team3s            Friday, January 14 2000            Volume 01 : Number 025




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 18:32:57 -0800
From: "Sam Shelat" <sshelat@erols.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: $350 TO CHANGE SPARK PLUGS??

***This is the NEW Team3S list. See message end for more info.***



Thats about right!  I just had my 60k tune-up today.  It cost me $900 total
not including the plugs.  He said it normally runs about $400 to do the
plugs.  I had the pre-tensioner, timing belt, water pump, all fluids, drive
belts, parking brake adjusted, and oil pan gasket changed.  The plugs are
about $10 each=$60+ wires at $65.00 + filter (their price) $35.00 listed at
4 hours labor at $60 /hour =$400 give or take for parts.  It took me 2 hours
to do it myself for the first time.  Its not that hard if you ask around for
detailed instructions like these:
Check out these instructions given from Brian at GT Pro.  I used them last
week, went very well and I can not think of anything I would add.
START BRIAN'S INSTRUCTIONS
The easiest way to do it will be to first remove the rear I/C pipe
completely to get more room. Now remove the EGR pipe to manifold connection
where it meets the manifold, but only remove one bolt completely and make
the other one really loose. What this will do is release the stainless
gasket that is in there and this way you can "swing the gasket around and
not have it drop into the "black void", never to be found again. Now remove
the bolt attatching the rear manifold with the engine pick-up bracket
located near the drivers side, and also the same bracket on the passenger
side. Loosen, but do NOT remove the Y-pipe, just loosen it up and remove
ONLY the two rubber I/C pipes connected to it, them swing the Y-pipe upwards
carefully to make room to move the manifold. Now remove the two 10mm bolts
that hold the throttle cable and move it to the side. Remove the two 10mm
bolts that hold the three connector plugs to the manifold that sit next to
the Y-pipe. Remove the two 10mm bolts holding the front injector loom to the
manifold. NOW you can remove the main manifold bolts to remove the manifold.
You can now lift the manifold up. Use a prop to hold the manifold up and
tilted to the passenges side, and this will give you just enough room to get
the plugs out and changed. I would reccomened a new gasket for the intake
manifold at this time. Now just reverse the steps. One trick though, put the
manifold down on the lower manifold, but don't bolt it down yet, put in the
EGR pipe FIRST, the reason being is that with the manifold "loose" you can
move it a bit to line up the EGR holes, put one bolt in first with the
gasket tilted up so you can hold it from falling, then once you have the
first bolt in a few turns, then swing the gasket around and install the
other bolt. NOW do the rest, and you'll be done!!
END BRIAN'S INSTRUCTIONS

From: Tim DeKeyser <tdekeyser@hotmail.com>
To: team3s@stealth-3000gt.st <team3s@stealth-3000gt.st>
Date: Thursday, January 13, 2000 12:40 PM
Subject: Team3S: $350 TO CHANGE SPARK PLUGS??


>***This is the NEW Team3S list. See message end for more info.***
>
>
>I have asked around all the shops, including the dealer, and they all say
>that a tuneup for a '91 Dodge Stealth is nothing but replacing the spark
>plugs and air filter. Nothing has to be done with the timing or anything
>else. $350 minimum!!! Is this crazy or what??? What can I do if I dont have
>the knowledge/tools to do it myself??
>______________________________________________________
>Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
>
>
>
>*** Please make sure you are using the NEW Team3S list address:
>team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
>Subscribe/unsubscribe and all other important info is at:
>http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm ***



*** Please make sure you are using the NEW Team3S list address:
team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
Subscribe/unsubscribe and all other important info is at:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm ***

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 11:00:50 +0100
From: "Robby SOL" <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: EGT question.

***This is the NEW Team3S list. See message end for more info.***


> Who out there has an EGT sensor? Where did you get it? And if I do start
> playing with an AFC for my car, how high can the temps go before I'll
> ruin anything? This is a 1993 R/T NA.

You can simply do ... nothing with the AFC when you don't use larger injectors.

I have the Autometer EGT (still not installed) altough it only shows up to 1600°F (871°C). IMHO, this is already high and I'd like to keep it always below 850 or even 820°C. You may have a look into our archive about this topic as there is much more in it !

Roger
93'3000GT TT



*** Please make sure you are using the NEW Team3S list address:
team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
Subscribe/unsubscribe and all other important info is at:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm ***

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 09:30:51 -0600
From: Matt Jannusch <MAJ@BigCharts.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: EGT question.

***This is the NEW Team3S list. See message end for more info.***


> > Who out there has an EGT sensor? Where did you get it? And
> > if I do start playing with an AFC for my car, how high can
> > the temps go before I'll ruin anything? This is a 1993 R/T NA.

