team3s
Saturday, July 29
2000
Volume 01 : Number
217
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 28 Jul 2000 09:17:28 -0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Viper vs. 3000GT VR-4 @ Thunderhill
>. I was able to
throttle steer the VR-4 all the way around turn 2.
>There is no way in
hell I can do that with the Viper. Too much damn torque.
>I have to keep
the throttle in a steady state. No off throttle... no on
>throttle. Once
the Viper driver learns this, he can smoke virtually anything
>else on the
track. <snip>
Well, there are always the AWD Porsche TTs, but
you're right -- a Viper can
be virtually unbeatable.
>Smoothness
is nowhere nearly as important in the VR-4. It is VERY forgiving.
>You
take the corner too fast? Just ease off the throttle... the front
wheels
>will bite and rescue you from understeer. The back end is coming
around?
>Just accelerate and the back snaps into place.
Few people
understand this. A VR4 is a fabulous driver school car because
it's so
forgiving.
>
> With the Viper, the accelerator is a freakin on/off
switch. It's all
>or nothing baby. The VR-4 is all about control. Less
performance, but easier
>to tame. My grandma could lap Porsche Boxsters in
my VR-4.
My granny couldn't, but otherwise I agree with everything you
say.
>
>
Rich/old poop
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 11:09:52
EDT
From:
Zeoswolf@aol.comSubject:
Team3S: (NEW!!)Valve/cam timing, is that the problem?
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Date:
Thu, 27 Jul 2000 21:57:46 EDT
Subject: Team3S: Valve/cam timing, is that the
problem?(new)
To:
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owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.stok
here it is,
i DID take it back to the dealership this past
tuesday and they said they
hooked it up to the computer and it said
everything was fine. i asked them
if they actually physically looked
at the marks and they told me no becuase
it would have been another 5 hour
job. i did this myself in 20 minutes. but
let me ask this, like
i said i didnt line the markings up perfectly cuz i
didnt have the time so i
just counted the teeth on the cam sprocket from mark
to mark. the mark
on the cam sprockets for the two front most sprockets were
exactically 5
teeth from the markings on the engine itself. the two rear
markings on
the cam sprockets were 4 teeth from the markings on the engine.
i
actually thought about it and figured this was an easier way to describe
it.. my first post it was confusing about how i said this. now, one
you told
me to line them perfectly and then look at them, others have
not. is this an
accurate way to check these markings by counting teeth
or will they be off
every time with this method? and if this is the a
correct way to check them,
and my cam timing is INFACT off.. would this give
me the power loss i am
experiencing and the wierd occurance of getting MORE
punch at half throttle
then with the pedal to the floor?? THANKS FOR
ALL YOUR HELP ON THIS!!!!!
james
94R/T
*** Info:
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***
- --part1_a4.7b6e61e.26b2fc40_boundary--
*** Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 18:19:45
+0100
From: Gordon Tyrrell <
gordon.tyrrell@openet-int.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Viper vs. 3000GT VR-4 @ Thunderhill
Your granny would need to
seek help if she couldn't beat a boxster in a
VR4 :)
They are a mid
6secs to 60 car with a professional driver and nowhere
near the grip of the
VR4.
Mind you mine is sick now so I'd need to work at
it.
Merritt wrote:
>
> >. I was able to throttle
steer the VR-4 all the way around turn 2.
> >There is no way in hell I
can do that with the Viper. Too much damn torque.
> >I have to keep the
throttle in a steady state. No off throttle... no on
> >throttle. Once
the Viper driver learns this, he can smoke virtually anything
> >else
on the track. <snip>
>
> Well, there are always the AWD
Porsche TTs, but you're right -- a Viper can
> be virtually
unbeatable.
>
> >Smoothness is nowhere nearly as important in
the VR-4. It is VERY forgiving.
> >You take the corner too fast? Just
ease off the throttle... the front wheels
> >will bite and rescue you
from understeer. The back end is coming around?
