--

From: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com (Team3S Digest)
To: stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Subject: Team3S Digest V1 #363
Reply-To: stealth-3000gt
Sender: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Errors-To: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Precedence: bulk


Team3S Digest        Tuesday, December 21 1999        Volume 01 : Number 363




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 09:02:21 -0600
From: Matt Jannusch <MAJ@BigCharts.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Re: Proud owner of 4 new SP8000's...

> Hey, I just ordered the same tires from the tirerack.. they HAVE to be
> better than the Nitto Drag radials up front and All-Season
> Nitto's in back (a SHITTY ASS combo on a "supposedly" stable/predictable
> AWD car, throws it all out the window, feels more like a FWD car
> around turns, and a RWD upon accel)

This is the expected behavior when using tires of different traction
levels on an AWD car...  Nothing to do with the car, all tire...

- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 08:39:31 -0800
From: "Mohler, Jeff" <jeff.mohler@netapp.com>
Subject: Team3S: RC Car Bodies

Are VR4 bodies available in 1/10 scale for a Tamiya chassis?

Thanks
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 08:50:10 -0800
From: Raymond Yap <raymond.yap@stanford.edu>
Subject: Team3S: tire pressure and premium sound system

I've just got myself a new set of firestone firehawk sz-50s. just
curious as to what is the optimal tire pressure setting for the front
and rear of our cars for street driving, and for track racing.

i've also just picked up an infinity premium sound system from a friend
driving a 97 eclipse gsx. according to him, it is supposed to be the
same sound system as those used in 96-97 3000GTs ? is it a direct bolt
on onto my present setup ? or do i have to make modifications ? (haven't
seen the system yet.)

thanks !

raymond.
91 vr-4.
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 09:07:02 -0800
From: "Mohler, Jeff" <jeff.mohler@netapp.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: tire pressure and premium sound system

Ok..heres the answer to the tire question, but its not much of an answer.

"It Depends"

For the street..and for track use, you have to watch the sidewall wear.  You
only want so much creep up the side of the tread (easily measured with shoe
polish or good chalk) and you adjust tire pressure accordingly.  General rule is
2psi = 1/8th".  Most tires have an arrow that points to the cap (tread) of the
tire near the edge of the sidewall, you generally dont want to see any wearing
at the tip of the arrow, adjust to stop about 1/8" from that point.  This has
everything to do with how much actual tread rubber is on the road in a forceful
turn.

Along those same lines for track use.  Please, dont use street tirs.  The hotter
they get, the greasier they tend to get.  Good track rubber is lots cheaper than
street rubber.  Id suggest Kumho's for low-cost, good traction learning tires.
I use em, and placed 3rd divisionally in the MidDiv last year (now I need struts
and springs BAD).

Also for track use, watching how much you creep up the sides means little about
how much total tread surface you are getting, on the track ever mm counts.
Watching tire temps helps there too.  Heres an example matrix of temperatures,
and what they tell you on the track with the average tire.  Some react different
to pressures and alignment.

Inside  Center  Outside
- ------------------------
100 90 100 Tire pressure too low.
105 100 90 Too much -neg camber.
85 95 105 Too little -neg camber.
90 100 90 Tire pressure too high.


These are just a beginners way of viewing those metrics...and you have to study
alignment WITH how the tire is wearing to find the perfect match.  If you have a
car that just leans over in a turn WAY too much, theres little you can do within
OEM alignment ranges..but you can work on it.

- -----Original Message-----
From: Raymond Yap [mailto:raymond.yap@stanford.edu]
Sent: Monday, December 20, 1999 8:50 AM
To: stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com
Subject: Team3S: tire pressure and premium sound system


I've just got myself a new set of firestone firehawk sz-50s. just
curious as to what is the optimal tire pressure setting for the front
and rear of our cars for street driving, and for track racing.

i've also just picked up an infinity premium sound system from a friend
driving a 97 eclipse gsx. according to him, it is supposed to be the
same sound system as those used in 96-97 3000GTs ? is it a direct bolt
on onto my present setup ? or do i have to make modifications ? (haven't
seen the system yet.)

thanks !

raymond.
91 vr-4.
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 11:17:53 -0600
From: Matt Jannusch <MAJ@BigCharts.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: tire pressure and premium sound system

> i've also just picked up an infinity premium sound system
> from a friend driving a 97 eclipse gsx. according to him, it
> is supposed to be the same sound system as those used in 96-97
> 3000GTs ? is it a direct bolt on onto my present setup ? or do
> i have to make modifications ? (haven't seen the system yet.)

