--

From: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com (Team3S Digest)
To: stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Subject: Team3S Digest V1 #173
Reply-To: stealth-3000gt
Sender: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Errors-To: owner-stealth-3000gt-digest@list.sirius.com
Precedence: bulk


Team3S Digest          Saturday, May 8 1999          Volume 01 : Number 173




----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 03:27:33 -0700
From: "Bob Forrest" <bf@bobforrest.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Ahem.....newbie discoveries

- -----Original Message-----From: SoCoDrnkr@aol.com
<SoCoDrnkr@aol.com>

- -----------snip-----------
|sure about Napa) and pick up the 1990 on Foreign or Domestic car
manual by
|Chiltons and they will give you the steps for just about
everything, for the
|3S.  That is around $22.  And pretty good but pretty big also.  I
found that
|by accident.  I am going to buy it because the service manual
through Dodge
|is around $40 or so.  But that is the only Servicing guide that i
have foound
|so far.  I think the average time to do this job on the first time
is 2-3 hrs.
|good Luck

About all the info you're going to get in the Chilton's is how to
change plugs...  They do just fine for lots of other cars, but not
S/3ks...  There have been discussions on this before, and that's the
consensus from several other owners.  Spring for the Dodge/Mitsu
manual or go for the big bucks for the full set of (2) manuals--
$59.00 + $10.47 shipping and tax.  Call 1-800-890-4038 to order.  If
I remember correctly, there's also an explanation and pictures
somewhere on Eric's website, www.3Si.org .  Good luck, and watch
your knuckles on the back plugs!  :-)

Forrest


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 13:11:20 +0200
From: Roger Gerl <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Raising compression in an NA

AFAIK, the compression is already high (10.6:1 I guess) and I wouldn't go higher
than 11:1. But this can only be done by working the heads down or using a
thinner gasket. In my point of view it gives you only about 2-5% more power if
the job is done right. But the cost for the job is pretty high :(

Regards,
Roger

> system, How high can I raise the compression? Is there a formula that
> can be used to get a compression ratio without valve problems. Is the
> valve clearance listed in the repair manual? Thanks
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 07:15:27 -0400
From: "Michael D. Romano" <mdr-nhl@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: RE: Team3S: Ahem.....newbie discoveries

Another good place to check for manuals is on Ebay. I snagged both manuals
for $50 total with shipping, in mint condition.  Only hitch was that they
were for a 1993 3000GT, and not Stealth...but thats not too big a deal. Also
got a beautiful 1993 Dodge Performance book with nice Stealth pics & info in
it for dirt cheap.

- -Mike
'93 Stealth ES

> consensus from several other owners.  Spring for the Dodge/Mitsu
> manual or go for the big bucks for the full set of (2) manuals--
> $59.00 + $10.47 shipping and tax.  Call 1-800-890-4038 to order.  If
> I remember correctly, there's also an explanation and pictures
> somewhere on Eric's website, www.3Si.org .  Good luck, and watch
> your knuckles on the back plugs!  :-)
>
> Forrest
>
>
> For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is
http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 08:49:25 EDT
From: MitsuVR41@aol.com
Subject: Re: Team3S: Valve noise question

I'm having the exact same thing going on with my valves right now too.   If
you figure it out, please let me know.
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 08:54:15 EDT
From: MitsuVR41@aol.com
Subject: Team3S: Oil Capacity issue 4.2 or 4.9 quarts?

I have a concern with the proper oil capacity when having my oil changed.
My Diamond Star Service manual (98$) from Mitsubishi sais  the proper oil
capacity is 4.9 quarts, however......Every oil change place I go to sais the
capacity or  recomended fill level is only 4.2 quarts.  This concerns me,
seing as how my lash valve  has failed on another engine before, due to
having too much oil in the vehicle......it was actually overfilled by 2
quarts (not by me), so at this point,  to  me....having .7 quarts too much or
 not enough oil in my vehicle concerns me........what's  the word???? 4.2 or
4.9?
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 08:33:58 -0500
From: Wayne <wala@hypertech-inc.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Oil Capacity issue 4.2 or 4.9 quarts?

I use 5 quarts every time i change it. The level is fine...

Wayne


At 07:54 AM 5/7/99 , you wrote:
>I have a concern with the proper oil capacity when having my oil changed.
>My Diamond Star Service manual (98$) from Mitsubishi sais  the proper oil
>capacity is 4.9 quarts, however......Every oil change place I go to sais the
>capacity or  recomended fill level is only 4.2 quarts.  This concerns me,
>seing as how my lash valve  has failed on another engine before, due to
>having too much oil in the vehicle......it was actually overfilled by 2
>quarts (not by me), so at this point,  to  me....having .7 quarts too much or
> not enough oil in my vehicle concerns me........what's  the word???? 4.2 or
>4.9?


