team3s
Saturday, February 3
2001 Volume 01 :
Number
395
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date:
2 Feb 2001 12:43:20 +0000
From: martin berkley <3000gto@breathe.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Plug gap ?
Hi Guys
I have just put new NGK platinum plugs in
my GTO TT and left the plug gaps as they were from the box.
I have noticed
that some comments have suggested different gaps on plugs so should i have
regapped the plugs to something else?
The only mod i have is a K&N
FIPK.
Regards
Martin.
(UK)
___________________________________________
It's amazing what
happens when you breathe.
www.breathe.com
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 08:00:27
-0500
From: "Donnelly, Michael" <DonnellM@ctc.com>
Subject: Team3S:
Spare Tire?
Hi all,
I'm trying to locate when I can get a hold of
a spare tire for my '94 R/T
TT. Does anyone have any ideas? Is
there a psuedo tire or 'donute' that I
can get cheep from someone or do you
think that a search of the local
junkyards is in order?
Mike
Donnelly
'94 R/T TT
62,000 miles
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 05:30:53
-0800
From: "Maupin, Justin" <Justin.Maupin@kla-tencor.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: timing belt tools
List,
>I am looking for someone
to copy me a 1995 3000 GT base manual. When I
>recently bought the car, it
wasn't in the glove compartment. I will pay all
>shipping of course, and a
small fee for photocopying. Thanks,
>
>Judson Smith
Try
looking on ebay for the manual on your year... I found one for $15
for
mine.
Justin
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 06:30:08
-0800 (PST)
From: Jeff Lucius <stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Spare Tire?
I list many used parts yards that handle our cars
on the Garage and
Links pages at my web site. I am sure you can find what you
want from
one of them. Shop and compare for the best price.
http://www.car-part.com/ is a great place to
start online.
Jeff Lucius, www.stealth316.com
- ----- Original
Message -----
From: "Donnelly, Michael" <DonnellM@ctc.com>
To: <team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Friday, February 02, 2001 6:00 AM
Subject: Team3S: Spare Tire?
Hi
all,
I'm trying to locate when I can get a hold of a spare tire for my
'94
R/T TT. Does anyone have any ideas? Is there a psuedo tire
or
'donute' that I can get cheep from someone or do you think that
a
search of the local junkyards is in order?
Mike Donnelly
'94 R/T
TT
62,000 miles
__________________________________________________
Do You
Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products.
http://shopping.yahoo.com/
***
Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 10:20:59
-0500
From: "Schilberg, Darren" <DSchilberg@freemarkets.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Impromptu Gathering near Philadelphia, PA 02/03
Anyone in the
Philly area willing to get together with a few of us? We have
a lucky
member who is looking at wanting to pick up another 1991 Stealth TT
in King
of Prussia and there are a few people in the area. I was wondering
if
anybody wanted to make a quick impromptu Gathering.
The technical post
(to make it legal) is that we will need some people who
know a thing or two
about the 1991-1993 Stealth line (TT knowledge is
helpful). There might
be some specific questions we have and would need
clarified before a sale can
be final. We don't know what they are yet but
just a heads-up to see if
anyone could swing by for some help, diagnostics
while driving,
etc.
Let me know with an offline post. Thanks.
-
--Flash!
dschilberg@freemarkets.com
3Si
#577
1995 Black VR-4 w/ K&N FIPK, Magnecor 8.5 wires, and a custom spark
plug
plate
http://www.ec3s.org/images/members/flash001full.jpg
***
Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 07:31:35
-0800 (PST)
From: Jeff Lucius <stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Picture of an installed K&M Filtercharger needed (OFF
TOPIC)
I think Roger means the Aircharger.
K&N Filtercharger
(part #33-2045) - This is a direct replacement for
the factory "box-shaped"
air filter. The stock air box and funnel
remain in place.
K&N
Aircharger (part #63-1000) - Made for the 95-99 DSM Turbo but
fits all 3S
factory MAS units. It has a bolt in the end cover for
your (optional)
fabricated mounting bracket. It is about 1 inch
longer than the FIPK, and
replaces the stock air box and funnel using
an adapter to connect to the MAS.
K&N FIPK (part #57-1500) - (Filtercharger Injection Performance
Kit)
Made for all year 3S cars, it has 2 brackets made for the 3S with
no
weird bolt sticking out of the end cover. It is a bit shorter than
the
Aircharger. It may have a CARB sticker. It replaces the stock air
box and
funnel using an adapter to connect to the MAS.
http://www.3si.org/member-home/jlucius2/j2-2-k&nguide.htm
Jeff
Lucius, www.stealth316.com
-
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roger Gerl (RTEC)" <roger.gerl@bluewin.ch>
To: "Team3S
List" <Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Thursday, February 01, 2001 3:48 PM
Subject: Re: Team3S: Picture of an
installed K&M Filtercharger needed
(OFF TOPIC)
Thanks for the
response guys, but please note :
I need pictures of the K&N
Filtercharger (for 2nd gen DSMs) installed
and NOT the K&N
FIPK.
