team3s
Friday, May 12
2000
Volume 01 : Number
134
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 11 May 2000 17:43:50 -0700
From:
jeff.mohler@netapp.comSubject: RE:
Team3S: Water injection mounting..
Sounds like a winner to me!
I
may get around to pulling it out this evening..since the car was stolen
the
washer pump hasnt worked anyway *heh*
- -----Original
Message-----
From: Mark [
mailto:pagan@siscom.net]
Sent: Thursday,
May 11, 2000 4:30 PM
To: Team3S List
Subject: Re: Team3S: Water injection
mounting..
At 02:41 PM 5/11/00 -0700, Geoff Mohler
wrote:
>*laugh*
>
>So just how did you do
that?
>
>
<snip>
Well, interestingly enough I got a
2" pipe plug. It is really just 2
pieces of metal with a rubbery
gasket in the middle and a stud with a wing
nut on top. Rather simple
idea, tighten the nut the pieces of metal close
together squashing the gasket
(washer thing). This causes it to get bigger
and seal up tight.
Air tight. In fact, when testing the top my friend and
I put a air hose
in the line coming out of the pump to see if the rest of
the washer bottle
was air tight. We regulated the line at 20 psi (since I
don't really
think I would put more than that in it) and viola, it held.
The interesting
thing is that we grabbed the wrong air line in the garage
and got one that
was unregulated. We put about 165 psi of pressure in that
tank.
It swelled like a balloon, but quickly shrunk back down. The good
news
is, no air leak :).
BTW, the 2" pipe plug gasket is too big.
We shrank mine down with a belt
sander. Very messy.
Tank works
great!
Mark
'93 R/T TT
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 11 May 2000 18:03:29 -0700
From: "Ryan Peterson" <
ryanp@crcwnet.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Gas cover release
The spring might have come off or got bent. Get
a friend, have him pull up
on the lever, then you get a plastic stick (so the
paint won't chip) and pry
the door open. Then fix your spring. I had the same
trouble once.
- -----Original Message-----
From:
owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st[
mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On
Behalf Of Brett Russell
Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2000 6:11 AM
To:
team3s@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
Team3S: Gas cover release
Hey all, I'm having a bit of a problem with
my 3000 this morning; my gas
tank cover won't open.
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 11 May 2000 21:50:03 -0400
From: "Heikki Pikkujamsa" <
hpikkujamsa@compuserve.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Motor Oil
I use Mobil Synthetic 0W-30. This oil was tested to
be the second best by
the biggest Scandinavian technical magazine, Tekniikan
Maailma, in Finland.
The best oil tested was Castrol Syntec 0W-30, but
unfortunately it is not
available here in USA. Test included all major oil
brands available in
Europe and was very thorough. I can try to get a copy of
the test and
translate it if you are interested.
I have been using
Mobil 0W-30 with K&N oil filter with very good results.
Oil consumption
is null, and it also stopped my lash adjuster tick
completely. Redline is my
choice for tranny/transaxle and rear end.
Heikki
'92 R/T
TT
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 11 May 2000 19:07:06 -0500
From: Wayne <
whietala@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Need a way to determine rod bearing failure...
Chris,
A good
way to check it without removing anything else would be to rotate
the
crankshaft until a piston is just past top dead center (just starting
the
downward movement). At this point, push on the top of the piston while
keeping the crank still. If the piston moves without the crank moving, you
have a bad rod bearing. Repeat for all 6 pistons. If the front head is
still on the engine, rotate the cams in such a way as to relieve the
pressure from as many valves as possible, to prevent interference between
the valves and pistons.
Keep in mind that this method of testing will
work only with bearings that
are pretty worn, but if ANY movement occurs,
you should remove the oil pan
and check from
underneath.....
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 11 May 2000 21:59:51 -0500
From: Merritt <
merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Team3S: Go-Kart Track
Just in case you haven't seen a go-kart track
before, here's what one looks
like:
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Garage/1222/autoxfl1.htmIn
my previous post, I said we were running a 60 mph average speed there,
but I
thought the track was 0.7 miles. In fact, it is 0.6 miles, which cuts
the
average speed for a :40 lap to
...hmmm, let's see...ah, minutes per mile
times.. ah.. er..
54.54 mph, I think. Any pro rallyists out
there?