> You can simply do ... nothing with the AFC when you don't use
> larger injectors.

He wants to lean the car out...  He has a non-turbo, therefore the stock sized injectors will work fine.

> I have the Autometer EGT (still not installed) altough it
> only shows up to 1600°F (871°C). IMHO, this is already high
> and I'd like to keep it always below 850 or even 820°C. You
> may have a look into our archive about this topic as there is
> much more in it !

You'll probably never see temps this high on a non-turbo.  The best thing to do initially is to get an A/F ratio meter to see what the car's behavior is at wide-open throttle.  If it still targets around .5V signal, then there isn't much you can do to lean out the mixture anyway.

- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4


*** Please make sure you are using the NEW Team3S list address:
team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
Subscribe/unsubscribe and all other important info is at:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm ***

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 17:15:57 +0100
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: EGT question.

***This is the NEW Team3S list. See message end for more info.***


Sorry for the confusion, I did not notice that it is an NA.

Anyways, the ECU will probably adapt very soo, especially in closed loop. We made this experience on my Z28 as we adjusted the fuel pressure and the ECU adjusted the injector rate ofer a specific time. EGTs for an NA cars often are in the 720-780 range and unless the timing will be changed I doubt there will be a problem.... but I also don't see a gain :(

> He wants to lean the car out...  He has a non-turbo, therefore the stock sized injectors will work fine.

Roger
93'3000GT TT


*** Please make sure you are using the NEW Team3S list address:
team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
Subscribe/unsubscribe and all other important info is at:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm ***

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 12:25:40 -0600
From: "Trevor L. James" <trevor@kscable.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: EGT question.

***This is the NEW Team3S list. See message end for more info.***


Ha! My TT idles at 780F....

Trevor

"R.G." wrote:

> ***This is the NEW Team3S list. See message end for more info.***
>
> Sorry for the confusion, I did not notice that it is an NA.
>
> Anyways, the ECU will probably adapt very soo, especially in closed loop. We made this experience on my Z28 as we adjusted the fuel pressure and the ECU adjusted the injector rate ofer a specific time. EGTs for an NA cars often are in the 720-780 range and unless the timing will be changed I doubt there will be a problem.... but I also don't see a gain :(
>
> > He wants to lean the car out...  He has a non-turbo, therefore the stock sized injectors will work fine.
>
> Roger
> 93'3000GT TT
>
> *** Please make sure you are using the NEW Team3S list address:
> team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
> Subscribe/unsubscribe and all other important info is at:
> http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm ***






*** Please make sure you are using the NEW Team3S list address:
team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
Subscribe/unsubscribe and all other important info is at:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm ***

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 10:32:39 -0800
From: "Mohler, Jeff" <jeff.mohler@netapp.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: EGT question.

***This is the NEW Team3S list. See message end for more info.***



Ha! My TT idles at 780F....

Trevor
- ---

You;re kidding right..idles at 780 degrees?

Just makin sure I read right.


*** Please make sure you are using the NEW Team3S list address:
team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
Subscribe/unsubscribe and all other important info is at:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm ***

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 20:25:28 +0100
From: Matthews <matthews@wiesbaden.vistec.net>
Subject: Team3S: Question about ABS

***This is the NEW Team3S list. See message end for more info.***


As I was in the process of nearly rear-ending my van into some idiot who
decided to slam on the brakes from 90 mph to take an exit at the last
minute on the Autobahn this morning, I began seriously questioning the
activation of ABS.

Why is ABS enabled when braking in a straight line?

Now, I realize that most cars (perhaps my van included) do not have a
steering angle sensor, but unless I'm mistaken our cars do.  And it
seems to me that if that sensor shows that the wheel is straight, it
makes little sense to activate ABS under full braking.

My reasoning is based on previous discussions we've had in this forum
that indicated that ABS does in fact INCREASE braking distance over
non-ABS braking, even (especially?) when the wheels are locked up and
skidding.  Check the archives for details, but the reason was that the
coefficient of static friction is essentially maintained even when the
wheels are sliding, since pieces of the tire tear away in the process.
And in the snow, ABS prevents buildup in front of the tire.  Etc.  I
apologize in advance if I misunderstood that discussion and am mistaken,
and I hope someone will set me straight.

There is little question that ABS is extremely valuable when you're
trying to steer, but if you're climbing up someone's tail pipe, or
entering a turn on the race course in a straight, controlled fashion
(brake BEFORE turning!), I'd rather it did not intervene.