The 96-97 Infinity system will not work in a '91 VR4 without a lot of work.  The wiring loom connectors are different, the Infinity system incorporates a 210-watt amp/crossover setup that resides under the passenger seat, and the speaker wiring actually attaches direct to there instead of under the dash.  It would be drastically easier to go with a quality aftermarket setup than graft the Infinity system onto your car.  The speakers are also specially designed to complement the crossover slopes on the Infinity amplifier.

- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4

> raymond.
> 91 vr-4.

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 09:40:07 -0800
From: Raymond Yap <raymond.yap@stanford.edu>
Subject: Team3S: noisy lifters

My hydraulic lifters from the visible half of my engine is making a lot
of noise recently. I've heard that 1st gen eclipses have the same
problem , and i wonder if the same lifters are used. Is this a common
problem with 1st gen VR-4s ?? and is there a fix to it ? i thought of
opening up the valve cover and clean and soak the lifters, but am not
sure if that'll work.

thanks

raymond.
'91 vr-4
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 13:23:16 -0500
From: "Michael Chan" <michael.chan@hcl.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Re: Proud owner of 4 new SP8000's...

I currently have SP8000s and will somewhat agree.  I think my OEM Gatorbacks
[Goodyear] handled better in the rain though.

I've seen or heard of a few AWD owners with different size tires and rims
for the front and back.  [Wider in the back]  Other than looks, is there a
reason for this?

Mike
91TT

- -----Original Message-----
From: R.G. <robby@freesurf.ch>
To: stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com <stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com>
Date: Sunday, December 19, 1999 8:32 AM
Subject: Re: Team3S: Re: Proud owner of 4 new SP8000's...


>I had the SP8000 (245/45-17) as the second set a few years ago. I was very,
>very happy with them and my current Yokohama AVS-Z1 are just crap compared
>to them. And yes, if you have the mounted brandnew they are slippery. Zhis
>depends on how they have been stored and what grease the guys at the shop
>used. I also drive the first 50 miels easy with some hard stopping and a
>little warm-up on empty roads.
>
>Roger
>93'3000GT TT
>
>For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
>

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 20:03:08 +0100
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: RC Car Bodies

No, I already asked and they showed me a Ferrari body that looks pretty
ugly, something in between a Testarossa and our cars :)

Roger
93'3000GT TT



> Are VR4 bodies available in 1/10 scale for a Tamiya chassis?


For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 18:36:40 -0500
From: "Pete Ryner" <pryner@ij.net>
Subject: Team3S: Downpipe question

Please bear with one more exhaust question.  My downpipe is shot and I'm
looking at my options.  I'm planning to sell my '91 VR4, but in the past
week the noise has gotten too bad to ignore.  I've seen a lot of folks
advertising they have the ATR downpipe installed.  When I looked at a
picture of the pipe on the web, I didn't see any flex pipe.  Does the ATR
have a flex section?  If not, how does it handle the vibration?  Can anyone
recommend where to purchase?  I like the idea of being able to use it with
the stock system, but being able to add the rest of their system later.
Thanks for your advice.

Pete
'91 VR-4 (for sale soon)

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 15:32:14 -0800
From: Chris Winkley <cwinkley@plaza.ds.adp.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Downpipe question

Pete...

The ATR downpipe does not have a flex section. The exhaust system hangers
absorb the flex to some degree. I bought mine direct from ATR
(864-972-3800).