The start/finish line is the white line across the track at the
top center.
We go CCW from the S/F line: It leads to a sharp right, then a
big
horseshoe left, then a straight where you hit about 70-75 before
braking,
turning left, and sliding right to the edge of the railroad
tracks
(protected by tires), then 70-75 to another horseshoe left, where
an
instructor says the fast way through is to diamond the turn (I never did
it
right). Then to the fastest part of the track, where the fast guys (not
me)
hit 80 mph before the carousel turn to the right, then a quick burst to
the
last left hand horseshoe and back to the start/finish line. Most cars
run
the entire thing in 2nd gear. Who says go-kart tracks aren't
fun?
In autocrosses, cars enter the track from the top left, take a
warmup run
around the track, and cross the S/F line at speed for the official
start,
then run two laps. A hot time for two laps in a street-legal car is
1:19.
It is totally unlike most autocrosses, because you get to warm up
the tires
and brakes, and there are no slaloms, Chicago boxes, gates or
pylons.
Several Iowa clubs run there, including SCCA, Porsche, and Mustang
clubs --
plus little gangs of cars, like our 10 cars from Cedar Rapids that
rented
it for the afternoon at $50 per car.
Rich/94 Mitsubishi 3000GT
VR4
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 11 May 2000 19:21:26 -0700
From: vect0r0 <
vect0r0@ix.netcom.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Need a way to determine rod bearing failure...
Is there a
detailed description of the removal of the lower end of an engine?
I have a
mechanic coming to my house this weekend to work on my car.
Any
ideas/help will save me a LOT of money as I can begin the process before
he
arrives. I've heard that the transfer case has to be
removed??? Any help
will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in
advance!
John
Wayne wrote:
> Keep in mind that this
method of testing will work only with bearings that
> are pretty worn, but
if ANY movement occurs, you should remove the oil pan
> and check from
underneath.....
>
> ***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 11 May 2000 19:32:22 -0700
From: "Barry E. King" <
beking@home.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S:
What's next?
If you think your suspension is good now, just wait until
you have GABs...no
sh*t. Spend the wad on GABs and be done with
it. Then drive the wheels off
of it.
Barry
>
-----Original Message-----
>
> We tested my suspension upgrades
yesterday, and now I'm not sure where to
> go from here.
>
>
An instructor measured the tire temps after a couple of hot laps
>
(immediate
> turn off the track, directly to the pyrometer, no cool down
at ALL!). The
> tires read 190 deg inside and out, and 185 in the center.
The instructor
> says that was absolutely dead-on perfect, and I should be
very happy,
> because lots of guys agonize over getting their tire temps
to a 5-deg
> spread and I got it the first time out (pure luck, gang! Or
maybe a good
> suspension shop.). He says I could make miniscule changes
in the tire
> pressure to get 190 all the way across, but he'd leave it
alone otherwise.
>
> Observers say the car corners completely
flat.
>
> I am wondering what to do next, if at all.
>
>
Here's the situation: I run Eibach springs (550 front/315 rear)
> with
Ground
> Control adjustable suspension and camber plates on stock struts.
The car
> has been lowered 1.5 in. all the way around. It has Yoko
A032R tires. I
> run 1 deg negative camber, +0.15 toe, and maximum castor
(+4.5 deg). We
> tested on a 0.7 mile/13 turn go kart track with about a
60 mph average
> speed, top speed of 70+, nice warm spring day, and ran 75
laps. We ran
> about 40 laps before checking tire temps.
>
> I
can still get some push and scrub the front tires, but two instructors
>
tell me I am overdriving the tires when that happens, and I should go a
>
little slower to go faster. There is no question that *I* have to
improve
> to go faster (be smoother and more consistent), but my
question
> involve car
> prep:
>
> Is there anything
else I can do to improve the CAR'S cornering ability?
> Sway bars? Chassis
stiffeners? Polyurethane bushings? Or do the tire
> temperatures say
that I am at the optimum point now?
>
> Mitsubishi lore says that
the Eibachs will ruin my stock struts very
> quickly, because the stock
shocks can't take the abuse from the
> higher rate
> springs. So,
what kind of shocks should I go to next? GABs seem to be the
> strut of
choice for Mitsus.
>
> Another instructor said to leave the
furshlugginer suspension alone and
> just get more seat time. He also
suggested I forgoe any horsepower mods
> until I get used to the new
suspension. I'm still running a stock engine.
