team3s            Tuesday, January 2 2001            Volume 01 : Number 365




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 23:58:53 -0700
From: "Barry E. King" <beking@home.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Re: Greddy Type S BOV

> I have been hearing a lot of different things about BOVs.
>
> 1). The Blitz SSBOV utilizes the stock BOV so it is not ideal for
> situations where the problem is "your stock BOV leaks."

Easily rectified with a small modification to bypass the stock valve if
necessary.  Suggest alternate spring if exceeding 19 PSI.

> 2). The HKS SSBOV replaces the stock BOV but does not blow off
> back into the intake path therefore the possibility of the car running too
rich and
> possibly stalling in applications that use 550cc or larger injectors is
> possible.

Really not a big deal.  Really.  This applies to all the BOVs listed here.
It CAN be tuned around despite what others may claim.  I own the Blitz with
the high pressure spring and have zero problems with stumbling when the
throttle is lifted, a symptom of a number of possible things but sometimes
attributed to the BOV.  Both the BOV and the fuel computer (whatever you are
using) need to be properly tuned in conjunction with your shift points and
desired boost levels.

> 3). The Greddy Type S BOV replaces the stock BOV and blows of
> back into the intake path similar to the stock BOV and like the stock BOV,
has
> the tendency to leak in applications that are running 20 psi or more.

Most consumer oriented BOVs will leak at these boost pressures.  It is
inherent in the mass production tolerances.  The cylinders in the mass
produced units have widely varying tolerances.  There are handmade units
that do not leak (or leak so little it doesn't matter) but they come at a
premium.

> Are these statements true and if so, which BOV is the best to use
> in a car that will soon be running 15G turbos and 550cc injectors?

Avoid the plastic ones -- they are simply junk and for show only.

> Thanks in advance------
>
> Royal K. Watkins III
> Senior Programmer Analyst
> Total System Services Inc.
> 1995 Black 3000GT VR-4  (3SI #210)
> 2000 Yellow TL1000R


Barry


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 23:34:39 -0800 (PST)
From: Geoff Mohler <gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject: Team3S: Re: Greddy Type S BOV

On Mon, 1 Jan 2001 GTOTLR@cs.com wrote:

> 2). The HKS SSBOV replaces the stock BOV but does not blow off back into the
> intake path therefore the possibility of the car running too rich and
> possibly stalling in applications that use 550cc or larger injectors is
> possible.
- ---

I belive thats an issue with the injector type, as the injector gets
larger the harder it gets to control it at idle.  Nippon style injectors
solve this problem for the most part, as theyre easier to fine-tune at low
pulse rates.  Also, if the VR4 has this problem..its gotta be unique.
Toyota's dont, I have three Toyo turbo models with open-release BOVs
without any problems.

> Are these statements true and if so, which BOV is the best to use in a car
> that will soon be running 15G turbos and 550cc injectors?
- ---

I'll let ya know what we use..but it'll probly be twin HKS SSQVs on 15Gs
and 900cc injectors.

Should be done in the next 2 weeks.


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 03:48:21 -0800 (PST)
From: Jeff Lucius <stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: rotors and pads

I have a fairly comprehensive discussion of brake upgrades at the
link below.

http://www.3si.org/member-home/jlucius2/j2-2-brakeupgrade.htm

It is focused on the AWD models but you might find some useful info
there for your FWD car.

Jeff Lucius, www.stealth316.com

- ----- Original Message -----
From: <AABOMB1@aol.com>
To: <Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2000 11:32 AM
Subject: Team3S: rotors and pads

Hello list members.

I have a warped rotor, so in a month or two I will be ordering a new
set of rotors and pads. I decided I want to just go ahead and buy the
best set available. Which rotors would you all recommend? Any
particular pads or just the factory?

Please keep in mind that I need these parts for a *non*turbo and I
would like to spend something no higher than in the upper three
figures.

I appreciate it!

'94 3000GT (Naturally Aspirated DOHC)
AA
- -------------------
E-mail: aabomb@thepentagon.com <or> aabomb1@aol.com


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos - Share your holiday photos online!
http://photos.yahoo.com/

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 14:05:39 -0500
From: "Russell Edwards" <blue@cois.on.ca>
Subject: Team3S: it's only money hahaha

Just thought I would share my latest woes with the group
I took my 92 Stealth R/T to my dealership yesterday for the new Canadian
emmisions test
well -- it didn't even pass the pre inspection as there was visible smoke in
the exhaust (sounds like an oxmoron )
anyway I knew it was burning some oil and assumed after reading the Faq's
that it was probably valve stem seals
well dealer thinks its either that or a valve guide
either way i'm looking at $2500 cdn for the repairs
such is the price I guess for loving these cars , Funny thing is is that
when I bought this one (my second stealth, previous one being a 91 ES) my
service manager at the dealership asked if my wallet hadn't had enough
punishment yet.