Thanks again
Roger
93'3000GT TT
www.rtec.ch
__________________________________________________
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Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 09:50:08
-0600
From: "Paul T. Golley" <ptgolley@hiwaay.net>
Subject:
Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire Info
H'lo Team 3s-
My OEM YOKO 245-40-18
tires wore out before 30K miles. I then bought
four NITTO 555s. They
weren't very expensive and have a wear rating of
300 (Wow!). Therefore
I figured they'd eventually get less sticky with
time,
or wear out before
the equivalent of the 300 rating. 11K miles later the
front
tires
had the cords showing at the inside edges. (Horrible alignment - front
wheels
were towed out 1.0 inch! A whole separate story.) So I put
new
NITTO 555s on front, and corrected the alignment. Now, with
8K miles
on front and circa 18k miles on the the rear, in hard turns at
55 - 65 mph
I get OVERSTEER! A phenomenon new to me with this car ('95
VR-4).
The oversteer occurs quickly, but it is easily corrected if you're on
your
toes. I hope this proves useful to
someone.
Regards,
ptg
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 17:04:47
+0100
From: Roger Gerl <roger.gerl@bluewin.ch>
Subject:
Team3S: K&N Filters explained
Ok, we have this discussion once every
year so I'd like to clear up the
things :
>K&N Filtercharger
(part #33-2045) - This is a direct replacement for
>the factory
"box-shaped" air filter. The stock air box and funnel
>remain in
place.
This is not really correct ! The brandname "Filtercharger" only
describes
the aluminum mesh with the cotton in between and is used on any
K&N
filters. The drop-in element 33-2045 is called "K&N Air Filter"
and fits
the stock air box and is street legal.
>K&N
Aircharger (part #63-1000) - Made for the 95-99 DSM Turbo but
>fits all 3S
factory MAS units. It has a bolt in the end cover for
>your (optional)
fabricated mounting bracket. It is about 1 inch
>longer than the FIPK, and
replaces the stock air box and funnel using
>an adapter to connect to the
MAS.
The Aircharger is any cylinderal or conical design of the
Filtercharger
mesh technology. It comes with an adapter and mounting bracket
(included,
not optional !) The bracket and the fender body should be drilled
with a
hole to support the bracket. Another way is to call K&N and to
get the FIPK
brackets that mounts to stock bolts. The Aircharger is not CARB
approved.
>K&N FIPK (part #57-1500) - (Filtercharger Injection
Performance Kit)
>Made for all year 3S cars, it has 2 brackets made for
the 3S with no
>weird bolt sticking out of the end cover. It is a bit
shorter than
>the Aircharger. It may have a CARB sticker. It replaces the
stock air
>box and funnel using an adapter to connect to the
MAS.
Yep, right. Correctly said, the FIPK is an Aircharger kit, CARB
approved
and street legal for your vehicle. I just don't understand why they
used
the smaller Filtercharger core for the FIPK .
Roger
93'3000GT
TT
www.rtec.ch
***
Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:09:22
-0500
From: "Schilberg, Darren" <DSchilberg@freemarkets.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire Info
I have Pirelli P-Zero Asimmetrico
with about a 140 treadwear (A and A on the
ratings on the sidewall).
What ratings are yours for temperature and such.
I drive hard and aggressive
sometimes but only when the turns prove fun.
They are about half dead at 10k
miles so I plan to have them for a while
longer. They were $265 from
Tirerack and well worth the money (even worked
good for road racing tires at
a local track).
Tirerack has some good pages with testimonials from
people but it really
depends on the weather in your area (hot sun, rain,
etc.) and the way you
drive (spinning tire off launches, digging into turns
on country roads,
etc.) that will best determine what you should use.
Jeff Lucius has a great
page of links for wheels and tires too.
-
--Flash!
dschilberg@freemarkets.com
3Si
#577
1995 Black VR-4 w/Pirelli P-Zero Asimmetrico street tires,
Yokohama
Advan-032 road racing tires, and Kumho Victoracer-700 AutoX
tires.
http://www.ec3s.org/images/members/flash001full.jpg
-
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul T. Golley [mailto:ptgolley@hiwaay.net]
Sent:
Friday, February 02, 2001 10:50
To: team3s@stealth-3000gt.st
Subject:
Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire Info
H'lo Team 3s-
My OEM YOKO
245-40-18 tires wore out before 30K miles. I then bought
four NITTO
555s. They weren't very expensive and have a wear rating of
300 (Wow!).
Therefore I figured they'd eventually get less sticky with
time,
or wear
out before the equivalent of the 300 rating. 11K miles later
the
front
tires had the cords showing at the inside edges. (Horrible
alignment - front
wheels were towed out 1.0 inch! A whole separate
story.) So I put new
NITTO 555s on front, and corrected the
alignment. Now, with 8K miles
on front and circa 18k miles on the
the rear, in hard turns at 55 - 65 mph
I get OVERSTEER! A phenomenon
new to me with this car ('95 VR-4).