> (I was kinda hoping that
my suspension mods were at an end, so I
> could kick
> it up to 400
hp)
>
> All advice is welcome.
>
> Rich/94 Mitsubishi
3000GT VR4 AWD
>
>
>
> ***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
>
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 11 May 2000 19:43:29 -0700
From:
jeff.mohler@netapp.comSubject: RE:
Team3S: Motor Oil
Define major brands..
Wal Mart availability, or
known high-performance synthetics available at
performance minded retail
locations.
- -----Original Message-----
From: Heikki Pikkujamsa [
mailto:hpikkujamsa@compuserve.com]
Sent:
Thursday, May 11, 2000 6:50 PM
To: 3S Team (E-mail)
Subject: RE: Team3S:
Motor Oil
I use Mobil Synthetic 0W-30. This oil was tested to be the
second best by
the biggest Scandinavian technical magazine, Tekniikan
Maailma, in Finland.
The best oil tested was Castrol Syntec 0W-30, but
unfortunately it is not
available here in USA. Test included all major oil
brands available in
Europe and was very thorough. I can try to get a copy of
the test and
translate it if you are interested.
I have been using
Mobil 0W-30 with K&N oil filter with very good results.
Oil consumption
is null, and it also stopped my lash adjuster tick
completely. Redline is my
choice for tranny/transaxle and rear end.
Heikki
'92 R/T
TT
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 00:46:34 EDT
From:
Klusmanp@aol.comSubject: Team3S: How much
$$$ to ship a car?
I'm moving from Indiana to Kansas in about a month.
(one exotic locale to
another!) I've got two cars so I'll need to drive one
and ship the other.
If I ship the 3000GT:
Anybody know of a Good
carrier for shipping cars and how much it will cost?
If I ship
the rusty '87 Ford Bronco:
Anybody know of a CHEAP carrier for shipping cars
and how much it will cost?
Thanks!
Paul
Klusman
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 00:39:23 -0700
From: "Jose Soriano" <
amahoser@linkline.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Re: IC Upgrade Efficiency
Sorry I haven't replied to this in
a while but here goes....
First off here's the specs of my setup at the
time of the "test" runs:
368sx Turbos at 15 psi
720 cc
injectors
runs were made near my house on a bunch of curvy roads where I
had to brake
and accelerate a lot. I KNOW that these are not optimal testing
conditions
but that's what I had at the time. I wanted info on what my
intercoolers
were capable of and since my car isn't track ready quite yet,
that's all I
had.
200 degrees inlet temp was the MAX I've seen in my car
EVER. Before my turbo
upgrade, the max inlet I saw was 165 degrees with 9b's
and outlet temp was
still around 5-7 degrees above ambient.
From:
"xwing" <
xwing@execpc.com>
> You'd have to
set a boost value (the higher the better, as that makes
> more heat); and
just HOLD THAT BOOST VALUE at some
> vehicle speed, say 60mph, by having
the THROTTLE FLOORED
> while HOLDING THE FOOTBRAKE so engine rpm and
boost
> remain constant, (wearing your brakes plenty)
> hold THIS
for say 20-30 seconds to EQUILIBRATE the system
> and produce TRUE
efficiency rating of the intercooler system.
Sorry buddy, I like my car to
much to abuse it like that! Abuse at the
track... sure... but
unecessary abuse like that is unwarranted... at least
for me. Brake pads,
rotors and drivetrain abuse are things I try to avoid
when not at the
track!
> Should specify which turbos; what car speed; rpm;
boost;
> which IC core; how mounted/sealed to frontend; how long
>
you held the value; and maybe based on how fast temp at
> outlet was
curving upward by the time you had to stop,
> you could extrapolate where
it would end up at at steady-state.
GT-Pro 368sx Turbos. Car speed was
variable... don't remember exactly but
somewhere around 80mph. Boost was
limited to 15psi. I don't have an EGT
guage mounted yet so I WON'T push my
boost beyond that. Gotta remember guys,
I just had the turbo's installed...
didn't wanna blow up my car right away.
Sorry, but I didn't have time to
watch the temp curve since I was driving at
the time.....
