--

From: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com (Team3S Digest)
To: stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Subject: Team3S Digest V1 #317
Reply-To: stealth-3000gt
Sender: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Errors-To: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Precedence: bulk


Team3S Digest         Monday, October 25 1999         Volume 01 : Number 317




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 22:03:43 -0700
From: "Jose Soriano" <amahoser@linkline.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Rebuilding calipers

I rebuilt my calipers the last time I changed my pads. The rebuild kits come
with the rubber piston dust caps and the rubber piston o-ring seals. That's
it. They do not come with new pistons. If your pistons are far gone... you
might wanna get a set of rebuilt calipers. I'm not an expert on this but, if
the walls of you pistons are ok and the sctraches and gouges are not
affecting the seal, then you are probably ok... this is by you own jugement.
Take a look at the walls of the pistons and you can generally tell if its ok
or not. I purchased the rebuild kit from car parts store called Car Quest.

Good Luck
Jose Soriano
Amahoser@Linkline.com


- ----- Original Message -----
From: Merritt <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
To: <stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 23, 1999 8:30 AM
Subject: Team3S: Rebuilding calipers


> Can the front brake calipers on a 94 VR4 be rebuilt?
>
> I seem to have totally banged, scratched, and gouged the pistons, and I
> ruined several O-rings on my calipers from a dozen or more pad changes
this
> season. Is this something that can be done on the workbench or is it best
> left to a dealer? Is there a rebuilding kit?
>
> Even if I go to the Big Red, I still need to fix my old calipers.
>
> And while we're on the subject, any chance the front calipers would fit on
> the rear?...I can see a system with Big Red up front and the big front
> calipers on the rear. Might actually stop the furshlugginer car.
>
> Please advise.
>
> Rich/old poop/94 VR4/somebody stop me!
> For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
>

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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 23:32:06 -0600
From: "CEskelsen" <cesk@redrock.net>
Subject: Team3S: Hein Coilover Struts

Hello all,
    I'm ready for a suspension upgrade.  I've heard that the Hein Coilovers
are an excellent upgrade.  Any other options?  After reading Turbo Mag and
seeing the Bee racing GTO with the HKS setup, I'm wondering if there is a
better choice.  Let me know what you think.

Cory Eskelsen
96 R/T TT

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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 08:17:39 +0100
From: Matthews <matthews@wiesbaden.netsurf.de>
Subject: Re: Team3S: new brake pads

Thanx to all who responded.  Yesterday I did some long, hard braking,
including a set of three consecutive stops from 100 mph down to 30 mph
or so which had the brakes smoking and stinking (but not warping!).
Brake power was definitely improving the more stops I made (ie- ABS was
finally getting involved, even at 75+ mph with hot brakes).  I let them
cool off on the way home and took a look at the rotors.  Where they were
completely polished before, they now have dark concentric lines (no
grooving), and the pads have taken on a more reddish color.
Interesting.  Anyway, I hope stopping power continues to increase.

So my understanding at this point is that the improvement in braking can
be attributed to either pad badding/outgassing or enough wear on the
rotors to eliminate buildup of the previous pads' compound.

Why aren't pads sold pre-outgassed?  If that was indeed the real cause
of my dangerous situation, then I would think liability would be an
issue.

At any rate, be careful when you install new pads!  Make sure you have
full braking power before you need it!  Thanx again...

- --
Jim Matthews - Wiesbaden, Germany
matthews@wiesbaden.netsurf.de (64 Kbps ISDN)
http://rover.wiesbaden.netsurf.de/~matthews

*** 3000GT-Stealth International (3Si) Member #0030 ***
http://rover.wiesbaden.netsurf.de/~matthews/stealth.html
Jet Black '94 Dodge Stealth R/T Twin-Turbo AWD AWS 6-spd
Adjustable Active Suspension, Adjustable Exhaust System
K&N FIPK, A'PEXi Super AVC-R (1.0 bar @ 72% BADC)
A'PEXi Turbo Timer (30 sec), Blitz Blow-Off Valve
Magnecore spark plug wires, Redline ShockProof fluids
Abex metallic brake pads, custom braided brake lines
Michelin Pilot XGT-Z4 245/45ZR17, Top Speed: 168mph
G-Tech Pro: 0-60 4.79 sec, 1/4 13.16 sec @ 113.9 mph
1 Feb 99 Dyno Session: 406 SAE HP, 354 lb-ft torque