The oversteer occurs quickly, but it is
easily corrected if you're on your
toes. I hope this proves useful to
someone.
Regards,
ptg
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 08:20:50
-0800 (PST)
From: Jeff Lucius <stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire Info
Very interesting, Paul.
I
have Nitto 555 tires on my stock '92 TT wheels. About 3K miles
worth. The
only time I have "lost control" of the car was on a fast,
off-camber, hard
left onto a freeway entrance ramp (cold morning,
cold road, cold tires). The
back end came around pretty good -
classic oversteer. I do not have enough
experience to know if the
Nitto 555 tires are related to your or my oversteer
experiences. I
have not noticed oversteer in 50-60+ mph hard twisties or hard
turns.
Jeff Lucius, www.stealth316.com
- ----- Original
Message -----
From: "Paul T. Golley" <ptgolley@hiwaay.net>
To: <team3s@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Friday, February 02, 2001 8:50 AM
Subject: Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire
Info
H'lo Team 3s-
My OEM YOKO 245-40-18 tires wore out before 30K
miles. I then bought
four NITTO 555s. They weren't very expensive and
have a wear rating
of 300 (Wow!). Therefore I figured they'd eventually
get less sticky
with time, or wear out before the equivalent of the 300
rating. 11K
miles later the front tires had the cords showing at the
inside
edges. (Horrible alignment - front wheels were towed out 1.0
inch! A
whole separate story.) So I put new NITTO 555s on front,
and
corrected the alignment. Now, with 8K miles on front and
circa 18k
miles on the the rear, in hard turns at 55 - 65 mph I get
OVERSTEER!
A phenomenon new to me with this car ('95 VR-4). The oversteer
occurs
quickly, but it is easily corrected if you're on your toes. I
hope
this proves useful to
someone.
Regards,
ptg
__________________________________________________
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personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35
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Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 10:29:42
-0600
From: "Walton C. Gibson" <kalla@tripoint.org>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire Info
On 2 Feb 2001, at 8:20, Jeff Lucius
wrote:
> road, cold tires). The back end came around pretty good -
classic
> oversteer. I do not have enough experience to know if the Nitto
555
I just upgraded my wheel setup and decided I would try the Nitto
555s and went with 265/35/18s. I had the stock 17'' wheels and
tires for
this past autocross season and got fairly used to the
amount of understeer
that came it, so I was unprepared for how
well the Nittos grip.
Last
weekend I was driving a friend home and was driving down this
fairly twisty
two lane road, and all of a sudden I came to a turn with
a poorly designed
decreasing radius ; I had little room to brake so I
took the turn. The
Nittos did not slip. I also have the cusco rear
strut bar so that may have
helped too ..
Walton C. Gibson
kalla@tripoint.org
***
Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 10:33:07
-0600
From: "cody" <overclck@starband.net>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire Info
Well, I can add to your alls
oversteer info here. I have the NT555's all
the way around on 18"
wheels on my SL and it is lowered via Intrax springs.
About a year ago,
when the tires were almost new (they still are cause the
car has been garaged
all this time) - I had a similar experience - I had
been driving extremely
fast on a desolate backroad for like an hour....
Once I got to a turn I had
to make, I turned as I had been doing - slowed
down but it was a tighter turn
than I had been - although I was fine - the
road was wide and there was no
one around for miles. For some reason - the
car swapped ends at about
40 MPH half way through the turn. It surprised me
so much - I thought I
had a blowout or something - but all was fine. The
intersection was
free of gravel or anything else, and it was almost
perfectly flat. I
didn't brake through the turn - I did that before the
turn, then just
turned. That was also the only time I have ever lost
control of my
car.
- - Cody
#Very interesting, Paul.
#
#I have Nitto
555 tires on my stock '92 TT wheels. About 3K miles
#worth. The only time I
have "lost control" of the car was on a fast,
#off-camber, hard left onto a
freeway entrance ramp (cold morning,
#cold road, cold tires). The back end
came around pretty good -
#classic oversteer. I do not have enough experience
to know if the
#Nitto 555 tires are related to your or my oversteer
experiences. I
#have not noticed oversteer in 50-60+ mph hard twisties or
hard turns.
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 10:29:00
-0600
From: Merritt <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire Info
story.) So I put
new
>NITTO 555s on front, and corrected the alignment. Now, with
8K miles
>on front and circa 18k miles on the the rear, in hard
turns at 55 - 65 mph
>I get OVERSTEER! A phenomenon new to me with
this car ('95 VR-4).
>The oversteer occurs quickly, but it is easily
corrected if you're on your
>toes. I hope this proves useful to
someone.
Hie thee to a better alignment shop. You have something
seriously wrong
with your car. When our cars are pushed to the limit, they
understeer, not
oversteer. When just pushed reasonably hard, your car should
have neutral
handling.
