--

From: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com (Team3S Digest)
To: stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Subject: Team3S Digest V1 #245
Reply-To: stealth-3000gt
Sender: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Errors-To: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Precedence: bulk


Team3S Digest         Saturday, July 31 1999         Volume 01 : Number 245




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 30 Jul 1999 23:43:29 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject: Team3S: New shock design

I'm gonna forward this from Dennis :

Dg B wrote:
>
> Hello folks,
>
>    I was recently pointed to an article in a mechanical engineering
> maagazine which was discussing a new shock absorber design by a company
> called Magneshock. (Magnetorheological shock)
>
> The idea seems to be pure genius.  Basically, instead of a normal shock, the
> Magneshock has a special fluid with electro-responsive particles inside.  In
> the center of the shock lies an electromagnet.  When the electromagnet is
> activated, the particles in the shock chain up and alter the viscosity of
> the fluid, changing its damping coefficient.
>
> This gives the shock infinite damping adjustability (within reason).
>
> After a quick net search, the Magneshock is for sale by a company called
> Carrera shocks.  (http://www.carrerashocks.com/MagneShock.htm)
> Though very expensive for now, the shock seems to be ideal for many, many
> applications (beyond just automobiles).
>
> Has anyone looked at this shock before, or heard about it?
>
> It seems that, if effective, the shock would be an amazing leap up from
> current suspension technology.  Imagine shocks that could instantaneously
> alter damping coefficients to an extremely fine level!
>
> Any opinions?
>
> Regards,
>    Dennis

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 30 Jul 1999 15:04:16 -0700
From: "Murat Okcuoglu" <murat@ashacorp.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Oil pressure problem.

Replace filter, sometimes bad filters reduce pressure.

On my brand new engine, I get two notches above zero, at low idle when oil
is really hot.

Is this normal?

on my previous mitsu's, I discovered that the greatest contributor to oil
pressure is the turbo bearings.

 In this car, turbos are 63K old.

I use W50 Mobil 1, it is the best oil money can buy (a Castrol racing team
uses it!!) It is safe in CA or other hot climates.

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 30 Jul 1999 15:15:43 -0700
From: "Murat Okcuoglu" <murat@ashacorp.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Oil pressure problem.

My oil pressure is right at the lower edge of the oil can figure on the
gauge, at 2500 RPM hot. Is this normal? this is my second engine, first one
blew up due to low oil pressure.

I also noticed the oil pressure goes up slightly when it gets hot. Is this
due to oil thermostat allowing better flow?

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 30 Jul 1999 15:16:23 -0700
From: "Murat Okcuoglu" <murat@ashacorp.com>
Subject: Team3S: Magnarheological fluids

This is real, but not so new.

Yes, it has the potential to revolutionize suspension and TRANSMISSION
design.

Difficulties so far have been the abrasiveness of the fluid, stability of
the fluid (particles are suspended in the solution therefore susceptible to
precipitation), thermal stability and breakdown.

Potential is there, as the quality of the fluid is improved and price comes
down. Current price of the fluid is $300 a quart.


For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 17:23:38 -0500
From: Del A Kolasinski <pearlvr42c@juno.com>
Subject: Team3S: Kormax Transmissions

This morning locked up the good old transfer case on the way to work,
nothing like a screaching hault around a freeway off ramp at 50mph.
Anyways I've been working the phones today and would like some feedback
from people who have dealt with Kormax Transmissions in California.
Talked with Frank and he said with my core I can get a used/rebuilt 5
speed transmission, transfer case, and output shaft for $1,700 plus
shipping to Wisconsin.  I called back twice just to make sure this was
for real and sure enough.  But I want to know from all of you out there
how reliable is this place as far as actually having good syncros, I'm
sick of my grinding 1-2 shift and want to fix it all in one shot.  Please
let me know what you all think.
Thanks,
Del Kolasinski
PEARLVR42C@juno.com
wisc.dsm.org

___________________________________________________________________
Get the Internet just the way you want it.
Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month!
Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj.
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 30 Jul 1999 17:26:05 -0700
From: "Jim Berry" <fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Kormax Transmissions

The key here is the term you used --- used/rebuilt --- the only new parts
are likely to be bearings and seals. At this time there are NO, NONE, NADA
new synchros, you can only get used/good synchros or worse used/bad
synchros.I have heard good reports about Kormax.