For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 02:41:37 -0500
From: "Vineet Singh" <billi_gates@hotmail.com>
Subject: Team3S: RE: No boost updates

This is kinda for Ahmed, but also asking yall,

can't you just unbolt the water/oil lines to either turbo, undo the "C"
clamp around the housing, and pull the compressor and center-cartridge out
by themselves? This sounds much easier to do, and I know you can do it on
the talons and older supra's... Just wondering, cause soon I have to check
them myself (my oil/smoke problem).

I heard more backfires (not really backfires, more like "afterfires") after
gutting my precats and occasionally running a 2.5" testpipe. This became
MUCH worse with the DSM injectors (450cc) installed UNTIL I got my AFC
installed. Now the AFC is kinda set from -20%@1000 thru 0%@7000 linearly.
(high throttle).

The afterfires still happen once in a while, but not as often, nor as loud
(SOMETIMES they are really loud tho still :)

Vineet Singh - Ghetto style exhaust semi-cured.
Manuals On CD - http://manualcd.dsm.org
Club DSM A/T - http://at.dsm.org  -  "Never Lift To Shift!"
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 12:36:33 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Fuel Pressure

> Anybody running the HKS in tank fuel pump?

HKS = Denso ... yes I do

> I would like to know what pressure it delivers to the fuel rail at idle
>  and at positive boost.

Ahem, fuel pressure is controlled by the pressure regulator.

> Or, as they check it in the Service manual, at idle with and without the
> FPR solenoid connected to the FPR.

Doesn't make sense to me. Fuel pressure is around 43psi at 0 psi boost and
rises as boost rises.

> Related question:  Do most after-market fuel pumps deliver a constant
> flow rate to the fuel rail no matter what the rpm?

The fuel pump is staged with a resistor that is switched off by a relay
activated by the ECU.

> At idle, the FPR allows most of the fuel to return to the fuel tank thus
keeping rail
> pressure down.  Then the FPR, when it senses boost, closes the return
> line which causes the rail pressure to raise.

The FPR is a linear device and therefore fuel pressure MUST not be lower
than a specific rate otherwise the injectors may want to spray more fuel
than available. This is why a minimum fuel pressure is available but the
flow is on a low level due to the pump slowed down to about 8V. The more the
change of the vaccum/boost to the FPR the more the fuel pressure changes.

Roger
93'3000GT TT

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 12:38:25 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Hein Coilover Struts

Never heard of "Hein" ... only "Tein" .... good stuff I heard but mucho $$$.

>     I'm ready for a suspension upgrade.  I've heard that the Hein
Coilovers
> are an excellent upgrade.  Any other options?

Roger
93'3000GT TT

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 12:45:31 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Turbo questions for all

Noble, your PCs date is Sat, 26 Dec 1998 , please correct it !

> Does anyone have experience with other turbos?

I guess Brad Bedell made some temp measurments as well.

> I'm thinking Brian's BIG ass monster turbos (@GTPro) would work great;
> they'd only be working probably at about 40-50% efficiency though.

Why should they run at such a low efficiency ? Please explain ! I do have the
368s ready and unfortunately they will create much more lag but for sure the
discharge temperature would be freezing cold compared to the small turbos. This
is easy to be exlained, because the air flow is much more with the same amount
of boost and therefore the compressor wheel must not work like crazy and
therefore will stay on it's efficiency island.

Roger
93'3000GT TT

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 10:01:14 -0000
From: "Sam Shelat" <sshelat@erols.com>
Subject: Team3S: 3si board

Does anyone know why every time I try to log on to www.3si.org, it gives me
a big Forbidden message?
Is it just my server, or does everyone have this problem.  Happens at work
too!