You sound like you know what you are doing,
but just to make sure we are
talking about the same thing: If you go into a
corner way too fast, an
understeering car will go off the road front-end
first (plowing or
pushing); an oversteering car goes off rear-end first, with
the tail
sliding out; and a neutral-handling car hits the guardrail
perfectly
sideways.
I suspect too much positive toe in the rear,
which can be very dangerous in
our cars. With too much positive toe, our cars
can swap ends under heavy
braking from high speeds, even in a straight line.
If you get into a
freeway offramp too hot and have to tap the brakes, the
rear end may come
around on you.
Autocrossers crank in positive toe
in the rear on purpose to get the
oversteer you are experiencing, but you
should not be getting oversteer
under normal conditions. Sheesh, I have about
all the suspension mods
possible on my car, and I don't have oversteer (I
wish I had a LITTLE
oversteer and not so much push, but them's the breaks.
Maybe Geoff's
spacers will finally cure it. But I digress).
You might
also have tire pressure problems.
If you suspect it's tires, swap the
tires front to rear and see if the
problem goes away. I bet it won't, because
I think you have something wrong
with your alignment.
Let us know what
the problem turns out to be. Maybe us racers can figure
out a way to use
whatever settings you have to get some oversteer without
swapping
ends.
Rich/old poop
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:46:32
-0500
From: "Schilberg, Darren" <DSchilberg@freemarkets.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire Info
I did find that the Yoko A-032 tires
I was using and the oversteer I
experienced was actually a lack of knowing
how to drive an AWD car through a
corner (at first I panicked and hit the
brakes which helped to slide the
back end out). I should have let off
the throttle and let the AWD kick in.
I've learned and can now kick the back
out when I need to (2nd gear provides
one heck of a lot of torque going into
a turn sometimes). IT is fine until
the AWD kicks in and whips me back
into shape.
- --Flash!
dschilberg@freemarkets.com
3Si
#577
Yoko A-032 road racing tires but the 5-point harness is what really
holds me
in sometimes
- -----Original Message-----
From: cody
[mailto:overclck@starband.net]
Sent:
Friday, February 02, 2001 11:33
To: Jeff Lucius
Cc: Team3S
Subject: RE:
Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire Info
For some reason - the
car swapped
ends at about 40 MPH half way through the turn. It surprised me
so much
- I thought I had a blowout or something - but all was fine.
The
intersection was free of gravel or anything else, and it was
almost
perfectly flat. I didn't brake through the turn - I did that
before the
turn, then just turned. That was also the only time I have
ever lost
control of my car.
- - Cody
#Very interesting,
Paul.
#
#I have Nitto 555 tires on my stock '92 TT wheels. About 3K
miles
#worth. The only time I have "lost control" of the car was on a
fast,
#off-camber, hard left onto a freeway entrance ramp (cold
morning,
#cold road, cold tires). The back end came around pretty good
-
#classic oversteer. I do not have enough experience to know if
the
#Nitto 555 tires are related to your or my oversteer experiences.
I
#have not noticed oversteer in 50-60+ mph hard twisties or hard
turns.
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 10:56:02
-0600
From: "cody" <overclck@starband.net>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire Info
Let me add to my own story here - i
have also experienced understeer. When
the incident happened below, i
was more than halfway through the turn, and
thought everything was perfect
because the car wasn't pushing outside.
Little did I know once I was halfway
through the turn it was going to do
that. My alignment on my car is
almost perfect -.5 degree camber on the
back and the same for the
front. All toe and such are almost perfect
factroy spec.
-
-Cody
#
#Well, I can add to your alls oversteer info here. I
have the NT555's all
#the way around on 18" wheels on my SL and it is lowered
via Intrax springs.
#
#About a year ago, when the tires were almost new
(they still are cause the
#car has been garaged all this time) - I had a
similar experience - I had
#been driving extremely fast on a desolate
backroad for like an hour....
#Once I got to a turn I had to make, I turned
as I had been doing - slowed
#down but it was a tighter turn than I had been
- although I was fine - the
#road was wide and there was no one around for
miles. For some reason - the
#car swapped ends at about 40 MPH half way
through the turn. It
#surprised me
#so much - I thought I had a
blowout or something - but all was fine. The
#intersection was free of
gravel or anything else, and it was almost
#perfectly flat. I didn't
brake through the turn - I did that before the
#turn, then just turned.
That was also the only time I have ever lost
#control of my car.
#
#-
Cody
#
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 10:58:04
-0600
From: "Walton C. Gibson" <kalla@tripoint.org>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire Info
Yes, I run the 265/35/18s all the way
around. I have the Enkei
RP01 wheels (42mm offset) in 18x9. I haven't had
any trouble with
rubbing the struts.
<color><param>7F00,0000,0000</param>>
265/35VR18 fit fine on the front as well?