> Just
running up on acceleration for 15 seconds at unspecified
> speed/boost/rpm
(turbo airflow) values is not enough information. If
> going to all
the
> trouble of a temp sensor before and after IC, that is
great!--but
> PUSH that IC with a HARD test (I'd like to see 20 psi
at
> 5000rpm for 20 seconds at 60mph or so, but at least TRY to do it as
long
> as
> possible until brakes overheat--may be less than 20
secs).
> If smaller turbos, try 15psi at 4500 or some such, just
specify.
> I suspect the huge FMIC cores now popular will do well,
>
but am not sure about taking 20 psi = 320 Fahrenheit air and
> cooling it
to 5 F above ambient continuously (such as roadcourse).
I DID NOT just run
the car for 15 seconds. I pushed the car pretty damn hard
for a while in
order to see 200 degrees. And don't worry, I'll run high
boost at a road race
track in the future. My car needs a roll cage and other
things before I take
the Stealth to the track again. I know at 5 degrees
above ambient probably
won't hold up under road race situations but come on
guys! It's still pretty
damn good.
> Turbo outlet temperatures at boost values:
>
15psi = 275F; 20psi = 320F; 25psi = 360F, all at 70%
compressor
> efficiency, for reference comparison.
Those figures are at
the turbo right? I assume that all my aluminum piping
and the length required
for the piping to reach the actual intercooler has
something to do with my
lower readings AT the intercooler.
Jack, I'm just an enthusiast. I
offered those numbers and the little test to
share with the rest of you since
no-one seemed to believe that the FMIC
worked. I have no problem running
tests for you guys, as a matter of fact, I
would be more than happy to. But
please make the test a little more
realistic. I am not gonna hold 60mph with
my brakes and keep the gas
floored! Geez, I don't wanna ruin another tranny,
buy a set of brake pads
and new rotors JUST for a few little tests for a
product I know works better
than anything else out there. When my car is
ready... I'll run it on a road
course (that's my first love anyways) and take
the car to a drag strip...
I'll give you guys my results when that happens...
might take a while since
I am not made of money.
Jose Soriano
visit
my Stealth site at
www.3si.org/amahoser***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 00:55:16 -0700
From: "Jose Soriano" <
amahoser@linkline.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Re: IC Upgrade Efficiency
Oh yeah... forgot....
>
Should specify which turbos; what car speed; rpm; boost;
> which IC core;
how mounted/sealed to frontend;
The front end is NOT sealed at this time.
There is no plastic undertray in
the font. I plan on putting something in in
the future.... check out my site
under "MODIFICATION" for
pics!
Jose Soriano
visit my Stealth site at
www.3si.org/amahoser***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 09:14:31 +0100
From: "Martin" <
martin@star.co.uk>
Subject: Team3S:
Wheel bearings?
Hi all
I am fairly new to the list and got my first 3k
GTO a couple of weeks ago so please bear with me if this subject has been
covered.
I am getting quite a violent wobble from the front wheels upon
braking at high speed.
I have had the wheels balanced and the four wheel
alignment checked which is well within the tolerance settings.
The pads look
OK but I am not sure about the rotors, but one thing I did notice is that when I
had the wheels up off the ground I grabbed the wheel at 6 and 12 O'clock and
there is about half an inch of play.
Is this normal? or can I tighten this up
with the centre nut and to what torque?
Or do you think that the bearings
need replacing?
Is this a big job such as needing a press or
something.
Sorry for all these questions but I don't have a manual of any
sort so I can't look up the info.
Thanks in advance
Regards
Martin
Berkley
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------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 10:41:04 +0200
From: "R.G." <
robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Re: IC Upgrade Efficiency
> 368sx Turbos at 15 psi
> 720
cc injectors
One thing to note is that the 368sx do not produce any hot
discharge air at
low 15psi. Therefore the large IC is an overkill at the
moment. Of course,
big airflow also means big piping and IC core to prevent
any boost loss but
at the moment the IC doesn't have to work a lot :) We'll
see what happens at
20 psi or more ;-)
Roger
93'3000GT
TT
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 08:07:59 -0500
From: "Basol, John" <
jbasol@Carlson.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Motor Oil
Lubricant, no matter if it's Dino or Man made gets
dirty. By-product of
combustion of air and gasoline is carbon.
There is now way around that.