Sam

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 16:20:23 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: 3si board

It seems that another organisation took over the URL and is building up
their service on it. Unfortunately, Eric Lotter is not answering on emails
too. AFAIK, www.3si.org is dead until either a new name is registered or the
other organisation dissapears. It is possible that you can access to the
pages with the IP address directly, but I don't have it.

Roger
93'3000GT TT

> Does anyone know why every time I try to log on to www.3si.org, it gives
me
> a big Forbidden message?
> Is it just my server, or does everyone have this problem.  Happens at work
> too!


For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 10:16:59 -0000
From: "Sam Shelat" <sshelat@erols.com>
Subject: Team3S: Downpipe installation

Do I need any extra parts like gaskets or something to put on the new
downpipe?  If the Stillen piece replaces the rear cat, how difficult is the
removal of the rear cat?  Do you start from the top or bottom?  I do not see
any bolts from underneath, just a metel shield.  Any help would be
appreciated.

Sam 95 VR4

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 10:30:57 -0000
From: "Sam Shelat" <sshelat@erols.com>
Subject: Team3S: HKS SSBOV

I installed this unit in about 30 minutes.  However, I tried to put the car
in reverse, and it was stuck.  It ends up the hose ran too low and was
hitting the cam for reverse gear.  I had to disconnect the bracket on the
BOV to fuse panel and just leave the unit sitting on top of the gap between
the fuse box and y-pipe.  It works very good, and does not make the car
stall like some people mentioned.  Turbo recovery is noticeable quicker.
The air coming off this thing must be very hot, cause it was untouchable for
about 15-20 minutes.  The car seems more responsive, but that is not
measured in any way, so its my opinion.  I heard people saying you need to
put the air back after the MAF to provide the correct ratio it measured
before.  Don't we want the car to run richer under more boost?  Wouldn't
recycling hot air be bad for power?  I am a little confused because everyone
says our cars run too rich already, yet we need to add fuel to run more
boost.  Just some thoughts, any opinions?


Sam 95 VR4

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 11:51:51 -0400
From: "Kevin" <Kevin@pacarsearch.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: 3si board

Roger,

No one hijacked the domain (at least that's not what Eric said).  Big server
crash at Eric's web hosting company, thought it would be solved by now, but
maybe it was worse than they thought.

Kevin Schappell
Auto Answers
http://www.PACarSearch.com
If you love cars, check out
http://www.pacarsearch.com/motorhead
- ------------Still under construction---------------
- ----- Original Message -----
From: R.G. <robby@freesurf.ch>
To: <stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 24, 1999 10:20 AM
Subject: Re: Team3S: 3si board


> It seems that another organisation took over the URL and is building up
> their service on it. Unfortunately, Eric Lotter is not answering on emails
> too. AFAIK, www.3si.org is dead until either a new name is registered or
the
> other organisation dissapears. It is possible that you can access to the
> pages with the IP address directly, but I don't have it.
>
> Roger
> 93'3000GT TT
>
> > Does anyone know why every time I try to log on to www.3si.org, it gives
> me
> > a big Forbidden message?
> > Is it just my server, or does everyone have this problem.  Happens at
work
> > too!
>
>
> For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
>

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 12:17:02 -0700
From: Joe Gonsowski <twinturbo@mediaone.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Fuel Pressure

R.G. wrote:

>
> > I would like to know what pressure it delivers to the fuel rail at idle
> >  and at positive boost.
>
> Ahem, fuel pressure is controlled by the pressure regulator.
>
> > Or, as they check it in the Service manual, at idle with and without the
> > FPR solenoid connected to the FPR.
>
> Doesn't make sense to me. Fuel pressure is around 43psi at 0 psi boost and
> rises as boost rises.

Do you know what the peak pressure would be?  Roger, you may remember a datalog I sent
you last week showing a fluctuating O2 voltage in third gear at the upper rpms.  I now
believe it is fuel related.  I've watched fuel pressure during acceleration (17psi
boost) in third gear and see that during WOT, the pressure spikes up to ~51psi (3.5
bars) and then slowly drops as rpm rises.  I then feel the hesitation.  I thought the
Denso pump was suppose to deliver and hold ~60psi during boost.  I suspect the FPR is
faulty and isn't closing off the return line.