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 08:46:30 -0500
From: "Gendron, Curt" <Curt.Gendron@westgroup.com>
Subject: Team3S: ACT clutch story and some news

Hey everyone,

Well, after some tense moments on Monday and Tuesday, I did get my ACT
clutch installed and I must say, I really like it.  The pedal pressure
increased slightly and you have to give it a little gas when letting 1st
gear out, but it definatly has a lot of grip.  I can't wait for my 500 mile
break in period to be over so I can really test it.  ;)  In case you don't
remember my earlier post about my rivit problem, I'll recap.  The dealer
called me before they put my clutch in and said that there were only 2
rivits holding in one side of the disk.  They thought it was a bad design or
a defect.  I call ACT, and discovered that it was a defect.  ACT was really
nice and overnighted a new one directly to the dealer.  On Tuesday, the
dealer got the new disk and got the install done that day.  I'm thankful
that Wayzata Mitsu discovered the defect before installing the clutch.  And,
I was satisfied with the customer service that ACT supplied in dealing with
the problem.  Wow, a happy ending, huh?  :)

My "news" portion of this e-mail is to let you all know that my "Minnesota
3/S" group got together last Saturday for a little cruise around Minnesota.
If you want to read about our outing, go to:
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Shop/5641/rural.html

Thats all for now,
Curt G
95 R/T TT
and author of Minnesota 3/S at:
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Shop/1044/

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 07:51:18 -0600
From: "Jeffrey Young" <jefyoung@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Oil Capacity issue 4.2 or 4.9 quarts?

The spec sheets show 4.2 Qt  (4.0 L) for the crankcase and 0.5 Qt  (0.3 L)
for the filter.  This may be where the oil change places are getting their
numbers from.  Be careful, most oil change places do not replace the crush
ring on the oil drain plug.  They also use off brand filters (sometimes).


Jeffrey
92 RT/Turbo
www.omega-sw.com/stealth


>
>At 07:54 AM 5/7/99 , you wrote:
>>I have a concern with the proper oil capacity when having my oil changed.
>>My Diamond Star Service manual (98$) from Mitsubishi sais  the proper oil
>>capacity is 4.9 quarts, however......Every oil change place I go to sais
the
>>capacity or  recomended fill level is only 4.2 quarts.  This concerns me,
>>seing as how my lash valve  has failed on another engine before, due to
>>having too much oil in the vehicle......it was actually overfilled by 2
>>quarts (not by me), so at this point,  to  me....having .7 quarts too much
or
>> not enough oil in my vehicle concerns me........what's  the word???? 4.2
or
>>4.9?
>


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 09:25:06 -0500
From: "John C. Davidson" <jd@edge-software.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Oil Capacity issue 4.2 or 4.9 quarts?

Strange...

My Mitsu Service Manual says (from page 00-47):

  4.5qts (Non-Turbo)
  4.9qts (Turbo)

Of course these are the total capacities (including the filter
and the cooler).  I recall seeing somewhere else that the crankcase
capacity was 4.2qts, thus the rest is probably accounted for in the
filter/cooler.  (Most shops tend to latch onto the 4.2 number.)

I found that most places tend to underfill the oil.  As a result, I've
found the best way to know how much they put in is to bring them 5
quarts of Mobil 1 and simply check how much is left in the 5th quart.
(I consistently have to pour in extra before leaving the shop.)

  -JD


> The spec sheets show 4.2 Qt  (4.0 L) for the crankcase and 0.5 Qt  (0.3 L)
> for the filter.  This may be where the oil change places are getting their
> numbers from.  Be careful, most oil change places do not replace the crush
> ring on the oil drain plug.  They also use off brand filters (sometimes).
>
>
> Jeffrey
> 92 RT/Turbo
> www.omega-sw.com/stealth

____________________________________________________________________________
    __________  ____________
   / ____/ __ \/ ____/ ____/                          John C. Davidson
  / __/ / / / / / __/ __/
 / /__ / /_/ / /_/ / /__                         email: jd@edge-software.com
/_____/_____/\____/_____/                        voice: (512) 371-EDGE
                          Inc.                     fax: (512) 371-3351
_____S O F T W A R E________________________________________________________

  "Success depends on having the EDGE."       http://www.edge-software.com 
____________________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 09:27:51 -0500
From: "John C. Davidson" <jd@edge-software.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: Oil Capacity issue 4.2 or 4.9 quarts?