    Jim Berry
================================================

> This morning locked up the good old transfer case on the way to work,
> nothing like a screaching hault around a freeway off ramp at 50mph.
> Anyways I've been working the phones today and would like some feedback
> from people who have dealt with Kormax Transmissions in California.
> Talked with Frank and he said with my core I can get a used/rebuilt 5
> speed transmission, transfer case, and output shaft for $1,700 plus
> shipping to Wisconsin

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 07:28:12 -0400 (EDT)
From: ie886@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (John T. Christian)
Subject: Team3S: 13Gs finished

Hi all,

Finished installing the 13Gs.  Took much longer than Barry's 2hrs front and
4 hrs rear.  More like 2 days and 4 days, but I'm just a back yard
mechanic......   
If you ever have a need to change turbos yourself, don't believe the
service manual that says you need totake off the radiator, AC, generator,
intake manifold, etc.  You don't.
You will need every 14mm socket/drive that Craftsman makes including
swivels.  New studs for the new turbos will save much time and physical
strength.

The good news is that the turbos work.  But I still have the 3rd gear
stutter.

Many thanks to Barry, Jack T, Roger, Todd & Bob for their advice and
encouragement on my first major TT engine operation.

Be of good cheer

- --
    JCZoooM  '93 Stealth TT Blue    almost stock    12.46 @109 MPH
e-mail: ie886@po.cwru.edu    www.geocities.com/motorcity/flats/4538
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 07:50:58 -0400 (EDT)
From: ie886@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (John T. Christian)
Subject: Team3S: Stutter

Hi all,

My TT still breaks up/stutters in 3rd gear above 5000RPM.  I first noticed
the stutter on the back straight at Mid Ohio last Fall and it seemed to get
worse.  When I blew the rear turbo at Road Atlanta in Nov. I thought
aaaaahh that rotten turbo is the problem.

I replaced the stock turbos with 13Gs and the stutter is still here.  Well
really, it seems worse.  I cannot accelerate thru 1st gear without breakup.
 Or any other gear for that matter.  I can get to redline in 3rd gear IF I
modulate the throttle to keep the boost <5psi. 

I replaced the negative battery terminal as the bolt for the cables came
out of the lead.  It didn't solve the stutter.

Perhaps I disturbed a sensor somewhere.  I had scribed the throttle cable
location on the intake manifold before I unbolted it and replaced it in the
same location.  The O2 sensors didn't seem clogged.

The air tube going into the intake air side of the rear turbo has a fitting
in it plugged with a screw.  Should there be a sensor connected???

The plugs/wires were new at the 60k maintenance which was 20k ago.

As a seat of the pants assessment, it feels as if the car is drowning in
fuel.

Lifetime member of the dirty fingernails club.

- --
    JCZoooM  '93 Stealth TT Blue    almost stock    12.46 @109 MPH
e-mail: ie886@po.cwru.edu    www.geocities.com/motorcity/flats/4538
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 10:17:26 -0500
From: "Brad Bedell" <bbedell@austin.rr.com>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Stutter

I would look at replacing the plugs, including regapping them.

Even though you have 20,000 miles on the plugs, they are most likely worn
out.  Plan on accelerating all maintenance items when you put the car
through "severe duty"  This includes changing oil after every race session.

Brad
Check out my home page:   http://home.austin.rr.com/overboost/
E-Mail: bbedell@austin.rr.com ICQ#  3612682

- -----Original Message-----
From: owner-stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com
[mailto:owner-stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com]On Behalf Of John T. Christian
Sent: Saturday, July 31, 1999 6:51 AM
To: stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com; stealth-d@starnet.net
Cc: bsc4@po.cwru.edu; thetek@cwix.com; ie886@po.cwru.edu
Subject: Team3S: Stutter

Hi all,

My TT still breaks up/stutters in 3rd gear above 5000RPM.  I first noticed
the stutter on the back straight at Mid Ohio last Fall and it seemed to get
worse.  When I blew the rear turbo at Road Atlanta in Nov. I thought
aaaaahh that rotten turbo is the problem.