Wondering if this sounds right or is this to  much to pay

Russell
92 Stealth R/T
2000 Intrepid R/T
86 Corvette


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 16:11:30 -0600
From: "cody" <overclck@flash.net>
Subject: Team3S: High Flow Cat?

In search of more upgrades to do to my car as of now, i stumbled upon this
site which lists larger flow cats for VR-4s for $175.  What diameter is
this?  I am going with a 3" exhaust system to a muffler then two 2.25" outs
from there.

www.discountconverter.com

Would that be beneficial, or should I look to another company  - Random
Technologies???

- -Cody


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 15:23:38 -0700
From: "Barry E. King" <beking@home.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: High Flow Cat?

I asked my muffler guy about a hi-flow cat a few years back.  He said
"You're looking at it" and pointed to the stocker.  He could sell me Random
Technologies and others and make some cash, but he stated, without
hesitation, that they don't offer any improvement over a stock one.  He told
me he'd sell me one if I wanted or if I needed a new one, but other than
that there would be zero benefit.  *shrug*

Notice how the flow comparisons offered by these companies are never against
a stock cat (at least not the last time I chekced)?  I'll get one when I
need a replacement, but I don't think I'll bother until that time.  Seems to
be better places to spend the money.


Barry

> -----Original Message-----
>
> In search of more upgrades to do to my car as of now, i stumbled upon this
> site which lists larger flow cats for VR-4s for $175.  What diameter is
> this?  I am going with a 3" exhaust system to a muffler then two
> 2.25" outs
> from there.
>
> www.discountconverter.com
>
> Would that be beneficial, or should I look to another company  - Random
> Technologies???
>
> -Cody


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 16:28:08 -0600
From: "cody" <overclck@flash.net>
Subject: RE: Team3S: High Flow Cat?

Ok, but what about a larger than factory n the Non-turbo model???

- -Cody

#-----Original Message-----
#From: owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st
#[mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On Behalf Of Barry E. King
#Sent: Monday, January 01, 2001 4:24 PM
#To: Team3S
#Subject: RE: Team3S: High Flow Cat?
#
#
#I asked my muffler guy about a hi-flow cat a few years back.  He said
#"You're looking at it" and pointed to the stocker.  He could sell me Random
#Technologies and others and make some cash, but he stated, without
#hesitation, that they don't offer any improvement over a stock
#one.  He told
#me he'd sell me one if I wanted or if I needed a new one, but other than
#that there would be zero benefit.  *shrug*
#
#Notice how the flow comparisons offered by these companies are
#never against
#a stock cat (at least not the last time I chekced)?  I'll get one when I
#need a replacement, but I don't think I'll bother until that time.
# Seems to
#be better places to spend the money.
#
#
#Barry
#
#> -----Original Message-----
#>
#> In search of more upgrades to do to my car as of now, i stumbled
#upon this
#> site which lists larger flow cats for VR-4s for $175.  What diameter is
#> this?  I am going with a 3" exhaust system to a muffler then two
#> 2.25" outs
#> from there.
#>
#> www.discountconverter.com
#>
#> Would that be beneficial, or should I look to another company  - Random
#> Technologies???
#>
#> -Cody
#
#
#***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
#


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Mon, 01 Jan 2001 17:26:34 -0500
From: smii <smii@mediaone.net>
Subject: Team3S: New HKS Super AFR unit

          Hello everyone,  I was just wondering if anybody on the list
has purchased one of the new HKS Super AFR units yet?  I'm up in the air
on whether to buy the GCC or the new Super AFR,
which I was told is a much better product due to the fact that you can
adjust your fuel up to 50%
in 1% increments. This unit can also connect to the VPC unit for fine
tuning of the fuel curve.

    I got my but spanked today, and I know it's because I am running way
to rich. If I lean out my VPC anymore I will stall my car, but if I
leave it the way it is, it runs to rich. I guess it's time for the next
step in fuel management. Any advice would be helpful.

Sincerely,
Boris


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 15:31:59 -0700
From: "Barry E. King" <beking@home.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: High Flow Cat?

No direct experience with the NT from which to draw.  Get a cat that fits
with the rest of the system from a diameter standpoint and go with it.


Barry

> -----Original Message-----
>
> Ok, but what about a larger than factory n the Non-turbo model???
>
> -Cody


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2001 00:01:58 +0100
From: "Roger Gerl \(RTEC\)" <roger.gerl@bluewin.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Question on Boost Gauges

> Besides price, what is the difference between Mechanical and Electronic
> Vac/Boost gauge?

It's really only the lenght of the vac hose, but this isn't a big deal
(electrical wires can also be damaged !)

> Can I use a Mechanical Gauge or do I have to use an Electronic gauge?

Whatever you like.

> Will I be able to run the vac hose in the pillar pod into the engine
> compartment?

Yes, no problem.

> Does anyone have a step by step instructions for the installation of a
boost
> gauge that identifies what hose to tap into to get the gauge working?

Check out the Blitz DSBC installation pages on my site :
www.rtec.ch/3000gt.html

Roger
93'3000GT TT
www.rtec.ch


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 23:58:29 +0100
From: "Roger Gerl \(RTEC\)" <roger.gerl@bluewin.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Re: Greddy Type S BOV

> > 1). The Blitz SSBOV utilizes the stock BOV so it is not ideal for
> > situations where the problem is "your stock BOV leaks."
>
> Easily rectified with a small modification to bypass the stock valve if
> necessary.  Suggest alternate spring if exceeding 19 PSI.

The SSBOV is not the best solutions in our cars design and the "your BOV
leaks" statement is true ... every stock BOV leaks as there is a small hole
in there. I'd not use the Blitz even with the stock BPV out.

> > 2). The HKS SSBOV replaces the stock BOV but does not blow off
> > back into the intake path therefore the possibility of the car running
too
> rich and
> > possibly stalling in applications that use 550cc or larger injectors is
> > possible.
>
> Really not a big deal.  Really.  This applies to all the BOVs listed here.
> It CAN be tuned around despite what others may claim.  I own the Blitz
with
> the high pressure spring and have zero problems with stumbling when the
> throttle is lifted, a symptom of a number of possible things but sometimes
> attributed to the BOV.  Both the BOV and the fuel computer (whatever you
are
> using) need to be properly tuned in conjunction with your shift points and
> desired boost levels.

I disagree in this because I had the HKS on my car and during shifting,
there was aleways an ultrarich condition due to the measured air was
released. Problem got not really recognized but visible in the datalogs. The
Greddy Type S solved the problem.

> > 3). The Greddy Type S BOV replaces the stock BOV and blows of
> > back into the intake path similar to the stock BOV and like the stock
BOV,
> has
> > the tendency to leak in applications that are running 20 psi or more.

No, not true. If you need really a stronger spring then you can get it from
Greddy.

Roger
93'3000GT TT
www.rtec.ch



***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 16:42:59 -0700
From: "Barry E. King" <beking@home.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Re: Greddy Type S BOV

> -----Original Message-----
>
> > > 1). The Blitz SSBOV utilizes the stock BOV so it is not ideal for
> > > situations where the problem is "your stock BOV leaks."
> >
> > Easily rectified with a small modification to bypass the stock valve if
> > necessary.  Suggest alternate spring if exceeding 19 PSI.
>
> The SSBOV is not the best solutions in our cars design and the "your BOV
> leaks" statement is true ... every stock BOV leaks as there is a
> small hole in there. I'd not use the Blitz even with the stock BPV out.

Based upon what exactly?  I know several SSBOV installations that work fine.
I also know of a number that do not.  I have seen many brands work and the
same brands not work.  It depends upon how they are installed and how the
system is tuned.

If all you want is a louder sound, it really doesn't matter.  Pick one and
set it up so that it blows off and sounds cools to passers-by at normal
driving speeds and live with it.  If you want one for performance reasons,
they must be tuned for the style of driving being done.

> > > 2). The HKS SSBOV replaces the stock BOV but does not blow off
> > > back into the intake path therefore the possibility of the car running
> too
> > rich and
> > > possibly stalling in applications that use 550cc or larger
> injectors is
> > > possible.
> >
> > Really not a big deal.  Really.  This applies to all the BOVs
> listed here.
> > It CAN be tuned around despite what others may claim.  I own the Blitz
> with
> > the high pressure spring and have zero problems with stumbling when the
> > throttle is lifted, a symptom of a number of possible things
> but sometimes
> > attributed to the BOV.  Both the BOV and the fuel computer (whatever you
> are
> > using) need to be properly tuned in conjunction with your shift
> points and
> > desired boost levels.
>
> I disagree in this because I had the HKS on my car and during shifting,
> there was aleways an ultrarich condition due to the measured air was
> released. Problem got not really recognized but visible in the
> datalogs. The Greddy Type S solved the problem.

First of all, if there is no problem, there is no problem.  An engine at
cold start is also terribly rich.  Yet it won't start without that
condition.  Close a throttle plate (or slide, or venturi) and all of a
sudden there is rich, then lean.  Completely normal.  If this does not
create a drivability or performance problem, who cares what the data log
says.

Of course, you may disagree all you like.  I am stating as fact that in my
application there is zero hesitation nor drivability issues with my SSBOV
setup.  Pretty simple.  I can lift, shift and get into it again without lag,
sputtering or stuttering.  Every single time.  However, I almost never fully
lift unless the engine is going to be allowed to idle since there is little
or no point in doing so during driving.  The throttle is a meter and for
optimal performance should be open in accordance with RPM (gearbox and
engine) and load.

This issue has come up a number of times over the last few years, and it is
not limited to the Blitz SSBOV.  I have never experienced drivability issues
with my setup **when it has been properly tuned**.  Other BOVs may be easier
to set up out of the box.  I have seen no evidence whatsoever to support
that one performs better than any other.  If someone has empirical
comparative evidence to the contrary let's have a look.  Until then, much of
this is anecdotal evidence at best, and yes I recognize that my statements
fall into that category.  However, anyone wishing to see it first hand can
arrange to do so.

> > > 3). The Greddy Type S BOV replaces the stock BOV and blows of
> > > back into the intake path similar to the stock BOV and like the stock
> BOV,
> > has
> > > the tendency to leak in applications that are running 20 psi or more.
>
> No, not true. If you need really a stronger spring then you can
> get it from
> Greddy.

If it doesn't leak why the need for a stronger spring?  See your own
statement above.  They ALL leak at some point, hence the need for stronger
springs.  Some leak sooner than others.

> Roger



Barry


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2001 01:06:48 +0100
From: "Roger Gerl \(RTEC\)" <roger.gerl@bluewin.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Re: Greddy Type S BOV

> Based upon what exactly?  I know several SSBOV installations that work
fine.
> I also know of a number that do not.  I have seen many brands work and the
> same brands not work.  It depends upon how they are installed and how the
> system is tuned.

This is true, in general all the venting back solutions work fine. In some
cases adjusting the Blitz to let it run perfectly is less easier than with
the HKS or Greddy. I also installed one the customer brought with him and it
works with no adjusting without any problems ... but car is not above 14
psi.

> > I disagree in this because I had the HKS on my car and during shifting,
> > there was aleways an ultrarich condition due to the measured air was
> > released. Problem got not really recognized but visible in the
> > datalogs. The Greddy Type S solved the problem.
>
> First of all, if there is no problem, there is no problem.

I finally decided, that the dark "puff" after shifting is a problem !

> condition.  Close a throttle plate (or slide, or venturi) and all of a
> sudden there is rich, then lean.  Completely normal.  If this does not
> create a drivability or performance problem, who cares what the data log
> says.

I do, the lenght of the rich condition got significantly shortened and the
response was better. Not that it was the world but what I felt was also
logged.

> Of course, you may disagree all you like.  I am stating as fact that in my
> application there is zero hesitation nor drivability issues with my SSBOV
> setup.  Pretty simple.  I can lift, shift and get into it again without
lag,

Good ... no improvement necessary !

> If it doesn't leak why the need for a stronger spring?  See your own
> statement above.  They ALL leak at some point, hence the need for stronger
> springs.  Some leak sooner than others.

Well, this is a mechanical statement as it is clear that the area the
pressure pushes against to is larger than the little vacuum tube from the
manifold that holds against it. This is why every BOV must have something
like a rating for the spring. Also if the spring is harder it can release
the pressure much quicker. This is necessary for higher boost applications
so the pressure can be relieved much quicker. For anything below 1.5 bars
the stock springs in the Greddy Type S is fine enough. Afterwards, the Type
R comes in play or just the R spring in the S.

A little sidenote : if an aftermarket fuel system is used with larger
injectors and a  fuel controller, the "rich"-effect comes more in play. I
recognized this especially with the ARC setup.

Roger
93'3000GT TT
www.rtec.ch



***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 19:16:54 -0500
From: "Michael Bulaon" <profilevr4@3000gtvr4.net>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Re: Greddy Type S BOV

Just wondering, Does anyone know how loud the Greddy Type S BOV is, compared
to the stock BOV when it's routed back to the intake.

- -----Original Message-----
From: owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st
[mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On Behalf Of GTOTLR@cs.com
Sent: Monday, January 01, 2001 1:42 AM
To: stealth@starnet.net; Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
Subject: Team3S: Re: Greddy Type S BOV


3). The Greddy Type S BOV replaces the stock BOV and blows of back into the
intake path similar to the stock BOV and like the stock BOV, has the
tendency
to leak in applications that are running 20 psi or more.


