team3s
Thursday, October 12
2000 Volume 01 :
Number
291
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 11 Oct 2000 16:28:07 -0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
Team3S: test
Please ignore..test for the team3s lists to resolve issues
with Geocities
Email accounts.
-
-------------------------------------------------------------
|
The proven method to make a Supra race worthy, is to
|
| strip it down, and shove as many $20 bills as possible
|
| within
the cavity of the car
itself. |
-
-------------------------------------------------------------
***
Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 20:07:44
-0400 (EDT)
From: Mike Baldwin <
mbaldwin@eecs.tufts.edu>
Subject:
Team3S: Tire question: Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole Position vs. Yokahama AVS
Sport
Hi - I am trying to decide between these two tires. Bridgestone
Potenza
S-02 Pole Position vs. Yokahama AVS Sport. I live in the Bay
Area
(California) so I don't see any snow, just some rain. Mostly use the
car
to commute so I would like something that lasts and performs
well.
Thanks
Michael 1997 VR4
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 17:04:57
-0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Tire question: Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole Position vs. Yokahama
AVS Sport
Keep in mind that "performance" and rain dont go well
together.
You'd not have a problem with any of those tires in the rain as
long as
you adjusted your driving to fit the weather at the time.
Not
saying you cant get a performance rain tire, but most ppl when I hear
they
get some..still drive like its a dry day.
On Wed, 11 Oct 2000, Mike
Baldwin wrote:
> Hi - I am trying to decide between these two tires.
Bridgestone Potenza
> S-02 Pole Position vs. Yokahama AVS Sport. I live in
the Bay Area
> (California) so I don't see any snow, just some rain.
Mostly use the car
> to commute so I would like something that lasts and
performs well.
>
> Thanks
>
> Michael 1997 VR4
>
>
>
> *** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
>
-
-------------------------------------------------------------
|
The proven method to make a Supra race worthy, is to
|
| strip it down, and shove as many $20 bills as possible
|
| within
the cavity of the car
itself. |
-
-------------------------------------------------------------
***
Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 17:24:39
-0700 (PDT)
From: Geoff Mohler <
gemohler@www.speedtoys.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Re: Cracked header = boost leak?
Should be able to weld it..cant
hurt can it *grin*
On Wed, 11 Oct 2000, Chris Maxwell wrote:
>
I think I finally (well my friend pointed it out) the reason why I can't seem to
hold more than .4 bar of boost with my 355 turbos. I think there is a
crack in at least one of my headers (I can't see the rear). Here are links
to a couple pics I took for you guys to look at and judge:
>
>
http://24.12.60.132/stealth/crack01.jpg>
http://24.12.60.132/stealth/crack02.jpg
<-- this one is a little blurry
>
> The pics are only about 20k
each, so don't worry about load time.
>
> Well, assuming this crack
goes all the way through the metal (which is almost certain I think), is it
possible to repair the header with a weld or do I have to replace it? How much
does a header cost at the dealer? I'd hate to have to fork over a few
hundred MORE dollars on this car.
>
> Thanks again,
> Chris
Maxwell
> 92 R/T TT
>
-
-------------------------------------------------------------
|
The proven method to make a Supra race worthy, is to
|
| strip it down, and shove as many $20 bills as possible
|
| within
the cavity of the car
itself. |
-
-------------------------------------------------------------
***
Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 13:51:49
+1300
From: Kevin Clark <
Kevin.Clark@hnz.co.nz>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Tire question: Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole Position vs. Yokahama
AVS Sport
> Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole Position vs. Yokahama AVS
Sport.
> I live in the Bay Area (California) so I don't see any
snow,
> just some rain. Mostly use the car to commute so I would
like
> something that lasts and performs well.
I get a fair amount
of rain where I live and love the performance
of the Potenza S-02. I
have used them for three years now and
have no trouble whatsoever in heavy
rain (I would say that is a
perfect wet weather tire).
I need to
change the front tires every 12 months, and the rear
every second time I
replace the front. For example I purchase
two tires, then four, then
two, etc, every twelve months. The
Potenza S-02 Pole Position
(225/55-16) cost NZ$390 (US$164)
over here. I run the tires on a '91
GTO-VR4 running 1.05bar
(15psi) boost without slippage in the wet (maybe I am
not
punching it hard enough?).
Hope this
helps,
Cheers,
Kevin.
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 17:50:29
-0700
From: "Watkins, Jim" <
jim.watkins@terayon.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Tire question: Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole Position vs. Yokahama
AVS Sport
You may want to check also the Firestone Firehawk SZ50
EP. It's cheaper
than Potenza and wears longer, but with a very high
dry traction rating.
Jim 1995 Spyder VR4
- -----Original
Message-----
From: Mike Baldwin [
mailto:mbaldwin@eecs.tufts.edu]
Sent:
Wednesday, October 11, 2000 5:08 PM
To:
team3s-digest@mail.stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
Team3S: Tire question: Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole Position
vs. Yokahama
AVS Sport
Hi - I am trying to decide between these two tires.
Bridgestone Potenza
S-02 Pole Position vs. Yokahama AVS Sport. I live in the
Bay Area
(California) so I don't see any snow, just some rain. Mostly use the
car
to commute so I would like something that lasts and performs
well.
Thanks
Michael 1997 VR4
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 21:03:26
EDT
From: "Michael D. Crose" <
ncsu4me@hotmail.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Faint squealing sound that comes from the front right wheel
area
Hi,
I hear a faint squealing sound every once in a while that
seems to come from
the front right wheel area, I thought it was the brakes
but I took the pads
out and cleaned the silencing pad put some brake
grease(don't know what it
is called got it at Auto Zone, supposed to quiet
noisy brakes) on the back
of it and cleaned the rotor and caliper assembly
with brake cleaner. This
did not seem to help the problem, what could
this
be?
Thanks,
Michael
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------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 22:13:39
-0000
From: "Sam Shelat" <
sshelat@erols.com>
Subject: Fw:
Team3S: Rotor Update
- -----Original Message-----
From: Michael D.
Crose <
ncsu4me@hotmail.com>
To:
sshelat@erols.com <
sshelat@erols.com>
Date: Wednesday,
October 11, 2000 1:53 AM
Subject: Re: Team3S: Rotor Update
>I
was at a Motorola Cup event and saw an incredible brake system on
a
>Porsche 993, here is a picture
>
http://www.motorolacup.com/gallery10/pages/DSC00082_JPG.htm>
>I
emailed NewTech to see if they make commercially available systems and
if
>so which vehicles do they have systems available. There website
is
>
http://www.newtech-ibs.com/aswf/flashanglais.htm>
>That
system seems like it would be very effective at stopping and cooling,
>360
degree contact and cooling fins.
>
>Checking out some
possibilities,
>Michael D.
Crose
>_________________________________________________________________________
>Get
Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at
http://www.hotmail.com.
>
>Share
information about yourself, create your own public profile at
>
http://profiles.msn.com.
>
>
***
Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 07:38:27
-0700
From: Richard <
radanc@home.com>
Subject: Team3S: Brake
Kit Discount Available
Hi All,
I am passing this along to all
interested as a favor to a friend that
has provided a lot of his expertise in
brake kit upgrades to me over
many months which has consumed a good bit of
his time. He is the North
American Distributor of Mov'it North America and
his site is
www.ultimategarage.com (big brake
kits). He is extremely knowledgeable
re: Porsche brakes and Mov'it is the
largest customer of Porsche brake
components which has afforded them many
benefits. They test many new
components Porsche is developing and even though
they state kits cannot
be broken up, Steve seems willing to consider this.
eg. He can get us
Porsche 993 Turbo rotors which retail (last I checked in
CA) for $216 a
piece for $175. These are the best rotors available, but
unfortunately
require hats machined specially by a shop out of steel for
~$400 or they
use 7075 aircraft quality lightweight aluminum (very tough) for
$700.
Unfortunately kits with rotors, hats, calipers (extensive machining
done
here too), pads, and lines are available for 93 and above
3000's/stealth
currently. that leaves me out:(. I pass this on since some
have asked
for good Porsche information re: brakes. this site has good info.