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 08:57:22
-0800 (PST)
From: Jeff Lucius <stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire Info
I noticed after I had the Nitto 555s
put on that the car seemed
"twitchier", that is more sensitive to the gooves
and ridges found on
most streets. The alignment shop checked the car twice
and found no
problems (they did great work on my Mitsu 4WD pickup and the
wife's
AWD Subaru Legacy). I did swap tires front to rear to no effect.
Of
course something could still be wrong somewhere in the suspension.
I
have noticed no tendency for the back end to come around with
heavy
braking.
I was accelerating hard when the back end came around
making that
turn onto the entrance ramp. I have been nervous about stomping
on
her in turns ever since. I should probably seek some professional
help.
:)
Rich, have you or your buddies tried Nitto 555 tires for your
racing
activities?
Jeff Lucius, www.stealth316.com
- ----- Original
Message -----
From: "Merritt" <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
To:
"Paul T. Golley" <ptgolley@hiwaay.net>;
<team3s@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Friday, February 02, 2001 9:29 AM
Subject: Re: Team3S: YOKO and NITTO Tire
Info
<snip>
If you suspect it's tires, swap the tires front
to rear and see if
the problem goes away. I bet it won't, because I think you
have
something wrong with your alignment.
Let us know what the problem
turns out to be. Maybe us racers can
figure out a way to use whatever
settings you have to get some
oversteer without swapping
ends.
Rich/old
poop
__________________________________________________
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Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 11:33:55
-0600
From: Merritt <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Team3S: Re: Oversteer (Was Tires)
>Rich, have you or your buddies
tried Nitto 555 tires for your racing
>activities?
>
I haven't
run Nittos.
I've run Michelin Pilot street tires, Yokohama O32R race tires
and Kuhmo
V700 race tires, and never experienced oversteer. I've gotten the
car
sideways a couple of times because it washed out (lost traction),
but
because I have neutral handling, I went off perfectly sideways.
Maybe
that's what you guys are experiencing instead of oversteer. Just
because
the car is sliding sideways does not necessarily mean that you
are
oversteering. It can just mean that all four tires lost
traction
simultaneously, which is what a neutral car does.
For
example, on the off ramp situation: You are turning into a decreasing
radius
turn, so the nose is in, power is on, and the car is in a
classic
tail-slightly-out four wheel drift around the turn with the AWD
grabbing
and the turbos howling. As the radius decreases, you turn in harder
and the
nose follows and the tail goes wider. If you lose traction at this
point,
the car will slide to the outside of the turn in what appears to
be
oversteer, but it may just be sliding perfectly sideways and so will
hit
the guardrail flat.
If you were to lift or bang the brakes with
the car in such an orientation,
the rear likely will come around on you, but
not because of oversteer --
it's because of the car's extreme position in the
turn. The wheel with the
most traction is the left front (on a right hand
turn), so when you lift or
bang the brakes the weight transfers forward and
the left front wheel acts
like a pivot to bring the rear around. Maybe some
of our driving
instructors can explain this better than I can. The racing
books don't help
because they don't deal with AWD.
The best way to
check for oversteer is to run a skid pad. Put a pylon or a
beer can down in
the middle of a flat parking lot somewhere, and drive
around it in a circle.
Keep going faster and faster at the same radius
until you can't hold it any
more and the car slides out. If it slides off
tail first, you have oversteer.
More likely, with our cars, it will plow
off front end first in a classic
understeer or straight sideways because
it's neutral.
Rich/old
poop
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: 2 Feb 2001 18:39:04
+0000
From: martin berkley <3000gto@breathe.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Wheel alignment
Hi guys
As evryone is talking about camber at
the moment.
I just had my 4 wheel alignment set today and they told me that i
am at maximum adjustment and these are my final settings.
Front axle
total
toe +00%00
partial toe
L. +00%00
partial toe R. +00%00
Camber
L. -00%29
camber
R. -01%26
out of alignment
-00%30
Rear axle
total toe
-00%43
partial toe L. -00%17
partial toe R.
-00%26
Camber L. -00%10
camber
R. -00%28
Thrust
angle +00%04
out of alignment -00%14
Now i
don't have a clue what any of that means, but if anyone can look at those
figures for me and tell me wether they look OK or not.
Thanks in
advance.
Martin
___________________________________________
It's
amazing what happens when you breathe.
www.breathe.com
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 15:10:43
-0500
From: "Schilberg, Darren" <DSchilberg@freemarkets.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Re: Oversteer (Was Tires)
The good racing book I am reading
for a bit of an edge at a PCA Driving
Event coming up in April at Mid-Ohio
has a line that made me just laugh out
loud. It was right after the
difference between FWD understeer in a turn
and RWD oversteer. I don't
remember exactly but it said, "And we won't
discuss how an AWD car acts when
racing around turns because they rarely
show up for races." Something
like that.