BTW - the service manual check for the FPR is to measure fuel pressure at idle with and
without the solenoid vacuum line connected to the FPR.  For a stock turbo car the
resultant pressures are suppose to be as follows:

idle: 235kPa (34psi)
idle with vacuum hose removed from FPR: 295-315kPa (43-45psi)

With a Denso pump, I'm not sure what values I should be seeing, I'd assume higher than
listed above.  I need to first understand whether my fuel system is delivering the
appropriate rail pressure.  If not, I'll focus on the FPR, FPR Solenoid, fuel filter,
vacuum lines/wiring, and the pump itself.  I wouldn't mind getting my RC injectors
rebalanced either.

Thanks,
Joe Gonsowski
'92 R/T TT

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 09:10:26 -0700
From: "Bob Forrest" <bf@bobforrest.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: 3si board

- -----Original Message-----From: Sam Shelat <sshelat@erols.com>
>>Does anyone know why every time I try to log on to www.3si.org, it
gives me
>>a big Forbidden message?
>>Is it just my server, or does everyone have this problem.  Happens
at work
>>too!
>
- -----Original Message-----From: R.G. <robby@freesurf.ch>
>It seems that another organisation took over the URL and is
building up
>their service on it. Unfortunately, Eric Lotter is not answering on
emails
>too. AFAIK, www.3si.org is dead until either a new name is
registered or the
>other organisation dissapears. It is possible that you can access
to the
>pages with the IP address directly, but I don't have it.


Eric sent me an email last night...

It's only a temporary technical glitch, centered with the ISP that
hosts the domain.  The www.3Si.org domain has not changed, nor
changed hands, but the current ISP has some of its 'wires crossed'
and can't seem to pinpoint the problem.  To further complicate
things, Eric can't access via FTP either, so he can't move the
website to a new ISP, which he is planning to do ASAP.

Stay tuned for details...  We'll post a more complete "Admin Alert"
with an update as soon as we have more information.

Best,

Forrest



For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 13:14:36 -0500
From: xwing <xwing@execpc.com>
Subject: Team3S: Re:Fuel injectors, Supra pump

Sam Shelat wrote:

> anyone know if Supra (MK4) 550cc injectors work on our cars?

No.  They are "side port", get fuel on SIDE of injector; ours and
most others are "top port" and get fuel from top of inj.
Supras upgrading injectors have to change their fuel rail also, HKS
makes upgrade fuelrail for like $340...ugh...this lets them use the
more standard top port inj of higher capacity out there.

Jack Tertadian


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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 20:50:54 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Fuel Pressure

> Do you know what the peak pressure would be?

Easy : at 0 psi FP is about 43 psi (like the hose disconnected from the FPR)
at 15 psi 43 + 17 = 60 psi

> I now believe it is fuel related.  I've watched fuel pressure during
acceleration (17psi
> boost) in third gear and see that during WOT, the pressure spikes up to
~51psi (3.5
> bars) and then slowly drops as rpm rises.  I then feel the hesitation.  I
thought the
> Denso pump was suppose to deliver and hold ~60psi during boost.  I suspect
the FPR is
> faulty and isn't closing off the return line.

Umpf, you may try to get an FPR from the NA but I dunno how well it works
under boost (out of it's specs !) Our stock fuel pump (also a Denso, 190
ltr/hr) is only able to flow around 32 gal/hr at 60psi. In reality it's more
as these values are the worst case in production. In comparison, the Walbro
"high pressure" fuel pump is able to flow 52gal/hr at the same fuel
pressure. I dunno what fuel pump you are using as well how rich you are
running. At 80% IDC with the 550cc you may flow up to 48 gal/hr, way too
much for the stock fuel pump. Assuming you are cooling the chamber with fuel
you are running around 44 gal/hr flow at around 58 psi. The fuel pumps
(Walbro) are rated to 255l/hr at around 41 psi and can deliver enough then.