I think this would be a fairly easy modification; the ABS system can be
disabled by simply pulling the fuse, so I'm sure a switch could be
installed that monitors the steering angle sensor and disables ABS if
the wheel is straight.  If the car starts to spin, the driver would
compensate by turning in the direction of the skid, the sensor would
show that the wheel is no longer straight and ABS would be activated as
before.

Question is, does this make sense?  The answer must be no, since none of
the auto manufacturers are doing this.  So please enlighten me!  Thank
you.  :-)

- --
Jim Matthews  3SI #30
Wiesbaden, Germany
http://rover.wiesbaden.vistec.net/~matthews/stealth.html



*** Please make sure you are using the NEW Team3S list address:
team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
Subscribe/unsubscribe and all other important info is at:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm ***

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 11:52:34 -0800
From: Dan Jett <djett@corp.ultratech.com>
Subject: Team3S: Question about ABS -Reply

***This is the NEW Team3S list. See message end for more info.***


** High Priority **

ABS under straight line braking...Well, to the best of my knowledge,
ABS is activated under straight line braking primarily because at the
limit of wheel lock, different conditions can arise leading to uneven
lock, causing the vehicle to turn. This may be due to uneven brake
wear, proprortioning (if so equipped), uneven vehicle weight,
etc...Remember, the only point ABS satisifies is negating said wheel
lock and provide traction while stopping...Whether in a straight
line, or in a curve.

As far as what manufacturers deem as sensible...Well, I'm sure we all
know that a very small percentage of drivers would know the attributes
of their vehicle at limit of adhesion. While it has been shown that
ABS increases braking distances in a straight line, the margins are
negligible for the ordinary driver. I remember seeing a study in '95
with Emerson Fittipaldi behind the wheel of a 95 Eagle Talon Tsi
AWD...The goal was to see how a skilled, experienced driver would
fare against the advent of braking technology. If I remember
correctly, 60mph-0mph testing in a straight line yeilded a 12 ft
difference in braking without ABS...But this was Fittipaldi, not your
next door neighbor. Threshold braking in a vehicle requires extensive
knowledge of where that envelope lies, ands lets face it, most people
don't put themselves in the postion to know, (thankfully!). I think
this is clearly a case of the manufacturers satisfying a need for the
many, as opposed to the wants of a few.

Regards,

Dan Jett
94 Stealth TT




*** Please make sure you are using the NEW Team3S list address:
team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
Subscribe/unsubscribe and all other important info is at:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm ***

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 17:01:13 EST
From: DSMDealer1@aol.com
Subject: Team3S: Question...please advise

***This is the NEW Team3S list. See message end for more info.***


Being new to the list and the 3000GTs I wanted to post an e-mail to introduce
myself and hopefully get some information from the gurus here.  I recently
purchased a showroom condition '92 3000GT VR4 (Silver, loaded, black
interior) for $8400.  Problem in (always a catch) is that the transmission is
bad.  When Pep Boys replaced the clutch for the previous owner (please flame
him, not me...I'd never take a car there) they neglected to refill the
transmission.  So as a result, I have dropped the transmission and torn it
apart.  I've found a supplier for the bearings and seals (which I definitely
need), but am still looking for the seal that goes on the outside of the 5th
gear housing and the oil director that fits underneath the main shaft bearing
on the inside of the bell housing.  I have also found a cheap 6-speed
transmission that I'm thinking about picking up.  My questions are as follows:

1) Does anyone know how to check a viscous on these cars to determine the
condition of the unit?

2)  What would I have to change in order to use the 6-speed in the car since
it originally came with a 5-speed? (Cables? Transfer Case? Linkages? Etc.?)

3) Does anyone know where i may be able to find the last minor parts for the
transmission I currently have in order to put it back together? (oil
director, seal on outside of casing)

I appreciate any reply on this!

Since I work at a Mitsu dealership in the Club/Internet/Tuner Sales dept.
(parts), I would like to offer the same discounts to everyone here on the
list as well. (25% off of Mitsubishi list..not inflated dealer pricing). 
This is basically good for any OEM parts with the exception of accesories
(floormats, mudguards, roof racks, power winches, etc...(joking on the last
couple!!!)).  I am the only person in this dept. that handles Mitsubishi's
though, so please be patient when trying to reach me.  The phone # is (610)
272-8504 and you now also have my work e-mail address.  Thanks again for any
help in advance, and I look forward to adding any knowledge that I might
aquire on these cars in the future!

Josh
Conicelli Mitsubishi


*** Please make sure you are using the NEW Team3S list address:
team3S@stealth-3000gt.st
Subscribe/unsubscribe and all other important info is at:
http://www.stealth-3000gt.st/Team3S-Rules.htm ***

------------------------------

End of team3s V1 #25
********************