team3s
Sunday, February 6
2000 Volume 01
: Number
052
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date:
Sat, 05 Feb 2000 14:04:11 -0800
From: Errin Humphrey <
errin@u.washington.edu>
Subject:
Re: Team3S: Fuel Injector questions...
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See message end for more info.***
Matt Jannusch wrote:
>
Then how come nobody other than Jack has run 10's? If it is so
easy,
> then there should be more 3S cars in the 10's. How can
Mike say this
> if he hasn't done it himself?
This is getting
off-topic, so I'm taking it off the list.
- --Errin
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------------------------------
Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 18:30:39
-0500
From: "Pete Ryner" <
pryner@ij.net>
Subject: RE: Team3S: FW:
Subject: Vibration from differential???
***This is the NEW Team3S
list. See message end for more info.***
Also check the differential
mounts (all 3) and the carrier bearings. Had a
similar problem
and all were bad. Didn't catch it in time and the input
shaft on the
differential started to leak. Had to have the seal
replaced
also.
Pete
91 VR-4
- -----Original
Message-----
From:
owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st[
mailto:owner-team3s@stealth-3000gt.st]On
Behalf Of Nickolaos M. Sgouros
Sent: Saturday, February 05, 2000 7:31
PM
To: Team3s
Subject: Team3S: FW: Subject: Vibration from
differential???
***This is the NEW Team3S list. See message end for more
info.***
Friends Hi:
I am an owner of a 92 Stealth RT/TT
AWD, AWS.
Lately I am getting a vibration from the axle or from
the rear
differential?? (some frient told me th look the engine
suports) Mostly
during the 1st, and 2nd shifts
between
2-3,000 rpm.
When I am accelerating hard it is worse. Feels like
Goop Goop Goop
at the
beginning and after goes a deep
vibration.. If I continue pushing
and the
rpm increase more than 3k, 3rd
4th 5th 6th gear the car feels
normal...
Any good ideas?
Thank
you
Nick Sgouros 92 Stealth RT/TT
Puerto Rico
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------------------------------
Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 19:20:13
-0500
From: "Michael Booker" <
mrbook@gate.net>
Subject: Team3S: A/F
ratio data for NA cars.
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for more info.***
This is a multi-part message in MIME
format.
- ------=_NextPart_000_0047_01BF700E.06CB40E0
Content-Type:
text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
quoted-printable
I have been doing some tests with my A/F gauge installed
on my R/T NA, =
and the results look promising. At WOT, I am getting voltages
(from the =
gauge, these data will be backed up with Voltgauge numbers soon)
ranging =
from .8-1.0. This looks to be rich enough to lean out with some
type of =
fuel controller. Anybody out there well versed on O2 sensor data
and =
give me some info about what the voltages mean, how lean can/should I
=
go, what is the best air/fuel controller, etc.=20
Matt
-
------=_NextPart_000_0047_01BF700E.06CB40E0
Content-Type:
text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding:
quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0
Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META
content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1"
=
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML
5.00.2919.6307"
name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY
bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I have
been doing some tests with my =
A/F gauge=20
installed on my R/T NA, and
the results look promising. At WOT, I am =
getting=20
voltages (from the
gauge, these data will be backed up with Voltgauge =
numbers=20
soon)
ranging from .8-1.0. This looks to be rich enough to lean out with
=
some=20
type of fuel controller. Anybody out there well versed on O2
sensor data =
and=20
give me some info about what the voltages mean, how
lean can/should I =
go, what=20
is the best air/fuel controller, etc.
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT
face=3DArial
size=3D2>Matt</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
-
------=_NextPart_000_0047_01BF700E.06CB40E0--
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------------------------------
Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 20:37:44
EST
From:
MitsuVR41@aol.comSubject: Team3S:
Transmission and clutch problems
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list. See message end for more info.***
Okay, 95
VR-4 6 speed
sometimes I have problems shifting into 1st or
reverse. pumping the clutch
sometimes seems to help, but it is
hard to say.
also, going into 3rd, sometimes I
have to wait about a half second
before the shifter will actually go into
3rd, I guess that must be a syncro
problem there, but is the
first?
NOW the clutch problem, the booster moves in about 1/2
an inch before I get
a good bite on the clutch, and the pedal had
about 1/2 an inch free play in
it.
How
should I adjust the clutch? The positon switch was all the way up
with
the pedal all the way up, I lowerd the pedal via the position switch
and the slack is out of the pedal, but now the pedal is too low, plus
the
booster still has play. I ran the booster check and it failed one
test but
passsed the other. does all of this sound booster
related or what? I can't
figure it out.
thanks Shannon 95 VR-4
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------------------------------
Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 21:34:40
-0800
From: "Todd Schmalzried" <
Q11981@email.mot.com>
Subject:
Team3S: motor question
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for more info.***
Is there any way to tell the difference between a
turbo and non-turbo
long block?