Amsoil may very well be the best oil on the
market, but I will never buy a
product whose manufacture is try to sham the
public into believing that it
is 'perfectly safe' to drive 50,000 miles
without changing the oil.
John Basol
'95 RT/TT <-- Mobile 1
- 15W50 EVERY 3,000 miles
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 07:41:04 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Lucius <
stealthman92@yahoo.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Re: IC Upgrade Efficiency
Well according to theory, at PR=2
(15psi+14.7/14.7psi) and
ambient T=75ºF (actually probably warmer into
turbo), exit temp
from compressor would be 191ºF (535ºF x 2^0.283
minus 460) with
100% efficiency. Even assuming an outrageous 80% eff., real
exit
temps would be 75 + (116/0.8) = 220. And all this while assuming
no
pressure loss from compressor to plenum!
At a minumum we will have 0.5-1
psi loss from friction in the
pipes and that again from the IC, so at a
probable 90ºF into
turbo, PR=2.1 (16.2 boost at turbo), and 0.75
compressor eff.,
we get 261ºF comimg out of the turbo. Gee, is the
"theory" wrong
or is a measurement off somewhere or did I screw up
the math or
do we have the perfect (loss-less) turbo and IC here?
Jeff
Lucius
- ----- Original Message -----
From: R.G. <
robby@freesurf.ch>
To: Team3S <
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.st>
Sent:
Friday, May 12, 2000 3:41 AM
Subject: Re: Team3S: Re: IC Upgrade
Efficiency
> 368sx Turbos at 15 psi
> 720 cc
injectors
One thing to note is that the 368sx do not produce any
hot
discharge air at low 15psi. Therefore the large IC is an
overkill at
the moment. Of course, big airflow also means big
piping and IC core to
prevent any boost loss but at the moment
the IC doesn't have to work a lot :)
We'll see what happens at
20 psi or more ;-)
Roger
93'3000GT
TT
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------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 10:20:06 -0500
From: Matt Jannusch <
MAJ@BigCharts.com>
Subject: Team3S:
TMO Datalogger on a '95?
I know that it doesn't plug into the OBD-II
style connector, and I know that OBD-II tools don't work on the ECU, even though
it has an OBD-II connector (I tried anyways, despite what people said - mostly
because I am desperate to have datalogging).
My question is: Has
anyone tried to graft an OBD-II connector (connecing the proper pins) onto a TMO
Datalogger and get it to talk to the OBD-I ECU, and was it successful or
not?
- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 08:37:15 -0700
From:
jeff.mohler@netapp.comSubject: RE:
Team3S: How much $$$ to ship a car?
Gonna cost me $800 to ship a car from
Tulsa to San Jose, CA..so cant be more
than that.
Consider paying a
friend to drive it there, then fly him home..much cheaper.
-
-----Original Message-----
From:
Klusmanp@aol.com [
mailto:Klusmanp@aol.com]
Sent: Thursday,
May 11, 2000 9:47 PM
To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
Team3S: How much $$$ to ship a car?
I'm moving from Indiana to Kansas
in about a month. (one exotic locale to
another!) I've got two cars so I'll
need to drive one and ship the other.
If I ship the
3000GT:
Anybody know of a Good carrier for shipping cars and how much it will
cost?
If I ship the rusty '87 Ford Bronco:
Anybody know of a
CHEAP carrier for shipping cars and how much it will
cost?
Thanks!
Paul Klusman
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 08:44:21 -0700
From:
jeff.mohler@netapp.comSubject: RE:
Team3S: Motor Oil
Nobody said you had to leave the filter there for 50k
miles..
A little common sense please.
And an oils ability to
chemically remain stable in the acidic conditions of
combustion byproducts is
a factor as well.
I go about 15k between changes with my hard city
driving, and change filter
every 3k.
I routinely send away samples of
used oil to a friend of mine that he diagnoses
for part of this Thesis he has
to defend later this year, and so far my used oil
has remained chemically
strong as it was new, viscosity hasnt changed, and
evaporation/ash volumes
are still -0-.
You dont want to know how amsoil tested as -new- oil
either.
I should have results by the middle of june W/testing
procedures.
- -----Original Message-----
From: Basol, John [
mailto:jbasol@Carlson.com]
Sent: Friday,
May 12, 2000 6:08 AM
To:
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
RE: Team3S: Motor Oil
Lubricant, no matter if it's Dino or Man made
gets dirty. By-product of
combustion of air and gasoline is
carbon. There is now way around that.