> With a Denso pump, I'm not sure what values I should be seeing, I'd assume
higher than
> listed above.  I need to first understand whether my fuel system is
delivering the
> appropriate rail pressure.  If not, I'll focus on the FPR, FPR Solenoid,
fuel filter,
> vacuum lines/wiring, and the pump itself.  I wouldn't mind getting my RC
injectors
> rebalanced either.

Depending on the pump, I'd say the fuel filter needs to be checked if it was
not changed lately. A faulty FPR lowers the pressure even more but its also
worth looking at. Remember, the values we are getting fro mthe ECU is what
it is trying to do. This is why we can read more than 100% IDC with the
stock injectors. Of course they will then just stay fully open. This of
course is not the case with your injectors.

Reading 51 psi may be low compared to the calculated 58 psi and I have not
yet been able to read fuel pressure on my car. Therefore others input would
help to determine if you're running into fuel starvation.

Roger
93'3000GT TT

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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 14:58:31 EDT
From: TrboDrvr@aol.com
Subject: Team3S: Manifold Vacuum

Has anyone checked their manifold vacuum lately?  My car runs great, but runs
consistently one or two mm/hg below the specs in the service manual.  I am
interesting in hearing what other's vacuum readings are.

    Thanks!

Joe 91TT
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 21:55:12 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Downpipe installation

> Do I need any extra parts like gaskets or something to put on the new
> downpipe?

You need new exhaust gaskets on any flange as the stock ones are gone. Also
get new nuts too because I just lost one that didn't held anymore after
taking it off and on thr 6th time.

> If the Stillen piece replaces the rear cat, how difficult is the
> removal of the rear cat?

No, it doesn't replace the rear one. This is why I recommend to gut the rear
one when putting it on. Otherwise you are having different packpressure on
the front and rear turbo. It is not known what this may cause but I do not
like "unbalanced" systems ! Removing the rear precat is a super-mega-pain in
the ass.

Good luck,
Roger
93'3000GT TT

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 22:06:03 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: HKS SSBOV

> I installed this unit in about 30 minutes.  However, I tried to put the
car
> in reverse, and it was stuck.

Yep, you are having a second gen and the kit doesn't fit without
modification.

> BOV to fuse panel and just leave the unit sitting on top of the gap
between
> the fuse box and y-pipe.

You must mount it to something as the flange of the HKS BOV is not very good
and if it hits something from time to time it may got damaged.

>  It works very good, and does not make the car stall like some people
mentioned.

Well, it does but on what boost are you running ? And is it adjusted
properly ? This was always my problem until I foudn out that it started to
open at 14 psi and I lost pressure due to this. After readjusting it never
worked properly anymore :-( Of course it was the 1st gen and not the new
SSBOV, although it's about the same plastic BOV under the aluminum body.

>  I heard people saying you need to put the air back after the MAF to
provide
> the correct ratio it measured before.  Don't we want the car to run richer
under
> more boost?

This is already the case !

>  Wouldn't recycling hot air be bad for power?

Sure, but if the turbos are already running extremely out of its range and
are producing way too much hot air, recycling this hot air back is not doing
much more bad. Also the air is sent back during the closed throttle
situation.

> I am a little confused because everyone says our cars run too rich
already, yet we
> need to add fuel to run more boost.

Ahem, what exactly is the question ? We need fuel to fight against the knock
and this is more than really needed for the power.

Hope this helps,
Roger
93'3000GT TT


For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 22:21:54 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Manifold Vacuum

> Has anyone checked their manifold vacuum lately?  My car runs great, but
runs
> consistently one or two mm/hg below the specs in the service manual.  I am
> interesting in hearing what other's vacuum readings are.

This depends on the temperature and humidity as well as idleing or rolling
the car out. The boost meters are not very consistent as the at idle
(850rpm) DSBC reads 44cm/Hg, the Dual Timer 43cm/Hg and the meter 46cm/Hg.
The manual say 45cm/Hg and therefore it's in the limits. I'd be worried if
your readings are more than 40cm/Hg or less than 50cm/Hg.

Roger
93'3000GT TT

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 16:19:45 -0500
From: Trevor James <Trevor@kscable.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Turbo questions for all

There is such thing as not being able to run enough boost/RPM to make the turbo more
efficient. This is apples to oragnes but it's the same theory. Check this out;
http://www.enzoco.com/mike/syclone/maps.htm
My Ty only turns 2100-4300 RPM and maxes out at 16 psi on pump gas. The turbo on the
right would never reach it's peak efficiency and is too large for my application....The
stock turbo on the left is much too small.
Yes I'd probably be better off for straight drag racing running the too large turbo vs.
the stocker but if there's a turbo in between I bet I'd run faster and have less lag!

Trevor
96 R/T TT 12.68@111.4 0-60 4.14 Gtech (15g's are going in this week)
92 GMC Typhoon 14.10@97.4 0-60 5.34 Gtech

"R.G." wrote:

> Noble, your PCs date is Sat, 26 Dec 1998 , please correct it !
>
> > Does anyone have experience with other turbos?
>
> I guess Brad Bedell made some temp measurments as well.
>
> > I'm thinking Brian's BIG ass monster turbos (@GTPro) would work great;
> > they'd only be working probably at about 40-50% efficiency though.
>
> Why should they run at such a low efficiency ? Please explain ! I do have the
> 368s ready and unfortunately they will create much more lag but for sure the
> discharge temperature would be freezing cold compared to the small turbos. This
> is easy to be exlained, because the air flow is much more with the same amount
> of boost and therefore the compressor wheel must not work like crazy and
> therefore will stay on it's efficiency island.
>
> Roger
> 93'3000GT TT
>
> For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 00:26:02 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Turbo questions for all (efficiency map)

> There is such thing as not being able to run enough boost/RPM to make the
turbo more
> efficient. This is apples to oragnes but it's the same theory. Check this
out;
> http://www.enzoco.com/mike/syclone/maps.htm

I've already seen such maps and I wonder if we can get it for our 9b / 13g
compressor wheels. Anyone ?

> My Ty only turns 2100-4300 RPM and maxes out at 16 psi on pump gas. The
turbo on the
> right would never reach it's peak efficiency and is too large for my
application.

Why do you think it is too large ? When running 20psi at 5000 you are at
around 75% what is good. Ok, the efficiency areas are thin and for the low
end power it would be better to have the 70% island also in the 3500 like
the small one. I htink it's not the size but the design of the wheel. What
if the bigger wheel would be clipped ?

Roger
93'3000GT TT


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Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 17:21:34 -0700
From: Raymond Yap <raymond.yap@stanford.edu>
Subject: Team3S: Apexi AFC

I just picked up an Apexi AFC (not the latest one) and plugged it in my
VR-4. Can anybody advice me on how to tune it effectively so that I
don't melt my engine in the process ? And what would be a conservative
setting on the various RPMs that I could start with ?

raymond.
'91 vr-4
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Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 19:37:44 -0500
From: Trevor James <Trevor@kscable.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Turbo questions for all (efficiency map)

"R.G." wrote:

> > There is such thing as not being able to run enough boost/RPM to make the
> turbo more
> > efficient. This is apples to oragnes but it's the same theory. Check this
> out;
> > http://www.enzoco.com/mike/syclone/maps.htm
>
> I've already seen such maps and I wonder if we can get it for our 9b / 13g
> compressor wheels. Anyone ?
>
> > My Ty only turns 2100-4300 RPM and maxes out at 16 psi on pump gas. The
> turbo on the
> > right would never reach it's peak efficiency and is too large for my
> application.
>
> Why do you think it is too large ? When running 20psi at 5000 you are at
> around 75% what is good. Ok, the efficiency areas are thin and for the low
> end power it would be better to have the 70% island also in the 3500 like
> the small one. I htink it's not the size but the design of the wheel. What
> if the bigger wheel would be clipped ?
>
> Roger
> 93'3000GT TT
>
> For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

It's too large because I'm only going to run 16 psi and the stock shift point is around
4300 RPM. I'm never going to even get into its best efficiency range. This turbo is
optimized at 18 psi with 5400 rpm shifts.

I just wanted to make a comparison of how a large turbo could possibly not be
beneficial. I really believe that the 368+ turbos are too large for street use. Physics
says it takes more energy to spin up a large compressor wheel. Those things are HUGE!!!
I know, they have ball bearings....and the turbine wheel is supposed to be soooo
efficient. It's only 1.5 liters of air trying to turn them. The 368 is the size of the
garrett 850 cfm turbos we use in the sy/ty (TE-44) world and they're good for 500 HP
easy. That's one turbo with 4.3L of exhaust driving it. I don't see why we need TWO
turbos that size on the 3000/Stealth unless you're doing the silver state classic with
110 Octane!!!

Trevor
96 R/T TT
92 GMC Typhoon

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Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 19:26:43 -0700
From: Errin Humphrey <errin@u.washington.edu>
Subject: Re: Team3S: SL/VR4 Caliper Clearance

Oskar,

Oskar wrote:

> Errin - if you're after caliper to rim measurements for a 2nd gen VR-4 I
> think you cannot compare to a Stealth TT.  As recently discovered by Mike
> Chapelski it appears that the Stealth TT calipers are somewhat wider that
> the VR-4 counterpart.

Interesting.  Thanks for pointing that out.

> In case you still need it, my '95 R/T TT with 18" factory chrome wheels
> measure 7 mm between the outer edge of the caliper and the inside of the
> rim.

Thanks for the information, however I don't think I'll be able to use it.
You see, I need somebody to give me the rotor to caliper edge distance
for an SL so that I can compare to the distance on my VR4.  Why?  I
ordered some new wheels which somebody tried on a 96 SL and they
said they fit with a decent amount of distance.  I ordered these wheels
for my VR4, and I want to figure out the margin of difference between
the caliper size (how far they stick out from the rotor) on an SL and
on a VR4.  This will let me know which size spacer I will probably need
to use (I'll already gain 8mm clearance from a lower offset).

Thanks for the help!

- --Errin Humphrey

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Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 19:38:12 -0700
From: Errin Humphrey <errin@u.washington.edu>
Subject: Team3S: Someone w/ SL please help

Maybe you missed my earlier post: "SL/VR4 Caliper Clearance."
Maybe my post was a bit unclear.

If you have a 3000GT SL could you PLEASE do the following? ...

1) Take a ruler and another small ruler (or something small and straight).

2) Go to one of your car's front wheels.

3) Put the ruler's end straight against the brake rotor, near the caliper.

4) Use the other small ruler (or straight thingie) and hold it against the
side of the caliper, perpendicular to the other ruler.

5) Read the point where they touch.  This will give the distance from
the brake rotor to the farthest out point on the brake caliper.

I don't need a really accurate measurement, just a ballpark figure in
inches or millimeters.

For reference sake, on a '94 3000GT VR4 the distance from the
surface of the rotor to the farthest out point on the brake caliper
(edge of the Mitsubishi lettering on the caliper) is about 2.25 inches.

I need to know a ballpark figure for how much thinner the SL calipers
are compared to the VR4 calipers because I have ordered some
wheels which somebody says fit on an SL but they aren't sure about
a VR4.  This will let me know the size of spacer I might have to order.

It would probably help if your 3000GT SL is second-gen (like the
one which tried on the wheels) since I'm not sure if there is a difference
in caliper size between 1st and 2nd gen SL calipers.

I really appreciate some help here.

- --Errin Humphrey

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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 22:23:59 -0500
From: "Benson \"elmagoo\" Russell" <benson@2015.com>
Subject: Team3S: Someone w/ SL please help

OK, I'm not sure if I have the correct measurement yer asking for, but here
goes :).  I have a '95 3000GT Base, which should be the same as the SL, with
the exception of the ABS.  So for this measurement that might make a
differenct :).  I'm not to up on all my technical terminology with cars, so
lemme ask now what the calipers are just to clairfy I did this right.  I
know what the rotors are, and I'm assuming that the calipers are what hold
the brake pads and actually squeeze them against the rotor right?  If this
is correct, then what I just did was take a small piece of paper, held it
perpendicular to the rotor, then took a pencil, laid it flat against the
farthest out piece of the caliper, and marked the paper.  I then came in and
measured the distance from the edge of the paper that was against the rotor
to the mark made by the pencil.  My result was 1 and 3/8 inches, which
converts to 34.925 mm.

again, dunno if this is what yer looking for, but I tried :).


Latufh fuh U,
Benson
benson@2015.com

"-Do you ever have second thoughts?
- -When do I ever have first thoughts?"

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Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 23:19:25 -0500
From: Rah <rah@isd.net>
Subject: Team3S: Dumb Question, but curious

Hello all,
    Recently I took the front license plate off my 93 Stealth RT, now
that plate is required in my state so hush-hush.  I know from people
I've seen on the road that it's not unusual at all.
    The real question, not to get my or anybody elses hopes up, but I
can't help but wonder how well a police officer can get a radar signal
off of this car.  From my experience in another car club, and
information an ex-military man was able to give me on how radar requires
a very specific reflection, it does make you wonder.

Anybody know?  Anyone put a gun to it and found out?  I'm not relying on
it yet, but it'd be interesting to know what y'all think,

- --Rich

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Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 23:04:24 -0500
From: "Benson \"elmagoo\" Russell" <benson@2015.com>
Subject: Team3S: Dumb Question, but curious

Well from my understanding on the way police radar works is that it doesn't
take a very specific 'signature' or profile of your vehicle, it just relies
on the doppler shift on the signal to calculate the speed.  The way all
police radar guns work (except laser of course :) is they scan the area, and
then show what the strongest signal returned was on the readout.  Hence why
if your traveling in a pack of cars, and a cop clocks the pack, he has to
determine (or rather GUESS) which car was doing the returned speed.  One
fact to note though is that big vehicles (trucks in other words) will ALWAYS
return the strongest signal no matter what.  So if a trucks doing 50, and
you zip buy at 80, he'll get a 50 reading because the trucks return signal
is much stronger.  This is another reason why you should always ask to see
the gun reading for yourself when they pull you over (I've heard of cops
trying to pull a fast one where they didn't even clock you at all).  If they
refuse, you make them write that on the ticket and point that one out to the
judge :).

another little trick of note that I read in Car and Driver a long ways back
on ways to defeat laser radar when they were first introduced.  One method
they came up with and tested is to put an extremely high candle-watt powered
light (like the ones the cops use) on the front of your car near the lisence
plate (because that's where they aim their laser guns due to the lisence
plates highly reflective surface).  Aim it forward, and then put an
infra-red filter on it (so it blocks all spectrum of light except ir).  This
won't defeat a laser radar gun, but it will confuse it for a while giving
you more time to slow down if you have a laser radar detector (like buy an
additional 2- 4seconds depending upon distance).  They way they described
how this works is imagine walking into a gymnasium full of people.  You're
on one side, and a friend is across all the people on the other.  If
everybodie is quite, you can hear each other fine, but when everybody's
talking, you'll be lucky if you can pick out a word or two from your friend.
That's what the light with the filter does.  You're flooding the area with
tons of extra ir light therefore confusing the gun as two which signal was
the original 'bounce', so it takes it a while longer to get the reading thus
giving you the extra time to slow down :).  The other great thing is it's
perfectly legal because with the filter, the light will appear off because
no regular light will emmit from it at all, and it's not illegal to emit
light :).

Anyways, just a little bit of info for ya :)


Latufh fuh U,
Benson
benson@2015.com

"-Do you ever have second thoughts?
- -When do I ever have first thoughts?"

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 09:43:34 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Apexi AFC

> I just picked up an Apexi AFC (not the latest one) and plugged it in my
> VR-4. Can anybody advice me on how to tune it effectively so that I
> don't melt my engine in the process ? And what would be a conservative
> setting on the various RPMs that I could start with ?

This depends on the injectors you are running. With stock injectors, the AFC should not be used. Also, you need an A/F meter and even better an EGR to tune any fuel device. The best would be a logging device.

Roger
93'3000GT TT

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