I replaced the stock turbos with 13Gs and the stutter is still here.  Well
really, it seems worse.  I cannot accelerate thru 1st gear without breakup.
 Or any other gear for that matter.  I can get to redline in 3rd gear IF I
modulate the throttle to keep the boost <5psi.

I replaced the negative battery terminal as the bolt for the cables came
out of the lead.  It didn't solve the stutter.

Perhaps I disturbed a sensor somewhere.  I had scribed the throttle cable
location on the intake manifold before I unbolted it and replaced it in the
same location.  The O2 sensors didn't seem clogged.

The air tube going into the intake air side of the rear turbo has a fitting
in it plugged with a screw.  Should there be a sensor connected???

The plugs/wires were new at the 60k maintenance which was 20k ago.

As a seat of the pants assessment, it feels as if the car is drowning in
fuel.

Lifetime member of the dirty fingernails club.

- --
    JCZoooM  '93 Stealth TT Blue    almost stock    12.46 @109 MPH
e-mail: ie886@po.cwru.edu    www.geocities.com/motorcity/flats/4538
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 11:29:33 -0400
From: William Lynn Larsen <wlarsen@ibm.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Oil pressure problem.

Matt,

Living in FL, I would definitely go with the 50W Mobil1. That is what I
use and I live in NC, but used to live in FL (Tampa/Winter Haven). I
think this will help you on both. I used to use Castrol Syntec 5W-50 and
just switched to Mobil1 and it has helped my lash adjuster noise a lot.

Someone else mentioned that the oil pressure went up as it got hot. This
is your multiweight oil doing what it is supposed to: as the temperature
of the oil goes up, so does its viscosity.  I have always seen my max
oil pressure after a half hour on the interstate with the A/C on.  In
the cold winter my oil pressure never gets over half way up the gauge,
but I just have to have faith that the oil viscosity is right for the
temp of the engine.  My first winter in Raleigh, I switched back to
Castrol 20-50 turbo oil because it un-nerved me so.

Regards,
Lynn

Matt wrote:
> >range of markings, almost 2 lines below. Should I use a Thicker or
> >thinner weight oil? I do live in florida, and the heat is some factor,
> >but now the lifters or something under there is making a loud ticking,
> >and I don't know what to do. Any ideas?
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 12:04:25 -0400
From: mark kibort <mkibort@compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Dyno/eRAM..., eRacing responds...

Thanks for the welcome, I hope I can answer any more questions in my small
area of expertise.
I was reading some of the recent posts and there is lots of good
information flying around here.

Fire away regarding any "hair dryer" inseries questions or anything
regarding to air flow.   (Ill see what I can do)

Ill check out your dyno runs for the losses .   Generally, you cant
determine the losses from the gear train from these graphs, only the
rollling friction from the cost down, that includes rubber to dyno wheel
friction, bearing, and rear diff losses. I JUST THOUGHT OF SOMETHING.  Are
you looking at the total "negative HP" on the graph?  If so, REMEMBER that
the compression is causing the large HP costs on the cost down if it still
is in gear.    I remember looking at my curve and saw the 100 hp losses.
When we did the neutral coast down, it went down to 20 hp.  (Which follows
the calculated losses of 20 hp for rolling and rear diff, and 20 more for
transmission, for a total of 40 hp on a 250 hp rear wheel dyno run.  (or
16% total )

Mark Kibort
eRACING
www.electricsupercharger.com


Message text written by "R.G."
>First I'd give Mark a warm welcome to the Team3S list and I'm happy to
have
more pros that can give us some insights behind the tech ;-)

Second, thanks a lot for all the answers answered in a great way. I do have
some more questions and the hairdryer example (LOL) is one that is not yet
clear. Please stay tuned as I'll do my first Water Injection runs and logs
tomorrow and I have to regain some energy from the looong nights in
Amsterdam, hehe.