The important thing I learned in AutoX is that when pushed
hard and slow it
acts like an understeer car until around the pivot point and
then look out
traction. When pushed fast, turning in late, you CAN get
the tail to slide
out but it is for such a short time since the front and
rear tires begin to
grab nearly instantaneously that you can't drift the rear
around a turn like
Mustangs and Corvettes.
I learned many valuable
lessons from our list racers (Merritt, John
Christian, Middaugh, Bedell,
Mohler, etc.) and I owe them many, many thanks.
I also learned by reading the
book and going out and trying it. I love this
car more than I ever
imagined now thanks to this list. Lord knows how much
fun it will be
when I get around to changing camber on the corners for even
MORE
grip.
- --Flash!
dschilberg@freemarkets.com
3Si
#577
1995 Black VR-4
http://www.ec3s.org/images/members/flash001full.jpg
-
-----Original Message-----
From: Merritt [mailto:merritt@cedar-rapids.net]
Sent:
Friday, February 02, 2001 12:34
To: Jeff Lucius; team3s@stealth-3000gt.st
Subject:
Team3S: Re: Oversteer (Was Tires)
Maybe some of our
driving
instructors can explain this better than I can. The racing books
don't help
because they don't deal with AWD.
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 14:30:09
-0800
From: "Chris Maxwell" <shmacker@home.com>
Subject: Team3S:
White smoke - turbo seal?
My friend was following me today and
mentioned that when I floor the car,
there is a noticeable amount of white
smoke that comes out of the exhaust.
This is constant until I lift off the
gas. It isn't noticeable under normal
driving though. Could this be a
turbo seal problem? I have the GT-Pro 355
turbos and I've heard that the
seals weren't all that great, but then again,
I've also heard good things
about them too. There are about 6000 miles on
these turbos. I guess I'm
thinking that the coolant is seaping through the
seal under high boost. What
do you guys think? Maybe the head gasket? The
thermostat did go bad a few
weeks ago and the engine temp went into the red
for a few minutes. I'm not
sure if the smoke was there before that but it's
something to
consider.
Thanks,
Chris
92 R/T TT
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 17:55:48
-0800
From: "noble" <nketo@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: funny ticking noise under hood
Ian,
They told me that the
clanking noise coming from the area was really from my
transmission.
I
suspected a spun bearing, but they said it was simply the gears
"expanding"
with heat, and
clanking due to production tolerances.
Either way, I
got a written statement that is legally binding just in case
of a
warranty
claim (I'd bill/sue them from a 3rd party).
Fortunately, 8 years later, my
tranny is still ok with its occasional
clanking.
A higher weight tranny
fluid also helped quelling the noise a bit.
Note: This only occurs after
a good run, giving the transmission time to
really heat
up.
During morning/cold
tranny starts, there's no such noise.
Best,
Noble
- -----
Original Message -----
From: ian sweeney <sween3000gt@hotmail.com>
To:
<nketo@sympatico.ca>
Cc: <team3s-digest@mail.stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Thursday, February 01, 2001 5:20 PM
Subject: Re: Team3S: funny ticking noise
under hood
> Noble,
> I think to an extent you are right.
THe ticking noise was there
previously.
> It is now verging on knocking
so it may in fact be a different issue.
> Somebody else suggested an
injector solenoid which might tally with a miss
> at high rpm. The miss
didnt seemt to be worse in 3rd than 2nd, so that
would
> suggest its
independent of load so maybe not the plugs. My guess is the
> injectors.
anyway all will be revealed tomorrow cos i'm off to the dealer
in
> the
morning.
>
> thanks
> Ian
*** Info:
http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 15:02:19
-0800
From: "ian sweeney" <sween3000gt@hotmail.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: funny ticking noise under hood
Noble,
went to the dealer
this morning. he reckons its the lifters..not quite sure
what the lifters
are (rocker arms or tappets or something) anyway its on the
way back to the
yard that i bought it from. its under 6 month warranty so
hopefully he'll
honor it. anyway i'm out of action for the next
while.
ian
>From: "noble" <nketo@sympatico.ca>
>To: "ian
sweeney" <sween3000gt@hotmail.com>
>CC:
<team3s-digest@mail.stealth-3000gt.st>
>Subject:
Re: Team3S: funny ticking noise under hood
>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 17:55:48
-0800
>
>Ian,
>
>They told me that the clanking noise
coming from the area was really from
>my
>transmission.
>I
suspected a spun bearing, but they said it was simply the
gears
>"expanding" with heat, and
>clanking due to production
tolerances.
>
>Either way, I got a written statement that is legally
binding just in case
>of a
>warranty claim (I'd bill/sue them from a
3rd party).
>Fortunately, 8 years later, my tranny is still ok with its
occasional
>clanking.
>A higher weight tranny fluid also helped
quelling the noise a bit.
>
>Note: This only occurs after a good
run, giving the transmission time to
>really heat
up.
> During
morning/cold tranny starts, there's no such
noise.