Looking forward...Chris

- -----Original Message-----
From: Pete Ryner [mailto:pryner@ij.net]
Sent: Monday, December 20, 1999 3:37 PM
To: stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com
Subject: Team3S: Downpipe question

Please bear with one more exhaust question.  My downpipe is shot and I'm
looking at my options.  I'm planning to sell my '91 VR4, but in the past
week the noise has gotten too bad to ignore.  I've seen a lot of folks
advertising they have the ATR downpipe installed.  When I looked at a
picture of the pipe on the web, I didn't see any flex pipe.  Does the ATR
have a flex section?  If not, how does it handle the vibration?  Can anyone
recommend where to purchase?  I like the idea of being able to use it with
the stock system, but being able to add the rest of their system later.
Thanks for your advice.

Pete
'91 VR-4 (for sale soon)
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 21:41:36 EST
From: Klusmanp@aol.com
Subject: Team3S: Are 2nd gen brake Calipers WIDER than 1st?

I'm gonna be really impressed if anyone knows this one:

How much WIDER are the front brake calipers on the 2nd gen. VR4 than 1st gen.
VR4? (or did the brake system simply grow in diameter?)

Here is another related question:
If I am going to buy an aftermarket rim that has an offset designed to clear
the front brake calipers on a 2nd gen. VR4, can I choose an offset that will
move the wheel/tire in closer to the centerline of my 1st gen. VR4 if the
calipers are smaller? I'm wanting to do this to get the tires closer to the
stock location with some aftermarket rims that would otherwise locate the
wheels further away from vehicle centerline than stock.


One final question:

Stock offset for 1st gen. VR4 is 46mm. Is this the same for 2nd gen. VR4? How
about 2nd gen. base and SL models?

Thanks for any help!
Paul Klusman
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 20:50:55 -0600
From: "cody" <overclck@flash.net>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Are 2nd gen brake Calipers WIDER than 1st?

The offset stays the same for all years, and I beleive All models.  The main
difference is wheel diameter, and more importantly, wheel design.  Wheels
with extremely thick spokes (thick deep, not thick wide) will have a harder
time clearing the calipers...  As far as your paragraph long question, I am
totally confused as to what you are trying to do...

Cody
overclck@flash.net


> Here is another related question:
> If I am going to buy an aftermarket rim that has an offset
> designed to clear
> the front brake calipers on a 2nd gen. VR4, can I choose an
> offset that will
> move the wheel/tire in closer to the centerline of my 1st gen. VR4 if the
> calipers are smaller? I'm wanting to do this to get the tires
> closer to the
> stock location with some aftermarket rims that would otherwise locate the
> wheels further away from vehicle centerline than stock.
>
>
> One final question:
>
> Stock offset for 1st gen. VR4 is 46mm. Is this the same for 2nd
> gen. VR4? How
> about 2nd gen. base and SL models?
> >

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 20:58:30 -0600
From: "cody" <overclck@flash.net>
Subject: Team3S: Introduction of Myself

I know this is the tech list, but I just would like to let people know who
the newcomer is.

My name is Cody Graham, I have been a member of the Starnet and Dragnet
lists for 2 years now.  I am also a founding member of 3SI, ID# 0101.  I
drive a 1993 3000GT SL, and I like to think I am knowledgeable about all
years and models of 3000GT and DSM (I also own a 1995 Eclipse GS-T)  Mods to
the 3000GT include your basic exhaust, air filter, spark plug wires, etc.
etc. and, oh yeah NOS...  No mods to the Eclipse yet...  A little about
myself, I live in South Padre Island, TX, and own a computer store here.  As
far as cars go, I have recently learned to paint (YAY!), and am also working
on the welding thing too, as I am considering a tube frame project car
(non-3000GT, they're too expensive)  I think I've wasted enough bandwidth
with this post, so if anyone would like more info, drop me a line at
overclck@flash.net or check out the 3SI Gallery / ReadersRides homepage at
http://members.tripod.com/readersrides

Thanks,
Cody
overclck@flash.net
PS - I tried to disable HTML for this e-mail address, if it is not, please
e-mail me and I will try and fx it...

