--
From: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
(Team3S Digest)
To: stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Subject:
Team3S Digest V1 #314
Reply-To: stealth-3000gt
Sender: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
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Team3S Digest
Thursday, October 21 1999 Volume 01 :
Number
314
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 20 Oct 1999 17:28:07 -0500
From: Merritt <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Team3S: Adventures in Braking IV
Time to discuss brakes again.
I just got off the phone with Porterfield. I told them about my
experience
at Road America, where I wore down a set of pads in three 25
minute
sessions and grooved the rotors badly before the pads had gotten down
to
metal. He said:
1. Did I see any whiteness on the edges of the
pads? Yes. That means I was
running temperatures of 1300 degrees or more, and
the pads simply don't
last long at those temperatures.
2. Adding air
and water cooling only helps marginally at those
temperatures. I can
increase the flow of both -- like with air blowers --
and it will help, but
only a little. Our cars are just too heavy and the
brake pad area is too
small.
3. The real problem is our calipers: They just are not big enough.
They
don't allow enough pad thickness (we can only get about a 1/2 in. of
pad
backing + material in there, which is pretty slim).
4. I can go to
Hawk pads, but they tend to wear the rotors down. He also
has a Performance
Friction pad that will wear a little longer, but only
about 10% -- not enough
to get through a whole weekend.
5. Yes, carbon kevlar pads (Porterfield
R4 pads) will groove a rotor,
especially at high temperatures.
6. Road
America and Blackhawk Farms (my last two events) are on his top ten
list of
"toughest tracks on brakes."
His recommendation: Get bigger
calipers and/or practice brake management.
Hmmm. Brad Bedell's Big Red
conversion kit is looking better all the time.
Did I hear that Supra calipers
will work on our car?
Any comments out there? Anybody got a good
solution?
Rich/old poop/94 VR4/somebody stop me!
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 20 Oct 1999 17:54:21 -0700
From: Ken Middaugh <Kenneth.Middaugh@gat.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Adventures in Braking IV
Hi Rich,
> Hmmm. Brad
Bedell's Big Red conversion kit is looking better all the time.
> Did I
hear that Supra calipers will work on our car?
>
> Any comments out
there? Anybody got a good solution?
John Christian has been road racing
his '93 VR4 for some time now. Hopefully
you will hear from him
directly, but in the mean-time check out his web pages at
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Flats/4538/.
It looks like he has tried
numerous combinations of rotors and pads at the
track. His current
recommendations are Brad's Porsche/Brembo kit, 322
mm directional veined Supra
rotors (he has larger aftermarket wheels), and
Paul Weston's $180 pads. The
Supra rotors require some minor machining
to fit our cars though. Perhaps Brad
will begin offering machined Supra
rotors with his kit.
Also, John is the one who BBQ's his pads on high for
1/2 hour, then turns off
the gas and lets the pads cool inside the BBQ until
they reach room
temperature. He also heat cycles new rotors in the oven
on 'self clean' cycle,
again letting them cool to room temperature slowly
inside the oven. He reports
longer life due to these
treatments.
A while back, Roger found the ultimate brake kit by Mov'it in
Germany at
http://www.ultimategarage.com/bigbrake1.html.
Unfortunately they cost almost
twice as much as Brad's kit, about
$2800! This kit is definitely worth $600
more than the Stillen/Brembo
kit though.
Good luck with your dilemma,
Ken
- --
Drive
faster, it is later than you think!
Ken Middaugh (858)
455-4510
General Atomics
San Diego
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our
web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:26:07 -0500
From: "Paul T. Golley" <ptgolley@ro.com>
Subject: Team3S: Re:
Another "Last" APEXi Boost Controller Question
Ken-
Once I got my BC
installed, I set it to 1.0 bar and 68% BADC.
I ran it to redline in 2nd gear
(to let it learn). Later I did this
twice, and got lots of popping and
sputtering both times. I
then assumed that I needed to reduce the plug
gaps to .034
or so to avoid this problem. A few days later I took the
car
to the local dealer to get the tranny linkage adjusted, and the
tech
said he noticed I had a boost controller, and he said it
boosted to 1.2 bar
in second gear at 3000 (I bet it was 6000rpm).
Anyway, on the way home, I
wound it up to 4500/6500rpm,
in 2nd and no longer got popping and missing;
and the
boost over-shot to 1.18 bar. I have boost programmed to
1.0
bar and 68% BADC. What do I need to change to keep
the car from going
above 1.0 bar? Do I need to reduce the
BADC from 68% to a lower, say
45% or so? I have info
from this list that supports both BADC numbers.
Thanks in advance for any help in this matter.