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 19:29:05 -0800 (PST)
From: Geoff Mohler <gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: High Flow Cat?

Ive heard this multiple times from shops all over the country (and out of
it).

SCC even did a test with a 'high flow' cat once, and lost 2hp.

*shrug*

A convertor has to have a certain amount of resistance to flow to work,
because the gasses need to stay in contact with the catylist for a long
enough period of time to work.

On Mon, 1 Jan 2001, Barry E. King wrote:

> I asked my muffler guy about a hi-flow cat a few years back.  He said
> "You're looking at it" and pointed to the stocker.  He could sell me Random
> Technologies and others and make some cash, but he stated, without
> hesitation, that they don't offer any improvement over a stock one.  He told
> me he'd sell me one if I wanted or if I needed a new one, but other than
> that there would be zero benefit.  *shrug*
>
> Notice how the flow comparisons offered by these companies are never against
> a stock cat (at least not the last time I chekced)?  I'll get one when I
> need a replacement, but I don't think I'll bother until that time.  Seems to
> be better places to spend the money.
>
>
> Barry
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> >
> > In search of more upgrades to do to my car as of now, i stumbled upon this
> > site which lists larger flow cats for VR-4s for $175.  What diameter is
> > this?  I am going with a 3" exhaust system to a muffler then two
> > 2.25" outs
> > from there.
> >
> > www.discountconverter.com
> >
> > Would that be beneficial, or should I look to another company  - Random
> > Technologies???
> >
> > -Cody
>
>
> ***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
>


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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Date: Mon, 01 Jan 2001 19:24:52 -0800
From: Todd Schmalzried <q11981@email.mot.com>
Subject: Team3S: clacking noise question

My car was making a funny noise a few days ago, so I parked it. I think
it was a lifter problem, but it's gone now. I would like an opinion from
you guys on the list.

History: '94 vr-4 120k miles. flushed oil with "gunk", ran 10-40 dino
oil for ~1000 miles. parts store was out of 10-30 mobil1, so used 5-30
mobil1 instead, new filter.

Problem: started on christmas vac. trip. at about 600 miles (Utah,
really cold to us californians) pulled over for gas. when i stopped at
the pump it started clacking really badly. changed with rpm. assumed it
was a rod bearing. got a hotel room because I was really frustrated at
this point. (had a blow out at 300 miles. finished off my bad rim, and
new tire kept leaking) in the morning I started it up, and the noise was
gone. turned around and headed home. started ticking again, below 2500
rmp, after about 150 miles. got stuck in LA traffic. now ticking was
just between 2500 and 3000 rpm. when I got home i played with it. noise
seemed to be from top end, instead of bottom. hoping it was just a
sticky lifter which didn't like the thinner oil.

Questions:
Could this be a collapsed/stuck lifter?
Did I do any damage driving with it this way?

I would appreciate any feedback or opinions from you guys.

Thanks.
Todd

- --
Todd Schmalzried                      q11981@email.mot.com
Motorola Network Field Engineering    Phone: (619) 933-1700
2121 Palomar Airport Road, Suite 301  Fax:   (760) 603-4920
Carlsbad, CA. 92009                   Pager: (888)
694-0222                    
- -You "put your 2 cents in" but only get "a penny for your thoughts"
- -Who gets the change? Think about it.  O-

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Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 21:37:20 -0600
From: "cody" <overclck@flash.net>
Subject: Team3S: O2 Sensor

OK, in looking for more stuff for my car, I am in search of a wideband o2
sensor.

I already have an autometer A/F Ratio gauge, and its is currently hooked up
to the factory o2 sensor.  My car has over 100K miles, and is 7, now almost
8 years old, so I am going to go ahead and replace the o2 sensor while the
exhaust is getting refinished.  I have read much talk about the factory o2
sensors being not so accurate, so what are my options?

Autometer sells a o2 sensor, but would it work for the factory o2 sensor
(and is it a good replacement?) as well as for the autometer gauge I have???

- -Cody


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 19:43:55 -0800 (PST)
From: Geoff Mohler <gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: O2 Sensor

The OEM is "accurate" as far as the ECU requires..

A wideband will cost heavy $$$ and offer the ECU no real improvement in
readings at all.

A few people tried it on thier Supras and one I know on his GT4
Celica..didnt do anything but cost money.  The A/F guage was "better" but
not so much that they (Supras) could tune in any extra Hp that was worth
the cost.

On Mon, 1 Jan 2001, cody wrote:

> OK, in looking for more stuff for my car, I am in search of a wideband o2
> sensor.
>
> I already have an autometer A/F Ratio gauge, and its is currently hooked up
> to the factory o2 sensor.  My car has over 100K miles, and is 7, now almost
> 8 years old, so I am going to go ahead and replace the o2 sensor while the
> exhaust is getting refinished.  I have read much talk about the factory o2
> sensors being not so accurate, so what are my options?
>
> Autometer sells a o2 sensor, but would it work for the factory o2 sensor
> (and is it a good replacement?) as well as for the autometer gauge I have???
>
> -Cody
>
>
> ***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
>


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 20:57:27 -0700
From: "Barry E. King" <beking@home.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: O2 Sensor

A wide band EGO will do absolutely nothing for the performance or
reliability of the car.  The ECU is ONLY interested in cross-counts from
generally rich to generally lean, roughly 0.5V on a typical O2 sensor.  Even
with an off-the-sheld EGO you STILL won't be able to rely upon it to tune
the car accurately.  There are better places to spend the money.


Barry

> -----Original Message-----
>
> OK, in looking for more stuff for my car, I am in search of a wideband o2
> sensor.
>
> I already have an autometer A/F Ratio gauge, and its is currently
> hooked up
> to the factory o2 sensor.  My car has over 100K miles, and is 7,
> now almost
> 8 years old, so I am going to go ahead and replace the o2 sensor while the
> exhaust is getting refinished.  I have read much talk about the factory o2
> sensors being not so accurate, so what are my options?
>
> Autometer sells a o2 sensor, but would it work for the factory o2 sensor
> (and is it a good replacement?) as well as for the autometer
> gauge I have???
>
> -Cody


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 22:07:37 -0600
From: "cody" <overclck@flash.net>
Subject: RE: Team3S: O2 Sensor

OK, so EGT sensor then?

- -Cody

#-----Original Message-----
#From: owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st
#[mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On Behalf Of Barry E. King
#Sent: Monday, January 01, 2001 9:57 PM
#To: Team3S
#Subject: RE: Team3S: O2 Sensor
#
#
#A wide band EGO will do absolutely nothing for the performance or
#reliability of the car.  The ECU is ONLY interested in cross-counts from
#generally rich to generally lean, roughly 0.5V on a typical O2
#sensor.  Even
#with an off-the-sheld EGO you STILL won't be able to rely upon it to tune
#the car accurately.  There are better places to spend the money.
#
#
#Barry
#
#> -----Original Message-----
#>
#> OK, in looking for more stuff for my car, I am in search of a wideband o2
#> sensor.
#>
#> I already have an autometer A/F Ratio gauge, and its is currently
#> hooked up
#> to the factory o2 sensor.  My car has over 100K miles, and is 7,
#> now almost
#> 8 years old, so I am going to go ahead and replace the o2 sensor
#while the
#> exhaust is getting refinished.  I have read much talk about the
#factory o2
#> sensors being not so accurate, so what are my options?
#>
#> Autometer sells a o2 sensor, but would it work for the factory o2 sensor
#> (and is it a good replacement?) as well as for the autometer
#> gauge I have???
#>
#> -Cody
#
#
#***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
#


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 22:34:42 -0600
From: "cody" <overclck@flash.net>
Subject: Team3S: Triple Gauge Pod

Where can i find one, or are they even manufactured for our cars?

I swear I have seen one, but can't find it for the life of me now...

- -Cody

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 20:39:33 -0800 (PST)
From: Geoff Mohler <gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: O2 Sensor

Ya...EGT is important.

I really like my Greddy one, very very fast reacting.

On Mon, 1 Jan 2001, cody wrote:

> OK, so EGT sensor then?
>
> -Cody
>
> #-----Original Message-----
> #From: owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st
> #[mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On Behalf Of Barry E. King
> #Sent: Monday, January 01, 2001 9:57 PM
> #To: Team3S
> #Subject: RE: Team3S: O2 Sensor
> #
> #
> #A wide band EGO will do absolutely nothing for the performance or
> #reliability of the car.  The ECU is ONLY interested in cross-counts from
> #generally rich to generally lean, roughly 0.5V on a typical O2
> #sensor.  Even
> #with an off-the-sheld EGO you STILL won't be able to rely upon it to tune
> #the car accurately.  There are better places to spend the money.
> #
> #
> #Barry
> #
> #> -----Original Message-----
> #>
> #> OK, in looking for more stuff for my car, I am in search of a wideband o2
> #> sensor.
> #>
> #> I already have an autometer A/F Ratio gauge, and its is currently
> #> hooked up
> #> to the factory o2 sensor.  My car has over 100K miles, and is 7,
> #> now almost
> #> 8 years old, so I am going to go ahead and replace the o2 sensor
> #while the
> #> exhaust is getting refinished.  I have read much talk about the
> #factory o2
> #> sensors being not so accurate, so what are my options?
> #>
> #> Autometer sells a o2 sensor, but would it work for the factory o2 sensor
> #> (and is it a good replacement?) as well as for the autometer
> #> gauge I have???
> #>
> #> -Cody
> #
> #
> #***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
> #
>
>
> ***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
>