Check
out FAQs under big brakes. Steve is interested in giving discounts
to
any as a model for this kit and want to take pictures, etc. to
help
advertise this kit. Most of the market is Beamers, Porsches, etc..
FYI
Hans Stuck is a big customer. At 245 on the Moulson straight
(SP?)
braking to under 100 I think he knows his brakes. Other sites I
have
passed on are:
www.rennsportsystems.com (excellent
Porsche info as well as brake fluid
comparisons etc.)
The other Mov'it
sites (German site (their headquarters) and the North
American sites are also
linked to UltimateGarage.
Hope this helps
Rich
92 Stealth
TT
*** Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 07:47:28
-0700
From: Richard <
radanc@home.com>
Subject: Team3S: Re:
Brake Kit Discount Available
Whoops, the
www.rennsportsystems.com link should
include a /porsche
Rich
92 Stealth TT
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 22:50:03
-0400
From: Ken Stanton <
tt007ken@yahoo.com>
Subject: Team3S:
Glowing turbo
Hello all
After driving my car down the interstate
tonight, I heard an unusual
noise.. disregarding that, when I looked under
the hood, the intake side
of my back turbo was glowing cherry red.
Help. Please.
Ken Stanton
'91 Pearl White
RT/TT
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------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 20:12:36
-0700
From: "Jim Berry" <
fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Glowing turbo
They'll do that if you were pushing the car --- under hard
extended use the turbos
will get to a redish yellow state. A lot lf heat
passes through the system.
Jim
Berry
=======================================================
- -----
Original Message -----
From: Ken Stanton <
tt007ken@yahoo.com>
> Hello
all
>
> After driving my car down the interstate tonight, I heard
an unusual
> noise.. disregarding that, when I looked under the hood, the
intake side
> of my back turbo was glowing cherry red. Help.
Please.
>
> Ken Stanton
> '91 Pearl White
RT/TT
*** Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 00:41:42
-0700
From: "noble" <
nketo@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Team3S:
turbo leaking
This origional question was asked by Chris Maxwell
in
regards to his boosting problems with his 355 gtpro turbos.
Those
pictures depicts the manifold heat shield covers.
It is unlikely that you'd
crack the exhaust manifolds themselves as
they are pretty thick, unless you
got into an accident.
You'd have to remove the covers and the manifolds
to be sure.
I'd start with the gaskets used when the 355's were
dropped;
they all need to be new and torqued to specs.
You might just have
a few loose manifold/turbo bolts.
Aside from that, inspect your
wastegates. They need a lot of force to
hold them in place, and if
they're weak, you'll get premature boost leak.
Good
luck,
Noble
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 00:47:38
-0700
From: "noble" <
nketo@sympatico.ca>
Subject: Team3S:
porting question
Hey everyone,
I've read about DSM's porting their
exhaust manifolds for more airflow.
Since I've got mine out, should this be
done?
I noticed that one of the turbo gaskets on the DSMs is round to
guide
the turbo into place. What some guys do is machine out the entire
gasket
as well as the surrounding area for more airflow.
Sounds like a
good idea, but what about sealing? To those that have done
this and
driven their 3000/stealths under full boost, have you had any
problems simply
running on 1 flat gasket instead of 2 gaskets, like
the
factory
recommends?
Thanks in
advance,
Noble
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 21:46:25
-0700
From: "Veilside GTO" <
gtovr4@postalzone.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Tire question: Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole Position vs.
YokahamaAVS Sport
Michael,
I have the S02s on my VR4 and have been
a loyal fan of Bridgestone for 4
years. Those S02s work well in the rain. I
used them to get thru thick snow
on some of the mountain passes here in
Washington State and it was real
impressive. Of course, the AWD on our cars
helped the most! :) The S02 pole
position is available on most sizes except
the one set I am currently using
which is 265 35/18. The pole position is
suppose to have another sticky
layer beneath the thread so that if the main
thread wears, the sticky
substance will still allow you to grip the road.
Honestly, both the S02 pole
and non pole position have that, so you shouldn't
have to worry.
Hope this helps.
Julian Huang
94 Mitsubishi
Veilside Tein TEC GTO tt
Team 3S
Seattle, Washington
gtovr4@postalzone.com-
-----Original Message-----
From:
owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st[
mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On
Behalf Of Mike Baldwin
Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2000 5:08 PM
To:
team3s-digest@mail.stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
Team3S: Tire question: Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole Position
vs. YokahamaAVS
Sport
Hi - I am trying to decide between these two tires. Bridgestone
Potenza
S-02 Pole Position vs. Yokahama AVS Sport. I live in the Bay
Area
(California) so I don't see any snow, just some rain. Mostly use the
car
to commute so I would like something that lasts and performs
well.
Thanks
Michael 1997 VR4
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 00:06:57
-0500
From: "Jannusch, Matt" <
mjannusch@marketwatch.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: porting question
> I noticed that one of the turbo gaskets
on the DSMs
> is round to guide the turbo into place. What
some
> guys do is machine out the entire gasket as well
> as the
surrounding area for more airflow.
You could skip the ring gasket and
port the steps for that ring out of the
exhaust side turbo inlet and the
manifold. I don't think you'd really see
any difference in airflow
though, as this area isn't any more of a
restriction than the rest of the
manifold, and it would restrict back down
to the same diameter as it enters
the turbo. On the other hand, it
shouldn't hurt anything. Should
be okay to go without the ring gasket
installed, however you'll need to make
sure the turbo is mounted to the
manifold exactly on-center which will be
difficult without the ring gasket.
If it isn't perfectly centered then you'll
be introducing a worse
restriction than if you had the ring in
place.
> Sounds like a good idea, but what about sealing?
> To
those that have done this and driven their
> 3000/stealths under full
boost, have you had any
> problems simply running on 1 flat gasket
instead
> of 2 gaskets, like the factory recommends?
The ring
gasket isn't really sufficient to seal anything, so the flat crush
gasket is
already doing all (or most) of the work. Should be okay, but keep
in
mind that you don't want to be taking this stuff apart again so if
there's
any question about it then you might want to skip it.
- -Matt
'95
3000GT Spyder VR4
*** Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 00:40:03
-0700
From: "Chris Maxwell" <
shmacker@home.com>
Subject: Team3S:
Cracked headers = boost leak? (again)
Sorry, I forgot to unformat the
email for the tech list. here it is again:
I think I finally (well
my friend pointed it out) the reason why I can't
seem to hold more than .4
bar of boost with my 355 turbos. I think there is
a crack in at least
one of my headers (I can't see the rear). Here are
links to a couple
pics I took for you guys to look at and judge:
http://24.12.60.132/stealth/crack01.jpghttp://24.12.60.132/stealth/crack02.jpg
<-- this one is a little blurry
The pics are only about 20k each, so
don't worry about load time.
Well, assuming this crack goes all the way
through the metal (which is
almost certain I think), is it possible to repair
the header with a weld or
do I have to replace it? How much does a header
cost at the dealer? I'd
hate to have to fork over a few hundred MORE
dollars on this car.
Thanks again,
Chris Maxwell
92 R/T
TT
*** Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 10:08:35
+0200
From: Roger Gerl <
roger.gerl@bluewin.ch>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Cracked headers = boost leak? (again)
This is strange as the
metal is not that thin there. It shouldn't be a
problem at all to weld this
part but I wonder how thik the manifold is there.
Roger
93'3000GT
TT
www.rtec.chAt 00:40
12.10.2000 -0700, Chris Maxwell wrote:
>Sorry, I forgot to unformat the
email for the tech list. here it is again:
>
>I think I
finally (well my friend pointed it out) the reason why I can't
>seem to
hold more than .4 bar of boost with my 355 turbos. I think there
is
>a crack in at least one of my headers (I can't see the rear).
Here are
>links to a couple pics I took for you guys to look at and
judge:
>
>
http://24.12.60.132/stealth/crack01.jpg>
http://24.12.60.132/stealth/crack02.jpg
<-- this one is a little blurry
>
>The pics are only about 20k
each, so don't worry about load time.
*** Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 06:38:46
-0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Lucius <
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Cracked headers = boost leak? (again)
Hi Chris,
I
assume you mean exhaust manifolds. As noble pointed out, the
"crack" is in
the heat shield in the pictures you posted. If you are
developing boost at
all, more than likely the exhaust side of the
plumbing is working just fine,
at least for one turbo. The most
likely reason your turbos only develop 0.4
bar of boost is because
all of the boost reference pressure from the Y-pipe
is going to the
wastegates and they are opening just like they should.
Wastegates
stuck open then no boost. Wastegates stuck closed then (possibly)
too
much boost.
Our wastegates will fully open when they "see" about 6
to 7 psi of
boost (0.41 to 0.48 bar). The only way we can develop higher
boost
than that is too fool the wastegates into staying closed longer.
In
other words, we either restrict or bleed off pressure in the
boost
reference hose from the Y-pipe; the wastegates "see" only 4
psi,
let's say, of pressure when really there may be 8 or 12 psi
of
pressure in the Y-pipe. I think you should look carefully at
every
piece of your boost control system from Y-pipe to wastegate -
every
hose, every connection, and the boost control solenoid (stock
or
aftermarket) - for the source of your problem. Take out the battery
and
washer tank (see my Garage web page for tips), and the MAS/air
filter to get
a clear view of all the intake hoses and devices. Now
if you were developing
no boost at all you could suspect a major leak
somewhere (like a
loose/cracked IC pipe), but the 0.4 bar number
suggests the wastegates are
"seeing" all of the Y-pipe pressure.
As a semi-dangerous test, pinch
closed the pressure hose that goes to
each wastegate and see what happens.
Boost should go way up as the
wastegates never see any pressure signal to
open.
Jeff Lucius, 3SI #476
-->
http://www.stealth316.com/- -----
Original Message -----
From: "Chris Maxwell" <
shmacker@home.com>
To: <
team3s@mail.stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Thursday, October 12, 2000 1:40 AM
Subject: Team3S: Cracked headers = boost
leak? (again)
Sorry, I forgot to unformat the email for the tech
list. here it is
again:
I think I finally (well my friend
pointed it out) the reason why I
can't seem to hold more than .4 bar of boost
with my 355 turbos. I
think there is a crack in at least one of my
headers (I can't see the
rear). Here are links to a couple pics I took
for you guys to look
at and judge:
http://24.12.60.132/stealth/crack01.jpghttp://24.12.60.132/stealth/crack02.jpg
<-- this one is a little
blurry
The pics are only about 20k each,
so don't worry about load time.
Well, assuming this crack goes all the
way through the metal (which
is
almost certain I think), is it possible to
repair the header with a
weld or do I have to replace it? How much does a
header cost at the
dealer? I'd hate to have to fork over a few hundred
MORE dollars on
this car.
Thanks again,
Chris Maxwell
92 R/T
TT
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------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 07:25:32
-0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Lucius <
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Steering wheel affects oil pressure gauge
I notice when the car
is warm or cold, that when I turn the steering
wheel, the oil pressure gauge
in my '92 TT will peak at high.
Does anybody else observe this
phenomenon?
Does anybody have an explanation? I suspect the problem is
electrical
in nature as I don't see how the oil pressure can rise
dramatically
without a rise in RPM (crankshaft speed that turns the oil
pump).
I have looked at the manuals and it appears to me that
(1) the
wire from the B-36 connector (oil pressure gauge unit, OPGU)
goes directly to
the combination gauge (not ECU),
(2) the power steering fluid system is
closed and seperate completely
from the engine lubrication system,
(3)
the PS fluid level sensor goes directly to the warning light (not
ECU), and
(4), the steering wheel position sensor (SWPS) output goes directly
to
the ECS control unit (not ECU).
The OPGU is a variable resistor that
sends higher voltage to the ECU
when the internal contacts are kept closed
longer (when oil pressure
is higher). The only electrical connection to the
power steering is
the 4WS fluid level sensor (an on/off switch). Now there is
a sensor
for steering wheel position by the steering wheel but I don't see
how
this might affect the OPGU voltage as the OPGU does not go to the
ECU
that I can see - maybe it does - and neither does the SWPS voltage
-
maybe it does to. Have I missed something?
Any ideas for this weird
"problem"?
Thanks,
Jeff Lucius, 3SI #476
-->
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------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 09:26:29
-0500
From: "cody" <
overclck@flash.net>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Steering wheel affects oil pressure gauge
Ahh check it out - this
one is alot easier than you would think.
Try sitting inone place and
turning the steering wheel. Now closely observe
the RPM
gauge.
The engine actually idles up a bit whenever you turn the steering
wheel, to
allow the power assist to actually do its job.
That's the
reason the oil pressure raises.
- -Cody
- -----Original
Message-----
From:
owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st[
mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On
Behalf Of Jeff Lucius
Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2000 9:26 AM
To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
Team3S: Steering wheel affects oil pressure gauge
I notice when the
car is warm or cold, that when I turn the steering
wheel, the oil pressure
gauge in my '92 TT will peak at high.
Does anybody else observe this
phenomenon?
Does anybody have an explanation? I suspect the problem is
electrical
in nature as I don't see how the oil pressure can rise
dramatically
without a rise in RPM (crankshaft speed that turns the oil
pump).
I have looked at the manuals and it appears to me that
(1) the
wire from the B-36 connector (oil pressure gauge unit, OPGU)
goes directly to
the combination gauge (not ECU),
(2) the power steering fluid system is
closed and seperate completely
from the engine lubrication system,
(3) the
PS fluid level sensor goes directly to the warning light (not
ECU),
and
(4), the steering wheel position sensor (SWPS) output goes directly
to
the ECS control unit (not ECU).
The OPGU is a variable resistor that
sends higher voltage to the ECU
when the internal contacts are kept closed
longer (when oil pressure
is higher). The only electrical connection to the
power steering is
the 4WS fluid level sensor (an on/off switch). Now there is
a sensor
for steering wheel position by the steering wheel but I don't see
how
this might affect the OPGU voltage as the OPGU does not go to the
ECU
that I can see - maybe it does - and neither does the SWPS voltage
-
maybe it does to. Have I missed something?
Any ideas for this weird
"problem"?
Thanks,
Jeff Lucius, 3SI #476
-->
http://www.stealth316.com/__________________________________________________
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You Yahoo!?
Get Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere!
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Info:
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***
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***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 09:30:09
-0500
From: "cody" <
overclck@flash.net>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Steering wheel affects oil pressure gauge
I might add that I have
no idea how the ECU does this, but it does - you can
actually hear the engine
idle up when you turn the steering wheel.
- -Cody
(see previous
post)
- -----Original Message-----
From:
owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st[
mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On
Behalf Of Jeff Lucius
Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2000 9:26 AM
To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
Team3S: Steering wheel affects oil pressure gauge
I notice when the
car is warm or cold, that when I turn the steering
wheel, the oil pressure
gauge in my '92 TT will peak at high.
Does anybody else observe this
phenomenon?
Does anybody have an explanation? I suspect the problem is
electrical
in nature as I don't see how the oil pressure can rise
dramatically
without a rise in RPM (crankshaft speed that turns the oil
pump).
I have looked at the manuals and it appears to me that
(1) the
wire from the B-36 connector (oil pressure gauge unit, OPGU)
goes directly to
the combination gauge (not ECU),
(2) the power steering fluid system is
closed and seperate completely
from the engine lubrication system,
(3) the
PS fluid level sensor goes directly to the warning light (not
ECU),
and
(4), the steering wheel position sensor (SWPS) output goes directly
to
the ECS control unit (not ECU).
The OPGU is a variable resistor that
sends higher voltage to the ECU
when the internal contacts are kept closed
longer (when oil pressure
is higher). The only electrical connection to the
power steering is
the 4WS fluid level sensor (an on/off switch). Now there is
a sensor
for steering wheel position by the steering wheel but I don't see
how
this might affect the OPGU voltage as the OPGU does not go to the
ECU
that I can see - maybe it does - and neither does the SWPS voltage
-
maybe it does to. Have I missed something?