> >Just accelerate and
the back snaps into place.
>
> Few people understand this. A VR4 is
a fabulous driver school car because
> it's so forgiving.
>
>
> > With the Viper, the
accelerator is a freakin on/off switch. It's all
> >or nothing baby.
The VR-4 is all about control. Less performance, but easier
> >to tame.
My grandma could lap Porsche Boxsters in my VR-4.
>
> My granny
couldn't, but otherwise I agree with everything you say.
> >
>
>
> Rich/old poop
>
> *** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
*** Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 10:27:32
PDT
From: "Ryan Meador" <
captainrye@hotmail.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: (NEW!!)Valve/cam timing, is that the problem?
I know you're
concentrating on cam adjustments right now- but here's a
thought. I had the
same symptoms when I bought my '93 VR4 a couple months
back. At half
throttle it pulled fairly hard but any more than that almost
felt like the
timing was retarding and I lost major power. It idled fine and
ran fine as
long as I didn't romp on it. The problem ended up being a very
simple vacume
leak. The hose to my EGR was pulled off but not plugged. Once
I popped it
back on- WHAM- the car ran GREAT and pulled very hard (like it
is
supposed to). So, maybe you could listen for hissing and visually inspect
the vacume lines and find a vacume leak. I'm not sure if the dealer's
diagnosing machine would have detected that, but wouldn't it be great if
that were the only problem!? I know I was ecstatic when I found my
leak...
Ryan '93 VR4
- ----Original Message Follows----
From:
Zeoswolf@aol.comTo:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
Team3S: (NEW!!)Valve/cam timing, is that the problem?
Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000
11:09:52 EDT
<< message3.txt
>>
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------------------------------
Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2000 12:35:19
EDT
From: "Dg B" <
dbretton@hotmail.com>
Subject:
Team3S: OT: Arrow Tire + 17" rechroming -resolution-
Hi
folks!
I know that many of you here were interested in
the outcome of my
dealings with Arrow Tire&Wheel of Upland, CA (email:
arrowtire@msn.com).
Here is the
the summary:
Last year, I purchased a set of rechromed 17" VR-4
wheels. This spring, I
pulled the wheels out of winter storage to
discover some chrome peel on the
wheels. So, I sent them back, since
the chroming was guaranteed for 1 year.
It took almost a full month from the
time the wheels left my house for them
to return. This includes 10
days worth of shipping time, however.
Arrow Tire was very good about the
entire deal, except for a single problem.
One of the wheels made
brief contact with a curb, resulting in about 1" of
rash on the outer
rim. Since the wheel was now "damaged", they would not
honor the
warranty on the chrome, even though it was obvious the chrome peel
was not
due to the damage at all...
I was quite bothered about this issue, especially
when they fixed the wheels
and presented me with a bill before consulting me
on the matter. However,
Brian at Arrow Tire was flexible and we agreed
on a payment resolution (I
paid return shipping, and they paid for the
repair of the 4th wheel).
The wheels are back, and look better now than
they did the first time I
received them.
So, in conclusion, I think I
would still recommend their service, though
they could be a little better
about their policies. :)
I believe their standard rate for repair +
rechroming is $100/wheel (I would
assume that extensive wheel damage might
be costlier, however).
I apologize for the off-topic post.
However, I felt that this would be
beneficial to all the chrome wheel owners
out there, knowing there are so
many of us, yet so few places that will
supply this product/service at a
reasonable price.
I hope this
helps!
Regards,
Dennis
...now where the heck did I
put those
lugs....?
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------------------------------
End of team3s V1
#217
*********************
team3s
Sunday, July 30
2000
Volume 01 : Number
218
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 28 Jul 2000 17:29:27 -0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Team3S: An outsider's look at a VR4
Here's what my instructor had to say
about driving a VR4 for the first time:
__________
Instructing at the
Heartland Park BWMCCA Driver's school was my first
experience in riding in
and driving an AWD car on the track.
It is obvious that my student was
and is comfortable with its handling,
traction and acceleration
characteristics. I rode with him for a couple of
sessions, working on the
line and utilizing all of the track. He had NO
problem getting the car to go
where he pointed it (not always WHERE I wanted
him to point it), but as an
instructor, who essentially has NO physical
control over where the heck we
MAY be going, I felt like the car was very
stable and capable in the twisties
at HPT. (Note, HPT has a WIDE range of
corners and speeds... fast, medium,
slow... tight, open... increasing,
decreasing... basically a wonderful
driver's education track.)
My student DID allow me to take his car out in
one of the instructor
sessions (me driving, him riding). I have literally
thousands of on-track
miles at HPT, but this was my FIRST experience in an
AWD car. Some of my
humble observations...
1) LOTS of traction...
can't imagine the HP it would take to spin the tires
on an AWD car running
DOT comp tires.
2) Neutral handling... UNTIL you really start to push the
car... ESPECIALLY
on corner exit. After turning in and getting on the power
(and the turbos),
the car takes on a DISTINCT "front-wheel-drive" understeer
condition. I
found myself using a LOT more of the track on exit, especially
on the
medium-speed, full power types. I could feel the front tires fighting
for
traction AND working to turn the car... a very heavy car at that.. all
at
the same time. I didn't drive the car 10/10ths ( I NEVER drive anyone
else's
car the way I do mine...), but even at my 7/10ths, I was unable to get
the
car to rotate at turn-in or get the back end to "step out"... which
isn't
all that bad, but with the way I'm used to driving... I found myself
wishing
that the car had a LOT more RWD characteristics than it
exhibited.
I agree with a recent post... that AWD can help beginning and
intermediate
drivers "be faster" (whatever that means... speed is relative...
SKILLS are
measurable).
I DO believe that an AWD car CAN be driven
fast and is a capable performer
at OT and Driving School events...and there
are CERTAINLY situations where
the AWD would be advantageous (rain, cool damp
track surface and those
ultra-low speed turns where you want and NEED all the
traction you can get.
<snip>
Is it (AWD) the PERFECT track
car?? I don't know... Is ANY car PERFECT. No.
As a driver, can you get
the most out of what you DO drive? ABSOLUTELY! Just
get out there and don't
be afraid to ask for help, insights and an
occasional instructor
ride.
But... I guess, for THIS slow ol' farmer dude... I'll stick with
AWD in my
Explorer for chasin' cattle, haulin' seed and pasture-bashin' up at
the
farm. For me, on track, guess I'll just stick with my ol'
under-powered,
under-tech 1978 Fairmont-chassis-ied Mustang...and
RWD.
________________________
Yeah, right. Under-powered 1978
Fairmont, my eye.
Jeff pushes that 1995 Mustang GT with a 351 Cleveland
around pretty dang
fast. Scared the peanuts out of me, I'll tell ya. I
remember what it's like
to drive an oversteering car on the hairy edge, and
Jeff hangs it out there
all the time. When we got done terrorizing the other
instructors, I
couldn't wait to get back into my stable VR4.
That
said, anybody got any idea how we could get some more RWD
characteristics
into our cars so as to induce a little oversteer when we
push to the edge? I
understand that they build our cars with more RWD bias
in Japan because they
do more road racing over there. I don't wanna mess
with the rear toe, because
it might get squirrely under braking. Whadda
think? Wider rear tires? Bigger
sway bar back there? Spacers in the front?
Jeff didn't mention it, but he
told me that the 4WS really works on our
car. He was following me into 12,
where we turn in at 80 mph and nail it,
and he said he could see the rear end
turn in a microsecond after the front
tires turned. He thought for a minute
that the rear had gotten loose, but
then he realized it was the 4WS helping
with the turn-in, and the car was
just stepping out a bit. He said it was
very smooth and appeared to help
the car get around the turn. Hmm...I wonder
if we could increase the 4WS
bite to get a little oversteer?
Rich/old
poop/94 VR4
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 12:06:16
-0700
From: Rich <
rleroy@pacifier.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Admin: Buyer's Guide Price List on our Website
All:
Since
many of our newer members (and countless visitors to our
website) are
actively shopping for a used Stealth or 3000GT, we have
published a Price
Guide on the Team3S website. Included are the
price of the car when new
and it's current wholesale and retail
values. Those of you who are
considering selling your car may find
it useful as well. Find it
here:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/FAQ-3Sprices.htmRich
for
the Admin
*** Info:
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***
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2000 12:35:02
EDT
From: "Dg B" <
dbretton@hotmail.com>
Subject:
Team3S: OT: Arrow Tire + 17" rechroming -resolution-
Hi
folks!
I know that many of you here were interested in
the outcome of my
dealings with Arrow Tire&Wheel of Upland, CA (email:
arrowtire@msn.com).
Here is the
the summary:
Last year, I purchased a set of rechromed 17" VR-4
wheels. This spring, I
pulled the wheels out of winter storage to
discover some chrome peel on the
wheels. So, I sent them back, since
the chroming was guaranteed for 1 year.
It took almost a full month from the
time the wheels left my house for them
to return. This includes 10
days worth of shipping time, however.
Arrow Tire was very good about the
entire deal, except for a single problem.
One of the wheels made
brief contact with a curb, resulting in about 1" of
rash on the outer
rim. Since the wheel was now "damaged", they would not
honor the
warranty on the chrome, even though it was obvious the chrome peel
was not
due to the damage at all...
I was quite bothered about this issue, especially
when they fixed the wheels
and presented me with a bill before consulting me
on the matter. However,
Brian at Arrow Tire was flexible and we agreed
on a payment resolution (I
paid return shipping, and they paid for the
repair of the 4th wheel).
The wheels are back, and look better now than
they did the first time I
received them.
So, in conclusion, I think I
would still recommend their service, though
they could be a little better
about their policies. :)
I believe their standard rate for repair +
rechroming is $100/wheel (I would
assume that extensive wheel damage might
be costlier, however).
I apologize for the off-topic post.
However, I felt that this would be
beneficial to all the chrome wheel owners
out there, knowing there are so
many of us, yet so few places that will
supply this product/service at a
reasonable price.
I hope this
helps!
Regards,
Dennis
...now where the heck did I
put those
lugs....?
________________________________________________________________________
Get
Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at
http://www.hotmail.com***
Info:
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------------------------------
Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2000 14:38:23
-0700
From:
jeff.mohler@netapp.comSubject:
Team3S: List
..is back up.
PacBell didnt like what I had to say
this morning..so..guess what. *grin*
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2000 14:40:51
-0700
From:
jeff.mohler@netapp.comSubject: RE:
Team3S: An outsider's look at a VR4
Hmm...I wonder if we could increase
the 4WS
bite to get a little oversteer?
-
---
Doubtfull.
Stretch out the front track if you want to counter
the horrible push our cars
exhibit like your instructor
mentioned.
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: 29 Jul 2000 19:51:15
-0700
From: John Monnin <
jkmonnin@altavista.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Need a block Again
I am looking for a 4-bolt short block for my
VR4 again! I had purchased one but yellow Freight felt I needed a yellow
engine so they spilled paint into the cylinders and between the rods and
crank. Just to finish the job it looks like the block was rolled
over breaking one of the mounting tabs off the block, ruining it.
The insurance adjuster looked at it Friday and I should kniow status of my claim
on Wednesday.
Best case: Yellow gives me insured value and lets me keep
remains of block. I can then transplant the new crank and rods into a used
block and use the insurance money to buy forged pistons! All I would have to do
is find a cheap used 4-bolt block.
Worst case: Yellow gives me insured
value and takes block. Unfortunately because I got a good deal on the
block It insured it for $2000 but the best deal I have found on a shortblock is
$2300 from Tallahasse Mitsubishi.
If anyone has a lead on a good
used 4-bolt block that can still be overbored email me privately.
One bit
of good news my wife finally got out of the hospital after a week and a half of
kidney stone problems. I am so glad she is better that my engine problems
seem trivial.
John Monnin
1991 VR4 with 2 bad engines!
jkmonnin@altavista.com_______________________________________________________________________
Free
Unlimited Internet Access! Try it now!
http://www.zdnet.com/downloads/altavista/index.html_______________________________________________________________________
***
Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 01:47:38
-0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: An outsider's look at a VR4
>
>Stretch out the front
track if you want to counter the horrible push our cars
>exhibit like your
instructor mentioned.
>
It's not just understeer or push... it's the
car clawing out of turns on
the front wheels, chewing the beejeesuz out of
the front tires. If we could
get some RWD bias, maybe it would be more of an
AWD car instead of a FWD
when it's being driven hard.
What about the
RWD bias they dial into our cars in Japan? How do we do that
here? Is it part
of the transmission or is it an external adjustment?
Rich/old
poop
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2000 23:41:58
-0700
From:
jeff.mohler@netapp.comSubject: RE:
Team3S: An outsider's look at a VR4
Two things:
Increasing track
will increase oversteer (decrease understeer)..period. But if
you are
reaching a point where the car is leaning too far, little can help as
you are
outdriving the co-efficient of static friction that the outside tire can
deal
with. Less turning or lower speed..pick. *frown*
Second, dump
the stock driveshaft, and watch your torque bias shift...as you
will
increasing the power efficiency of the back of the car, and raising
the
amount of delivered power to the ground. Im hoping to find about
30-40lbs in
shaft alone (IE: Significant in power terms)
-
-----Original Message-----
From: Merritt [
mailto:merritt@cedar-rapids.net]
Sent:
Saturday, July 29, 2000 11:48 PM
To:
jeff.mohler@netapp.com;
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
RE: Team3S: An outsider's look at a VR4
>
>Stretch out the
front track if you want to counter the horrible push our cars
>exhibit
like your instructor mentioned.
>
It's not just understeer or push...
it's the car clawing out of turns on
the front wheels, chewing the beejeesuz
out of the front tires. If we could
get some RWD bias, maybe it would be more
of an AWD car instead of a FWD
when it's being driven hard.
What about
the RWD bias they dial into our cars in Japan? How do we do that
here? Is it
part of the transmission or is it an external adjustment?
Rich/old
poop
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 02:32:29
-0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: An outsider's look at a VR4
At 11:41 PM 7/29/00 -0700,
jeff.mohler@netapp.com
wrote:
>Two things:
>
>Increasing track will increase
oversteer (decrease understeer)..period.
I was gonna get that
spacer and longer studs like you suggested a few weeks
ago, but I got new
wheels instead. I gotta check with Tire Rack and see
what they think about
spacers with the Milli Miglia wheels.
>
>Second, dump the stock
driveshaft, and watch your torque bias shift...as you
>will increasing the
power efficiency of the back of the car, and raising the
>amount of
delivered power to the ground. Im hoping to find about 30-40lbs
in
>shaft alone (IE: Significant in power terms)
How does changing
the driveshaft shift the torque bias?
Rich/old poop
***
Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 02:28:59
-0500
From: "cody" <
overclck@flash.net>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: An outsider's look at a VR4
Say you have a gear turning two
identically shaped pieces. That gear gives
the exact same amount of
torque to each piece. One is made of an ultralight
material, and one is
a standard steel. That gear can turn the lighter piece
alot easier than
it can the heavier piece. Which means a quicker response
time to the
wheels. Now, add in the the front axle(s) also. In stock form,
if
driving the fornt wheels took the exact same amount as driving the
back
wheels, then when you lighten the rear assembly, it makes the rear
more
responsive, leaving the front as is, thus giving you a higher rear
torque
bias.
- -Cody
(if they hurt anything, spacers would hurt
the hub/axle)
- -----Original Message-----
From:
owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st[
mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On
Behalf Of Merritt
Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2000 2:32 AM
To:
jeff.mohler@netapp.com;
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
RE: Team3S: An outsider's look at a VR4
At 11:41 PM 7/29/00 -0700,
jeff.mohler@netapp.com
wrote:
>Two things:
>
>Increasing track will increase
oversteer (decrease understeer)..period.
I was gonna get that spacer and
longer studs like you suggested a few weeks
ago, but I got new wheels
instead. I gotta check with Tire Rack and see
what they think about spacers
with the Milli Miglia wheels.
>
>Second, dump the stock
driveshaft, and watch your torque bias shift...as
you
>will increasing
the power efficiency of the back of the car, and raising
the
>amount of
delivered power to the ground. Im hoping to find about
30-40lbs
in
>shaft alone (IE: Significant in power terms)
How
does changing the driveshaft shift the torque bias?
Rich/old
poop
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 03:40:49
-0400
From: "Michael" <
mdorsey@mindspring.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: An outsider's look at a VR4
Also, a material that won't flex
as much will help. The stock driveshaft
will flex a little before the
torque is applied to the rear axles. With a
stiffer driveshaft, the
torque will be transferred immediately. I've
noticed a huge difference
first hand on mountain bikes with wheels, cranks
and frames.
-
-----Original Message-----
From:
owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st[
mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On
Behalf Of cody
Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2000 3:29
To: Merritt
Cc:
Team3S
Subject: RE: Team3S: An outsider's look at a VR4
Say you
have a gear turning two identically shaped pieces. That gear gives
the
exact same amount of torque to each piece. One is made of an
ultralight
material, and one is a standard steel. That gear can turn
the lighter piece
alot easier than it can the heavier piece. Which
means a quicker response
time to the wheels. Now, add in the the front
axle(s) also. In stock form,
if driving the fornt wheels took the exact
same amount as driving the back
wheels, then when you lighten the rear
assembly, it makes the rear more
responsive, leaving the front as is, thus
giving you a higher rear torque
bias.
- -Cody
(if they hurt
anything, spacers would hurt the hub/axle)
- -----Original
Message-----
From:
owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st[
mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On
Behalf Of Merritt
Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2000 2:32 AM
To:
jeff.mohler@netapp.com;
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
RE: Team3S: An outsider's look at a VR4
At 11:41 PM 7/29/00 -0700,
jeff.mohler@netapp.com
wrote:
>Two things:
>
>Increasing track will increase
oversteer (decrease understeer)..period.
I was gonna get that spacer and
longer studs like you suggested a few weeks
ago, but I got new wheels
instead. I gotta check with Tire Rack and see
what they think about spacers
with the Milli Miglia wheels.
>
>Second, dump the stock
driveshaft, and watch your torque bias shift...as
you
>will increasing
the power efficiency of the back of the car, and raising
the
>amount of
delivered power to the ground. Im hoping to find about
30-40lbs
in
>shaft alone (IE: Significant in power terms)
How
does changing the driveshaft shift the torque bias?
Rich/old
poop
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 09:45:39
-0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Lucius <
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Torque split (was: An outsider's look at a VR4)
The torque from
the engine is split between front and rear axles at
the center
differential/viscous coupling unit. The transfer case gear
reduction
quantifies what the torque split is. For 5-spd it is 45/55
(F/R) and for 6-sp
it is 49/51 (F/R). **If** the Japanese version has
a different split then the
center diff/VC unit, transfer case, front
diff, and rear diff must all be
different than ours. I have not heard
of such critters but would like to know
about details if they really
exist. AWD gear reduction ratios can be found on
the Specifications
page at my web site.
Jeff Lucius
Red 1992
Stealth TT - modified
-->
http://www.3si.org/member-home/jlucius/-
----- Original Message -----
From: "Merritt" <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
To:
<
jeff.mohler@netapp.com>;
<
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Sunday, July 30, 2000 12:47 AM
Subject: RE: Team3S: An outsider's look at a
VR4
> What about the RWD bias they dial into our cars in Japan? How do
we
> do that here? Is it part of the transmission or is it an
external
> adjustment?
> Rich/old
poop
__________________________________________________
Do You
Yahoo!?
Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites.
http://invites.yahoo.com/***
Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 09:57:01
-0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Lucius <
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Please turn off auto-replies!
Hey kiddies, please turn off your
"I'm not here" replies to list
emails.
- ----- Original Message -----
From: <
Anissa.Mohler@netapp.com>
To:
<
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
******* this was a Team3S email! ********
Sent: Sunday, July 30,
2000 10:47 AM
Subject: Out of Office AutoReply: Team3S: Torque split (was:
An
outsider's look at a VR4)
> I will be out of the office from
7/31-8/4.
> For technical assistance please call
1-888-4NETAPP.
__________________________________________________
Do
You Yahoo!?
Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites.
http://invites.yahoo.com/***
Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 11:31:01
-0700
From:
jeff.mohler@netapp.comSubject: RE:
Team3S: An outsider's look at a VR4
At 11:41 PM 7/29/00 -0700,
jeff.mohler@netapp.com
wrote:
>Two things:
>
>Increasing track will increase
oversteer (decrease understeer)..period.
I was gonna get that
spacer and longer studs like you suggested a few weeks
ago, but I got new
wheels instead. I gotta check with Tire Rack and see
what they think about
spacers with the Milli Miglia wheels.
- ---
Whats for them to
think..this doesnt affect the wheel at all.
They'll whine about
lug-centric..but with an acorn wheel and nut..it doesnt
matter anyway.
Just ask the Porsche ppl who run 2"+ spacers out back
*heh*
>Second, dump the stock driveshaft, and watch your torque
bias shift...as you
>will increasing the power efficiency of the back of
the car, and raising the
>amount of delivered power to the ground.
Im hoping to find about 30-40lbs in
>shaft alone (IE: Significant in power
terms)
How does changing the driveshaft shift the torque bias?
-
---
As you gain efficiency in your drivetrain (less mass to waste
power
accelerating) you gain power to the ground.
I dropped 69lbs of
drivetrain (pulley, flywheel, driveshaft, wheels..all
lightweight) and on
STOCK boost Im running about 238Hp with 286lb of torque.
This is on a 500
mile old motor as well..drivetrain weight is worth BIG
power
differences.
The more weight you remove from the rear
drivetrain, the more power that is sent
there..makes it to the ground,
shifting the bias. To do so mechanically would
require major
modifications to the drivetrain otherwise.
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 11:31:58
-0700
From:
jeff.mohler@netapp.comSubject: RE:
Team3S: Please turn off auto-replies!
I'll get her to fix that..shes in
holland for a week and I get to babysit.
- -----Original
Message-----
From: Jeff Lucius [
mailto:stealthman92@yahoo.com]
Sent:
Sunday, July 30, 2000 9:57 AM
To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stCc:
Anissa.Mohler@netapp.comSubject:
Team3S: Please turn off auto-replies!
Hey kiddies, please turn off
your "I'm not here" replies to list
emails.
- ----- Original Message
-----
From: <
Anissa.Mohler@netapp.com>
To:
<
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
******* this was a Team3S email! ********
Sent: Sunday, July 30,
2000 10:47 AM
Subject: Out of Office AutoReply: Team3S: Torque split (was:
An
outsider's look at a VR4)
> I will be out of the office from
7/31-8/4.
> For technical assistance please call
1-888-4NETAPP.
__________________________________________________
Do
You Yahoo!?
Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites.
http://invites.yahoo.com/***
Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 14:00:31
-0500
From: "Greg S." <
wizards@mhtc.net>
Subject: Team3S:
Gathering Web Site is NOW up and running!
Hi all,
The web site for
the first ever W3SI Gathering is now up and running!
Stop by and sign up if
you're going to be in the area ... I'm hoping for
a
great turnout and
would love to see you there!
http://www.mhtc.net/~wizards/W3SI/Events/Roadrun/RoadRun.htmlGreg
P.S.
Feel free to make comments/Suggestions on the HTML if you
like
as well .... that's how
we all improve.
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 14:59:49
-0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Torque split (was: An outsider's look at a VR4)
At 09:45 AM
7/30/00 -0700, Jeff Lucius wrote:
>The torque from the engine is split
between front and rear axles at
>the center differential/viscous coupling
unit. The transfer case gear
>reduction quantifies what the torque split
is. For 5-spd it is 45/55
>(F/R) and for 6-sp it is 49/51
(F/R).
You guys with 5-speeds have a RWD bias, then. Do you oversteer as
much as
6-speed cars?
Think I could swap the center diff from a
5-speed into a 6 speed?
**If** the Japanese version
has
>a different split then the center diff/VC unit, transfer case,
front
>diff, and rear diff must all be different than ours. I have not
heard
>of such critters but would like to know about details
I just
heard about it. Don't know if it's true. Mebbe it's just the
5-speed, like
you describe.
Rich/old poop
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 14:56:53
-0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
RE: Team3S:lightweight driveshafts
>wheels, then when you lighten the
rear assembly, it makes the rear more
>responsive, leaving the front as
is, thus giving you a higher rear torque
>bias.
>
Where do you
get one of these lightweight driveshafts, and how much do
they
cost?
Rich/old poop
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 13:26:30
-0700
From:
jeff.mohler@netapp.comSubject: RE:
Team3S:lightweight driveshafts
You have to have one made.
I can
get an alum-alloy made for a Supra for $350, probly $425 for a VR4
(increased
length). A cold-steel OEM type shaft (but without the
heavy
joints..etc) will weight about 2x an alum shaft, but still half of a
stock
probly.
- -----Original Message-----
From: Merritt [
mailto:merritt@cedar-rapids.net]
Sent:
Sunday, July 30, 2000 12:57 PM
To: cody
Cc: Team3S
Subject: RE:
Team3S:lightweight driveshafts
>wheels, then when you lighten the
rear assembly, it makes the rear more
>responsive, leaving the front as
is, thus giving you a higher rear torque
>bias.
>
Where do you
get one of these lightweight driveshafts, and how much do
they
cost?
Rich/old poop
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 15:51:47
-0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
RE: Team3S:lightweight driveshafts
At 01:26 PM 7/30/00 -0700,
jeff.mohler@netapp.com
wrote:
>You have to have one made.
>
>I can get an alum-alloy
made for a Supra for $350, probly $425 for a VR4
>(increased
length). A cold-steel OEM type shaft (but without the
heavy
>joints..etc) will weight about 2x an alum shaft, but still half of
a stock
>probly.
OUCH!! I think I'll try the
spacers.
Rich
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 17:34:02
-0500
From: "Jannusch, Matt" <
mjannusch@marketwatch.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: An outsider's look at a VR4
> Also, a material that won't
flex as much will help. The stock driveshaft
> will flex a little
before the torque is applied to the rear axles. With a
> stiffer
driveshaft, the torque will be transferred immediately. I've
>
noticed a huge difference first hand on mountain bikes with wheels,
cranks
> and frames.
Unfortunately that means that the transmission
and transfer case need to
absorb more of that twisting energy, and as most of
us are aware - those
parts aren't particularly strong (or cheap). The
torque will get transfered
quicker, but with an increase of opposing force on
both ends of the system.
Opposing force probably isn't the right choice of
words, but I think I'm
getting my point across.
- -Matt
'95 3000GT
Spyder VR4
*** Info:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm
***
------------------------------
End of team3s V1
#218
*********************