Sorry about including the sig on that last post, as well as the extra
bandwidth wasted by this explanation. ;)

  -JD


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 12:59:30 -0400
From: Kevin Schappell <kevin@pacarsearch.com>
Subject: Team3S: new digital pressure guage

Was just looking through a design magazine and saw a cool looking pressure
guage.  Check out the site http://www.keyence.com/sensors/ap30.htm#2  I
talked to the company and the price is $179.00.  A little steep but if you
want a fast and accurate guage it might be worth it.


Kevin Schappell
Auto Answers
http://www.pacarsearch.com

 

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 20:45:43 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject: Re: Team3S: new digital pressure guage

> guage.  Check out the site http://www.keyence.com/sensors/ap30.htm#2  I
> talked to the company and the price is $179.00.

You can have this much cheaper ! Get a 3bar GM MAP sensor for $49 (0-5V) and a
3-4 digit LED display kit (voltmeter, about $20) Depending on the voltage the
meter can display you now have to add an amplifier to change the readout to be
shown in the appropriate scale (cost around $5) That's it, you have your digital
gauge :)

The biggest problem is ... where do you mount it :) Also check out the
"Intellitronix" digital gauges that come already in a 2 1/16" case (should have
a boost gauge soon).

// Roger

- -----------------------
Roger Gerl, Switzerland
93'3000GT TwinTurbo (Animale Rosso)
K&N FIPK,Magnecor wires,Blitz DSBC/gauge/Dual Timer,Apexi AFC,HKS SBOV,
ATR DP/testpipe,Borla Cat-back,OZ Mito2 rims,Yoko AVS-Z1,braided brake lines,
Bremsa brakes,Mevius Street Race pads

Check out: http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/9589/3000gt.html
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 15:21:31 -0700
From: Jeff Schwartz <jeff.schwartz@citicorp.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S: More Turbo problems

I had the same problem and refused to believe that it could have been
the plugs or wires since my car only has 14K miles on it,  although
it is 3 years old.  Well last week I changed my plugs (NGK's) and
put in some Magnecor wires, and the miss firing is gone!
- --
Jeff Schwartz
1995 Panama Green Pearl VR4
Borla, K&N FIPK, Magnecors

R.G. wrote:
>
> > You may be right, but my car did make a "popping noise" under heavy
> > acceleration in 5th until I did the change.  Later I attributed it to be
> > a misfire.
>
> Yes, this was under heavy load. Unfortunately, it's very hard to determine the
> sound if not heard by myself. I agree with you on the wires and plugs to be
> changed if they are old or do have a high milage. But it's an investment and for
> some of us not easy to do by ourselfs. Anyway, if the tubing/hoses are ok the
> wires plugs are the next step :)
>
> Roger
>
> -----------------------
> Roger Gerl, Switzerland
> 93'3000GT TwinTurbo (Animale Rosso)
>
> For subscribe/unsubscribe info, our web page is http://www.bobforrest.com/Team3S.htm
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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 00:04:46 +0200
From: "R.G." <robby@swissonline.ch>
Subject: Team3S: Pagid pads .. problems ?

For a longer time I successfully use the Bremsa crossdrilled/slotted disks
together with Pagid RS-R (orange) pads. About 4 weeks ago I was on a small track
and did my yearly driving brush-up but on higher speeds than the last times.
Braking was very good and compared to all of the other cars I had the best
braking distance :)

Unfortunately, something bad happened to the brakes then as it seemed that I can
hear more noise when the car is running slowly. Looking at the rotors (disks) I
noticed some new grooves in them. As I have a set of z-Mevius pads sitting on
the floor I thought it is a good time to change the pads to find out how they
work. As I removed the Pagids and looked at the pads surface I was somewhat
shocked : They had holes in the surface, about 8mm dia and 2-3mm deep. The dia
is exactly the size of the holes in the rotors and it seems that the pads could
not withstand the material of the rotors, especially around the holes. I
immediately called Bremsa and they agreed to send them back to Pagid for further
investigations.

I remember that I was maybe not driving easy and long enough to cool the brakes
down after the final, extra heavy lap on the track. We then parked the cars
after a cool down phase and the turbo-timer was up to about 38 seconds. The air
was about 13°C or lower and good conditions to let the car cool down and I
really though it is enough. But it really seems that the pads had time to bond
to the rotors, more on the outside than on the inside (due to the size of the
holes).

Conclusion : I wait for the investigation results by Pagid and will post them
here. Also, do not only let the engine/turbos cool down but give the brakes an
extra lap to cool them down.

BTW, I've put the z-Mevius in and noticed that the pad area is about 5mm smaller
to the outside of the disks. In my opinion, this is too small, even smaller than
the stock pads ! The Pagids where about 1/2mm too large so they "hung" a little
over the disks edge. The Mevius work good so far.

Later,
Roger


- -----------------------
Roger Gerl, Switzerland
93'3000GT TwinTurbo (Animale Rosso)
K&N FIPK,Magnecor wires,Blitz DSBC/gauge/Dual Timer,Apexi AFC,HKS SBOV,
ATR DP/testpipe,Borla Cat-back,OZ Mito2 rims,Yoko AVS-Z1,braided brake lines,
Bremsa brakes,z-Mevius pads

Check out: http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/9589/3000gt.html


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 18:37:59 -0700
From: wce@bc.sympatico.ca
Subject: Re: Team3S: ** Getrag Info **

Jim Berry responded to

> ----
>  David Margrave"s
>
> >
> >I tend to lean in favor of organizing a class action lawsuit which I think would be more persuasive
> than >sending the CEO a "Dear Sir, ... signed, Concerned Customer" letter.  I was very close to
> inquiring with a >couple law firms, but stopped to find out what progress the previous legal saber
> rattling on the 3000gt.com >web board had went.  Answer: nowhere yet.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

with the following

> We need to initiate more than one solution !! A class action lawsuit, if feasible
> will take years to resolve. I for one will need parts in the next 6 months. My
> second gear synchro is in its final stages of life.
> Appearently Turboharry is working on something back east but I don't have
> any solid information. I think their working on developing a 6 speed parts
> supplier.
> As for our European contingent I know there's a lot of racing fabrication going
> on in Europe. Any chance of developing a supplier from that group.
> Other items like bearings are probably easier, I doubt getrag manufactures
> its own bearings. The bearings should be stamped with mfg. codes  which
> might allow us to track down a supplier. For example my Yamaha V-Max
> needed a front fork bearing --- Yamaha wanted $55 --- I got the same part
> from a bearing supplier for $18
>
>

All of these ideas are good, and were I there instead of here, I believe I would  (shoulda coulda) have
the pertinent information of this thread (Paul?) stored for posterity for the above reasons. A group
solution is possible and likely with the brilliant fabricator, who will in all likelihood be someone who
someone here knows, or who is their brother in law, boss, etc. However, has anyone considered contacting
60 minutes, or Nader? Both are saber rattlers, and love to wail on big organizations like this one;
organizations who act impervious and are not about to stoop to the petty needs of their customer
regardless of their clear liability. The squeaky wheel gets the grease, and when it comes to David and
Goliath, the populace sees few cheering for the giant.

Best

Darc   (Canada)

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 20:00:14 -0700
From: David Margrave <davidma@premier1.net>
Subject: Re: Team3S: RH drive shaft

now that the clutch is done, I can't get the darn thing back in!  any advice here?


"Barry E. King" wrote:

> These things can be a PITA.  They have a spring clip of some sort.  Prying
> by itself won't usually cut it.  What you need to try and do is get a big
> wedged pry bar in there and whack it pretty hard with a bit of pressure on
> the pry bar to push the shaft outwards.  I have seen people with "the knack"
> do it with one simple blow.  The percussion seems to pop the snap ring and
> with the ouutward pressure, off it comes.  I was not able to pry mine off.
> Popping it with a blow or two did it.  The half shafts gave me the most
> trouble.  I doubt I could pull it off twice in a row.  On one side I simply
> pulled it off the knuckle since the bnoot was already in need of
> replacement.  Even though I had one side off I simply could not get the
> other one to budge.  *shrug*
>
> Hope that helps.
>
> Barry
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> >
> >
> > I'm doing a clutch replacement and can't get the RH drive shaft out of
> > the transmission.  The shop manual calls for prying against the housing
> > to remove the shaft rather than trying to pull it out, but I can't get
> > it to budge more the the tiny amount of in/out play the shaft has.  It
> > seems like there's a clip holding it in, but nowhere does it specify any
> > special steps to remove a clip.  Has anyone been through this before?
> >
> > Dave
> > '91 RT TT
>
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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 08:10:06 -0500
From: "Oskar" <swede@pclink.com>
Subject: Team3S: For Sale - Blitz turbo timer

I have a Blitz Turbo Timer for sale.  It has never been used and is still in
the box.  This is the basic model.  It counts down the time that you preset.

1/4 din size, gray color.
I also have a VR-4/TT specific wiring harness to make installation a breeze.

I'll let it go for $50 w/o harness, or $70 with harness.

Oskar

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------------------------------

End of Team3S Digest V1 #173
****************************

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