Later,
Roger

PS : Mark, please check out the dynosheets on my homepage under (February
dyno session) for ther tranny loss. We do this the same way as you do and
the figures are pretty close to Subarus, Audis and Porsche Carrera 4
losses.

http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/9589/3000gt.html
<

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 12:01:03 -0500
From: "Gabriel Estrada" <typhoonzz@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Stutter

Check all of the vacuum lines.  When I was having a similar problem with my
VR-4, I went through and changed all of the plugs, wires, air filter, fuel
filter and changed the oil.  It didn't make any difference what-so-ever.
Went through and found a vacuum line had cracked.  Replaced it with new
silicone lines and the car runs 10x stronger.  Check out
www.bakerprecision.com for new lines that are much nicer than the crappy
rubber hose you get at part stores.
Hope this helps with the problem.
Gabe Estrada
94 Pearl Yellow 3000GT VR-4
92 Gmc Typhoon
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Brad Bedell <bbedell@austin.rr.com>
To: John T. Christian <ie886@cleveland.Freenet.Edu>;
<stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com>
Sent: Saturday, July 31, 1999 10:17 AM
Subject: RE: Team3S: Stutter


> My TT still breaks up/stutters in 3rd gear above 5000RPM.  I first noticed
> the stutter on the back straight at Mid Ohio last Fall and it seemed to
get
> worse.  When I blew the rear turbo at Road Atlanta in Nov. I thought
> aaaaahh that rotten turbo is the problem.
>
> I replaced the stock turbos with 13Gs and the stutter is still here.  Well
> really, it seems worse.  I cannot accelerate thru 1st gear without
breakup.
>  Or any other gear for that matter.  I can get to redline in 3rd gear IF I
> modulate the throttle to keep the boost <5psi.
>


For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 09:51:35 -0700
From: "Bob Forrest" <bf@bobforrest.com>
Subject: Team3S: Welcome to eRacing... (was: Dyno/eRAM...)

Hey, Mark,

And another welcome... to you and your eRacing Team, and a "thank you" for
taking so much time to try and make your eRAM products yield maximum
performance on our 3000GT's and Stealths.  With any luck, we can help each
other--  I think you have one of those products that may prove to be of
additional benefit to us, not just for the HP gains, but because we're going
to learn something more about the operation of our engines.  And in having
another sophisticated platform on which to test the eRAM, hopefully you'll
realize an even better product in its future incarnations as well.
Knowledge is power...

Here's to both of us, and a long, friendly, and mutually beneficial
relationship between eRacing and Team3S.

Regards,

Forrest

- -----Original Message-----From: mark kibort <mkibort@compuserve.com>

>Thanks for the welcome, I hope I can answer any more questions in my small
>area of expertise.
>I was reading some of the recent posts and there is lots of good
>information flying around here.
>
>Fire away regarding any "hair dryer" inseries questions or anything
>regarding to air flow.   (Ill see what I can do)
>
>Ill check out your dyno runs for the losses .   Generally, you cant
>determine the losses from the gear train from these graphs, only the
>rollling friction from the coast down, that includes rubber to dyno wheel
- ------snip--------




For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 10:07:54 -0700
From: "Bob Forrest" <bf@bobforrest.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Dyno/eRAM..., eRacing responds...

- -----Original Message-----From: mark kibort <mkibort@compuserve.com>

- ---------snip--------
>Ill check out your dyno runs for the losses .   Generally, you cant
>determine the losses from the gear train from these graphs, only the
>rolling friction from the cost down, that includes rubber to dyno wheel
>friction, bearing, and rear diff losses. I JUST THOUGHT OF SOMETHING.  Are
>you looking at the total "negative HP" on the graph?  If so, REMEMBER that
>the compression is causing the large HP costs on the coast down if it still
>is in gear.    I remember looking at my curve and saw the 100 hp losses.
>When we did the neutral coast down, it went down to 20 hp.  (Which follows
>the calculated losses of 20 hp for rolling and rear diff, and 20 more for
>transmission, for a total of 40 hp on a 250 hp rear wheel dyno run.  (or
>16% total )
>
>Mark Kibort
>eRACING
>www.electricsupercharger.com


Mark makes a good point...  When we did my dyno run when testing the eRAM,
Terry (the dyno guru at Frey Racing) was most emphatic about IMMEDIATELY
banging the clutch in as soon as we reached 5500 and doing the coast-down in
neutral...