Amsoil may very well be the best
oil on the market, but I will never buy a
product whose manufacture is try to
sham the public into believing that it
is 'perfectly safe' to drive 50,000
miles without changing the oil.
John Basol
'95 RT/TT <--
Mobile 1 - 15W50 EVERY 3,000 miles
***Info:
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***Info:
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------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 11:05:38 -0500
From: "Basol, John" <
jbasol@Carlson.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Motor Oil
I'm aware they recommend changing the filter. I
find it extremely difficult
to believe that it does not get dirty, even with
frequent filter changes. I
do find it easily acceptable to create a
lubricant that can maintain film
strength for extended periods of time.
It's simply the dirt issue I can't
overlook. Perhaps I am too old
school, but the extremely small financial,
and time investment into oil
changes just doesn't seem to outweigh the risk
involved, in my mind
anyway. I've rarely heard professional pit crews say
"Gee, if only
we hadn't changed the oil so often." The few
semi-professional
teams I know change oil after every event. Perhaps that
is a bit
drastic, but I bet they look at it the same way I
do....cheap
insurance.
John Basol
Wasting oil all over the
place :-)
-----Original Message-----
From:
jeff.mohler@netapp.com [
SMTP:jeff.mohler@netapp.com]
Sent:
Friday, May 12, 2000 10:44 AM
To:
jbasol@Carlson.com;
Team3S@stealth-3000gt.stSubject:
RE: Team3S: Motor Oil
Nobody said you had to leave the filter there for
50k miles..
A little common sense
please.
***Info:
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------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 10:53:10 -0700
From: Ken Middaugh <
Kenneth.Middaugh@gat.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Calculated boost behaviour with 13g
Hey Roger,
It
looks like I should have reread your post before sending my reply, instead
of
just looking at the graph a day later and replying :o. My mistake
:(, I
apoligize.
Yes, you explained everything very well, that only
the second half of the graph
is relevant, and that boost was calculated from
air flow frequency.
"Shift my gaze" -- More language
misunderstandings ;). I meant that I was
looking at my SPI gauge.
When the boost reached 14.5, I looked over (shifted my
gaze) to the RPM
gauge.
By the way, you express yourself very well using American English,
better than
many Americans ;). No doubt that our cliches and slang must
be difficult to
understand for our friends in which English is not their
primary language.
I always look forward to your tests &
measurments. They are invaluable to our
group. I'm especially
looking forward to test results in which you determine
how high you can boost
without detonation using your new 720 injectors and
water
injection.
Regards,
Ken
>
> Ken et
all,
>
> > This graph you calculated from injector frequency is
very interesting but
> IMHO
> > doesn't seem representative of
true boost.
>
> No, it isn't calculated from the injector frequency
at all. It's the signal
> given from the ARC upon the value it read from
the MAF.
>
> > It shows you don't reach 14.5 psi until
almost 4100 RPM and also the
> curve has a noticable hump.
>
> I thought I explained why this is and in a next run I will record the
data
> on a flat road. Please understand that I can't do this in 4rd gear
as I'd
> exceed our speed limit on our highways a lot ;-)
>
>
> For a contrast, my '91 with stock 9B's controlled with an SAVC-R and
stock
> > exhaust & cats will reach 14.2 psi (visually measured by
my SPI gauge and
> > corroberated with the SAVC-R gauge last night)
between 3200-3400 RPM
> > depending upon the gear (2nd-4th), the
incline of the road, and how quick
> I
> > shift my gaze from the
SPI boost gauge to the RPM gauge.
>
> Do not shift ! My recorded
data is like a run on the dyno. Choose a flat
> road and start at 1800 rpm
WOT in 3rd gear up to 6000-7000 (210km/h at 7k)
> You will see that boost
climbs up and will indeed reach max boost around
> 3200 or even a little
earlier, depending on the controller and how the low
> end is handeled. In
this situation, the discharge temperature and the
> efficiency of the
turbo are on the bad islands pretty soon and the IC have
> to work
overtime.
