yahoo.com>
To: <team3s@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2001 7:21 AM
Subject: RE: Team3S: Wheel Offsets and Effect on geometry?

>> The "official" Mitsubishi listing states that Z15A & Z16A models
all have a 42mm offset, as do the peeps at

Sorry for the confusion. I should have stated all ***US*** models
have a 46 mm offset.

Look at the US service manuals. I have copies of the actual pages at
the link below.

http://www.3si.org/member-home/jlucius2/j2-2-wheelspecs.htm

ALL US models are listed as having 46-mm offsets according to the
service manuals. I have no idea what wheels were installed on
Japanese and European models. In fact I have not measured the offset.
I am having a tire taken off my stock 17" 1992 wheel soon and I will
measure the offset to see if the manuals are reporting this
correctly.

Jeff Lucius, www.stealth316.com

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "George Shaw" <george.shaw@btinternet.com>
To: "Team3S Technical Forum" <team3s@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2001 5:02 AM
Subject: RE: Team3S: Wheel Offsets and Effect on geometry?


Jeff wrote>

>ALL factory 3S wheels have a 46 mm offset. All years, all sizes
(16",
>17", 18", even the spare), all models.

The "official" Mitsubishi listing states that Z15A & Z16A models all
have a 42mm offset, as do the peeps at
http://www.takakaira.com/rimsandtyres/rimsspecs/mitsubishirims.html

As I want to up-size the wheels without affecting the existing
steering characteristics it is important to have the original
dimensions to calculate from. So is it 42 or 46 as Std. On 17x8.5 and
18x8.5 rims? (I don't have std rims to check). Is it possible that
there is a difference between UK/Japan/USA?

Your totally confused Irish member.

- --
George Shaw - CTO
XL Solutions Ltd

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2001 17:44:37 +0200
From: Roger Gerl <roger.gerl@bluewin.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: learn from my mistake

Spare tire ??? What spare tire  ;-)

I do have "Tire Fix" and this works for about 80km without a problem :)

Of course works only with the rim isn't damaged.

>I think somebody posted a similar warning a couple of months back.  When was
>the last time you checked the air pressure in your temporary spare tire?

Roger
93'3000GT TT
www.rtec.ch

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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