Any ideas for this weird
"problem"?
Thanks,
Jeff Lucius, 3SI #476
-->
http://www.stealth316.com/__________________________________________________
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You Yahoo!?
Get Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere!
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Info:
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***
*** Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 10:12:54
-0400
From: "Kevin Schappell" <
kevin@pacarsearch.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Steering wheel affects oil pressure gauge
The oil pressure
sender connection is very close to the steering system
(rack and tie
rods) Take a look under there and see if the wire has
worn
through. If the connection was loose the gauge would drop not
rise. Seems
like a short to ground would give you a max oil pressure
reading.
Kevin Schappell
Learn more about your car
http://www.AutoEducation.comOnline
Mobile Audio SuperStore
http://mobilesounds.vstorecar.com3SI
members.... you have to see this page
http://www.pacarsearch.com/motorhead/mitsu2.htm>
-----Original Message-----
> From:
owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st>
[
mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On
Behalf Of Jeff Lucius
> Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2000 10:26 AM
>
To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Subject: Team3S: Steering wheel affects oil pressure
gauge
>
>
> I notice when the car is warm or cold, that when I
turn the steering
> wheel, the oil pressure gauge in my '92 TT will peak
at high.
>
> Does anybody else observe this
phenomenon?
>
> Does anybody have an explanation? I suspect the
problem is electrical
> in nature as I don't see how the oil pressure can
rise dramatically
> without a rise in RPM (crankshaft speed that turns the
oil pump).
>
> I have looked at the manuals and it appears to me
that
> (1) the wire from the B-36 connector (oil pressure gauge unit,
OPGU)
> goes directly to the combination gauge (not ECU),
> (2) the
power steering fluid system is closed and seperate completely
> from the
engine lubrication system,
> (3) the PS fluid level sensor goes directly
to the warning light (not
> ECU), and
> (4), the steering wheel
position sensor (SWPS) output goes directly
> to the ECS control unit (not
ECU).
>
> The OPGU is a variable resistor that sends higher voltage
to the ECU
> when the internal contacts are kept closed longer (when oil
pressure
> is higher). The only electrical connection to the power
steering is
> the 4WS fluid level sensor (an on/off switch). Now there is
a sensor
> for steering wheel position by the steering wheel but I don't
see how
> this might affect the OPGU voltage as the OPGU does not go to
the ECU
> that I can see - maybe it does - and neither does the SWPS
voltage -
> maybe it does to. Have I missed something?
>
> Any
ideas for this weird "problem"?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jeff
Lucius, 3SI #476
> -->
http://www.stealth316.com/>
>
__________________________________________________
> Do You
Yahoo!?
> Get Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from
anywhere!
>
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>
*** Info:
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***
>
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 07:36:06
-0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Lucius <
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Steering wheel affects oil pressure gauge
Thanks Cody. Nice
idea but I checked that out already. I observed the
RPM when I turned the
steering wheel and no significant increase.
Also, I revved the engine a lot
with the steering wheel straight and
no (big) oil pressure increase. The oil
pressure gauge literally
pegs, not just raises up a little, when I turn the
wheel - even while
driving.
Any other ideas?
Thanks,
Jeff
Lucius
- ----- Original Message -----
From: "cody" <
overclck@flash.net>
To: "Jeff Lucius"
<
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Cc:
"Team3S" <
team3s@mail.stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Thursday, October 12, 2000 8:26 AM
Subject: RE: Team3S: Steering wheel
affects oil pressure gauge
Ahh check it out - this one is alot easier
than you would think.
Try sitting inone place and turning the steering
wheel. Now closely
observe the RPM gauge.
The engine actually
idles up a bit whenever you turn the steering
wheel, to allow the power
assist to actually do its job.
That's the reason the oil pressure
raises.
- -Cody
- ----- Original Message -----
From: "cody"
<
overclck@flash.net>
To: "Jeff
Lucius" <
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Cc:
"Team3S" <
team3s@mail.stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Thursday, October 12, 2000 8:30 AM
Subject: RE: Team3S: Steering wheel
affects oil pressure gauge
I might add that I have no idea how the
ECU does this, but it does -
you can actually hear the engine idle up when
you turn the steering
wheel.
- -Cody
(see previous post)
-
-----Original Message-----
From:
owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st[
mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On
Behalf Of Jeff Lucius
Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2000 9:26 AM
To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
Team3S: Steering wheel affects oil pressure gauge
I notice when the
car is warm or cold, that when I turn the steering
wheel, the oil pressure
gauge in my '92 TT will peak at high.
Does anybody else observe this
phenomenon?
Does anybody have an explanation? I suspect the problem is
electrical
in nature as I don't see how the oil pressure can rise
dramatically
without a rise in RPM (crankshaft speed that turns the oil
pump).
I have looked at the manuals and it appears to me that
(1) the
wire from the B-36 connector (oil pressure gauge unit, OPGU)
goes directly to
the combination gauge (not ECU),
(2) the power steering fluid system is
closed and seperate completely
from the engine lubrication system,
(3) the
PS fluid level sensor goes directly to the warning light (not
ECU),
and
(4), the steering wheel position sensor (SWPS) output goes directly
to
the ECS control unit (not ECU).
The OPGU is a variable resistor that
sends higher voltage to the ECU
when the internal contacts are kept closed
longer (when oil pressure
is higher). The only electrical connection to the
power steering is
the 4WS fluid level sensor (an on/off switch). Now there is
a sensor
for steering wheel position by the steering wheel but I don't see
how
this might affect the OPGU voltage as the OPGU does not go to the
ECU
that I can see - maybe it does - and neither does the SWPS voltage
-
maybe it does to. Have I missed something?
Any ideas for this weird
"problem"?
Thanks,
Jeff Lucius, 3SI #476
-->
http://www.stealth316.com/__________________________________________________
Do
You Yahoo!?
Get Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere!
http://mail.yahoo.com/***
Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
End of team3s V1
#291
*********************
team3s
Thursday, October 12
2000 Volume 01 :
Number
292
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 12 Oct 2000 10:07:01 -0500
From: "Willis, Charles E." <
cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Faint squealing sound that comes from the front right wheel
area
[Willis, Charles E.] Does the squeal happen only on applying
the
brakes, or while the wheels are rolling? If you hear the squeal
while
rolling, not only on braking, you might be hearing wheel bearing
noise. I
don't believe you can replace or repack the wheel bearings -
you have to
replace the whole hub. If you have to replace one side, you
may as well do
both sides.
Does the squeal happen continuously during
braking, or does it go
"squeak, squeak, squeak"? - that might be a warped
rotor. I didn't notice
whether you had the rotors faced off
(machined/milled/turned).
What kind of brake pads are you using?
Highly metallic pads (like
PAGID) squeak a lot in normal use, even when the
pads are new and the rotors
are flat to within 0.002".
Does the car
stop good? Or does it pull to one side? What
condition were the
calipers in? Did the dust boots on the caliper pistons
look good or
ragged out? If a piston sticks after you release pressure on
the brake
pedal, it can leave the pad in contact with the rotor. Over the
years,
these chrome pistons get corroded, and you have to clean them or
replace them
while rebuilding the calipers. Also the seals on the pistons
tend to
swell up and can make the pistons stick.
When was the last time you
drained and bled the brake system? The
fluid wouldn't directly affect
the squeal, but old fluid picks up water
which causes
corrosion.
Brakes are a good thing! Everybody concentrated on
horsepower, but
stopping my two-ton monster is very important to
me!
Chuck
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 13:48:24
-0400 (EDT)
From: Mike Baldwin <
mbaldwin@eecs.tufts.edu>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Tire question: Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole Position vs.
YokahamaAVS Sport
How has the wear been on these tires? I've heard that
they may wear a bit
faster than the Yoka's. Also, what is the average
lifespan of these tires
(miles)?
Thanks!