>
> > The SAVC-R graph modes also always show a
very
> > flat line from 3400-5100 RPM or so
>
> Yes, this
is the same with a simulated 1/4 mile run, although I'm above 4800
> in
these cases but due to the light overboost after shifting, the whole
>
bosot is a little higher. Watch the resolution of the AVC-R2 and what's
the
> difference of two dots on the display are. I think its pretty
accurate for
> what I have seen.
>
> > How accurate do you
feel your graph is?
>
> I took two reference points, at 4k and 5k.
Both are corresponding to the
> calculation and therefore the possible
error is around 2-4% due to the
> adjustability of the ARC. But look at
the graph again, the resolution is
> high on the axis and you'll note that
I still have 13.4psi (0.94 kg/cm2) at
> 6000 rpm what I think is not bad.
And at 5100 boost is still 14.4psi (1.01
> kg/cm2) compared to the 14.8psi
(1.04 kg/cm2) max boost. What is the
> measured boost at those rpm with
the AVC-R2 ?
>
> Just record the same data on the AVC-R and I'm
pretty positive you'll find
> somewhat same data. The diffenrence between
4000 and 5100 is only 2.7% and
> is what I've seen on the two peak-holds
of the Blitz stuff (pressing reset
> at the right moment. Of course my
finger trigger is not that accurate and
> fast enough and therefore 2-4%
offset is possible) and I like to be on the
> lower/safe side than on the
too optimistic side.
>
> > While it is accurate as far as your
ECU & injectors are
> > concerned, I'd guess it is a little
pessimistic of what your true boost
> really
> > is.
>
> Of course me too but driving the car around lately and watching the
boost
> gauges more than usually are proving the results. Of course I will
only
> believe in data that is really measured from a boost sensor and I
hope to be
> able to get the measuring device up and running next week.
Then I "simply"
> have to put both data together and then adjust
the conversion factors for
> the formula. As said, the data is NOT by the
injectors (I do also have a
> combined boost, IDC% chart) but it is from
the air flow signal read by the
> ECU. This signal determines how much
fuel must be given. Of ocurse, if I
> change the ARC setting to richer,
I'm simulating more air flow. But the
> trick is that the ARC is NOT rpm
related like an AFC or GCC as it is load
> related. If I'd change the
mixture by +2% I'd see 2% higher air flow
> reading. But the 2% are still
the same if the car is still under full load.
> And I will then also see
2% more boost and with the reference point I will
> then have to reduce
the factor by 2% to get the same boost at the points as
> measured. This
compensates the change on the ARC and again shows the same
> curve. BTW,
the air flow did only show an increase up to 6000 rpm. After
> that it
stayed constant, i.e. the consumption increase of the engine and the
>
loss of the turbo where the same. I can't wait to see a curve with
larger
> turbos as then the flow should still grow.
>
> Yes,
I also gave me the same question after the curve has been drawn the
>
first time. It wasn't just flat enough and I couldn't do anything
against
> the problem when boost falls below 0 (vacuum). But the
interesting area is
> under WOT and full load (i.e. 3rd or 4th gear). But
I took several runs I
> made and always got the same results. Of course,
the less resolution I took,
> the flatter the curve got.
>
>
As said, I'll do "real" measures, although the data used to calculate
boost
> IS real, and I will compare the results. I just hope that I'll be
able to
> record rpm too soon :)
>
> Roger
> 93'3000GT
TT
>
> PS: Damn, it's hard to explain this stuff not in my language
so please bear
> with me when I use the wrong words or longer senstences
to draw a picture.
>
> ***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
-
--
If you're not the lead car, your view never changes!
Ken Middaugh
(858) 455-4510
General Atomics
San Diego
***Info:
www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm***
------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 13:25:59 -0500
From: "Greg S." <
wizards@mhtc.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Motor Oil
I'm with you John ... I've read a couple of experts say that
the single BEST
thing the typical driver can do to preserve the life of their
vehicle is change
the oil and change it often. Several have said that
if you wanted to go to the
time and expensive of changing your oil and filter
every single day, the engine
would virtually never wear out. Now
changing the oil daily is far from
practical, but it does support what you've
said about the pit crews.