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 21:09:20 -0500
From: Mark <pagan@siscom.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Are 2nd gen brake Calipers WIDER than 1st?

This is taken from www.3000gt.com and applies to all years and models as
far as I can tell:


"Stock size if 17" x 8.5"or 18" x 8.5". Centerline offset is 42mm"

Mark
'93 RT TT


>I'm gonna be really impressed if anyone knows this one:
>
>How much WIDER are the front brake calipers on the 2nd gen. VR4 than 1st gen.
>VR4? (or did the brake system simply grow in diameter?)
>
>Here is another related question:
>If I am going to buy an aftermarket rim that has an offset designed to clear
>the front brake calipers on a 2nd gen. VR4, can I choose an offset that will
>move the wheel/tire in closer to the centerline of my 1st gen. VR4 if the
>calipers are smaller? I'm wanting to do this to get the tires closer to the
>stock location with some aftermarket rims that would otherwise locate the
>wheels further away from vehicle centerline than stock.
>
>
>One final question:
>
>Stock offset for 1st gen. VR4 is 46mm. Is this the same for 2nd gen. VR4? How
>about 2nd gen. base and SL models?
>
>Thanks for any help!
>Paul Klusman
>For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
>http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 21:51:13 -0600
From: Merritt <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject: Team3S: A REAL virus alert! On OUR list!

I just refreshed my Norton anti-virus and lo and behold it discovered a
virus in the gadget.exe file I received from George Gergov. Fortunately, I
don't open ANY .exe files, so it had no effect.

If any of you got an message titled "Borla at Jeggs" in the past two days,
I suggest you do not open the enclosed gadget.exe.

Norton didn't find it yesterday when I opened the "Borla at Jeggs" message,
but after I upgraded Norton it found it a few minutes ago in my Trash file.
So, it's a brand new one. George Gergov probably didn't even know it was
there.

Word to the wise.

Rich/old poop/94 VR4
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 23:30:19 EST
From: Klusmanp@aol.com
Subject: Re: Team3S: Are 2nd gen brake Calipers WIDER than 1st?

In a message dated 99-12-20 21:55:59 EST, you write:

<< As far as your paragraph long question, I am
totally confused as to what you are trying to do... >>

Hmmmm, clear as mud eh? (my 10th grade English teacher would not be impressed)

OK!

1) There is an aftermarket rim I'd like to get. The rim is available in
various offsets.

2) Different offsets will end up placing a given rim/tire either more
"inside" the wheel well or "outside" the wheel well. When I say "inside" I
mean that the distance between the two front wheels is smaller - when I say
"outside" I mean that the distance between the two front wheels is bigger. An
extreme example of "outside" would be cars that have very small diameter
wheels that stick "way out" the sides of the car - usually with a very
powerful stereo system and driven by certain ethnic groups of our fellow
automotive brethren.  :)

3) The rims I'm looking at have an offset that ends up placing the wheels a
little more "outside" than stock rims. This is so the "spokes" of this
particular rim don't hit the front brake calipers of a 2nd gen. VR4.

4) If the brake calipers of my 1st gen. VR4 are a little slimmer, I can order
these rims with an offset that doesn't places the wheels (tires) so far
towards the "outside" as in 3) above.

5) The closer I keep the wheels (tires) to the position they would be with
stock rims, the less I will affect the handling and steering response of the
car.



Hope this helps!
Paul Klusman
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 21 Dec 1999 01:29:55 -0500
From: Bill Wagner <wagner@sprynet.com>
Subject: Team3S: A Strange noise coming from my car.

I have a strange noise coming from my car, and hopefully someone can
help me diagnose it.