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 23:39:26 EST
From: StevePKT77@aol.com
Subject: Team3S: Another O2 Sensor question

OK since we're talking about O2 sensors, I'm wondering just what goes wrong
when they go bad?  My 92 R/T seems to run rich, but would this be caused by a
bad O2 sensor?  Also, when an O2 sensor goes is there a warning light on the
dashboard like in many other cars, or do we have to figure it out for
ourselves?  Thanks for any input.
- -Steve

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 20:46:35 -0800 (PST)
From: Geoff Mohler <gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Another O2 Sensor question

It'd be nice to replace every 60K miles, 100K if youre _really_ on a
budget.  Replacing the cat every 100K can yield a lot of lost power as
well.

A truly screwed sensor can light up the Chk Eng light, but not a work out
one.

On Mon, 1 Jan 2001 StevePKT77@aol.com wrote:

> OK since we're talking about O2 sensors, I'm wondering just what goes wrong
> when they go bad?  My 92 R/T seems to run rich, but would this be caused by a
> bad O2 sensor?  Also, when an O2 sensor goes is there a warning light on the
> dashboard like in many other cars, or do we have to figure it out for
> ourselves?  Thanks for any input.
> -Steve
>
> ***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***
>


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 00:37:49 -0500
From: Bill Wagner <wagner@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: clacking noise question

Todd:

The facts that the noise comes and goes, is coming from the top end, and
varies with RPM almost always points to a noisy lash adjuster. A method
described in the service manual is to SLOWLY rev the car from
idle->3000rpm->idle three times, with each cycle taking 30 seconds.
Supposedly this will force air trapped in the adjusters (which is one of
the causes of the noise) to go away .... at least temporarilly anyway.

I had the lash adjuster problem BAD for about three years...so bad in
fact I considered getting the adjusters replaced. I thought the story in
the service manuals about the oil getting aerated by the crankshaft was
really just some type of bogus excuse Mitsubishi made up to try to
compensate for a bad design. A friend of mine sells AMSOIL and he
claimed that there oils wouldn't aerate but Mobil 1 would. I figured
that I might as well try it since I'd tried many of the other tricks but
they never seemed to last long (Marvel Mystery Oil and Risolone with
Mobil 1, using different viscocity's of Mobil 1...these always seemed to
work for about 1000 miles and then the problem would appear).

I put in the AMSOIL 10W-30 Turbo Formulated oil and the lash adjuster
noise is GONE!!!! FINALLY GONE!!!!

I now believe that the aeration explanation that Mitsu gives in the
service manual is probably correct. I'm also convinced that the AMSOIL
doesn't aerate as quickly as Mobil 1, if at all. For what it's worth,
when I was using non-synthetic oils, the noise would show up immediately
after an oil change. At least with Mobil 1 it would go away for a while.

Keep in mind that other problems can cause this noise (sticking or
damaged adjuster) and if this is occuring, it will obviously not be
fixed by just changing oils.

Good Luck,

Bill Wagner


Todd Schmalzried wrote:
>
> My car was making a funny noise a few days ago, so I parked it. I think
> it was a lifter problem, but it's gone now. I would like an opinion from
> you guys on the list.
>
> History: '94 vr-4 120k miles. flushed oil with "gunk", ran 10-40 dino
> oil for ~1000 miles. parts store was out of 10-30 mobil1, so used 5-30
> mobil1 instead, new filter.
>
> Problem: started on christmas vac. trip. at about 600 miles (Utah,
> really cold to us californians) pulled over for gas. when i stopped at
> the pump it started clacking really badly. changed with rpm. assumed it
> was a rod bearing. got a hotel room because I was really frustrated at
> this point. (had a blow out at 300 miles. finished off my bad rim, and
> new tire kept leaking) in the morning I started it up, and the noise was
> gone. turned around and headed home. started ticking again, below 2500
> rmp, after about 150 miles. got stuck in LA traffic. now ticking was
> just between 2500 and 3000 rpm. when I got home i played with it. noise
> seemed to be from top end, instead of bottom. hoping it was just a
> sticky lifter which didn't like the thinner oil.
>
> Questions:
> Could this be a collapsed/stuck lifter?
> Did I do any damage driving with it this way?
>
> I would appreciate any feedback or opinions from you guys.
>
> Thanks.
> Todd
>
> --
> Todd Schmalzried                      q11981@email.mot.com
> Motorola Network Field Engineering    Phone: (619) 933-1700
> 2121 Palomar Airport Road, Suite 301  Fax:   (760) 603-4920
> Carlsbad, CA. 92009                   Pager: (888)
> 694-0222
> -You "put your 2 cents in" but only get "a penny for your thoughts"
> -Who gets the change? Think about it.  O-
>
> ***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2001 01:45:53 -0500
From: "Schilberg, Darren" <DSchilberg@freemarkets.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Triple Gauge Pod