With modern synthetic oils, thermal breakdown
is virtually irrelevant today, but
even the best filter on the market isn't
going to completely remove all of the
contaminants, metal particles, etc.
that accumulate in the oil .... and those
contaminants are certainly not
helping the engine any. As an example, look at
your oil when brand new
and after it's been used ... something is turning it
into that black-as-night
liquid, because it certainly doesn't look that way
going in ... ta dah
contaminants. Consumers Reports says that any name brand
synthetic will
last virtually forever, but for the longest engine life, it
should be changed
(with filter) every 7 - 8,000 miles. I do (and almost
everyone I know)
do them one better by changing it once every 2 - 3,000
miles.
"Basol, John" wrote:
> I'm aware they
recommend changing the filter. I find it extremely difficult
> to
believe that it does not get dirty, even with frequent filter changes.
I
> do find it easily acceptable to create a lubricant that can maintain
film
> strength for extended periods of time. It's simply the dirt
issue I can't
> overlook. Perhaps I am too old school, but the
extremely small financial,
> and time investment into oil changes just
doesn't seem to outweigh the risk
> involved, in my mind anyway.
I've rarely heard professional pit crews say
> "Gee, if only we
hadn't changed the oil so often." The few
> semi-professional
teams I know change oil after every event. Perhaps that
> is a bit
drastic, but I bet they look at it the same way I do....cheap
>
insurance.
>
> John Basol
> Wasting oil all over the
place :-)
***Info:
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------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 15:20:36 -0500
From:
sjc0u812@juno.comSubject: Team3S: Pardon
the intrusion...
Sad news race fans:
Adam Petty, 19 year old son
of Kyle, was killed today at NH Motorspeedway
during practice for
qualification. As you know, the patriarch, Lee, just
passed on
too. Very
sad.
Best,
SJ
________________________________________________________________
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Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 13:42:34 -0700
From: Ken Middaugh <
Kenneth.Middaugh@gat.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Wheel bearings?
Welcome aboard Martin,
On the VR4's,
and maybe the normally aspirated models as well, the front
bearings are in a
hub assembly and cannot be tightened. They cost about $60 per
side from
one of the discount parts dealers (I'll forward a list to you
privately) and
should be easy to replace for a do-it-yourselfer. There should
be no
where near 1/2 inch play in your wheel. You should also grab at 9 and
3
O'clock. If you have the same amount of play, it probably is the
bearings. If
the play is only noticable when grabbing at the 6 and 12
O'clock positions, It
might be the ball joints in which case you'll have to
replace the whole A-arm
assemblies at about $220 per side. I can't
believe the alignment tech did not
mention this too you! I'd hesitate
going back there for an alignment if they
can't detect major wheel
play.
Good luck,
Ken
> I am fairly new to the list and got
my first 3k GTO a couple of weeks ago so please bear with me if this subject has
been covered.
> I am getting quite a violent wobble from the front wheels
upon braking at high speed.
> I have had the wheels balanced and the four
wheel alignment checked which is well within the tolerance settings.
> The
pads look OK but I am not sure about the rotors, but one thing I did notice is
that when I had the wheels up off the ground I grabbed the wheel at 6 and 12
O'clock and there is about half an inch of play.
> Is this normal? or can
I tighten this up with the centre nut and to what torque?
> Or do you
think that the bearings need replacing?
> Is this a big job such as
needing a press or something.
> Sorry for all these questions but I don't
have a manual of any sort so I can't look up the info.
- --
If you're
not the lead car, your view never changes!
Ken Middaugh (858)
455-4510
General Atomics
San Diego
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------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 12 May 2000 13:55:16 -0700
From: Ken Middaugh <
Kenneth.Middaugh@gat.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: TMO Datalogger on a '95?
> I know that it doesn't plug
into the OBD-II style connector, and I know that OBD-II tools don't work on the
ECU, even though it has an OBD-II connector (I tried anyways, despite what
people said - mostly because I am desperate to have datalogging).
>
> My question is: Has anyone tried to graft an OBD-II connector
(connecing the proper pins) onto a TMO Datalogger and get it to talk to the
OBD-I ECU, and was it successful or not?
There was a small thread last
November about this. Apparently the '94-'95 cars
are not OBD I or OBD
II, but some hybrid. Most likely, just a connector will
not do the
trick.
What needs to be done is someone with experience comparable to
Todd Day has to
get in and do the software. It really shouldn't be too
hard as long as the
'94-'95 protocol can be obtained.
- --
If you're
not the lead car, your view never changes!
Ken Middaugh (858)
455-4510
General Atomics
San Diego
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of team3s V1 #134
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