The noise is SIMILAR to that of a bearing going bad (woo-woo-woo sound),
but I've checked the wheel bearings, a transmission shop checked the
bearings, and a dealership checked them before going out of warranty. I
noticed the noise about a year ago, and it hasn't gotten a lot worse,
but then again the car only gets driven about 7000 miles a year anyway.
The noise isn't real loud...playing the stereo at a moderate level will
cover it up. The guys at the transmission shop put a stethoscope on the
tranny and differential while one of them had the car on a rack and ran
it like it was actually in use, and couldn't find it. The best
suggestion I've had to date is that it's tire noise.

Here are the symptoms:

1. Noise seems to only appear after the cars been driven a while, but
once it's there it stays.
2. Seems to like to peak when I'm going about 42-45mph. Engine RPM has
no effect on the noise.
3. Noise is there regardless of the gear....it will be the same even if
I'm coasting at 45MPH..
4. Tire inflation doesn't seem to affect it...I tried adding 5lbs extra
pressure in each tire with no significant change.
5. I've had the tires rotated, balanced, and aligned...once again no
difference.

The noise APPEARS to be driveline related, but I'm not certain. Some
noises can be very tricky, and I suppose that something like a vibration
could be producing a deceptive sound.

Any ideas? If it is tire noise, does it mean I've got something wrong
with one of my tires (Pirelli P7000 Super Sports)? Any ideas?

Thanks,

Bill Wagner
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 21 Dec 1999 03:16:24 -0800
From: "Bob Forrest" <bf@bobforrest.com>
Subject: Team3S: NOS question (was: Introduction of Myself)...

- -----Original Message-----From: cody <overclck@flash.net>
- ------snip-----
>I drive a 1993 3000GT SL, and I like to think I am knowledgeable
about all
>years and models of 3000GT and DSM (I also own a 1995 Eclipse GS-T)
Mods to
>the 3000GT include your basic exhaust, air filter, spark plug
wires, etc.
>etc. and, oh yeah NOS...

What size NOS shot did you use?  I've been considering it for a
while now on my Stealth NT, but was hoping for a bit more info
before doing something wrong and toasting my engine.  Since with
Nitrous the igniting gases burn substantially hotter, what changes
did you make to other systems to protect the engine?

TIA,

Forrest


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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 21 Dec 1999 21:10:14 +0100
From: Mike Chapleski <mike.chapleski@attglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S: EGT Temps...

I have an Apexi EGT gauge (probe mounted before the turbo) and I found similar results.
While everyone tells you the best place to put the probe is right before the turbo, I cannot
figure out how it is helping me do anything.  I always get readings of 950+ deg C at WOT
(15psi, Borla cat back, test pipe, stock pre-cats, stock fuel, stock turbos).  On an other
engine this would indicate the pistons are already melted.  However, it appears perfectly
normal on our engine.  Everyone I know on the list that has installed the probe in that
position has reported similar results.  I was also very disappointed, because I thought I
could use the probe to tell me when the car was running too lean.  However, the normal heat
rage for our cars is A LOT higher than other cars and therefore I cannot figure out what it
is telling me.  Some people have recommended mounting the probe in the downpipe. Logic says
the closer to the heads the better, but when I hit 975 deg C, and the car is running
perfectly "normal" logic goes out the window.


Mike Chapleski
0018
'95 Stealth RT TT  In the process of installing a fuel pressure gauge in the center pod
(hopefully more useful than the EGT, but probably not).

"Trevor L. James" wrote:

> Just finished my Autometer Air/Fuel and EGT Gauge install. Tell me if these readings
> sound high:
> Idle-790 F
> WOT-1620 F (pegs the gauge out)
> It doesn't peg it out immediately, it takes a sec or two of WOT. I'm running 14.9psi. I
> dropped it down to 14.2 and it still pegged the gauge. I put the probe right above where
> the left most front cylinder meets the others. It will "see" all of the exhaust from the
> front bank of cylinders. Don't know how good it'll turn out BUT here's some ASCI art:
> _I______
> -|  |-|  |-|  |
>
> This things going to be useless to tune by if it's always maxing out!
>
> Trevor
> 96 R/T TT
> 92 GMC Typhoon
>
> For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

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------------------------------

End of Team3S Digest V1 #363
****************************

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