I found a core which the guy claims is a
turbo, but the oil pan and oil
filter bracket are wrong. The water pump is
gone, so I can't check for
the water lines to the turbos. The oil pressure
sensor is also gone,
which is where the other oil supply line comes
from.
I'm going to try to check the compression, but with no flywheel it
might
be hard.
Is there anything else to look for on the block
itself?
Thanks
- --
Todd
Schmalzried
q11981@email.mot.com - -You
"put your 2 cents in" but only get "a penny for your
thoughts"
- -Who gets the change? Think about it.
O-
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------------------------------
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 13:31:25
+0100
From: "R.G." <
robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: A/F ratio data for NA cars.
***This is the NEW Team3S list. See
message end for more info.***
This is very normal for our cars,
although I do not have any experience with
our NA cars. But I do have same
measures on the Camaro and I doubt that it
is different. Now you must find
out the safe amount of fuel you can give.
Therefore the amount of knock would
be good to know. For an NA car I'd say
0.86V is rich enough for the higher
compression ratio but I'd not change it
(you can use an old AFC) without any
monitor for knock.
Roger
93'3000GT TT
PS: ADMIN WARNING : Do
not use HTML in your posts !
> WOT, I am getting voltages (from the
gauge, these data will be backed up
with Voltgauge numbers soon)
>
ranging from .8-1.0. This looks to be rich enough to lean out with some
type
of fuel controller.
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------------------------------
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 13:58:29
+0100
From: "R.G." <
robby@freesurf.ch>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Fuel Injector questions...
***This is the NEW Team3S list. See
message end for more info.***
(182in^3 * 7000rpm * 0.5 *0.9 * 2.3
(1.3 bars of boost)) / 1728 = 763 cfm
> > 13g and 15g maps as I
need them for my calcs.
>
> Obviously I don't have those, but I
don't think I would need them to make
> my above statement. The 9Bs
just can't push 15 psi near redline. Since
> lower psi will
correspond to lower cfm (efficiency issues aside) I don't
see
> the
point you're trying to make. 260cfm is max for 9Bs at 15psi, so
this
> is definitely the most you could expect from them at
redline.
Damn, why can one know how much they flow if there are no maps
around. I
don't understand this !
Are you saying that 15psi is the max one
can expect at teh redline ? If the
260cfm is correct @ 15 psi then it is
impossible that tehy can hold this
boot at 7000. The calc says that boost is
limited to 8.3 psi then as the
engine sucks in more air than the 9b would be
able to deliver at 15 psi. IF
I could get the maps I'd be able to draw a
pressure curve over the rpm band
for our cars.
> Here's another
excellent post of Barry's from my Starnet archives:
>
> <<The
only thing the ECU cares about is the transition across one known
>
voltage, usually 0.5 v. It does NOT use specific voltages to
determine
> mixture. Anything over 0.5 v is considered rich,
anything below that is
> lean. The ECU is constantly adjusting the
mixture to attain roughy 0.5v
> under normal driving conditions.
This does NOT apply at WOT. At
> WOT the ECU goes into open loop
mode and ignores the O2 sensor
> completely. At that point the ECU
(in our cars) dumps as much fuel as
> possible into the engine with
readings from the MAS. Note that the stock
> MAS also only operates
well at lower than maxiumum airflow. At higher
> airflow it can
start to miss beats therefore giving the ECU inaccurate
> information (it
is actually telling the ECU that there is less air than
there
> really
is which MAY be a clue as to why the ECU gets paranoid and
> starts
gumping as much fuel as possible).>>
I do not fully disagree with
the great information. The only fact that is
forgotten is that the ECU goes
in open loop when the TPS is showing a more
than 50% open condition and a
larger amount of air flow. Simply open the
throttle fully at 2500 rpm and the
mixture goes rich. Of course the air flow
is not really that high at this
moment. Larger injectors or not the ECU is
only in closed loop at part
throttle situations. If you install larger
injectors, the flow signal must be
tweaked with a fuel computer. This then
tells the ECU that there is less air
flow, causing the injectors to be
opened less time. Now, at WOT (or what the
ECU thinks is WOT) fuel is still
dumped in like crazy causing the ovwer-rich
conditions.
> > Come on, why would an NA benefit of a larger MAS or
a bored TB ?
>
> Please note the word "superficial."
In other words, upgrading it would
> be similar to upgrading your spark
plug wires.
Yep, I got it ;-)
> But with the way things are
going, maybe I will be the first, heheh.
Also for me the car is my daily
driver (at least in winter) and money is
limited as well. I'm very wondering
how the animal will be driveable after
the new power drops it will get
:)
> I realize all the things you're saying comparing Supras to our
cars
> when it comes to track performance. My only issue is with the
poor
> showing for our cars. I would argue that it wouldn't take
much to
> put together a consistent 10-sec car, but simply no one has done
it.
> I think a 15G setup, drop in some forged pistons, and run
100hp
> shot NOS direct port would be all it would take. If someone
does
> it and fails, then I'll shut up. We'll see how Mike fares
this year with
> a couple of his projects. And there are other guys
out there too who
> have projects in the work, so I'll be rooting for them
too. :)
I agree that a 10s 3S MUST have mods in the internals ! The
forged pistons
and maybe good rods and pinions are the key to high pressure
stuff. And I
definitely don't want to stripe the engine after every run on
the autobahn
unless Mitsu builds some Pit-Stops every 100 km, haha
:)
PS: Don't forget the weak ignition in our
cars...
Roger
93'3000GT TT
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------------------------------
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 10:47:03
EST
From: "Dg B" <
dbretton@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re:
Team3S: Ground Control Installation Project
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list. See message end for more info.***
Thanks Bob.
:)
>
>Nice page Dennis!! I would like to recommend that your
page be used as the
>base and any new info and pics supplement you already
outstanding work if
>that would be acceptable to you.
Sure, use
that at will. I would rather have someone start with this
information
and add to it, rather than having to "re-invent the wheel". so
to
speak.
>By the way, do you have an Autozone part
># for that
emergency bellows kit.
Unfortunately, I do not. I can tell you that
it was one of those
emergency-type kits, and that it was in a green package,
cardbaord backing
with molded plastic for the front (the kind of packing you
would see for,
say a walkman or the like.
Also, I believe it was for a
Honda, originally.
If you go into AutoZone and ask for an emergency CV
boot kit for a small
car.
I lucked out when I went, as the guy I
ended up talking to knew what I was
doing, and had done stuff like this
before. This made him somewhat
resourceful, as it was his idea to use
a CV joint boot.
The boot works well, albeit the fit is a little snug
against the spring (and
you have to cut large holes on both
ends).
Hope that helps!
Regards,
Dennis
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------------------------------
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 09:46:03
-0800
From: "Jim Berry" <
fastmax@home.com>
Subject: Re: Team3S:
motor question
***This is the NEW Team3S list. See message end for more
info.***
I tried to find out the same thing about a year ago with
little success.
The blocks appear to be the same except for the two bolt main
for the
91 model year. The manual refers only to SOHC and DOHC
which
implies the turbo and DOHC blocks are the same. The
compression
ratio is lower for the turbo and I ' assume ' it's done in the
heads, but
I couldn't get anyone to tell me.
Jim
Berry
===============================================
>
> Is there any way to tell the difference between a turbo and
non-turbo
> long block?
> I found a core which the guy claims is a
turbo, but the oil pan and oil
> filter bracket are wrong. The water pump
is gone, so I can't check for
> the water lines to the turbos. The oil
pressure sensor is also gone,
> which is where the other oil supply line
comes from.
> I'm going to try to check the compression, but with no
flywheel it might
> be hard.
>
> Is there anything else to
look for on the block itself?
>
> Thanks
> --
> Todd
Schmalzried
q11981@email.mot.com > -You
"put your 2 cents in" but only get "a penny for your
thoughts"
> -Who gets the change? Think about it. O-
>
>
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>
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>
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>
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------------------------------
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 17:44:05
PST
From: "Chris Marsh" <cmarsh90@hotmail.com>
Subject:
Team3S: HVAC probelm
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more info.***
Hi, I'm new to the list and have been lurking for
awhile, I hope my question
here is relevant.
My father has a 95 VR4
with approx 50K miles on it. The car is all stock
except for a Blitz
FATT turbo timer, the installation of the turbo timer
roughly correlates
with the onset of this problem, so they may be related.
If anyone has
any insight or has seen something similar I would really
appreciate some
help, my fathers description of the problem is below.
When one turns on
the AC after a few minutes a small red light apprears and
shortly begins to
blink in the center of the
little screen in the center of the dash. The
screen shows air flow and fan
speed etc. It is invisible
normally. If one manually turns off
the AC the light goes away.
Must shut off both the full AC and the economy
setting. Almost
immediately after the warning light appears the
AC stops. The fan works
and blows air but it is not cold. The heater works
and the temp
control and fan control (speed) all work during
the time the redlight is on
and when the AC has been manually turned off.
There is a plug for a
diagnositc intrument (I have not seen this) next to
the fuse box on the
drivers side. the garage says that this
instrument indicates that the
"air door" is not moving to cold. The part is
described on
the box as "motor,auto heater control. Its part #
is MB657209 (I
think-there are several numbers on the box). This part was
replaced
with a new factory part. Immediately, the same light
appeared and when
the diagnostic instrument is reattached it gives the same
fault
indication.
The little screen has a solid state (black box) attached to
it. The garage
had one of these subassemblys sitting around.
They put this
used part in and nothing changed (same red light and diagnostic
indication
on the instrument). So now they think it MUST be the
main
control of the heating and AC stuff (another black box) They want
to
replace this part which costs $547.22 new, plus labor, with
no
guarantee that it will fix problem and probably can not return it to
Mitsubishi as they don't like to take electronic parts back.
This
latest black box is part # MB897174.
So what should we try and in
what order?
Thanks for your help.
Chris
Marsh
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------------------------------
End of team3s V1
#52
********************