Michael
On
Wed, 11 Oct 2000, Veilside GTO wrote:
> Michael,
>
> I
have the S02s on my VR4 and have been a loyal fan of Bridgestone for 4
>
years. Those S02s work well in the rain. I used them to get thru thick
snow
> on some of the mountain passes here in Washington State and it was
real
> impressive. Of course, the AWD on our cars helped the most! :) The
S02 pole
> position is available on most sizes except the one set I am
currently using
> which is 265 35/18. The pole position is suppose to have
another sticky
> layer beneath the thread so that if the main thread
wears, the sticky
> substance will still allow you to grip the road.
Honestly, both the S02 pole
> and non pole position have that, so you
shouldn't have to worry.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
>
Julian Huang
> 94 Mitsubishi Veilside Tein TEC GTO tt
> Team
3S
> Seattle, Washington
>
gtovr4@postalzone.com>
>
-----Original Message-----
> From:
owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st>
[
mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On
Behalf Of Mike Baldwin
> Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2000 5:08 PM
>
To:
team3s-digest@mail.stealth-3000gt.st>
Subject: Team3S: Tire question: Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole Position
>
vs. YokahamaAVS Sport
>
>
> Hi - I am trying to decide
between these two tires. Bridgestone Potenza
> S-02 Pole Position vs.
Yokahama AVS Sport. I live in the Bay Area
> (California) so I don't see
any snow, just some rain. Mostly use the car
> to commute so I would like
something that lasts and performs well.
>
> Thanks
>
>
Michael 1997 VR4
>
>
>
> *** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
>
>
>
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 11:50:33
-0700
From: "Veilside GTO" <
gtovr4@postalzone.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Tire question: Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole Positionvs. YokahamaAVS
Sport
Michael,
The wear on the S02s are not as bad as they deem it
to be. I have had my
present tires for 2 years and I still have quite a bit
of thread left on
them. I bought them when my VR4 had about 90,000 miles. I
now have exactly
119,020 miles on my car and it is still alive and well. I
don't know the
exact amount but you still can see the V pattern very clearly
on all 4
tires. Inside thread (near the strut tower) seems to be good too.
Actually,
my feel to this is that it depends on the alignment of the vehicle.
I have a
friend with an RX7 with these same tires on his rear. He has
extremely
negative camber on his rear and he goes through two rear S02 tires
- 265
35/18 every year as the inside balds quickly compared to the outside.
:)
Tire wear for the S02 also depends on how often you drive your car. So
far,
I drive it very often and it has still held up pretty well in terms
of
thread wear.
Average life span of these tires would depend on how
much u drive - I would
say 3 - 31/2 years or 60,000 miles. Again, I cannot
emphasize enough the
point on regular alignment and how often you drive and
the distance
traveled. The Yokos are suppose to be equally good and like you
said,
suppose to have longer thread life. All in all, I have heard from some
of my
friends who tested out the Yokos and concluded the S02s are still
better.
Some tires stores like Discount Tire will tell you that S02s are over
priced
and not as good as Yokos. Beware; As Discount Tire and other stores
say this
becos they get more commission selling Yokos than the Bridgestones.
They
will tell you anything just so that they can sell the tires which make
them
more commission. !!
So, the main thing here is to go with the
tire you like best and not so much
who is telling you what. I have personally
stuck with S02s for a long time
and will continue to recommend this tire as
long as it is in production. I
don't think you have to worry so much about
thread wear - as long as it
GRIPS the road and keeps the driving safe! That
is real important in
Seattle, where it rains alot. Even the Bridgestone
Blizzak snow tires are
ranked no.1. I plan to get those for my other car if a
freak snow storm hits
Seattle again this year.
Both tires look good
from a distance so I know how you feel. It is a tough
decision. You will have
to give both a try if possible to really know for
sure which tire is more
suitable for your driving habits. Try the S02s and
they will last for some
time. If they don't, please don't chew my head
ff - lol. But instead,
try the Yokos. I am sure you will like the S02s -
and I am not getting
commission for neither brands. :))
ttyl,
Julian Huang
94
Mitsubishi Veilside Tein TEC GTO tt
Team 3S
Seattle, Washington
gtovr4@postalzone.com-
-----Original Message-----
From:
owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st[
mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On
Behalf Of Mike Baldwin
Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2000 10:48 AM
To:
Veilside GTO
Cc: Mike Baldwin;
team3s-digest@mail.stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
RE: Team3S: Tire question: Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole
Positionvs.
YokahamaAVS Sport
How has the wear been on these tires? I've heard
that they may wear a bit
faster than the Yoka's. Also, what is the average
lifespan of these tires
(miles)?
Thanks!
Michael
On
Wed, 11 Oct 2000, Veilside GTO wrote:
> Michael,
>
> I
have the S02s on my VR4 and have been a loyal fan of Bridgestone for 4
>
years. Those S02s work well in the rain. I used them to get thru
thick
snow
> on some of the mountain passes here in Washington State
and it was real
> impressive. Of course, the AWD on our cars helped the
most! :) The S02
pole
> position is available on most sizes except the
one set I am currently
using
> which is 265 35/18. The pole position is
suppose to have another sticky
> layer beneath the thread so that if the
main thread wears, the sticky
> substance will still allow you to grip the
road. Honestly, both the S02
pole
> and non pole position have that, so
you shouldn't have to worry.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
>
Julian Huang
> 94 Mitsubishi Veilside Tein TEC GTO tt
> Team
3S
> Seattle, Washington
>
gtovr4@postalzone.com>
>
-----Original Message-----
> From:
owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st>
[
mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On
Behalf Of Mike Baldwin
> Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2000 5:08 PM
>
To:
team3s-digest@mail.stealth-3000gt.st>
Subject: Team3S: Tire question: Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole Position
>
vs. YokahamaAVS Sport
>
>
> Hi - I am trying to decide between
these two tires. Bridgestone Potenza
> S-02 Pole Position vs. Yokahama AVS
Sport. I live in the Bay Area
> (California) so I don't see any snow, just
some rain. Mostly use the car
> to commute so I would like something that
lasts and performs well.
>
> Thanks
>
> Michael 1997
VR4
>
>
>
> *** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
>
>
>
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 11:40:55
-0700
From: Ken Middaugh <
Kenneth.Middaugh@gat.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Brake summary (long), was: Brake Kit Discount Available
As you
may recall, some of us track and "decelleration" enthusiasts banded
together
in search of better, resonably priced brakes for our cars. There
are
already lots of kits available for our cars, but most are
expensive. We wanted
something that was economical, yet was a big
improvement over stock brakes. Our
original goal was to fund research
and development of a 2 piece rotor for Brad
Bedell's Porsche "Big Red"
upgrade kit. With a 2 piece rotor, Brad's kit would
be very similar to
Mov'it's $2800 kit but we were hoping that Brad's kit with a
2 piece rotor
would be about $2100. A lot of investigation was done and here is
a
summary.
We ended up not spending any money on R&D since our
investigation uncovered
existing economical solutions. It turns out
that there would be little if any
cost savings if Brad were to fabricate his
own hats for 2 piece rotors versus
just buying them from a reputable and
experienced manufacturer.
FRONT KITS
$1450
Brad's Big Red kit,
http://home.austin.rr.com/overboost/.
It currently sells
without rotors but includes Porsche 993 calipers, caliper
mounting brackets,
Goodridge stainless steel brake lines for 4 wheels, a set
of pads, and fluid.
This is the entrypoint to serious brake upgrades and
folks have reported
dramatic results. With a set of $250 Porterfield
rotors you can seriously
upgrade stock performance for about
$1700.
~$1900
KVR "Lobster" kit (his name for the Big Reds) with 2
piece Porsche rotors.
Terry Gosse of KVR,
http://www.kvrperformance.com, has been
doing custom brake
kits for many years and has a lot of knowledge and
experience. Basically, he
can do anything for any budget. This
price was approximate, and includes
Porsche 993 calipers, mounting brackets,
2 piece rotors using Porsche GT2
322x32mm disks and custom 6061 T6 aluminum
hats, stainless steel lines for the
front, AP racing fluid. I don't
know if this price would include SS lines for
the rear, or include
pads. However, this is basically the same thing as the
Mov'it kit for a
lot less money. Porsche makes awesome disks. They
are
directionally veined, the holes are cast and then drilled to final
diameter. If
desired, he could substitue other, larger disks for about
the same price. KVR
also has directionally veined disks that you can
get solid, crossdrilled, or
slotted. The Porsche and KVR disks have
"reasonable" replacement costs, less
than $200 each. The hats should
last 5 racing seasons or a lifetime on the
street.
~$2100
KVR "Big
Black" kit with Porsche 928 S4 calipers with 2 piece rotors. This
kit
is the same as the above Lobster kit except for the calipers. Terry
Gosse of
KVR says these calipers will be a better match for our car since the
928 is a
similar heavy weight, front engine car like ours (VR4). The
Big Red calipers
are for lighter, rear engine cars. The Big Black
calipers have 2x38x44mm
pistons while the Big Red has 2x36x44mm
pistons. This extra 2mm makes a big
difference over 4 total
pistons. Also the Big Black calipers are bolted
together more near the
centerline and will deflect less than the Big Reds. The
Big Blacks use
shorter 50mm pads which deflect less than the Big Reds 60mm
pads. The
Big Blacks can accomodate 332mm rotors while the Big Reds max size
is
322mm. Finally, there are more pad choices for the Big Blacks versus
the Big
Reds. This is IMHO the best deal of the
survey.
~$2200
Stillen Brembo kit,
http://www.stillen.com/brakes/systems/systems.html.
This
was the price a few years ago. Some folks have this and are very
happy, but
others have reported that their crossdrilled disks crack and
warp. The
replacement disks are also costly. Supposedly, the
Porsche treatment of Brembo
calipers in the above kits is better than the
stock Brembo caliper in this kit.
The calipers do compare to the 928 though
since the pistons are also 2x38x44mm.
~$2100 - $2800
Mov'it Big Red
kit,
http://www.ultimategarage.com.
The Ultimate Garage's web
site say they utilize the Porsche 996 monobloc
calipers (instead of the 993) and
the GT2 2 piece rotors. These 996
calipers would make it better than the above
Lobster kit. Supposedly,
our European friends can get these directly from
Mov'it for about $2100
although Ultimate Garage's price is $2800. I think Roger
Gerl was
investigating becoming a Swiss distributor.
$2500 - $3000
KVR AP
Racing 6 piston caliper and 2 piece rotors. Terry said he could
sell
this kit for $2500 for a group purchase of 5 or more. $3000 is the
normal
price. I'm not sure if this is the identical kit to the one on
Stillens web
page. This is the entry to the "very serious" upgrades and
is really a step
above the previous kits. It can accomodate 355x35.5mm
rotors!
$3000+
There are other kits available but not investigated
becasue of their prices.
Mov'it's Terminator kits (14.9" disks!!), Baer, and
Wilwood, come to mind.
Probably the awesome looking NewTech fits this
category too.
REAR KITS
~$1800 - $2600
Mov'it has a kit for the
rear brakes too. It uses Boxter S components including
a 299x24mm
rotor. It should cost about $1800 in Europe but $2600 in the
states.
SUMMARY
All of these kits including the Mov'it kits should
fit '91+ 3000GTs and
Stealths, as long as you have the wheel clearence.
To improve clearence and
increase front track width (reduces understeer), you
could utilize a thicker
facing on the hat with longer wheel studs.
Since Mov'it is now using 996
calipers, it would be worthwhile to compare
them with the 928 S4 caliper.
Regardless, Terry Gosse of KVR should be able
to build custom front kits with
any caliper and any disk and still have
unbeatable prices.
Happy braking,
Ken
> I am passing this
along to all interested as a favor to a friend that
> has provided a lot
of his expertise in brake kit upgrades to me over
> many months which has
consumed a good bit of his time. He is the North
> American Distributor of
Mov'it North America and his site is
>
www.ultimategarage.com (big brake
kits). He is extremely knowledgeable
> re: Porsche brakes and Mov'it is
the largest customer of Porsche brake
> components which has afforded them
many benefits. They test many new
> components Porsche is developing and
even though they state kits cannot
> be broken up, Steve seems willing to
consider this. eg. He can get us
> Porsche 993 Turbo rotors which retail
(last I checked in CA) for $216 a
> piece for $175. These are the best
rotors available, but unfortunately
> require hats machined specially by a
shop out of steel for ~$400 or they
> use 7075 aircraft quality
lightweight aluminum (very tough) for $700.
> Unfortunately kits with
rotors, hats, calipers (extensive machining done
> here too), pads, and
lines are available for 93 and above 3000's/stealth
> currently. that
leaves me out:(. I pass this on since some have asked
> for good Porsche
information re: brakes. this site has good info. Check
> out FAQs under
big brakes. Steve is interested in giving discounts to
> any as a model
for this kit and want to take pictures, etc. to help
> advertise this kit.
Most of the market is Beamers, Porsches, etc.. FYI
> Hans Stuck is a big
customer. At 245 on the Moulson straight (SP?)
> braking to under 100 I
think he knows his brakes. Other sites I have
> passed on are:
>
>
www.rennsportsystems.com
(excellent Porsche info as well as brake fluid
> comparisons etc.)
>
The other Mov'it sites (German site (their headquarters) and the North
>
American sites are also linked to UltimateGarage.
- --
Could you
drive any better if I shoved that cell phone up your a**?!
Ken Middaugh
(858) 455-4510
General Atomics
San Diego
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 14:05:06
-0500
From: "Willis, Charles E." <
cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Brake summary (long), was: Brake Kit Discount Availab le
Also
note that Stillen is now advertising a 6 piston caliper upgrade kit for
our
front brakes. The older version was 4 piston.
***
Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 14:50:47
EDT
From: "Michael D. Crose" <
ncsu4me@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Faint squealing sound that comes from the front right wheel
area
The squeal is present when the wheel is free rolling and when
braking. It
is more of a squeak, squeak, squeak sound that an
continuous squeal. I have
not replaced the pads yet, I purchased it
this time last year, but the owner
before me put some aftermarket pads(not
sure of the brand, all he told me
was that a place in Florida had to make a
mold to cast them) I would assume
he had the rotors turned. The car
stops very well, doesn't pull to either
side and doesn't have any rough our
grinding feel when stopping. The dust
boots seem in very good
condition, not torn, they were quite supple. When I
removed the
calipers for painting I flushed and bled the lines and master
cylinder.
>From: "Willis, Charles E." <
cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
>To:
"'Michael D. Crose'" <
ncsu4me@hotmail.com>,
>
team3s@mail.stealth-3000gt.st>Subject:
RE: Team3S: Faint squealing sound that comes from the front right
>wheel area
>Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 10:07:01
-0500
>
>
>
> [Willis, Charles E.] Does the squeal
happen only on applying the
>brakes, or while the wheels are
rolling? If you hear the squeal while
>rolling, not only on braking,
you might be hearing wheel bearing noise. I
>don't believe you can
replace or repack the wheel bearings - you have to
>replace the whole
hub. If you have to replace one side, you may as well do
>both
sides.
>
> Does the squeal happen continuously during braking, or
does it go
>"squeak, squeak, squeak"? - that might be a warped
rotor. I didn't notice
>whether you had the rotors faced off
(machined/milled/turned).
>
> What kind of brake pads are you
using? Highly metallic pads (like
>PAGID) squeak a lot in normal
use, even when the pads are new and the
>rotors
>are flat to within
0.002".
>
> Does the car stop good? Or does it pull to one
side? What
>condition were the calipers in? Did the dust boots
on the caliper pistons
>look good or ragged out? If a piston sticks
after you release pressure on
>the brake pedal, it can leave the pad in
contact with the rotor. Over the
>years, these chrome pistons get
corroded, and you have to clean them or
>replace them while rebuilding the
calipers. Also the seals on the pistons
>tend to swell up and can
make the pistons stick.
>
> When was the last time you drained and
bled the brake system? The
>fluid wouldn't directly affect the
squeal, but old fluid picks up water
>which causes
corrosion.
>
> Brakes are a good thing! Everybody concentrated
on horsepower, but
>stopping my two-ton monster is very important to
me!
>
> Chuck
>
>*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
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***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 14:21:45
-0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Brake summary (long), was: Brake Kit Discount Available
My
summary of your summary:
1. It's tough to beat Brad's Big Red kit.
2.
The Porterfield cryogenically treated rotors seem to be the best buy for
the
buck.
3. The next upward step MIGHT be to buy a two-piece Porsche rotor.
(Does
anyone know if the Porsche rotor will fit the Brad's conversion,
or do we
need a new mounting bracket?)
4. No one has improved our
rear brakes yet except for an extremely
expensive kit.
Correct me if I
am wrong.
Rich/old poop
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 14:55:29
-0500
From: "Willis, Charles E." <
cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Faint squealing sound that comes from the front right wheel
area
How many miles on your car? It sounds like the wheel bearings
to me.
Sometimes when the wheel bearings are going out, the wheel only
squeals when
you put it under load, like while turning or braking. The
bearings in my
son's VR4 went out at about 80K miles.
I would remove
and turn the rotors first. It's a lot cheaper than replacing
the hubs,
unless of course, you have an extended warranty.
The pads sound kindof
like CarboTech Panther Pads. Were the metal backings
on the pads
painted gold?
Chuck
93 and 94 VR4
> -----Original
Message-----
> From: Michael D. Crose [
SMTP:ncsu4me@hotmail.com]
>
Sent: Thursday, October 12, 2000 1:51 PM
> To:
cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org;
team3s@mail.stealth-3000gt.st>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Faint squealing sound that comes from the front
>
right wheel area
>
> The squeal is present when the wheel is free
rolling and when braking. It
>
> is more of a squeak, squeak,
squeak sound that an continuous squeal. I
> have
> not
replaced the pads yet, I purchased it this time last year, but the
> owner
> before me put some aftermarket pads(not sure of the brand, all he told
me
> was that a place in Florida had to make a mold to cast them) I
would
> assume
> he had the rotors turned. The car stops very
well, doesn't pull to either
>
> side and doesn't have any rough
our grinding feel when stopping. The dust
>
> boots seem in
very good condition, not torn, they were quite supple. When
> I
> removed the calipers for painting I flushed and bled the lines and
master
> cylinder.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>From: "Willis, Charles E." <
cewillis@TexasChildrensHospital.org>
>
>To: "'Michael D. Crose'" <
ncsu4me@hotmail.com>,
> >
team3s@mail.stealth-3000gt.st>
>Subject: RE: Team3S: Faint squealing sound that comes from the front
>
right
> >wheel area
> >Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 10:07:01
-0500
> >
> >
> >
> > [Willis, Charles
E.] Does the squeal happen only on applying the
> >brakes, or
while the wheels are rolling? If you hear the squeal while
>
>rolling, not only on braking, you might be hearing wheel bearing
noise.
> I
> >don't believe you can replace or repack the wheel
bearings - you have to
> >replace the whole hub. If you have to
replace one side, you may as well
> do
> >both sides.
>
>
> > Does the squeal happen continuously during braking, or does it
go
> >"squeak, squeak, squeak"? - that might be a warped rotor. I
didn't
> notice
> >whether you had the rotors faced off
(machined/milled/turned).
> >
> > What kind of brake pads are
you using? Highly metallic pads (like
> >PAGID) squeak a lot in
normal use, even when the pads are new and the
> >rotors
>
>are flat to within 0.002".
> >
> > Does the car stop
good? Or does it pull to one side? What
> >condition were
the calipers in? Did the dust boots on the caliper
> pistons
>
>look good or ragged out? If a piston sticks after you release
pressure
> on
> >the brake pedal, it can leave the pad in contact
with the rotor. Over
> the
> >years, these chrome pistons
get corroded, and you have to clean them or
> >replace them while
rebuilding the calipers. Also the seals on the
> pistons
>
>tend to swell up and can make the pistons stick.
> >
> >
When was the last time you drained and bled the brake system? The
>
>fluid wouldn't directly affect the squeal, but old fluid picks up
water
> >which causes corrosion.
> >
> > Brakes are a
good thing! Everybody concentrated on horsepower, but
> >stopping
my two-ton monster is very important to me!
> >
> >
Chuck
> >
> >*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
>
>
_________________________________________________________________________
>
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at
http://www.hotmail.com.
>
> Share
information about yourself, create your own public profile at
>
http://profiles.msn.com.
***
Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 14:55:55
-0500
From: "Jannusch, Matt" <
mjannusch@marketwatch.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Tire question: Bridgestone Potenza S-02 Pole Position vs.
YokahamaAVS Sport
> Tire wear for the S02 also depends on how
often
> you drive your car. So far, I drive it very
> often and it
has still held up pretty well in
> terms of thread wear.
Tire wear
depends much more on *how* you drive, not how often you drive. If
you
just tool around on the freeway, you aren't going to get much tire wear.
If
you drive aggressively and corner hard, the tires are going to wear
much
quicker on the edges. You said you can get 60,000 miles out of a
set of
tires which, frankly, for a performance tire is abnormally high.
Even on
long wearing tires, I max out at about 30,000 miles by the time the
edge
tread is worn beyond usability no matter what the
type/construction/brand.
- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder
VR4
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 15:30:58
-0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Team3S: Mitsubishi Motorsports?
Whilst checking the Barbadoes rally site
at
http://www.motorsportbarbados.com/index1.htmI
saw a reference to Mitsubishi Motorsports. I've tried to find out
anything
substantial, but all I can find is a dumb web page that doesn't
tell me
anything.
Seems to me that if Mitsubishi corporate in Japan is sponsoring
big-time
rallying, they MUST have come up with some parts that could filter
down to
us -- like brake rotors, to name one.
Anybody know about this
operation and the availability of racing parts
from
Japan?
Rich
94/VR4
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 17:30:49
-0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Team3S: Brembo rotors
Thanks to Edwin Shaw, we've found a source for
Brembo rotors.
Here's the description from MVP Motorsports:
Brembo
Cross-Drilled or Slotted Front Rotor for 3000GT VR4, 1993.5-99
This is for all VR4's made from 6/93 to 1999. Price is per rotor.
These
are direct replacements for your stock rotors. They are the same size
and
fit under your stock calipers and your stock wheels so no other
upgrades
are necessary to use these rotors. Remember, this is Brembo quality,
not
some generic brand slapped on a drill press with holes punched at
random.
Every rotor is cadmium plated to prevent rusting. Each rotor has
been
X-rayed and is of the highest quality metals. PLEASE CHOOSE DRILLED
OR
SLOTTED UNDER
ITEM # Br FR VR4 93-99
MSRP $224.00
Your Price $190.40
Seems like this is exactly what we've been
looking for, n'est ce pas?
Because they are Brembos, we can order them
drilled, too.
Does ANYONE have any experience with these on a race
track?
Rich/94 VR4
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 18:53:00
EDT
From: "Michael D. Crose" <
ncsu4me@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Brembo rotors
Rich,
Why would this not fit the 91-92
models? Does the Big Red kit fit 91+ models
if the wheels offer enough
clearance? Would the Brembos fit 91-92 models if
we convert to the Big
Reds and have larger wheels?
Thanks,
Michael
>From:
Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
>To:
stealth@starnet.net,
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>Subject:
Team3S: Brembo rotors
>Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 17:30:49
-0500
>
>Thanks to Edwin Shaw, we've found a source for Brembo
rotors.
>
>Here's the description from MVP
Motorsports:
>Brembo Cross-Drilled or Slotted Front Rotor for 3000GT VR4,
1993.5-99
>
> This is for all VR4's made from 6/93 to 1999.
Price is per rotor. These
>are direct replacements for your stock rotors.
They are the same size and
>fit under your stock calipers and your stock
wheels so no other upgrades
>are necessary to use these rotors. Remember,
this is Brembo quality, not
>some generic brand slapped on a drill press
with holes punched at random.
>Every rotor is cadmium plated to prevent
rusting. Each rotor has been
>X-rayed and is of the highest quality
metals. PLEASE CHOOSE DRILLED OR
>SLOTTED UNDER
>ITEM # Br FR VR4
93-99
>MSRP $224.00
>Your Price $190.40
>
>Seems like
this is exactly what we've been looking for, n'est ce pas?