Forrest



For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 13:42:15 -0400
From: "Bob Rand" <rtr@vnet.net>
Subject: Team3S: Vacuume hose

Hi guys could use some info.  I am going to change all the vacume lines on
my 93 Stealth TT.  Was wondering if anyone knows the different sizes of hose
needed and the approx. lengths of each to do the job.

Thanks,  Bob


For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 13:48:00 -0500
From: "Jeff" <spydervr4@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Dyno/eRAM..., eRacing responds...

Bob, out of curiosity, why were you shutting it down at 5500rpm?  Why not
take it to redline?

jeff
'95 Mitsubishi Spyder VR-4
'90 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX

- -----Original Message-----
From: Bob Forrest <bf@bobforrest.com>
To: mark kibort <mkibort@compuserve.com>; R.G. <robby@freesurf.ch>; stealth
list <stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com>
Date: Saturday, July 31, 1999 12:09 PM
Subject: Re: Team3S: Dyno/eRAM..., eRacing responds...



>Mark makes a good point...  When we did my dyno run when testing the eRAM,
>Terry (the dyno guru at Frey Racing) was most emphatic about IMMEDIATELY
>banging the clutch in as soon as we reached 5500 and doing the coast-down
in
>neutral...

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 02:12:43 -0500
From: xwing <xwing@execpc.com>
Subject: Team3S: Compressor Efficiency Theory, HP 9B vs 13G

RE:  9B vs 13G compressor heating air/horsepower differences:

The mechanical DEVICE one uses to compress air imparts heat to the
air, which is above and beyond the simple physics of compressible
gas heating up on compression (to boost).  For automobile instance,
a Roots-type supercharger is VERY inefficient, and
imparts ALOT of heat; it is a design from the 1930's.  Improved
designs have come out ("high-helix" Roots-type, etc) that really work
better and heat air less per unit compression, but they work SO well
that NHRA outlawed them because they could make cars too fast.

On a turbo, the heat imparted to the volume of air compressed is
graphically depicted on the "compressor map", is a 3-D graph.
On the left (of a 2-D map on a sheet of paper) is the
"pressure ratio"=boost.  On the bottom is the
"air flow" = pounds per minute.  Coming out toward you as an
"island" in the middle of the graph is an oval-shaped area, with
several "ovals" each inside the other, representing "Efficiency
Islands"...SO, at a CERTAIN BOOST and a CERTAIN
AIRFLOW you can find WHICH EFFICIENCY level the compressor
is at.  Generally, a turbo ranges between 50% and 80% efficient;
60% is the lower level desirable, and the higher the better.  As you
can see, a turbo operating at 60% efficiency at high rpm and high
boost (9B at high rpm/power) will impart more heat to the charge
than a WELL-PICKED turbo operating at 70-75% efficiency.

At 20psi boost, turbo outlet temps are 320 F at 70% compressor
efficiency island.  If you have 60% efficiency, that would be 373 F
or so.  There is about 1% more power for every 10 degrees lower
intake temp, so the 53 degree difference would be about 25 hp, or
2mph in quartermile.

A mitigating factor is that the higher the discharge temp from the
turbo, the greater the delta T across the INTERCOOLER, so the
intercooler works better and better as temps go up, so the 53 degree
difference above MIGHT only be ?? 35-45degrees by the time it
gets to the intake manifold.