Cody,

   I've never found one.  Might not be made anymore.  I ended up buying a
dual- and a single-gauge A-pillar pod to make my own triple.  I even fit it
snug over the pillar without gauges to see how it would be when driving
(road racing/AutoX) with my helmet on and assure I don't smack it at all.
Works fine.
   At the First Blue Ridge Gathering this past year I saw at least one
3000GT with a triple gauge pod on both the driver's and passenger's side
A-pillars.  The passenger's side is harder to see so was used for
less-important gauges to the driver (maybe intake temp and stuff like that).
   Maybe somebody will come forward that it was their car.  I can't remember
if that was a TT or N/A car as one of the guys was running nitrous on his NA
so a few gauges could have been for that.  I took some video of it that I
might review if I don't find the picture of it.
   I can give you the part numbers for the single- and dual-gauge pillar
pods too.  Just let me know.

- --Flash!
dschilberg@freemarkets.com

3Si #577
1995 Black VR-4 w/ K&N FIPK, a Valentine One, and a custom spark plug plate
http://www.ec3s.org/cgi-bin/gallery.cgi



 -----Original Message-----
From: cody [mailto:overclck@flash.net]
Sent: Monday, January 01, 2001 23:35

Where can i find one, or are they even manufactured for our cars?

I swear I have seen one, but can't find it for the life of me now...


***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2001 06:28:23 -0800 (PST)
From: Jeff Lucius <stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: High Flow Cat?

Well the ATR "high-flow" cat weighs 10 pounds less than the stocker
(5 vs. 15). The ATR also has 3" openings versus the 2.37" openings of
the stocker. I could see through the ATR cat; the stocker was like a
solid block (after 55,000 miles of course). A quick search of the net
showed that dyno results can be nearly identical for performance
engines with an open exhaust versus with a cat, with the right
tuning. While replacing a cat only that is working well is not worth
it, it is probably a good idea to replace it if the rest of the
exhaust is being upgraded. $175 seems like a very fair price.

Jeff Lucius, www.stealth316.com

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Geoff Mohler" <gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
To: "Barry E. King" <beking@home.com>
Cc: "Team3S" <team3s@mail.stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent: Monday, January 01, 2001 8:29 PM
Subject: RE: Team3S: High Flow Cat?


Ive heard this multiple times from shops all over the country (and
out of
it).

SCC even did a test with a 'high flow' cat once, and lost 2hp.

*shrug*

A convertor has to have a certain amount of resistance to flow to
work,
because the gasses need to stay in contact with the catylist for a
long
enough period of time to work.

On Mon, 1 Jan 2001, Barry E. King wrote:

> I asked my muffler guy about a hi-flow cat a few years back.  He
said
> "You're looking at it" and pointed to the stocker.  He could sell
me Random
> Technologies and others and make some cash, but he stated, without
> hesitation, that they don't offer any improvement over a stock one.
 He told
> me he'd sell me one if I wanted or if I needed a new one, but other
than
> that there would be zero benefit.  *shrug*
>
> Notice how the flow comparisons offered by these companies are
never against
> a stock cat (at least not the last time I chekced)?  I'll get one
when I
> need a replacement, but I don't think I'll bother until that time.
Seems to
> be better places to spend the money.
>
>
> Barry
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> >
> > In search of more upgrades to do to my car as of now, i stumbled
upon this
> > site which lists larger flow cats for VR-4s for $175.  What
diameter is
> > this?  I am going with a 3" exhaust system to a muffler then two
> > 2.25" outs
> > from there.
> >
> > www.discountconverter.com
> >
> > Would that be beneficial, or should I look to another company  -
Random
> > Technologies???
> >
> > -Cody


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***  Info:  http://www.Team3S.com/Rules.htm  ***

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End of team3s V1 #365
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