>Because they
are Brembos, we can order them drilled, too.
>Does ANYONE have any
experience with these on a race track?
>
>Rich/94
VR4
>
>*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
_________________________________________________________________________
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***
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***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 15:55:40
-0700
From: Ken Middaugh <
Kenneth.Middaugh@gat.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Brake summary (long), was: Brake Kit Discount Available
>
1. It's tough to beat Brad's Big Red kit.
Agreed.
> 2. The
Porterfield cryogenically treated rotors seem to be the best buy for
> the
buck.
For 1 piece steel rotors, I agree.
However, #1 and #2 will
cost $1700. For a few hundred more (~$1900 or so) you
can get the KVR
Lobster kit that has the same calipers and a 2 piece rotor using
the Porsche
GT2 disk.
> 3. The next upward step MIGHT be to buy a two-piece
Porsche rotor.
A 2 piece rotor would definitely be the next
upgrade. Here are some of the
advantages of 2 piece rotors:
1)
They are lighter. Not only do they reduce the weight of the vehicle,
they
reduce the important un-sprung weight (lighter wheels do this
too).
2) Higher performance. There is no doubt that cross drilled
and/or slotted
rotors provide better braking. If the Porsche rotor
resists or eliminates the
usual tendency for cross drilled rotors to crack,
this would be a great
advantage.
3) Better cooling. The
Porsche and KVR rotors (and Supra too) have directional
cooling veins.
This will increase the longevity of the disks.
4) It is possible to
manufacture the hats with thicker facings. This
essentially provides an
integral spacer to increase the front track and/or
provide more
wheel-to-caliper clearance. Longer wheel studs are required.
Some
advantages of the Porsche disks are:
1) Holes are cast and drilled out
to final diameter. This means they will have
less of a tendency to
crack than other cross drilled rotors.
2) They have directional
veins. This will improve cooling and prolong the life
and performance
of the rotor.
Also available would be KVR's directionally veined solid,
cross drilled, or
slotted rotors, probably available in more sizes too such
as 332x32mm.
Basically, thats a lot of advantages for a few hundred
dollars more!
> (Does
> anyone know if the Porsche rotor
will fit the Brad's conversion, or do we
> need a new mounting
bracket?)
Most likely, unless your current rotor is 322mm in
diameter. Folks ordering 2
piece rotors should also order caliper
mounting brackets. Unfortunately, this
becomes an expensive upgrade in
the two-step approach, likely around $850.
> 4. No one has
improved our rear brakes yet except for an extremely
> expensive
kit.
Agreed.
Regards,
Ken
- --
Could you drive any
better if I shoved that cell phone up your a**?!
Ken Middaugh (858)
455-4510
General Atomics
San Diego
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 17:56:26
-0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Brembo rotors
At 06:53 PM 10/12/00 EDT, Michael D. Crose
wrote:
>Rich,
>
>Why would this not fit the 91-92 models? Does
the Big Red kit fit 91+ models
>if the wheels offer enough
clearance? Would the Brembos fit 91-92 models if
>we convert to the
Big Reds and have larger wheels?
Yes, I think so.
Check with Brad
Bedell to be sure
Rich
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 17:59:44
-0700
From: "Jim Berry" <
fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Brembo rotors
Yes --- I have the Big Red setup with 1994 17" wheels on my
93 Stealth TT.
I also put one of my 1993 17" wheels to see if they would
fit, they did but
with about .010" clearance on one side, in my opinion not
enough
clearance to race with.
Jim
Berry
===================================================
- -----
Original Message -----
From: Michael D. Crose <
ncsu4me@hotmail.com>
To: <
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>; <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
>
Rich,
>
> Why would this not fit the 91-92 models? Does the Big Red
kit fit 91+ models
> if the wheels offer enough clearance? Would
the Brembos fit 91-92 models if
> we convert to the Big Reds and have
larger wheels?
>
> Thanks,
> Michael
***
Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 18:08:31
-0700
From: "Jim Berry" <
fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Brake summary (long), was: Brake Kit Discount Available
- ----- Original
Message -----
From: Ken Middaugh <
Kenneth.Middaugh@gat.com>
To:
Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
>
>
> 2. The Porterfield cryogenically treated rotors seem to be the best buy
for
> > the buck.
>
> For 1 piece steel rotors, I
agree.
>
I've said this a couple of times in the past ---
porterfield will make custom hats [ about
$300 each ] and damn near any rotor
configuration you want. The rotors were about
$110 plus $40 for cryo
treatment.
I still remain unconvinced that cross drilled or slotted
rotors provide any advantage for
us, even at open track events. The purpose
of the slots/holes is to allow gasses to escape
under heavy braking, the main
problem with our cars is overheating and burning up pads
or boiling brake
fluid. If you want to spend money, do it on cooling goodies [Merrit
style],
air ducts, fans, water, and wheels with open spokes. Once a certain
level of performance
is achieved, additional efforts to shorten stopping
distance are a waste of money. At this
point cooling the brakes should be
your priority.
Jim Berry
>>> 93 stealth TT
---- "arrest me
red"
K&N FIPK -- Magnicore/.034" --- Blitz
SSBC
--- GAB struts --- Stillen SS lines
---
GC/Eibach 600# F/350# R --- GC caster/camber
plate
Yokohama AVS sport
255x40x17
Porsche/Brembo [ big red ] brakes --- Porterfield 315mm
rotors
Roadrace engineering rear strut
tower
Gtech --- 0-60 = 4.75 -- 1/4 = 13.3 @ 110 mph
***
Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 06:11:34
-0700
From: Richard <
radanc@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Brake summary (long), was: Brake Kit DiscountAvailable
I agree, but take
a different view of braking finances. I want to
optimize my large pad surface
area and therefore need larger rotors then
anything stock Porterfield would
make except venturing into a non-stock
rotor which means customization
anyway. To get the 332x32 SA I think the
Cast Porsches are unmatched. I am
willing to pay for the development
costs. My solution to the rears are is
going to be a bit creative, but
will be upgraded rotors and calipers, right
now probably stock fronts. A
master cylinder upgrade will be critical to
making this combination
effective. A 24 mm MC or around there will be
necessary. You can get
kits with hats for the Porsche rotors, but my post 93
Stealth dosn't
have the bolt on kits available for the post-92 models. I am
also
willing to pay for the strong stuff. Which means 7075 aluminum.
No
cracked hats hear. All in all my kit which is a smorgasbord
includes
F-40 calipers ($1050), Porsche rotors ($250), Machined 7075 hat
($600-
done by local shop) = $1850 total.
Rich
92 Stealth
TT
Merritt wrote:
>
> My summary of your summary:
>
> 1. It's tough to beat Brad's Big Red kit.
> 2. The Porterfield
cryogenically treated rotors seem to be the best buy for
> the
buck.
> 3. The next upward step MIGHT be to buy a two-piece Porsche rotor.
(Does
> anyone know if the Porsche rotor will fit the Brad's
conversion, or do we
> need a new mounting bracket?)
> 4. No
one has improved our rear brakes yet except for an extremely
> expensive
kit.
>
> Correct me if I am wrong.
>
> Rich/old
poop
>
> *** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2000 06:18:06
-0700
From: Richard <
radanc@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Brembo rotors
Missed the previous post but rotors sizes are different in
pre93 and
post 93 GTs 296x30 on my pre93 and 314x30 on yours. Also bolt holes
etc.
are different. So no direct bolt on possible without some
modifications.
I assume you were talking about rotors too?
Rich
92
Stealth TT
Merritt wrote:
>
> At 06:53 PM 10/12/00 EDT,
Michael D. Crose wrote:
> >Rich,
> >
> >Why would
this not fit the 91-92 models? Does the Big Red kit fit 91+ models
>
>if the wheels offer enough clearance? Would the Brembos fit 91-92
models if
> >we convert to the Big Reds and have larger wheels?
>
> Yes, I think so.
> Check with Brad Bedell to be sure
>
> Rich
>
> *** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
End of team3s V1
#292
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