I do NOT have compressor maps of the 9B vs. the 13G, but based on the
rated airflows (265 cfm @15psi for 9B, 360cfm @15psi for 13G, a
36% increase in airflow at SAME pressure=can maintain SAME pressure
at a 36% higher rpm) the 13G is clearly going to be on a higher efficiency
island at high compressor speeds, probably 6-10% higher, so the round
guesstimate example of 70% vs 60% above may not be that far off, in
some of the powerband at least; maybe 1-2mph based on compressor
design 13G vs. 9B at same boost setting.

Of note, the "G" in 13G denotes a somewhat more efficient compressor
BLADE design than the "B" in 9B; the G design is slightly more efficient
at higher boost/pressure ratios than the B.  For instance, "back in the day"
when I was researching turbos for my car and looking into getting something
better than the 13G offered direct from Mitsu, I spoke with Mitsu Heavy
Industries Turbocharger Division engineers and hashed some things out.
I was considering getting a 14B compressor wheel instead of the 13G but
they said the 14B "don't flow for shit", and are not as good as the 13G I
already had.  The Mitsubishi 300ZX upgrade, a TD04HL-15C-8.5cm^2
unit, uses a "C" design that works ok below 20psi but is less efficient
than the "G", especially at high boost.  The 15C is rated at 390cfm.
The 15G TEC upgrade is "rated" at 460cfm as I recall, but I am not sure
at what pressure; if 15psi, the 70cfm difference serves to show some
of the importance of the wheel design.

In short, it matters "alot" what compresses the air, whether 9B, 13/15/17G, or
gerbils.  Whether a few mph in quartermile are important to an individual is
what defines "alot" for each of us...

Jack Tertadian
Road Warrior Contingent,  3S mailing lists  :)

Jim Berry wrote:

> I keep seeing the statement that somehow the 13G produces more 02 at say
> 15psi than the 9B does at 15 psi.
> I see no reason for air temp of 13G to be lower than
> 9B--you are doubling pressure 14. 7 PSIA to 29.7
> PSIA so compression heating will double  temp at outlet of
> turbo. There should be small  heat gain from heat of
> turbo itself but I expect  it a small percentage of the change.

> air temp should be about same whether
> generated by 13G or 6 pack gerbils on treadmill. I see no scientific
> evidence to support theory that 13G's are more efficient and
> beat air charge less.
>     Jim Berry
>
> > >At say, 5000 rpm and 15psi, an engine with 13G turbos will deliver more
> > >horsepower than an engine with 9Gs, everything else being equal.
>
> > We definitely found better mid power/torque but
> > not real power gain. 13G works more effective as
> > discharge temperatures are noticeably lower than 9Bs (measured in
> > the y-pipe).

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 23:20:53 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Dyno/eRAM..., dyno stuff

> Ill check out your dyno runs for the losses .   Generally, you cant
> determine the losses from the gear train from these graphs, only the
> rollling friction from the cost down, that includes rubber to dyno wheel
> friction, bearing, and rear diff losses. I JUST THOUGHT OF SOMETHING.  Are
> you looking at the total "negative HP" on the graph?  If so, REMEMBER that
> the compression is causing the large HP costs on the cost down if it still
> is in gear.

This makes me thinking. As far as I remember, the dyno was set to the "loss
measuring mode" (or something like that) and the operator drove the car in
4th gear up to about 6k and the left off the gas. The computer then drawed
the curve. To be honest, I can't remember if he pressed the clutch then,
switched to neutral or left it in fourth. If i recall correctly it was the
later.

>  I remember looking at my curve and saw the 100 hp losses.
> When we did the neutral coast down, it went down to 20 hp.  (Which follows
> the calculated losses of 20 hp for rolling and rear diff, and 20 more for
> transmission, for a total of 40 hp on a 250 hp rear wheel dyno run.  (or
> 16% total )

But how did you got the 20hp loss on the tranny ? I'd say pressing the
clutch will show the real loss as the tranny is still in fourth and the
whole resistance (including rolling friction) of the tranny with rear diff,
transaxle, etc just before the flywheel would be measured. What do you think
?

Roger
93'3000GT TT

For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

------------------------------

End of Team3S Digest V1 #245
****************************

For unsubscribe info and FAQ, see our web page at http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm