--
From: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
(Team3S Digest)
To: stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Subject:
Team3S Digest V1 #189
Reply-To: stealth-3000gt
Sender: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Errors-To:
owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Precedence:
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Team3S Digest
Wednesday, May 26 1999 Volume 01
: Number
189
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date:
Tue, 25 May 1999 15:05:59 -0700
From: wce@bc.sympatico.ca
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Need some help from the pros on installing a boost
controller
Josh;
I will not advise on your particular BC although
the fundamentals are essentially the
same for all of them. I'm running an
Apexi SAVC-R. So, find someone here who has your
unit and solicite advise
from them. Go slow (as I did) and double or triple check
yourself with the
instalation. Some people say they can do it in a few hours, some even
claim a
couple. Well, I did it via the internet, and double/triple checked,
backchecked
with Barry King who helped me via this box of magic, until
I'm certain he was certain I
was clueless, took it slow and did it right. My
car was not being used so I was in no
hurry...after a" week" a dabbling
I had an absolutely show room quality (better than
professinal) instalation.
Do yourself a favour and do it the same way. Haste makes waste
if you're
uncertain of what you're doing, and in the case of these vehicles,
mistakes
can be reeeeeeeeeeeeeal costly. Check for member signatures who have
your BC and contact
them individualy for help. Most people are glad to help
and advise, and those who
aren't, you don't need to
know.
Best
Darc
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web
page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Tue, 25 May 1999 18:09:11 -0400
From: "Fein, Edward" <fein@strategy.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Need some help from the pros on installing a boost c
ontroller
Sheesh, no need to start a flame war over this...
1)
Yes, my instructions were incomplete. They were just designed to give
Josh a
feel for what he's going to be dealing with. I expected him to reply
with
more questions after a closer look at his instructions.
2) Yes, the
dashed while vacuum line from the stock boost control solenoid
to the intake
just IN FRONT OF the rear compressor wheel exists on our cars.
Its purpose is
to create a vaccuum while the solenoid is open. You should
know about this
line and have capped it in your own install.
The EVC may will require the
same line, if it functions the way the stock
boost controller
does.
3) Ok, he didn't mention an intake line, which is (in
retrospect) probably
what is meant by the line to the compressor wheel. Our
cars have a nipple on
the Y-pipe for this purpose, close to the throttle
body.
Come to think of it, this would be better placed right after the
compressor
wheel - no use cooling this air and reducing its pressure through
the
intercoolers. Higher pressure in the input line would mean faster
response
by the wastegates.
So you're right, I wasn't thinking
there.
4) Most people mount their boost controllers in the space left
by replacing
the stock airbox with a conical filter. From that position, a
new line to
the front wastegate is far shorter than running back up behind
the engine to
the hardline. A shorter line means quicker response by the
wastegate to the
operation of the boost controller.
Any more
questions, Roger?
Josh, if you're still listening... If you're
completely confused by all
this, I'd advise finding someone in your area who
knows what they are doing
and asking them for some help. There are a lot of
helpful people on this
list. Where are you located?
Or come to a
Gathering and ask someone. Check out
http://www.3si.org/upcoming.html for
a list of upcoming Gatherings.
It's really not that hard, but it's tough
to describe without having a car
handy to point at.
-Ed
Lives in Boston, works in Jersey.
Drives a '94 VR-4...
sometimes
Completely off topic, in the past 6 weeks, I've driven the
following, each
for at least 3 days:
3000 GT VR-4
Isuzu Impulse
RS
Pontiac Grand AM SE
Ford Escort
Toyota Corolla
Ford
Taurus
Chevy Malibu
Chevy Lumina
Ain't rentals fun? (only the first two
are mine).
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Tue, 25 May 1999 20:14:57 EDT
From: MikeVR4@aol.com
Subject: Team3S: Re: TWS
Track Report Questions
<<Does this mean you lower the car when you
get to the track?>>
Yes, we drive to the track the evening before,
scout out a good spot to call
our own, and then jack the cars up and switch
out wheels/tires. Since the
cars are already jacked up, it's also a
convenient time to lower them.
<<How do you tell? What do you ask
for?>>
When ordering, I would press the guy on the phone about the
kit - Does it
include their new rear kit for the VR-4 that includes longer
springs and
machined aluminum upper spring perches? They should know
what this is, or at
least can hand you over to someone who does...You can
mention us if you like
for easier reference.(No, we don't get a
gratuity!) The old rear did not
include upper
perches.
<<Is this a real problem?>>
Yes, wheel
alignment becomes a problem when you lower the car more than 3/4 -
1", since
you can no longer adjust them back into specs. You'll quickly get
uneven tire wear if it's way off. You need some kind of caster/camber
plate
that would increase your range of adjustment to keep the car lowered
all the
time. I think a few people on the list also bought these from
Ground
Control...Anyone have results?
<<Companies are giving
away Boxsters and Z3s to new-hire engineers.>>
Man, I guess I'm
working for the wrong company...All I got was a 2 yr visit
to
Nebraska...
<<Come in on Friday. You can set up at the track, then
leave everything
there. The track is locked up and guarded all night. We
start at 8:00 am.
on Saturday.>>
What time do they lock up the
track on Friday? Is there a fee to enter the
gates on
Friday?
Mike Willis
'93 Pearl White VR-4
For subscribe/unsubscribe
info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Tue, 25 May 1999 20:19:11 -0400
From: Joshua <joshua@princelaw.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Need some help from the pros on installing a boost c
ontroller
I am located in Pa somewhat near Philadelphia anyone around
that area that
wants to make some money or know of a good performance
shop? I might try
tackling it but I don't wanna mess anything
up.
-----Original Message-----
From: Fein, Edward [mailto:fein@strategy.com]
Sent: Tuesday,
May 25, 1999 6:09 PM
To: 'stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com'
Subject:
RE: Team3S: Need some help from the pros on
installing a boost c
ontroller
Sheesh, no need to start a flame war over
this...
1) Yes, my instructions were incomplete. They were
just
designed to give
Josh a feel for what he's going to be dealing with.
I
expected him to reply
with more questions after a closer look at his
instructions.
2) Yes, the dashed while vacuum line from the stock
boost
control solenoid
to the intake just IN FRONT OF the rear compressor
wheel
exists on our cars.
Its purpose is to create a vaccuum while the
solenoid is
open. You should
know about this line and have capped it in
your own install.
The EVC may will require the same line, if it functions
the
way the stock
boost controller does.
3) Ok, he didn't
mention an intake line, which is (in
retrospect) probably
what is meant by
the line to the compressor wheel. Our cars
have a nipple on
the Y-pipe for
this purpose, close to the throttle body.
Come to think of it, this
would be better placed right after
the compressor
wheel - no use cooling
this air and reducing its pressure
through the
intercoolers. Higher
pressure in the input line would mean
faster response
by the
wastegates.
So you're right, I wasn't thinking there.
4) Most
people mount their boost controllers in the space
left by replacing
the
stock airbox with a conical filter. From that position,
a new line to
the
front wastegate is far shorter than running back up
behind the engine
to
the hardline. A shorter line means quicker response by the
wastegate to
the
operation of the boost controller.
Any more questions,
Roger?
Josh, if you're still listening... If you're
completely
confused by all
this, I'd advise finding someone in your area
who knows what
they are doing
and asking them for some help. There are a
lot of helpful
people on this
list. Where are you located?
Or come
to a Gathering and ask someone. Check out
http://www.3si.org/upcoming.html for
a list of upcoming
Gatherings.
It's really not that hard, but it's
tough to describe
without having a car
handy to point
at.
-Ed
Lives in Boston, works in Jersey.
Drives a
'94 VR-4... sometimes
Completely off topic, in the past 6 weeks, I've
driven the
following, each
for at least 3 days:
3000 GT VR-4
Isuzu
Impulse RS
Pontiac Grand AM SE
Ford Escort
Toyota Corolla
Ford
Taurus
Chevy Malibu
Chevy Lumina
Ain't rentals fun? (only the first two
are mine).
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Tue, 25 May 1999 20:40:08 -0400
From: Joshua <joshua@princelaw.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Need some help from the pros on installing a boost c
ontroller
Ok I looked at your page now for my question.
Ok it says
Port 1 connect to uninterrupted intake manifold AKA Plenum. I
understand
that. Port 2 Section of hose to a source pressurized air such
as
turbocharger compressor housing(discharge side) or compressor
Outlet
pipe(before intercooler) This one I can't figure out where I am
supposed to
get this line from your diagram. Port 3 wastegate which is
just me tapping
into the H hose section. So if I am wrong with anything
PLEASE tell me and
also please explain port 2 to me. Thanks so much
guys. And thank you for
showing me your page IT WAS SOOOO HELPFUL.
-----Original Message-----
From: R.G. [mailto:robby@swissonline.ch]
Sent:
Tuesday, May 25, 1999 5:25 PM
To: stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Need some help from the pros on
installing a boost
controller
> There's actually a line from just in front of the
rear
turbo compressor
> housing back down there - I think it has a
dashed white
line on it.
Please, BE CAREFUL what you advice !! No
offend broh as we
all appreciate your
help, but you are very wrong
!
> If the EVC wants a line from in front of the compressor
If
the thing really wants a line INFRONT of the compressor
wheel ... throw
it
away. Usually three ports are used to sense boost, input
and
output, that's it.
> you can just use that and disconnect your stock
boost
control solenoid.
No,no again. Just disconnecting the solenoid
is not good. At
least the free port
must be capped. Even more this would
make zero sense and it
is boost INFRONT the
throttle body.
>
Putting in a line _after_ the compressor would be
difficult, but I
don't
> see why the EVC would need it.
What are you speaking about
? You know an EVC is a boost
controller that
controls the wastegates by
letting pressure to them or not.
And this pressure
comes from after the
compressor wheel (ahem, where it is
produced). EVERY boost
controller
needs this boost on the input port and the output
port goes then to
the
wastegates and that's it.
> You actually have two wastegates - you'll
want to T that
output from the EVC
> to both. You can use the stock
4-way T just below the
stock boost control
> solenoid, or run the lines
directly to the wastegates on
the turbochargers.
This is ok, and yes
we have to wastegates (we also have two
turbos). But why
running an extra
line where we already have a hardline
installed ????
> Get your
hands on a shop manual - it helps a lot.
Ed, this is the best advice and
I second it for sure. Please
note that Josh is
learning the stuff from
scratch and it doesn't help to
confuse him :)
I think the best advice
for Josh is to look around on
different homepages and
checking out the
different setups. Josh, also have a look on
my Turbo Basics
page where a
typical boost controller setup is drawn for our
cars. And no, our
turbos
do not have a port on the compressor housing as it
may be drawn in
the
manual of the EVC.
A last note, you also have to regap the plugs
for higher
boost. So be prepared
for more work to come.
Good luck,
and go on slowly.
Roger
-----------------------
Roger Gerl,
Switzerland
93'3000GT TwinTurbo (Animale Rosso)
Check out:
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/9589/3000gt.html
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Tue, 25 May 1999 23:16:13 -0400
From: Bill Wagner <wagner@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: ECS failure
Andrew:
I've had a battery die on me before.
At no time did the ECS fail because
of the battery. I think it's just
cooincidence.
Bill Wagner
Andrew Clark wrote:
>
>
Thanks Wayne for the reply & the offer, but I would still like to
know
> if the ECS draws alot of current & if the car requires a very
powerful
> battery, as this problem has only occurred when the charge of
the
> battery has been down slightly ie if the car hasn't been driven for
a
> few days.
> Cheers
> Andrew
> Australia
>
Wayne wrote:
> >
> > Andrew,
> > It's probably one of
your front strut harnesses (top of the strut tower) I
> > have one i'll
sell you if you are interested........I'll take $50
> >
> >
Wayne
> >
> > At 04:10 AM 5/24/99 , you wrote:
> >
>Recently the ECS on my car started to play up in that "sport/tour"
mode
> > >started to flash & the car would revert to a stiff
suspension setting.
> > >The battery was a bit old (actually very
old) so I replaced it with a
> > >high power Bosch battery &
this seemed to fix the problem.
> > >I went away over the weekend
& left the alarm on & when I went to drive
> > >the car this
morning the ECS indicator started to flash.
> > >Is this a common
thing?
> > >The alarm being left for a few days would drain the
battery a bit, but I
> > >wouldn't have thought that much that the
ECS would start to fail.
> > >Does the ECS draw a huge amount of
power?
> > >Does the 3KGT require a super powerful battery?
>
> >Any other remedies?
> > >Thanks
> >
>Andrew
> > >Australia
> > >94 VR4
>
>
> For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 01:05:13 -0400
From: "Kevin Schappell" <kevin@pacarsearch.com>
Subject:
Team3S: Web page for Scoops
Put together a quick site tonight for my car
and the scoops. I have a
question about my car. I was told that
the color was kind of rare. The
paint code is TA2 and it's teal or
turqoise. I have not seen any other
stealth's that color and I know
it's an original paint job.
Kevin Schappell
Auto Answers
http://www.pacarsearch.com
Pennsylvania's
newest auto classifieds site.
Free ads, chat, links and research
tools.
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 18:20:47 +1000
From: Andrew Clark <chemist1@ozemail.com.au>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: ECS failure
Thanks Roger ,Darc & Bill for the
advise.
In checking these connectors, are they just under the rubber seals
on
top of the strut towers & pretty easy to get at? Is this
procedure
described on anybodies web page?
Thanks again for the
help.
Andrew
Australia
wce@bc.sympatico.ca wrote:
>
> Andrew;
>
> Roger's advise is right on target. It is
likely the connectors on top of the towers.
For subscribe/unsubscribe info,
our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 10:29:48 +0200
From: Roger Gerl <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject:
Team3S: Boost Controller setup (was: Need some help...)
> Ok it says
Port 1 connect to uninterrupted intake manifold AKA Plenum. I
> understand
that.
Yes, as Ed stated, tap into the bypass valve line (infront the
plenum) or the
fuel pressure line (back of the plenum). This will be the
boost sensing line for
the controller.
> Port 2 Section of hose to
a source pressurized air such as
> turbocharger compressor
housing(discharge side) or compressor Outlet
> pipe(before
intercooler)
Usually, turbos have a small nipple attached to the
compressor wheel housing.
This line goes then directly to the wastegate (like
Ford Cosworth). On our cars
we indeed have a small boost controller with a
small solenoid (look at the
drawing with the bleeder valve). In our system
the pressure to open the
wastegates is taken from the nipple at the elbow of
the y-pipe (marked red).
This is AFTER the compressor and intercoolers but
BEFORE the throttle body. To
make thinking simple, you just can pull this
hose and the boost controlelr
solenoid will be in between then. This means :
Port 2 must be connected to the
original nipple at the y-pipe.
>
Port 3 wastegate which is just me tapping into the H hose section.
Yes,
correct. You can do this by just taking the hose you pulled off from
the
y-pipe and use a hose connector to attach the Port 3 hose to
it.
The hose that goes from the H-distributor to the stock boost solenoid
(the one
closer to the drivers side of the bracket at the firewall) should be
pulled and
capped. Also put a small cap onto the now open port of the
solenoid valve.
That's it :)
Hope this helps,
Roger
93'3000GT
TT
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 10:30:01 +0200
From: Roger Gerl <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject:
Team3S: Boost Control explanation (was: Need some help...)
> Sheesh,
no need to start a flame war over this...
Nah, for sure not. Even more I
think there is a misunderstanding :
> 2) Yes, the dashed while vacuum
line from the stock boost control solenoid
> to the intake just IN FRONT
OF the rear compressor wheel exists on our cars.
I think you say it is
routed there but not attached IN FRONT of the rear turbo.
> Its
purpose is to create a vaccuum while the solenoid is open. You should
>
know about this line and have capped it in your own install.
Or even
removed. But there is no vacuum created due to the open solenoid ! If
the
solenoid is open it releaves some pressure back into the intake path
(before
the turbos) acting like a bleeder valve. This results in a lower
pressure in the
lines to the wastegate actuators and therefore will open them
later. When the
stock boost solenoid is closed, the pressure produced by the
turbos will be
routed directly to the wastegate actuators causing them to
open.
> The EVC may will require the same line, if it functions the
way the stock
> boost controller does.
You are right, if you use
the controller to release pressure. But this is not
how the aftermarket boost
controllers are designed to work like !!! The stock
setup keeps the
wastegates closed by BLEEDING the air out of the lines. An EBC
keeps the
wastegates closed by BLOCKING the pressure from going to the
wastegates. This
is a different principle and should not mixed up. This is what
I meant with
confusing ;-)
> 3) Ok, he didn't mention an intake line, which is (in
retrospect) probably
> what is meant by the line to the compressor wheel.
Our cars have a nipple on
> the Y-pipe for this purpose, close to the
throttle body.
>
> Come to think of it, this would be better placed
right after the compressor
> wheel - no use cooling this air and reducing
its pressure through the
> intercoolers.
I agree but the problem is
that we do have two turbos and it's almost impossible
that both are producing
the same bosot at the very same time. The GT Pro 368S
turbos do have such a
port where can be used for this purpose but from the
technically fiew, a
really fast acting wastegate is not what the system needs :
The systems
aim is to create a most "un-wavy" behaviour and therefore the WGs do
have a
small delta in reaction (spring rate, hose expansion, etc.) An EBC
doesn't
look at these parts directly but indirectly you can see the effect in
the
boost characteristic. And this is what good self-learning controllers
learn
(Apexi S AVC-R) or what you can control yourself with the params at the
Blitz
DSBC. If done by hand you can control e.g. the height of the amplitude
of the
boost signal as well as the duration of the wave. You'll always have a
wave
signal althought the change in the aplitude is very small going to 0 (in
a
perfect system). Also the higher the amplitude the more overboost is
created. If
you have wastegates that open more quick, the frequency of the
boost signal will
become higher that can finaly cause more high peaks. Even
more it needs a faster
sensing device for the boost controller and todays
low/mid cost devices are not
able to act really quick. The Blitz DSBC is a
good example as speed is about 20
measures per second. But now it comes to
mind that the higher the frequency the
more we are getting a nice area and
the best possible reaction. YES, this is
what we want, but there are still
some deltas around and the speed of the
sensing device are too slow :( That's
why we have to live with a compromise that
finally works pretty well for
us.
If I ever make it to get the additional sensors working, I will
record such a
behaviour on my digital scope. This will help a lot to
understand what's going
on. Damn, my days should have 35.56
hours.
> 4) Most people mount their boost controllers in the space
left by replacing
> the stock airbox with a conical filter. From that
position, a new line to
> the front wastegate is far shorter than running
back up behind the engine to
> the hardline. A shorter line means quicker
response by the wastegate to the
> operation of the boost
controller.
Yes, you're absolutely right and indeed people have to retune
their BC
afterwards. The best result would be the shortest line as possible
to the
solenoid (fro mthe y-pipe) and the shortest to the H distributor.
That's why
some people (Mikael comes in mind) mounted the solnoid close to
the rear
firewall.
> Or come to a Gathering and ask someone. Check
out
> http://www.3si.org/upcoming.html for
a list of upcoming Gatherings.
I'm sure this would be of most benefit for
Josh. It's so much easier to point
with the finger to a device and not trying
to describe it :)
> It's really not that hard, but it's tough to
describe without having a car
> handy to point at.
My words ;-) But
don't forget regapping the plugs as well. This is somewhat
harder for a
newbie.
Regards,
Roger
93'3000GT TT
For subscribe/unsubscribe
info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 10:33:41 +0200
From: Roger Gerl <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: ECS failure
> In checking these connectors, are they just
under the rubber seals on
> top of the strut towers & pretty easy to
get at? Is this procedure
> described on anybodies web page?
I
don't know a web page with this topic but on my 93' the connectors are
outside
the rubber top.
If you clerned everything also reset the ECU
to clear any already set code. If
you have still a problem afterwards get the
code out of the ECU to find out what
strut or part is causing the
problem.
Let us know,
Roger
93'3000GT TT
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 07:16:31 -0400
From: "Kevin Schappell" <kevin@pacarsearch.com>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Web page for Scoops
Well this shows how late I was up.
The address is
http://www.pacarsearch.com/stealth
Kevin
Schappell
Auto Answers
http://www.pacarsearch.com
Pennsylvania's
newest auto classifieds site.
Free ads, chat, links and research tools.
-
-----Original Message-----
From: Kevin Schappell <kevin@pacarsearch.com>
To: stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com
<stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com>
Date:
Wednesday, May 26, 1999 2:09 AM
Subject: Team3S: Web page for
Scoops
>Put together a quick site tonight for my car and the
scoops. I have a
>question about my car. I was told that the
color was kind of rare. The
>paint code is TA2 and it's teal or
turqoise. I have not seen any other
>stealth's that color and I know
it's an original paint job.
>
>Kevin Schappell
>Auto
Answers
>http://www.pacarsearch.com
>Pennsylvania's
newest auto classifieds site.
>Free ads, chat, links and research
tools.
>
>For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
>
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 22:13:34 +1000
From: "Bryan G Langton" <blangtonb@bigpond.com>
Subject:
Team3S: new owner Help questions
This is a multi-part message in MIME
format.
- ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BEA7C4.FEEB1380
Content-Type:
text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
quoted-printable
Hi=20
i have just bought a Mitsu 3000 gt
vr4 full spec as an intort into =
Australia from Japan.
wowooo what a
car but some answer to some questions if possible.
1..I want to fit a CD
stacker is the wiring already in the boot some =
place as the radio has a CD
button ??
2..When i have been cruising for a few miles on the freeway and
i give =
it some gas i am aware of a "take up" in the drive train for a very
=
brief period of time..any suggestions re this and is it a
problem.??
3..Does any body know the part number for a 240klm speedo as
mine has =
the Jap 180klm speedo and is it easy to fit. ??
4..If i
have been running hard for a while even though i have =
intercoolers is it
best to let the motor run for a while to aid cooling =
of the turbo's before
i switch off. ??
5..I need a set of door seals for the windows any US
company send me a =
set i can pay by Amex ?
So far that is it... great
site for info.... but some of the messages =
are a bit odd
Bryan 95
tt
- ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BEA7C4.FEEB1380
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text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0
Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META
content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1"
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http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000"
name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY
bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV>Hi
</DIV>
<DIV> i have just bought a Mitsu 3000
gt vr4 full spec as an =
intort=20
into Australia from
Japan.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>wowooo
what a car but some answer to some questions if
=
possible.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>1..I
want to fit a CD stacker is the wiring already in the boot =
some
place=20
as the radio has a CD button
??</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>2..When i have
been cruising for a few miles on the freeway and i =
give it=20
some gas i
am aware of a "take up" in the drive train for a very brief =
period
of=20
time..any suggestions re this and is it a
problem.??</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>3..Does
any body know the part number for a 240klm speedo as mine =
has the=20
Jap
180klm speedo and is it easy to fit.
??</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>4..If i have
been running hard for a while even though i have =
intercoolers=20
is it
best to let the motor run for a while to aid cooling of the =
turbo's
before=20
i switch off.
??</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>5..I need a
set of door seals for the windows any US company send =
me a set=20
i can
pay by Amex ?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>So
far that is it... great site for info.... but some of the =
messages are
a=20
bit
odd</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Bryan 95
tt</DIV></BODY></HTML>
-
------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BEA7C4.FEEB1380--
For subscribe/unsubscribe
info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 10:17:45 -0400
From: "Fein, Edward" <fein@strategy.com>
Subject: RE:
Team3S: Boost Control explanation (was: Need some help...)
While we're on
the subject, an thought occurred to me last night (always a
dangerous
thing).
A simplified diagram for a "standard" EBC looks like this (pardon
the ASCII
art):
[Boost
Sensor]--------Controller
|
V
[High Pressure]>------>Solenoid----------Wastegates
The
controller senses the boost (Line 1 in the earlier discussion I
believe), and
directs the solenoid to open and close to allow air from the
high pressure
source (Line 2) to go to the wastegates, opening them (line
3). Note that the
connection from the Controller to the Solenoid is
electronic, not
air-based.
Now, once the solenoid has let through enough air to open the
wastegates,
how does it then re-close the wastegates once pressure falls to
an
acceptable level? Obviously, pressure must be bled from the
system.
My feeling is that most EBCs use a bleeder-type
system:
[High
Pressure]>------>Solenoid----------Wastegates
|
Restrictor->[Outside air]
This allows pressure to bleed down naturally
when the solenoid closes. In
fact, a manual bleeder system works exactly this
way, replacing the
"solenoid" with a manually adjustable
valve.
Now, the stock system works a little differently:
[High
Pressure]>------>----------Wastegates
|
Solenoid->[Compressor Vacuum]
The solenoid in this case *opens* to
relieve pressure from the wastegate
line... Not as efficient a
system. So why did Mitsubishi design it this
way??
Now, Probably
the best option would be controlling both the air going into
the wastegate
lines *and* the air bleeding out of the wastegate lines:
[High
Pressure]>------>Solenoid----------Wastegates
|
Solenoid->[Outside air]
Hence resulting in a "Dual Solenoid Boost
Controller"... Without the
restriction in the line to the outside air,
pressure can bleed down faster
when that solenoid is open, closing the
wastegates faster.
Anyone know if the Blitz actually works this way? Any
comments?
And wouldn't this work even faster if we connected the
bleed-down line to
compressor vaccuum rather than just venting to the outside
air?
-Ed
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web
page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 07:20:48 -0700
From: wce@bc.sympatico.ca
Subject: Re:
Team3S: new owner Help questions
Bryan G Langton wrote:
> snip
1..I want to fit a CD stacker is the wiring already in the
> boot some
place as the radio has a CD button ??
>
> I have not fitted one in
mine, but from past posts I believe is
> reported to be behind the back
seat. Information on this is in
> the archives or, if I am in error, it
will shortly be
> corrected.
>
> 2..When i have
been cruising for a few miles on the freeway
> and i give it some gas i am
aware of a "take up" in the drive
> train for a very brief period of
time..any suggestions re this
> and is it a problem.??
>
> Can
you explain "take up" a bit better. Offhand it sounds like
> you have a
hesitation which "normally" can be taken care of
> with new plugs (and if
they are old--also new wires). If you're
> planning on increasing boost,
as many do...gap your new plugs
> to .034". Use NGK PFR6J-11 which are
preset to.044 and
> carefully regap to .034 with a gapping tool. Otherwise
leave
> stock, or set to .040.
>
> 3..Does any
body know the part number for a 240klm speedo as
> mine has the Jap 180klm
speedo and is it easy to fit. ??
>
> Contact Tal Mitsu (phone #
posted in the archives) and they can
> provide the part and the parts you
have listed in #5 below.
> They have reasonable prices. Anticipate a
lengthy instalation
> as you'll have to dismantle the dash. Consider also
getting the
> 2 part shop manuals for the car as well as these will save
you
> a lote of time (and the CD backup for $25 also listed in our
>
archives).
>
> 4..If i have been running hard for a
while even though i have
> intercoolers is it best to let the motor run
for a while to aid
> cooling of the turbo's before i switch off.
??
>
> It's an excellent idea...always let it idle down for a
minute
> or two, perferably two. And, since you do not know how it
was
> run before, consider an oil flush (follow directions) at
your
> next oil change and then use a pure synthetic oil from that
>
point on. I prefer Mobil 1 (10-30) synthetic, but Castrol and
>
others are available.
>
> 5..I need a set of door seals
for the windows any US company
> send me a set i can pay by Amex
?
>
> See above re Tal Mitsu.
>
> So far
that is it... great site for info.... but some of the
> messages are a bit
odd
>
> Glad you like it. We are devoted to technical aspects of
the
> vehicles here, and due to a recent closure of another 3S
site
> (which is now back up incidentally) there have been a few
more
> chatty messages than we encourage. Given the the problems
with
> the other site, we have been accomodating. However, rules
are
> likely to be more applicable now.
>
>
Best
>
> Darc
For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web
page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 10:33:04 -0400
From: "Meyer" <meyer2@erols.com>
Subject: Team3S:
Intercooler Upgrades For Sale
I am selling my Alamo/Cartech
intercoolers. They fit in the stock locations
on all 1990-1999
3000GT/Stealth cars. I will sell the pair complete with
custom adapter
hard pipes for $900.00.... These intercoolers sell for
$1899.00 NEW,
and are in perfect working condition. Visa and
Mastercard
accepted. 301-824-3337
Matt
www.AcceleratedAccessories.com
-
---------------------------->from www.alamomotorsports.com/frameset1.htm
<------------------------------------------------
AMSI133000
SERIES 1 INTRCOOLERS 3000/STEALTH-TT (set) : includes oil cooler
relocation
kit.
DIMENSIONS : 8.5"h x 6.5"w x 5.75"d (each unit). (Approx. 19 square
inches
of internal flow area per unit)
$1899.00set
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 07:43:22 -0700
From: Chris Winkley <cwinkley@plaza.ds.adp.com>
Subject:
RE: Team3S: new owner Help questions
Bryan...
First (Admin
note)...please turn off the HTML on your e-mail app, it messes
with the
server. Thanks.
1. Yes, the connectors are under the carpet in the trunk
(boot) on the
drivers side.
2. Could be slack in the drivetrain (some is
"normal"), could be slipping
clutch (not normal).
3. Nope.
4. YES, YES,
YES...invest in a turbo timer or sit in the car for at least 30
seconds.
Turning off the engine while the turbos are cooking is a sure way
to shorten
their lives.
5. Unknown.
Looking forward...Chris
-
-----Original Message-----
From: Bryan G Langton [mailto:blangtonb@bigpond.com]
Sent:
Wednesday, May 26, 1999 5:14 AM
To: stealth-3000gt@list.sirius.com
Subject:
Team3S: new owner Help questions
Hi
i have just bought a Mitsu
3000 gt vr4 full spec as an intort into
Australia from Japan.
wowooo
what a car but some answer to some questions if possible.
1..I want to
fit a CD stacker is the wiring already in the boot some place
as the radio
has a CD button ??
2..When i have been cruising for a few miles on the
freeway and i give it
some gas i am aware of a "take up" in the drive train
for a very brief
period of time..any suggestions re this and is it a
problem.??
3..Does any body know the part number for a 240klm speedo as
mine has the
Jap 180klm speedo and is it easy to fit. ??
4..If i have
been running hard for a while even though i have intercoolers
is it best to
let the motor run for a while to aid cooling of the turbo's
before i switch
off. ??
5..I need a set of door seals for the windows any US company send
me a set i
can pay by Amex ?
So far that is it... great site for
info.... but some of the messages are a
bit odd
Bryan 95 tt
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 09:09:09 -0500
From: Merritt <merritt@cedar-rapids.net>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Re: TWS Track Report Questions
><<Come in on Friday.
You can set up at the track, then leave everything
>there. The track is
locked up and guarded all night. We start at 8:00 am.
>on
Saturday.>>
>
>What time do they lock up the track on
Friday? Is there a fee to enter the
>gates on Friday?
No
fee. Registration opens at 5:00 pm. I don't know if you can get into
the
track before then. They usually lock it up at sundown (8 pm or
so).
Rich/old poop
>
>Mike Willis
>'93 Pearl
White VR-4
>For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
>
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 07:45:32 -0700
From: "Jim Berry" <fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
new owner Help questions
> > > 2..When i have been
cruising for a few miles on the freeway
> > and i give it some gas i am
aware of a "take up" in the drive
> > train for a very brief period of
time..any suggestions re this
> > and is it a problem.??
>
>
> > Can you explain "take up" a bit better. Offhand it sounds
like
> > you have a hesitation which "normally" can be taken care
of
> > with new plugs (and if they are old--also new
wires).
=====================================================
Is it
possible the take up is actually turbo lag if you'r not used to a
turbo the lag
feels like a hesitation then a burst or power. Turbo lag
is a short [ 1 sec ] smooth
transition from low power to considerabley more
power.
=========================================================
>
> 3..Does any body know the part number for a 240klm speedo
as
> > mine has the Jap 180klm speedo and is it easy to fit. ??
>
>
.
> > Anticipate a lengthy instalation
> > as you'll
have to dismantle the dash. Consider also getting the
> > 2 part shop
manuals for the car as well as these will save you
> > a lote of time
(and the CD backup for $25 also listed in our
> >
archives).
===========================================================
The
removal of the instrument pod is not as involved as removal of the dash.
The
pod can be removed in 1/2 hour with just a few
tools
============================================================
Jim Berry
>>> 93 stealth TT
---- "arrest me
red"
K&N FPIK -- Magnicore/.034" --- Blitz
SSBC
[soon] --- GAB struts --- Stillen SS
lines
GC/Eibach 550# F/330#
R
Gtech --- 0-60 = 4.75 -- 1/4 = 13.3 @ 110 mph
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 20:00:55 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Boost Control explanation
> While we're on the subject, an
thought occurred to me last night (always a
> dangerous
thing).
Huhuuu, yep I know this :))
> Now, once the solenoid
has let through enough air to open the wastegates,
> how does it then
re-close the wastegates once pressure falls to an
> acceptable level?
Obviously, pressure must be bled from the system.
>
> My feeling is
that most EBCs use a bleeder-type system:
>
> [High
Pressure]>------>Solenoid----------Wastegates
>
|
>
Restrictor->[Outside air]
Well, the DSBC do have something like a
small valve on the out side of each
solenoid. But I haven't really checked if
they work like this. It makes sense
that the valves open to the ambient when
the solenoid closes. This will release
the pressure. An open solenoid causes
the releave valve to close.
Therefore it looks like this (thanks for the
ASCII pre-work):
Solenoid Valve
closed
______ WG
[High Pressure]>------>Solenoid---¦
/
¦
------>[Outside air]
Pressure is releaved to the
ambient
Solenoid Valve open
:
______ WG
[High
Pressure]>------>Solenoid-----/
---
------>[Outside air]
Pressure goes directly to the
wastegates
> This allows pressure to bleed down naturally when the
solenoid closes. In
> fact, a manual bleeder system works exactly this
way, replacing the
> "solenoid" with a manually adjustable
valve.
Yes, if the manual bleeder is continously adjusted :)
>
Now, Probably the best option would be controlling both the air going
into
> the wastegate lines *and* the air bleeding out of the wastegate
lines:
>
> [High
Pressure]>------>Solenoid----------Wastegates
>
|
>
Solenoid->[Outside air]
Not necessary as the WG actuators are spring
loaded and the pressure is releaved
quick enough. Adding a vacuum to draw
them back doesn't help at all. The job
will be done at the same
time.
> Hence resulting in a "Dual Solenoid Boost Controller"...
Without the
> restriction in the line to the outside air, pressure can
bleed down faster
> when that solenoid is open, closing the wastegates
faster.
No, there is no restrictor and therefore it doesn't work like a
bleeder setup
that only releaves a particular amount.
> Anyone know
if the Blitz actually works this way? Any comments?
The DSBC is using two
small solenoids that can act faster than a larger design.
They are in
parallel to provide enough pressure to be handled combined with
fast
reaction. A good solution and no restrictor at all.
> And
wouldn't this work even faster if we connected the bleed-down line to
>
compressor vaccuum rather than just venting to the outside air?
Try it
out, but the spring is stronger than the vacuum. Even more I don't want
to
add vacuum to the WG actuators when they are already in close position.
Of
course this is a small vacuum but INMHO, not worth the
hassle.
Regards,
Roger
- -----------------------
Roger Gerl,
Switzerland
93'3000GT TwinTurbo (Animale Rosso)
K&N FIPK,Magnecor
wires,Blitz DSBC/gauge/Dual Timer,Apexi AFC,HKS SBOV,
ATR DP/testpipe,Borla
Cat-back,OZ Mito2 rims,Yoko AVS-Z1,braided brake lines
Bremsa brakes,u-Mevius
Street Race pads
Check out: http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/9589/3000gt.html
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 11:07:54 -0700
From: "Jim Berry" <fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
Boost Control explanation
> > Now, once the solenoid has let
through enough air to open the wastegates,
> > how does it then
re-close the wastegates once pressure falls to an
> > acceptable level?
Obviously, pressure must be bled from the system.
> >
> > My
feeling is that most EBCs use a bleeder-type system:
> >
> >
[High Pressure]>------>Solenoid----------Wastegates
>
>
|
>
>
Restrictor->[Outside air]
>
> Well, the DSBC do have something
like a small valve on the out side of each
> solenoid. But I haven't
really checked if they work like this. It makes sense
> that the valves
open to the ambient when the solenoid closes.
=============================================================
On my
SSBC the solenoid is switched between two ports --- one is boost pressure
the
other port is open to the atmosphere [ like the normally open and
normally closed contacts
on a switch
].
Jim Berry
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
Date:
Wed, 26 May 1999 18:36:38 -0400
From: "Stealth" <cirrus@shore.intercom.net>
Subject:
Team3S: Dual battery question
I'll be going to Baltimore in a week and a
half from now, for two weeks of
technical training in the downtown area. I
plan to leave the car in the
hotel garage for most if not the whole time (I
despise heavy city driving,
and am too paranoid about the Stealth to expose
it to the downtown
elements).
My battery is only about a year old, but
I have noticed that it drains
unreasonably quickly. The last battery did the
same thing, as did the two
batteries I went through in my previous Stealth,
so I don't think it's the
battery. I've had the car dead as a doornail from
the parking lights being
on for three hours, or the car door being just ajar
enough for the little
light to be on most of the night.
Sears used to
sell a dual mode battery, which had a switch for a reserve of
power if the
main cell was drained. Does anyone know of any such a thing
that is available
now? I really hate the idea of it sitting for two weeks,
even if I do go
start it every day, I don't want to think about getting
caught with a dead
battery after dark in Baltimore without a backup of some
sort...and I know
those so-called battery packs are a rip-off and
useless.
Robyn
(any 3/S folks in Baltimore? e-mail me privately
please,
cirrus@shore.intercom.net)
For
subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
------------------------------
End
of Team3S Digest V1 #189
****************************
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