Regards,
ptg
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http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 20 Oct 1999 19:17:58 -0700
From: Errin Humphrey <errin@u.washington.edu>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Road America (Supra)
Mikael Åkesson wrote:
> You
won't gain anything from a singleturbo setup. The Supra people upgrades
>
to a Single turbo because it costs less with one turbo than two turbos.
The
> twin turbo upgrades costs both an arm and a leg (Ask Jack, he
installed some
> HKS twins on a friends Supra a few weeks ago). The Supras
sequential turbos
> works as a single turbo anyway ,what I mean is that
only one turbo at a
> time produce boost.
The Supra turbos
both work together after a certain rpm (3400 rpms
I think). The first
turbo works by itself at first, and then at 3400 rpms
the second turbo comes
"online" and it shares boost with the first turbo.
Both turbos are exactly
the same size, but the rear turbo has a slightly
larger compressor
wheel.
Most Supra owners who go a big single complain about
streetability.
There is little boost (or ram air effect) through the low
rpms, so low
speed driving suffers. Another thing they mention is that
power can
sometimes come on too quickly with a big single once it begins
to
produce boost. This power "jump" is usually sufficient to break
their
tires loose all of a sudden. This isn't something you would want
to
happen while coming out of a sharp corner. The thing they say
they
like about a big single is that the power is "very linear" compared
to
twins and the boost feels like it could keep building way past
redline.
- --Errin Humphrey
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our
web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 20 Oct 1999 22:18:51 -0500
From: "Oskar" <swede@pclink.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Re: Another "Last" APEXi Boost Controller Question
Paul,
I see you
have had this dilemma for a few days and I will try to help with
some
comments from my experience.
I don't know if you have the old or new
Apex~i. Also I do not know what
your mods are, but here are my
experiences.
1.0 kg/cm2 and 68% BADC is pushing it with the old
Apex~i. It may not work
for all 3/S cars. On the other hand some
people get by with 70% BADC. It
just depends.
When I ran this
with stock exhaust and K&N I got a 10% boost spike with
these
settings. Once I gutted my precats and installed a testpipe.
This
caused the boost spikes to be even higher and I had to reduce the BADC
to
62% to keep boost spikes below 1.10.
You need to play with the
settings to get the desired results. First lower
the BADC
significantly, say 56%, and then increase it until you reach
desired
results. You MAY also have better luck reducing the boost to .95.
After
all you don't want to hurt your engine.
Also it sounds like you have a
peak boost metering device. It is hard to
see 1.18 on a manual boost
gauge. Boost spikes are not visible on a boost
gauge. For people
looking for a peak boost meter I highly recommend the
Blitz dual turbo
timer.
Additionally I think the "learning" should include a WOT in third
gear as
well.
Good luck!
Oskar
'95 R/T TT
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 20 Oct 1999 23:09:17 -0500
From: "Oskar" <swede@pclink.com>
Subject: Team3S:
Resetting the ECU
How long does it really take? I have heard
anything from a few minutes to
30 minutes. Are there any alternate
methods to disconnecting the negative
battery
cable?
Thanks,
Oskar
'95 R/T TT
For subscribe/unsubscribe
info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 01:15:14 -0400
From: Jason Barnhart <phnxgld@erols.com>
Subject: Team3S:
Desperately seeking synchros...
Well I'll be going with a new
clutch soon so I figure it's about time I stop kidding
myself about my
synchros. The colder it gets, the worse my 2nd gear upshift feels.
Even
shifting slow, it grinds like crazy when the car is cold, and I can forget up
or
downshifting fast (not speed shifting). The tranny fluid was
replaced with redline a
couple months ago if anyone is curious.
This leaves me looking for synchros. I absolutely hate to put factory
synchros back
in the car, but I'm left with little choice at this
point. If anyone would have any
synchros to spare, or have a lead for
me, I would GREATLY appreciate it.
thanks in advance,
Jason
94
VR4
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 20 Oct 1999 21:44:54 -0500
From: "Vineet Singh" <billi_gates@hotmail.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Why don't we get em MADE! RE: Possible source for synchros?
Hello
3/S land!
Well well well... I was perusing through the net, and did some
research into
QUAIFE. Well they are known to the DSM world for making
expensive but GREAT
center and front differentials. I don't believe they make
ANYTHING for the
AWD 3/S and GTO cars.
As most of us know first hand,
or have heard from many other owners, the
synchro design in the GETRAG
tranny's is either flawed or weak or both (most
likely the latter). Cars with
less than 30,000 miles (50,000km) have been
known to have shifting problems.
This problem only gets worse after the
first occurance.
Fluid changes
(to BG Synchroshift or GM Synchromesh) only help in a few
cases, and usually
don't remedy the situation for very long (this is my case
as well).
As
most of you all know, our GETRAG (AWD only) tranny's are "not
rebuildable".
This is a bunch of baloney in my opinion. There are people out
there that
have the know-how on how to "rebuild" them,
1) but does it really matter
when they can only find the stock (bad
design/material) parts,
2) or even
worse, use "good" parts (read - USED)
I am pretty sure that it would be
near impossible to find NEW GEARS, but I
am also thinking that the gears have
no real fallacies on their own. Most,
if not ALL the problems lay in the damn
SYNCHRO's.
Well guess what? I called Quaife and talked to them about our
otherwise
excellent cars. I told them about the group we have here, and how
frustrated
some people are with the "getrash" tranny.
The stock
synchro's (I believe) are made out of brass (they are "goldish" in
color).
The person I was talking to said this is quite common, as it is easy
to mass
produce parts out of this soft metal, and it works quite well w/o
wearing
down the gear it meshes with. I don't want to get into the detail of
how it
all works (nor do I pretend to understand it all :), but what he told
me,
made a hell of a lot of sense.
Quiafe has the ability to produce
synchro's for our beloved cars out of
(most likely, they still have to see
them first) "British Steel". He
couldn't explain to me what this was, but
upon some investigation, it seems
like it's steel with a higher calcium
content, which abrades a bit easier
than steel (not as easy as BRASS), and in
the process "lubricates" itself!
He said many lemans cars use quaife
parts, and run long rally races w/o
problems with the transmissions. Quaife
also has experience with other 4wd
systems (that use transfer
cases).
So, with the installed updated synchro's, our tranny's will be as
good (or
better? :) as any others out there, with MUCH fewer problems. Maybe
then we
can find the next weak link(s)?.
Wait... what's the
catch?
These don't exist yet. What we as a group have to do is
this.
1)Quaife needs samples to work from.
b. Used synchro's
are OK, but NEW(ish) are even better
c. They need sets for each
different iteration of the GETRAG AWD TRANNY.
2)They DON'T want to make
(affordably) a set that only works on ONE year's
car
b. They need
to know how many years can a set be applied to.
c. They would like
some hard data on the different years/versions.
3)They can make however, as
many we want.
b. The cost will be determined by the amount of
orders
c. I told them 30-100 sets of a mix of years. They said between
$500 and
$1000 (EACH SET of 5-6 rings)
If we can get more than that
(I'm SURE that there are more than that many
AWD owners out there) then the
price will be closer to $500. For their other
applications, synchros are
between $90 and $200 EACH.
I know that Jack T. could aquire (somehow! :)
some of them, and maybe he
knows more about the different year's and
differences.
I know that $500-1000 sounds like a lot, but think of how
sweet and complete
your car (and mine :) would be with a properly working
transmission?! One
that didn't embarass you at every stop light, or one that
let you drop it
into the gear you REALLY wanted around that curve. Just
remember, $500-1000
doesn't even cover replacement turbo's, so in reality, it
isn't THAT bad.
One request, (by the person I talked to) please do not
flood them with
questions. Until they have our synchro's in hand (and even
better, a WHOLE
tranny), nothing I said can be verified.
Even if your
transmission doesn't have a problem (yet), it would be a good
idea to update
the synchro's (when and if they become available) as soon as
it does start to
grind.
If you want to know more about anything I talked about, here are a
couple of
pertinant links. Thanks for listening, let's make this happen
guys/gals!
For more info on HOW a synchromesh transmission works can be
found here,
http://www.csn.ul.ie/~lavelles/synchro.html
More
info on Quaife as a company is here,
http://www.quaife.co.uk/info/index.htm
This
was posted to the larger Starnet list, maybe it will get a better
response on
the tech list. I posted it here because of this post below,
From: Klusmanp@aol.com <Klusmanp@aol.com>
To: stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com
<stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com>
Date:
Monday, October 18, 1999 5:29 PM
Subject: Team3S: Possible source for
synchros?
The Quaife engineering team makes excellent
components....for select cars.
I dont beleve they'll make any parts for our
cars unless there is enough
demand in the marketplace to
warrant
production.
Maybe we can bug 'em for
some?
Noble
>Saw an ad for this importer of drive train
components. Quaife engineering
>offers complete gear sets for various cars
- didn't see 3000GT/Stealth
>listed, but I did see diff. sets for
Eclipse/Talon/Laser cars.
>
>check it out:
>
>http://www.autotech.com/qpsnew.htm
>
>This
outfit might be able to supply synchros after the current supply
dries
>up? (Jack Tertadian is the only other source I know of - he uses
some
amazing
>sort of diplomacy to sneak synchros directly from Getrag
for us)
>
>Paul Klusman
For subscribe/unsubscribe info,
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------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 20 Oct 1999 23:53:03 -0500
From: "Benson \"elmagoo\" Russell" <benson@2015.com>
Subject: Team3S: Why
don't we get em MADE! RE: Possible source for synchros?
Would this be
only for the AWD turbo versions, or the non-turbo's as well?
I have a
non-turbo and it really pisses me off when I'm performance driving
and I've
got my shifting timing patern down, and *GGRRRUUUUCCNCNGNH* as it
didn't
fully or properly engage while upshifting.
Latufh fuh
U,
Benson
benson@2015.com
"-Do
you ever have second thoughts?
- -When do I ever have first
thoughts?"
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 09:26:22 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Resetting the ECU
>How long does it really take? I have
heard anything from a few minutes to
>30 minutes. Are there any
alternate methods to disconnecting the negative
>battery cable?
In
reality the internal capacitor in the ECU loses the power after 30
seconds
and the memory get's cleared. Over the period, they installed a
newer version
of microcontroller that has an additional capacitor on the
chip and therefore
hold the memory soemwhat longer. My experience is that 5
minutes is enough
for sure.
Roger
93'3000GT TT
For subscribe/unsubscribe info,
our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 09:31:57 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Team3S:
Re: Possible source for synchros?
If you can provide me with the exact MD
numbers I can shop around. They told
me that they can get everything (!!) for
the tranny but I have to provide
the real numbers, or at least the drawing to
identify the parts. But, be
prepared to pay $$$
Let me
know,
Roger
93'3000GT TT
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our
web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 03:13:12 -0700
From: Chris Winkley <cwinkley@plaza.ds.adp.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Desperately seeking synchros...
Jason...
You may have
just joined our list, or have missed the series of postings on
the subject,
but Jack T has been in the process of coordinating a purchase
of parts from
Getrag between the middle of July of this year and the end of
September. To
the best of my knowledge, he is done with this purchase and
has collected
money (there were twenty-two of us who got in on this
purchase) from all of
us. Jack's e-address is: "xwing@execpc.com" in case
you want to talk
to him about availability at this late date.
Looking
forward...Chris
FWIW...here's the information Jack required back in
July...
<snip from Jack T>
If anybody wants to order synchro
sets + gears (it is actually better
to replace the gear which grinds going
into it also, new info)
EMAIL REPLY TO ME PERSONALLY with
info:
1) Your REAL FULL NAME, address, phone #, and email
address
2) year/make car,/speeds in your TWIN TURBO's trans (5 or
6)
3) which you want:
a) 1-2 synchro assembly (fixes
1-->2 upshift grind)
b) 3-4 synchro assembly
c)
5-Reverse synchro assembly (if 5 speed; almost nobody ever has
problems
here!)
d) 5-6 synchro assembly (if 6 speed; almost nobody ever has
problem
here!)
e) 2nd gear (would help fix upshift to 2nd grind,
WITH 1-2 assy above)
e) 3rd gear (would help fix upshift to 3rd grind,
WITH 3-4 assy above)
f) 4th gear (would help fix upshift to 4th grind,
WITH 3-4 assy above)
g) MAYBE can get output shaft from trans, would
NEED to tell
me large or small shaft, do NOT ASK ME WHICH YOU
HAVE--see
above re: understanding what you are buying!
<end of snip from Jack
T>
- -----Original Message-----
From: Jason Barnhart [mailto:phnxgld@erols.com]
Sent:
Wednesday, October 20, 1999 10:15 PM
Cc: Team 3S
Subject: Team3S:
Desperately seeking synchros...
Well I'll be going with a new
clutch soon so I figure it's about time I
stop kidding
myself about my
synchros. The colder it gets, the worse my 2nd gear
upshift
feels.
Even shifting slow, it grinds like crazy when the car is
cold, and I can
forget up or
downshifting fast (not speed shifting).
The tranny fluid was replaced with
redline a
couple months ago if anyone
is curious.
This leaves me looking for synchros. I absolutely
hate to put factory
synchros back
in the car, but I'm left with little
choice at this point. If anyone would
have any
synchros to spare, or
have a lead for me, I would GREATLY appreciate it.
thanks in
advance,
Jason
94 VR4
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 16:59:00 +0100
From: Matthews <matthews@wiesbaden.netsurf.de>
Subject:
Team3S: transaxle and xfer case check
Today I put my Stealth up on the
lift to install new Abex brake pads in
the front, unseize the active exhaust
valve, change the engine
oil/filter, fix a flat tire (which coincidentally
happened on the way to
the shop!), etc.
While I was under there, I
decided to check the transaxle and xfer case
fluid levels. The first
thing I noticed was a small amount of green
liquid on the bottom of the
transaxle. There wasn't much, but enough to
see that it seemed to come
from higher up towards the back of the
transaxle case. Please tell me
there is some kind of breather or
overflow hole up there and that this is
normal! Otherwise, is there
anything I can do? I checked the
bolts holding the two halves of the
case together and they're all
tight.
I checked the level through the fill hole by sticking my finger
in
almost as far as it would go so that I reached the top of the resevoir.
Luckily, I got my finger back out (almost didn't - kind of like a
Chinese
finger puzzle!) and found clean, green fluid just shy of full.
So if it's
leaking, then it hasn't lost much - yet.
Then I moved on to the xfer
case. My manual shows a drain bolt
(bottom), fill bolt (front) and
inspection bolt (side), but I could not
find the inspection bolt. Was
it eliminated with the 2nd gen xfer
cases? I have the '94 shop manual
but perhaps it wasn't updated.
Anyway, I checked the level via the fill hole
and it was perhaps
1/4-1/2" below the bottom of the hole. The fluid was
also pretty
dirty... I seem to remember Extreme Motorsports replacing it
with
Shockproof Light (yes, I know it's GL-5 - I wanted MTL, but
they
insisted) 30k miles ago. Isn't that the pink stuff? Maybe
I'm thinking
of the Shockproof Heavy they put in the diff. At any rate,
there was no
sign of pink in my xfer case.
So... what should I do, if
anything? Do I need to take it in to have
the dealer replace a
transaxle seal? Should I replace the fluids
again?
TIA...
-Jim
P.S.- A story about the flat tire... First, I noticed
that the boost
gauge was higher than normal when cruising and that
maintaining speed
required more gas. I also noticed that the usual xfer
case whine I hear
when decelerating continued even when I pushed in the
clutch! Expecting
the worst (like the square xfer case bearings someone
posted about last
week), I slowed and pulled over to the right-most lane of
the Autobahn
(hey, it doesn't happen often, gimme a break!) just as the car
began
handling very poorly. Now thinking that the infamous four-wheel
lockup
of the xfer case was going to send me careening into the trees at
any
moment, it was an adrenaline-filled moment when I finally pulled
into
the next service station, a big, new Esso (Exxon). Of course it
was
here that I was relieved to find that it was just the tire, but
the
experience continued! I found that a screw had become lodged in
the
center of the tread and decided to just pump up the tire and drive
the
short distance remaining to the shop to plug it there. So I pull up
to
the luftstation where I was pleased to find that they had a regular
air
hose like those in the states (those of you who have been subjected
to
the German portable air canisters can relate, I'm sure). So I take
the
nozzle end of the hose and put it up to the tire stem only to
realize
that there was no air! Walk back to the air pump and there are
two
buttons, one to send air through the hose, the other to bleed air
back
out. Problem is, the pump is fifteen feet from the damn
tire! What is
that? I stood there for five minutes in disbelief
before spending an
equally frustrating amount of time recruiting a
non-English speaking
German to help. What a way to start the
day...
- --
Jim Matthews - Wiesbaden, Germany
matthews@wiesbaden.netsurf.de
(64 Kbps ISDN)
http://rover.wiesbaden.netsurf.de/~matthews
***
3000GT-Stealth International (3Si) Member #0030 ***
http://rover.wiesbaden.netsurf.de/~matthews/stealth.html
Jet
Black '94 Dodge Stealth R/T Twin-Turbo AWD AWS 6-spd
Adjustable Active
Suspension, Adjustable Exhaust System
K&N FIPK, A'PEXi Super AVC-R (1.0
bar @ 72% BADC)
A'PEXi Turbo Timer (30 sec), Blitz Blow-Off
Valve
Magnecore spark plug wires, Redline ShockProof fluids
Metal Matrix
brake pads, custom braided brake lines
Michelin Pilot XGT-Z4 245/45ZR17, Top
Speed: 168mph
G-Tech Pro: 0-60 4.79 sec, 1/4 13.16 sec @ 113.9 mph
1 Feb
99 Dyno Session: 406 SAE HP, 354 lb-ft torque
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------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 08:04:11 -0700
From: "Jim Berry" <fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Team3S: -
1992 Dodge Stealth Twin Turbo
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Still looks like a hell of a buy --- likely to go up in the last few
hours though.
Jim berry
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=181820401
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Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 08:29:41 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Andrew C. Ohnstad" <andy@andysaudio.com>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Parts for sale- turbos and intercoolers
Bah, This post has
me thinking bad bad thoughts. I 'ver got an SL.
Assuming one could buy
all the parts of the turbo system from Mitsu or
hauled off of VR4's how much
of a pain in the arse would it be to turbo
charge the car?
Or am I
really better off just selling it for a VR4 of the same
vintage?
=-=Andrew
"Traveling At The Speed of Thought" --- Teenage
FanClub
'94 Mitsubishi 3000 GT -- Eclipse, Boston Acoustics, Rockford
Power
On Wed, 20 Oct 1999, Rick Diogo wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I am new to this list and this is my first post. I have just been
reading
> what others have said. There seems to be a few very
knowledgeable guys on
> this list. Thanks for all the great
info!
>
> I am selling a pair of brand new turbos for a 94 R/T
TT. They are brand
> new in the box from Mitsu (not remans) and
have never been installed in a
> vehicle. Best reasonable
offer over $1,000 gets them. I am looking to
> get just enough to
purchase the ARC2 from GT-Pro. So if someone wants to
> trade for
that instead I would even be willing to do that too.
>
> Like I
said, the turbos are brand new in the box. They list for
>
$2,861.00 for the pair. I was told that they will fit 91-96 R/T TT's
and
> Vr-4's.
>
> I also have my original stock intercoolers
and all the original piping and
> hoses from my 94 TT. If anyone is
interested in these parts please let me
> know ASAP. I will let the
intercoolers and all piping go for $700. I
> think when I called
the dealer these parts (collectively) listed for more
> than some
complete used cars cost.
>
> Take Care,
>
> Rick
Diogo
> 94 Stealth TT
> 6 speed, climate control A/C
> Pearl
Yellow w/factory Dodge Chrome wheels
>
> For subscribe/unsubscribe
info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
>
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------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 10:38:41 -0500
From: Matt Jannusch <MAJ@BigCharts.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Parts for sale- turbos and intercoolers
> Bah, This post
has me thinking bad bad thoughts. I 'ver got an SL.
> Assuming one
could buy all the parts of the turbo system from Mitsu or
> hauled off of
VR4's how much of a pain in the arse would it
> be to turbo charge the
car?
Need: exhaust manifolds, pre-cats, downpipe, turbos, intake piping,
turbo ECU, intercoolers and piping, BOV, boost control parts, oil and water
feeds for turbos, oilpan with turbo oil drainback connections, turbo fuel
pressure regulator, fuel pump....... Injectors?
> Or am I really
better off just selling it for a VR4 of the
> same vintage?
Better
off selling... Unless you went with lower compression pistons, you
couldn't run nearly the boost that the turbo cars are running. You could
maybe get away with 8 psi (around 300hp), but now you've got a high-powered FWD
car which will probably have pretty bad torque steer when the turbos spool up,
or massive wheelspin as the front differential on these cars is open
(non-limited-slip).
- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder VR4
For
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------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 10:07:55 -0500
From: "Benson \"elmagoo\" Russell" <benson@2015.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Parts for sale- turbos and intercoolers
get a new VR-4, the engine
requires modifications to work with the turbo's.
Plus you won't get the AWD
without major changes as well. Figure dumping
about $8000 - $10000 (or
more) to convert the non-turbo to a turbo. I've
been researching it and
asking around for a while and it's just not worth
it. Granted, you can
get the non-turbo's up to about 300 - 320 hp without
nitrous mind ya, but of
course it's still not as good as the TT ;).
Latufh fuh
U,
Benson
benson@2015.com
"-Do
you ever have second thoughts?
- -When do I ever have first
thoughts?"
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------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 09:16:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Andrew C. Ohnstad" <andy@andysaudio.com>
Subject:
Team3S: VR4-AWS?
Settle an argument please, oh gurus....
Does the
VR4 have all wheel steering, or just all wheel
drive?
=-=Andrew
"Traveling At The Speed of Thought" --- Teenage
FanClub
'94 Mitsubishi 3000 GT -- Eclipse, Boston Acoustics, Rockford
Power
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 18:39:08 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: VR4-AWS?
All VR4 / TT do have AWS. This is totally enclosed in
the chassis construction
and part of the whole system.
> Does the
VR4 have all wheel steering, or just all wheel drive?
Roger
93'3000GT
TT
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 09:40:25 -0700
From: "Dr. John A. Tabler" <jtabler@summitmicro.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: VR4-AWS?
Andrew,
I've got a 92 VR4, and it is AWD
and AWS. (I looked underneath to be sure ! :) The
extra power
steering stuff is quite obvious when you look.
The '92 service manual
says the following about testing the AWS: Raise the car on a
lift so
that all four wheels clear the floor. Have someone put the car in gear
and
"accelerate" to 50 MPH. Now turn the steering wheel sharply,
and the steering action
of the rear wheels can be observed.
Three
points about the AWS.
1) it seems to only kick in above 50
MPH
2) it is "same phase", i.e. the rear wheels turn the
same way as the front.
3) the rear wheel steering is
subtle
JAT
"Andrew C. Ohnstad" wrote:
> Settle an argument
please, oh gurus....
>
> Does the VR4 have all wheel steering, or
just all wheel drive?
>
> =-=Andrew
> "Traveling At The Speed
of Thought" --- Teenage FanClub
> '94 Mitsubishi 3000 GT -- Eclipse,
Boston Acoustics, Rockford Power
>
> For subscribe/unsubscribe info,
our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 20 Oct 1999 13:04:29 -0700
From: Nick Xiong <nxiong@juno.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Road America (Supra)
Actually the 2nd turbo doesn't come on until about
4300-4500 rpms, but
when it comes online, HOLD ON FOR DEAR LIFE!!! :-)
but yes they BOTH
work together to produce that killer top end...
Most
Supra owners agree that a properly sized BIG SINGLE will do just as
well if
not better than a twin setup (let alone the diff in $$$$). In
fact
there is a debate right now about the best BIG SINGLE to get. The
2
that stand out are the RPS T-66 and HKS Ts04. The T-66 is a
consistent
10 sec runner (as seen in Christian Raldo's car, he's on the MK4
list).
Christian produces 650 rwhp and over 600 ft-lbs of torgue on turbo
alone.
99% of the fast Supras run singles...
A big single in a VR4
would be interesting indeed (hope it doesn't scrape
too much :-)....
...never heard of a single in a 300ZX...
On Wed, 20 Oct 1999
19:17:58 -0700 Errin Humphrey
<errin@u.washington.edu>
writes:
> Mikael Åkesson wrote:>
> > You won't gain anything
from a singleturbo setup. The Supra people
> upgrades> > to a
Single turbo because it costs less with one turbo than
two
> turbos.
The> > twin turbo upgrades costs both an arm and a leg (Ask
Jack, he
> installed some> > HKS twins on a friends Supra a few weeks ago).
The
Supras
> sequential turbos> > works as a single turbo anyway
,what I mean is
that only one turbo > at a> > time produce
boost.
>
> The Supra turbos both work together after a certain rpm
(3400 rpms
> I think). The first turbo works by itself at first, and
then at
> 3400 rpms> the second turbo comes "online" and it shares
boost with the
first
> turbo.
> Both turbos are exactly the same
size, but the rear turbo has a
> slightly
> larger compressor
wheel.
>
> Most Supra owners who go a big single complain about
streetability.
> There is little boost (or ram air effect) through the low
rpms, so
> low
> speed driving suffers. Another thing they
mention is that power can
> sometimes come on too quickly with a big
single once it begins to
> produce boost. This power "jump" is
usually sufficient to break
> their
> tires loose all of a
sudden. This isn't something you would want to
> happen while coming
out of a sharp corner. The thing they say they
> like about a big
single is that the power is "very linear" compared
> to
> twins and
the boost feels like it could keep building way past
> redline.
>
> --Errin Humphrey
>
> For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our
web page is
> http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
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------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 12:07:18 -0500
From: "Bill Davis" <wjdavis@inlink.com>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: VR4-AWS?
Both.
Bill Davis 95 VR-4
- ----- Original
Message -----
From: Andrew C. Ohnstad <andy@andysaudio.com>
To: <stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com>
Sent:
Thursday, October 21, 1999 8:16 AM
Subject: Team3S: VR4-AWS?
>
Settle an argument please, oh gurus....
>
> Does the VR4 have all
wheel steering, or just all wheel drive?
>
> =-=Andrew
>
"Traveling At The Speed of Thought" --- Teenage FanClub
> '94 Mitsubishi
3000 GT -- Eclipse, Boston Acoustics, Rockford Power
>
> For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
>
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 13:40:16 -0400
From: "Scotty" <omnitech@Fast.net>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: VR4-AWS?
Both Stealth RT TT and 3000 GT TT have AWS &
AWD
AWD 55% at the rear wheels and 45% at the front wheels. that's with
out
traction loss.
AWS activates above 30 MPH and will only move the real
wheels 1.5 degrees
Scotty
92 RT TT
- -----Original
Message-----
From: owner-stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com
[mailto:owner-stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com]On
Behalf Of Andrew C.
Ohnstad
Sent: Thursday, October 21, 1999 9:16
AM
To: stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com
Subject:
Team3S: VR4-AWS?
Settle an argument please, oh gurus....
Does
the VR4 have all wheel steering, or just all wheel
drive?
=-=Andrew
"Traveling At The Speed of Thought" --- Teenage
FanClub
'94 Mitsubishi 3000 GT -- Eclipse, Boston Acoustics, Rockford
Power
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 22 Oct 1999 09:02:32 +1300
From: Kevin Clark <Kevin.Clark@hnz.co.nz>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Resetting the ECU
> Are there any alternate methods to
disconnecting
> the negative battery cable?
Some have suggested
the easiest way is to pull the
dome light fuse (controls alarm, disk changer
and
interior lights).
I have not tested this, but maybe others know
?
Cheers,
Kevin Clark
'91 GTO-VR4
For subscribe/unsubscribe
info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 22 Oct 1999 09:14:20 +1300
From: Kevin Clark <Kevin.Clark@hnz.co.nz>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: VR4-AWS?
> Both Stealth RT TT and 3000 GT TT have AWS
& AWD
> AWD 55% at the rear wheels and 45% at the front wheels.
I have also heard that the '91-93 models actually had
a 40/60 split
and that it was not until the '94-99
that the cars came with a 45/55
split...
Does anyone know if the above is
correct?
Cheers,
Kevin Clark
'91 GTO-VR4
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 15:26:03 -0500
From: Matt Jannusch <MAJ@BigCharts.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: VR4-AWS?
> > Both Stealth RT TT and 3000 GT TT have AWS
& AWD
> > AWD 55% at the rear wheels and 45% at the front wheels.
>
> I have also heard that the '91-93 models actually had
>
a 40/60 split and that it was not until the '94-99
> that the cars came
with a 45/55 split...
>
> Does anyone know if the above is
correct?
These are the correct numbers. It was changed in '94 when
the 6-speed Getrag was introduced.
- -Matt
'95 3000GT Spyder
VR4
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 23:36:55 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: VR4-AWS?
> > I have also heard that the '91-93 models
actually had
> > a 40/60 split and that it was not until the
'94-99
> > that the cars came with a 45/55 split...
>
>
> > Does anyone know if the above is correct?
>
>
These are the correct numbers. It was changed in '94 when the 6-speed
Getrag was introduced.
Therefore we have another difference between the
Euro and US cars. All Eu cars
do have the 45/55 split as stated on my euro
shop manual.
Roger
93'3000GT TT
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our
web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 16:54:40 CDT
From: "Curt Gendron" <curt_gendron@hotmail.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: VR4-AWS?
Kevin is exactly right. The ratio did change
in 94. So far everything is
this discussion has been correct, except
for one thing. The 95-96 Stealth
TT did NOT have AWS. And if
anyone doesn't believe me they can drive to
Minnesota and I'll line up
a 94,95, and 96 Stealth TT and show you the
difference.
;)
later,
Curt
http://www.mn3s.org
>From:
Kevin Clark <Kevin.Clark@hnz.co.nz>
>To: stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com
>Subject:
RE: Team3S: VR4-AWS?
>Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 09:14:20
+1300
>
> > Both Stealth RT TT and 3000 GT TT have AWS &
AWD
> > AWD 55% at the rear wheels and 45% at the front
wheels.
>
>I have also heard that the '91-93 models actually
had
>a 40/60 split and that it was not until the '94-99
>that the
cars came with a 45/55 split...
>
>Does anyone know if the above is
correct?
>
>Cheers,
>Kevin Clark
>'91 GTO-VR4
>For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
>http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
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------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 23:56:23 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject:
Team3S: Off topic : 95'Stealth TT pricing
I'm very sorry about the
off-topic but I just found an add in the newspaper :
Red 95'Stealth TT,
44k miles, US imported to Switz., mint condition
$20'000
I never
shoped around so I'm not familiar with the market price. Is this too
much
compared to the US or just what the market says ?
Please reply privately
;-)
Thanks in advance,
Roger
93'3000GT TT
maybe ....
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 17:00:48 CDT
From: "Curt Gendron" <curt_gendron@hotmail.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: transaxle and xfer case check
Hey Jim,
The picture in
the newer manuals are incorrect for the transfer case. The
picture
they show is the 91-93 transfer case. They have three plugs. The
94+ iron transfer cases only have two plugs, drain and
fill/check.
later,
Curt
http://www.mn3s.org
>From:
Matthews <matthews@wiesbaden.netsurf.de>
>To:
Team 3S Tech List <stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com>
>Subject:
Team3S: transaxle and xfer case check
>Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 16:59:00
+0100
>
>Then I moved on to the xfer case. My manual shows
a drain bolt
>(bottom), fill bolt (front) and inspection bolt (side), but
I could not
>find the inspection bolt. Was it eliminated with the
2nd gen xfer
>cases? I have the '94 shop manual but perhaps it
wasn't
updated.
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------------------------------
Date:
Fri, 22 Oct 1999 00:00:02 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: VR4-AWS?
Curt, can you please take a pic of the rear double
wishbones and parts of such a
car ? And are you sure that they don't have AWS
? I ask because I was told they
dropped the active suspension and I want to
make sure you didn't mixed the stuff
;-)
Let us know
!
Roger
93'3000GT TT
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page
is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Thu, 21 Oct 1999 19:46:59 -0400
From: Jason Barnhart <phnxgld@erols.com>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: VR4-AWS?
> > > I have also heard that the '91-93 models
actually had
> > > a 40/60 split and that it was not until the
'94-99
> > > that the cars came with a 45/55 split...
> >
>
> > > Does anyone know if the above is correct?
>
>
> > These are the correct numbers. It was changed in '94
when the 6-speed Getrag was introduced.
Hmm, wouldn't a 40/60 split be
more desirable for autocrossing? Would it be possible to convert to
the
40/60 split on a 2nd gen?
Jason
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