>
>Best,
>Noble
>
>----- Original Message
-----
>From: ian sweeney <sween3000gt@hotmail.com>
>To:
<nketo@sympatico.ca>
>Cc:
<team3s-digest@mail.stealth-3000gt.st>
>Sent:
Thursday, February 01, 2001 5:20 PM
>Subject: Re: Team3S: funny ticking
noise under hood
>
>
> > Noble,
> > I think to an
extent you are right. THe ticking noise was there
>previously.
>
> It is now verging on knocking so it may in fact be a different
issue.
> > Somebody else suggested an injector solenoid which might
tally with a
>miss
> > at high rpm. The miss didnt seemt to be
worse in 3rd than 2nd, so that
>would
> > suggest its independent
of load so maybe not the plugs. My guess is the
> > injectors. anyway
all will be revealed tomorrow cos i'm off to the
>dealer
>in
> > the morning.
> >
> >
thanks
> >
Ian
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
Get
your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
***
Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 15:23:25
-0800
From: "ian sweeney" <sween3000gt@hotmail.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Lo-Jack and theft deterrent
further to the lo-jack idea there is
an immobiliser that interacts with the
likes of lo-jack to shut the car down
remotely. (i'm a little biased cos i
used to work for the
company that designed them!) but it is quite a cool
system that has 3
electrical circuit immobilisation, e.g coil, starter, fuel
pump but it also
shuts down the fuel line itself using a solenoid valve.
The idea is
that without the transponder you can't deactivate the system and
you have to
overcome 3 electrical circuits and the fuel circuit. It works
well
because the solenoid valve and code verifaction electronics are encased
in a
robust housing on the fuel line. It resisted a 15 minute attack test at
the
regulatory test house in the UK which put it in the top rankingof theft
deterrents. This system can interact with Lo-Jack to shut down the car
remotely. Its used quite widely on trucks in europe where they can
shut
down the truck if it deviates from the designated corridor, ie its
stolen!
the other thing i remember is it was about $200 installed. it's
called a
Kosran ECV and i can find out more if anyone's
interested
ian
under repair 92 3000
VR4
_________________________________________________________________
Get
your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
***
Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 15:30:33
-0800 (PST)
From: Geoff Mohler <gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Lo-Jack and theft deterrent
Remember, lojack only works where
the local law enforcement supports it.
On Star is the company behind all
the GPS stuff...that works everywhere,
and where it doesnt, they'll tell you
the garage it rolled into before it
lost contact.
On Fri, 2 Feb 2001,
ian sweeney wrote:
> further to the lo-jack idea there is an
immobiliser that interacts with the
> likes of lo-jack to shut the car
down remotely. (i'm a little biased cos i
> used to work for
the company that designed them!) but it is quite a cool
> system that has
3 electrical circuit immobilisation, e.g coil, starter, fuel
> pump but
it also shuts down the fuel line itself using a solenoid valve.
>
The idea is that without the transponder you can't deactivate the system and
> you have to overcome 3 electrical circuits and the fuel circuit.
It works
> well because the solenoid valve and code verifaction
electronics are encased
> in a robust housing on the fuel line. It
resisted a 15 minute attack test at
> the regulatory test house in the UK
which put it in the top rankingof theft
> deterrents. This system can
interact with Lo-Jack to shut down the car
> remotely. Its used
quite widely on trucks in europe where they can shut
> down the truck if
it deviates from the designated corridor, ie its stolen!
> the other
thing i remember is it was about $200 installed. it's called a
> Kosran
ECV and i can find out more if anyone's interested
>
> ian
>
under repair 92 3000 VR4
>
_________________________________________________________________
> Get
your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
>
>
> *** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
>
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 19:36:37
EST
From: Klusmanp@aol.com
Subject:
Team3S: Single vs. twin turbo?
This may be a bit off topic, but I'm
interested in studying the trade-offs
between a larger single turbo vs.
smaller twin turbos (parallel system as in
the VR4/Stealth TT). I recognize
that the twin turbo will have less turbo
lag, but does it offer any other
advantages over a larger single turbo in
terms of air charge temperature,
installed weight/volume, heat generation,
and exhaust
backpressure?
Also, does anybody know of any good books or articles that
cover turbocharger
to engine matching? (i.e. what size/flowrate turbo is
good for an engine with
a given HP/displacement)
Thanks
Paul
Klusman
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 19:44:01
-0500
From: "Trent" <bdtrent@netzero.net>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Single vs. twin turbo?
Ref. Maximum Boost by Bell. This is
a common standard among car guys, but
unfortunately not among airplane
guys.
- ----- Original Message -----
From: <Klusmanp@aol.com>
To: <team3s@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Friday, February 02, 2001 7:36 PM
Subject: Team3S: Single vs. twin
turbo?
> This may be a bit off topic, but I'm interested in
studying the trade-offs
> between a larger single turbo vs. smaller twin
turbos (parallel system as
in
> the VR4/Stealth TT). I recognize that
the twin turbo will have less turbo
> lag, but does it offer any other
advantages over a larger single turbo in
> terms of air charge
temperature, installed weight/volume, heat generation,
> and exhaust
backpressure?
>
> Also, does anybody know of any good books or
articles that cover
turbocharger
> to engine matching? (i.e. what
size/flowrate turbo is good for an engine
with
> a given
HP/displacement)
>
> Thanks
>
> Paul
Klusman
>
> *** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
>
Shop online without a credit card
http://www.rocketcash.com
RocketCash, a
NetZero subsidiary
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 20:07:22
-0500
From: "Trent" <bdtrent@netzero.net>
Subject:
Team3S: Toe Recommendations
I'm wandering what the effects of toe
adjustments are. After setting my
front camber, I checked toe using a
laser pointer. With the beam just
touching the front and rear sidewalls
of the front tire (at rocker sill
height), you can measure the distance from
the rocker sill to the beam along
the length of the rocker sill. With
this metheod, I measured both fronts
with just a slight amont of
toe-in. I'm assuming this is good to go, but
I'm wandering what kind of
affects toe adjustments have at the front and the
rear. I havn't got to
the rears yet, but I'm assuming they should have a
slight amount of toe-in
also.
Regards,
DaveT/92TT
Shop online without a credit
card
http://www.rocketcash.com
RocketCash, a
NetZero subsidiary
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 18:26:27
-0800
From: "Jim Berry" <fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Wheel alignment
Martin
The % sign is meaningless in this
application Camber and caster are measured in degrees and
toe is measured in
inches. On the front axle the toe is zero which is fine the spec says ± .12"
so
0 is fine.
The camber is supposed to be ± ½ degree or
±30', as you no doubt remember from school, angles can be broken down
into
degrees, minutes and seconds --- each degree can be broken down into 60
minutes [ 60' ] and each minute into 60 seconds
60" ] therefore ½
degree is
written as 30' .The camber on the left front is probably 29'
which is within the ±30'.
The problem on the rt. front is the negative 1
degree 26 minutes [ 1º 26' ] ---- remember the spec
is ± 30' so the
wheel is tilted in at the top by 1º more than you want. My car has 1½
º
negative in front for street use and I will have 3º negative for the track
[ a set of tires will last me
less than a year --- wear rating 80 ].
If
you want handling the 1½º is a good thing [ should have it on both wheels ], If
you want 30K
miles out of a set of tires buy a Honda. The camber is
adjustable so I have no idea why they
couldn't bring it into spec --- bent
parts, worn parts ??? they should have given you some idea.
The report says
out of spec by 29' [ ½º ] but it looks to me as though it's out by about 1º, I
have
no Idea where they got a ½.
On the rear your camber is
within the ±30', but the wheels are toed in by .17 inches and .26
inches ---
again the rear toe is adjustable but you have to disconnect the rear tie rod
adjust the
camber then reconnect and adjust the toe --- If the shop
doesn't know what they're doing that
could be part of the problem. I don't
remember how the rear toe is adjusted but in the case of
front there is a
huge amount of adjustment on the tie rod ends. I've heard of not being able
to
reach the camber spec but not the toe spec.
I don't know about
thrust angle ---- I keep threating to find out but haven't yet.
confused
yet ???????
Jim Berry
- ----- Original Message
-----
From: martin berkley <3000gto@breathe.com>
.
> I
just had my 4 wheel alignment set today and they told me that i am at maximum
adjustment and these are my final
settings.
> Front axle
> total
toe +00%00
> partial toe
L. +00%00
> partial toe R. +00%00
> Camber
L. -00%29
> camber
R. -01%26
> out of alignment
-00%30
>
> Rear axle
> total
toe -00%43
> partial toe
L. -00%17
> partial toe R. -00%26
> Camber
L. -00%10
> camber
R. -00%28
> Thrust
angle +00%04
> out of alignment
-00%14
>
> Now i don't have a clue what any of that means, but if
anyone can look at those figures for me and tell me wether they
look OK or
not.
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 13:57:08
-0000
From: "George Shaw" <george.shaw@btinternet.com>
Subject:
Team3S: CATZ?
CATZ are not that common in the UK. Does anyone have any
experience with
these or other auxiliary lights? Which are the BEST for
driving & fog that
fit our cars? Has anyone tried the CATZ Zeta00 system
that boosts the
voltage to STD lights? I see they also do a neat turbo
timer!
http://www.fet-usa.com/shownews1.asp?newsid=27
eMail:
george.shaw@xlsolutions.com
eMail:
george.shaw@btinternet.com
Office:
+44 (0) 28 9092 5000
Fax/Voice Mail: +44 (0) 87 0133
6126
Mobile:
+44 (0) 78 1162
5179
Home:
+44 (0) 28 9062
8924
ICQ#:
1741675
*** Info: http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
End of team3s V1
#395
*********************